Comments

1
vegan-curious? ugh.
2
The dinosaur's a nice touch.
3
Don't they have some kind of support group for people who need buy two seats to fly on an airliner? Or are carnivores so macho they can handle that embarrassment all on their own?
4
@2. Yeah, the T-Rex is what did it for me (and the “Keep being AWESOME!”, naturally). Normally I think vegetarian-bashing is childish, but… this is pretty funny.
5
I'm very pro-vegan/vegetarian (and supportive of the "vegan-curious" whatever that is), but this made me laugh so hard.
6
This is the best installment of Dinosaur Comics yet.
7
Yep, only vegans are skinny.

That's some rock-solid logic there bro.
8
Hahahahahahaha
9
This kinda made my day... Thanks
10
Vegans taste good.
11
Straight? Chances are you don't need some wimpy pride week! Haw haw haw. It's fun to pick on minorities.
12
Good stuff.

In the last few years most of my hardcore vegetarian friends have returned to the meat. Its touchy-feely pro vegan/vegetarian shit liked this that pushed them over the edge.
13
All these people bashing passive aggressivism should really reconsider their open mindedness, if they looked into it a little more deeply I am sure they would learn something about themselves.
14
damnit i'm going to go and be awesome right now!
15
PS, There are plenty of colon cancer, prostate cancer, breast cancer, heart disease, stroke, obesity, diabetes, high cholesterol, and hypertension support groups. Carnivores will be joining them when they're a little older.
16
Is there a support group for those so pathetic that they need to make fun of other people's convictions in order to placate the nagging realization that they don't do anything about their own convictions but sit on their ass?
17
@15: zing! good one!
18
@15
1. Vegans/ vegetarians are hardly what I would call a minority.
2. Are you really suggesting that vegans/vegetarians don't suffer from colon cancer, prostate cancer, breast cancer, heart disease, stroke, obesity, diabetes, high cholesterol, or hypertension. Because that is just infantile nonsense.
19
@11
OMG, puh-lease. You know that being queer and being a vegan are totally different, right? Being a vegan actually is a lifestyle choice, just for one example. Whining about what you choose not to eat doesn't make you a minority, it makes you a privileged brat who has the money to buy specialized food, the ability to prepare it, the shamelessness to make waitresses bend over backwards for you at their jobs and the time to try to shame other people into conforming to your ideals.
20
@15 Yeah, but we'll enjoy the ride a-lot more until we get there. By the way, vegetarian advocates, much like anti smoking crusaders, like to pint out cancer risks for their arguments, but I have to ask, do you people really think you will live forever? You all do realize you are going to die of something someday don't you? Do I like the prospect of cancer or any other long, drawn out illness eventually leading to death? Fuck no! But I also don't like the prospect of living my life as a kill-joy, which is what I was when I was a vegetarian (can't eat there with you guys, no tasty vegetarian options). I also don't like the prospect of living until I am bat shit insane with senility. You know why I really started eating meat again? Because I had to eventually admit that that steak on the grill smelled delicious and life was too damn short to deny myself that. God Dammit a lamb chop sounds good right now!
21
Awesome! Hahaha. Is it really considered passive aggressive if it's intentional comedy?
22
Vegans never die, they just eventually begin to smell like prey and get eaten by carnivores who can't help themselves.
23
Gotta love the Slog insecure omnivore brigade.

Oh, and Rotten666 @ 12, go fuck yourself. How's that for "touchy feely"?

24
I've been a vegetarian for a long time, and I have heard all of the ridiculous, defensive comments out there. All this despite the fact that I have never once tried to "convert" anyone to my way of thinking. It took me a long time to figure out why. It seemed so strange that people would get so worked-up over a choice I had made for myself that really had nothing to do with them.

Well, after many years of dealing with this, I realized that people were only trying desperately to convince themselves that what they are doing is OK. Ex-vegetarians are the worst at this, by the way. I guess they have to work extra-hard to cover the guilt they must be feeling. I mean, at one point you thought that the many arguments against eating meat had validity, right?

When it boils down to it, the only thing these people have to defend themselves is greed and mockery. Please, keep making fun of me and people like me. I will keep doing what I believe is right. I also believe that any rational person that approaches the issue with honesty and logic will see that regardless of what you feel about the morality, cruelty, and inhumanity involved in producing and eating meat, there are few, if any, justifications for it other than your own greed.

You might have funny jokes, and you might be happy to stuff all of the dead animals you can find into your mouth, but that doesn't change the fact that you're a pathetic asshole.
25
none of the vegans i hang around with are 'touchy-feely' or 'wimpy.' but they are conscientious, thoughtful, peaceful folks who don't have a gripe with someone who eats animal stuff. then again, none of my omnivorous friends have a gripe with my vegan-ness, either. and they're all conscientious, thoughtful and peaceful, too. live and let live (or die), i suppose.
26
The whole goldarn U.S. of A. is a meat eaters' support group. A couple vegans say "boo!" and you bigboys all wet your pants. Who you callin' a wimp?
27
@ 24
I have thought long and hard about the meaning and effects of the food i eat on the world, its residents and my own body. Eating tons of heavily processed industrially monocropped soy "products" doesn't give you any more moral brownie points than eating pasture-raised and finished beef, and if you call someone who thinks that way a pathetic greedy asshole, you are wrong. Some of the arguments against eating meat have merit. Some of the arguments against being a vegan have merit. And you know what? Making it a moral high point that you are dogmatically in one camp or the other is always leotarded. Tends to be that the veggie types tend more to self-righteousness and screeds while the omnis either stick to simple teasing or are ignorable obvious mouth-breathing trolls anyway.
28
@23 did i touch a nerve,pumpkin? Feel a little bit more butch now that you told me to go fuck myself?

I'm blushing.
29
@27, you're cute. are you boycotting the evil soy sauce and (most) vegetable oils?
30
@19, @27
So you don't think that your first post was a self-righteous screed? Also, I don't whine about other people eating meat when they do it, I don't make waitresses bend over backwards to get me food, and I don't eat tons of "heavily processed industrially monocropped soy 'products'" either.

So, thanks for the stereotypes. I don't think many of the vegetarians I know, including several Hindus, fit them either. I'm not trying to get any moral brownie points and really don't care about being on moral high ground. I just get so tired of people who seem to think that because I choose not to eat meat that I am looking down on them and therefore deserving of ridicule.

You can keep trying to put me into your stereotype of what a vegetarian is, but I don't spend my time trolling message boards to make fun of meat eaters, and no vegetarian I have known has felt the need to either.
31
Oh, Rotten666 @ 28, I'll never be as butch as you -- that is a given, friend.

I only wish I were man enough to stomp on geese just for the fuck of it -- we all know how that makes Ms. Clement swoon.
32
You know that being queer and being a vegan are totally different, right?


I am both (mostly), and I wasn't equating the two.

As for the "life is too short for me to not eat corpses" crowd: fine, but don't complain when I harass you on a relevant Internet thread for causing global warming, swine flu, deforestation, animal cruelty, and ridiculously high health costs. #30 is a nice vegan, I'm an annoying vegan, but you are cruel and damaging to humanity.

Some light reading:
http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/full/70/… - Meat causes approximately 39% of all incidences of cancer and 28% of all heart disease
http://www.fao.org/newsroom/en/news/2006… - Meat causes 18% of global warming and uses 30% of our total land area
33
@30 Dude, you can't take the moral high road after you write the following:

You might have funny jokes, and you might be happy to stuff all of the dead animals you can find into your mouth, but that doesn't change the fact that you're a pathetic asshole.

Hmmm?
34
@33
Maybe I wasn't clear. I wasn't calling all meat-eaters pathetic assholes, just you and the other "haw haw vegans" posters on this thread.
35
i love these meat vs. veg bitch-fests!
i eat nothing, and am superior to all of you.
36
I don't think there's anything funny about vegans in theory, but the fact they take themselves so goddammed seriously begs ridicule. lighten up, you're doing a good job. leave it at that.
37
@34 don't deny it You know you love arguing with meat eaters.

@32

the research for the first article seems sound, yet I don't see anywhere in the article that Meat causes approximately 39% of all incidences of cancer and 28% of all heart disease, like you said. Me thinks you are just throwing random numbers out there with nothing to back it up. And the second article is nothing but junk science. You can do better than that.
38
besides, how do we know that the intent wasn't to make fun of meat-eaters? the dinosaur. the all caps AWESOME. it seems fairly sarcastic.
39
lol@veganz
40
Why do Vegans hate America? Is it because of our freedom?
41
#37, Read the abstract or results - the difference between cancer (malignant neoplasm) and heart disease rates amongst vegetarians and meat eaters.

For the second link, that's just a press release, but there's a link to the full scientific article (PDF) on the right.
43
really though? none of you mega moral vegans (or mostly-queer vegans) think that "vegan-curious" is just awful?
and yes, i use vegetable oils and soy sauce only very sparingly. traditionally fermented soy food like soy sauce is decent for you and all, but the industrial ag stuff gives me the heebie jeebies. vegetable oils same thing, but pretty selectively as far as what kind. i switched to farmer's market butter and my food tastes better, i feel better and my weight and health have remained just fine, with a shiner coat.
44
Vegans are immortal and never get sick.
45
herriman say "go veg!"
46
"You know that being queer and being a vegan are totally different, right?"

Really? I imagine both do bizarre things to cucumbers on lonely nights.

"but they are conscientious, thoughtful, peaceful folks who don't have a gripe with someone who eats animal stuff."

Right, tell that to the customers at Lark. I've never seen meat eaters protest outside a vegan restaurant although once after a really good meat fest at Lark I dropped into Cafe Flora to take a meaty cr*p and tried as hard as I could to miss the bowl (yes, that was me).

BTW, I'd never eat vegan pu**y if its any consolation to the vegans here; you'd probably need written permission from PETA to go down on a vegan.
47
I don't really understand the whole "I've never seen meat eaters protesting at a vegan restaurant" thing. First, meat eaters assumedly eat some sorts of vegetables or fruits or beans etc. at some point, so they don't have anything to protest. Second, even if they don't ever eat any of those things, the animals they eat do. So no matter what, it doesn't make sense to protest vegans because meat eaters eat the same things, only they also have meat on their eating list as well. Going along with this, vegans personally think it is wrong to eat meat based on health, environmental or ethical reasons, or all three. Meat eaters do not think it is wrong to eat veggies, so again, nothing to protest for meat eaters, but potentially something to protest for vegans.

Finally, in my life as a vegetarian first, and vegan now I've certainly gotten plenty of push back. Maybe not a protest, but certainly a lot meant to make me feel bad about myself. If can't count the amount of times that people have called me less of a man or offered me meat as a joke. I've learned to deal with it, but don't be so quick to assume that vegans don't get quite a bit of flack from meat eaters.
48
They may not need it now but carnivores will need a support group. It's called the National Cancer Institute.

Check out www.cancerproject.org for how diet is the primary cause of cancer.
49
"make me feel bad about myself"

Here's a bacon flavored tissue to wipe away the tears.
50
@49 So you choose to take one phrase taken out of context and ignore the rest? I was saying that meat eaters often try to do that, which is similar to your complaints about vegans, of which, I refused to accept the claim.

Good try though, I'll keep my cruelty free tissues
51
@48

"...diet is the primary cause of cancer".

You know what I'm sick of? When the herbivores make wild accusations that have no scientific backing. Just because you read something online doesn't mean it is true. Show me some facts. Peer reviewed, published, the works, that support your idiotic claim. Maybe you and Lizzy @32 can work together, make it a little project.

I don't care that you don't eat meat. Just stop making up imaginary facts to support your belief system.

Bush league.
52
Sorry mate, the full context stills make you look like a 3 year old:

"Maybe not a protest, but certainly a lot meant to make me feel bad about myself."

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah..............

Maybe some meat in your diet would help with your self-esteem issues.
53
Lizzie, you blanket "meat" as causing a huge amount of cancer and whatnot. But does that meat include the wild game or organically grown livestock raised the same "humane" way they have been for thousands of years? The factory farm industry is grosso-mundo, sad, and detrimental to the environment (yep, read Fast Food Nation) but I like to remember that this is a phenomenon of this industrial revolution for the most part.
54
maybe it's because i'm not sure which side i belong on myself (being vegetarian-ish for the most part but still eating fish), but i really like this photo / these notes. it just made me smile..
why would someone from left or right get all touchy about something like this?
55
Yeah I agree with 54. I'm a vegetarian and this made me laugh. I don't get what the big deal is. Everyone knows there are people who eat meat out there and people who don't. So?
56
@32- Comparing veganism to the gay rights struggle (or omnivores to nazis, etc. etc.) is counterproductive. Vegans are allowed to marry and serve openly in the military, they're just one of the many groups that get's made fun of, just like roleplaying nerds, furries, etc. The comparison makes other people less likely to take your points seriously or even bother to read the rest of what you have to say. Frankly you sound like an anti-choice protester at a planned parenthood clinic: more interested in trying to control and/or others and make yourself feel morally superior than in actually changing anyone's mind.
57
@52 You are the one who is complaining that some vegans may have made one of your meals unpleasant...I'm simply telling you what type of reactions I get when some people, like you, find out I'm a vegan.

Does it hurt my feelings or make me feel bad about myself? No. In fact, I end up feeling better about myself because it helps to justify the choices I have made in my own life.

I hope you have fun being a dirty asshole (apparently somewhat literally as well)
58
You know what will kill you? Being self righteous, and stressing over others eating meat. http://stress.about.com/b/2008/07/07/exa…
59
@58 Maybe that's why so many of us do yoga as well
60
59, Not enough yoga apparently.

If a Vegan's house or apartment gets an roach, ant, termite, rodent infestation, how do you handle it? Do you just live with them? Killing them, even with some organic method would seem to be contrary to vegan's beliefs. If termites decided to dwell in your woodwork, who are you to force them to die or leave?

What about all the animals killed in grain fields, fruit orchards, etc?

61
Oh, yeah, and one of the biggest contradictions of all, many vegans are also pro-choice. Killing an animal for food wrong. Killing a fetus because you don't want to be pregnant, okay?
62
@60&61 First, I wanted to say that through the course of a lifetime, unfortunately there will be harm done to certain living things. Ultimately for me, the most important thing is to consider this and to reduce that impact as much as you possibly can. Because someone might accidentally step on an ant doesn't invalidate all the other compassionate things that person has done by avoiding killing and harming animals for food. To your point about insect infestation, there are traps that can be set that do not kill the insects, and then you can let them go. Your whole argument doesn't make sense though because we aren't talking about insect invading a house, we are talking about people torturing animals willfully and for no reason. Those cows and pigs did nothing to you, and certainly do not deserve to die prematurely or be treated in the way they do.

To your comment on abortion, I think you will find that there is debate among vegans about the issue that you bring up. So not all vegans are pro-choice. I think vegans that do support a woman's right to chose have a different definition of when life begins. I do not think they would condone using abortion as a means of contraceptive but I do think that if the woman's life or health was in danger, then that woman's life takes precedence, especially since without the mother, the fetus wouldn't survive anyway.

In the end, no one is perfect and no one is fully vegan, it is the approach and desire to be fully vegan that is important. For me personally I do all I can to make sure that no living animal is harmed in anything I do, but I acknowledge that no matter what I do, there still will be suffering. Again, this doesn't invalidate all that I or other vegans do.
63
"I'm simply telling you what type of reactions I get when some people, like you, find out I'm a vegan."

What, they hold up signs and protest around your table? You know some weird omnivores.

"So not all vegans are pro-choice."

Please, probably 95% are. I know you people, most are also hardened leftists.

"I think vegans that do support a woman's right to chose have a different definition of when life begins"

Huh? So why do they freak if theirs an boiled chicken egg in their salad?.
64
" if there's an boiled..."
65
Jesus, no coffee yet:

'if there's a boiled...'
66
Rob:

Regarding the point you make in 60, the main idea behind veganism (for me and my girlfriend, I can't even pretend to speak for the entire nation) is to do the least amount of harm reasonably possible. Is it reasonable to live in a roach infested house? Not particularly - we have a reasonable right to live in non-infested houses. Is it reasonable to prevent the death and abuse of animals by not eating meat? I would argue yes, in this day and age where the choices are available and the education is simply a mouse-click away, it's a reasonable idea. Is there room for manuvering? Of course, but living in a world of 100% absolutes never helps anyone. It reminds me of my friend who, because he can never make his paintings perfect (completely utterly absolutley perfect) he refuses to finish them.

For your point in 61, that is apples to oranges on many levels. I am not pro-choice because I think abortion is "okay" as you say - I personally wish it didn't exist - but because I believe in a woman's right to choose what she does with her own body, in privacy, and the reasonable assumption that abortions will happen no matter what, they might as well be done in a medically safe and sound environment.

I never try to convert my friends/family, but if THEY ask ME questions, I do try to encourage them to try it out. If not being a full vegetarian, then cutting out meat for three or four days. One friend has become vegan, my brother has become a vegetarian, and the others haven't; oh well, we're all still friends.

On the health issues, I can't say much for the numbers and stats since I don't know them. I can say I used to live a pretty terrible life style and since changing my diet I've also changed my other bad habits, starting exercising more, and feel more in shape and better about life than I ever did. I have a spiritual peace and a physical rejuvenation that wasn't present before (too much booze, cigarettes, fast food etc.) I do believe I will live longer and have a higher quality of life - I don't think that makes me a pretentious dick. I do agree with 24 on some points, mainly that there is a lot of insecurity about diet out there (no surprise given how big people are) and I've had meals with people who take something as small as asking for no cheese on a salad as a personal attack.

Eat what you want, let me eat what I want, and if you have questions I'll be happy to explain my own experience. It is a luxury to have access to all non-animal based food here in the US, but that doesn't make it a bad idea.
67
@63&64
First, funny that you corrected yourself and kept a grammatical error in there anyway...the proper way to say it would be "if there's a boiled"...anyway...

You have absolutely no statistics to suggest how many vegans are or are not pro-choice, and even if you are right, it still means that there are differences of opinion.

Then vegans do not eat eggs because of the way that chickens who lay the eggs are treated. Chickens are induced to lay more eggs than they naturally would, and they are kept in cages where they can't move. Also because eggs are profitable and males cannot lay eggs, they are killed just after they are born, because they have no monetary value to the factory farms.
68
62, You're doing a lot of twisting to avoid giving a direct answer here. So are you saying it's okay to make kill or make homeless roaches, ants, termites, rodents because you just don't want to live with them in your home? The live insect traps are pretty much useless, and what you do catch and release just go back into someone's home, so they end up dying anyway. Since most household pests have evolved to become dependent on humans to live, releasing them in the wild is also a death sentence.

It's seems your being very selective with your kindness. It's okay to kill and torture some animals when all they did was take up residence inside your home? A direct question if you find termites in your home's structural supports what would you do? Is it okay to kill them, as long as you don't eat them?

Animals are killed when harvesting wheat, other grains, fruit, vegetables, but you still eat those. Storage, transport, and sales of such items also cause the death of animals. Is that okay, as long as nobody eats the dead animals?

So if a vegan doesn't consider a fetus a life, is it okay to eat animal fetuses, since their not living and all?

If you and your child are starving in the wild somewhere, and you have the resources to hunt to feed yourself and your child, do you abandon your principals when the going gets rough? Is it okay to torture and kill animals for food then, or do you live by your beliefs that animals are equal to humans, and sacrifice yourself and your child to preserve animals?.

69
" the reasonable assumption that abortions will happen no matter what, "

Well, ditto for my eggs and bacon breakfast - it is, afterall, in my evolutionary nature to be an omnivore so the piece of bacon in my mouth at this moment making all my glands go nuts, is really beyond my control. It is my nature.

So abortion is ok, eating a chicken egg bad. I guess moral contradictions are a part of veganism too; so do us a favour and stop protesting at Lark when I'm eating there.
70
66, So it's okay to kill and torture animals only when you say it it, I.E. When it suits you just because you don't want to share your home with certain animals? But you're going to pass judgment on folks who draw the line somewhere else? Please give a list so that we all know when it's okay to kill animals, and when it's immoral?
71
@68 I'm going to refer you back to post 66 where he does a great job explaining a vegan mentality.

As I said before, we as humans do cause suffering, yet we also have the ability to reduce that suffering to great degrees. I also said I think it is extremely important to think constantly about ways to reduce that impact even further.

The society that we live in does not require us to kill animals. We can easily survive in a world free food made from animals or animal by-products. If the case cam that somehow you ended up in a situation where there were only animals as your source of food, then in terms of survival you would have to eat an animal. But again, that is not a necessity in the society that we live in. If I were in that position though, I would make as sure as I could that there was as little pain inflicted on the animal as possible, and I respected the sacrifice that the animal made, something that is not done in the factory farms that exist today.

Humans do not need meat to live a perfectly healthy lifestyle. In fact, living without meat and animal products makes us healthier.
72
Samel, this is the kind of vegan preaching and fundementalism that makes you look like fools. . Great. Enjoy your lifestyle. But like the rightwing religious loons and various Taliban in the world, keep it to yourself.

If the words of my two year old this morning.....yummy bacon daddy!
73
@72 Not exactly sure how my own lifestyle, which I don't really bring up except for when it is brought up for me, that focuses on less harm toward animals and the environment, has any similarity to a right wing religious loon or the Taliban. Last I checked, I haven't said that anyone is going to hell, I haven't oppressed anyone. I do keep it to myself, unless someone brings it up for me or asks about it.

You and your 2 year old can do whatever you would like, but you can also expect that if you post something ignorant on the topic, people will respond, which we also have the freedom to do.

Have a good one!
74
@62 "Those cows and pigs did nothing to you, and certainly do not deserve to die prematurely or be treated in the way they do."

Don't kid yourself, Sam. If a cow ever got the chance, he'd eat you and everyone you care about!
75
@74 Yes, I have heard that cows are choosing to change their diets from grass to humans! I'll be sure to watch out from now on!
76
"has any similarity to a right wing religious loon "

I guess you didn't see the protesters outside Lark earlier this year, and all the other places these fools show up; as irritating and self-righteous as any abortion clinic protesters. Do you support them? Or the animal rights and tree hugging groups that attack labs, cause arson and burn down homes they deem environmentally unfriendly? Do you support them?
77
""Those cows and pigs did nothing to you, and certainly do not deserve to die prematurely or be treated in the way they do."

But pulling out an 7 month old baby, sucking its brains out and tossing the baby in the trash; that's an acceptable 'choice' with most looney leftists & vegans.
78
@76 I do not support using violence as a means to getting a point across, much for the same reason that I don't support killing animals. I believe in compassion and having conversations. However, I do believe in protesting. So just like I protest against wars, the death penalty, and for civil rights, I also will be there marching when an animal rights protest or rally is held. Again, no violence...
79
Mr. Stupid White Man,
Do you believe that any animals have rights? Do you believe that animals have any rights? If you do, what are these rights and how are they determined? How do you separate them? Based on type of animal? Intelligence? Ability to feel pain or fear?

Also, if there were food that tasted virtually the same as meat to you, would you give up eating meat?
80
"If you do, what are these rights and how are they determined? How do you separate them? Based on type of animal? Intelligence? Ability to feel pain or fear?"

Taste.....
81
@80

So animals deserve no rights at all? I should have the right to kick a dog if I feel like it? Or mangle a chicken just because?

If that's the way that you truly feel, then we clearly can't have an intelligent conversation and I'm done.
82
" I believe in compassion"

So you obviously support banning abortions after 6 months when fetuses can survive outside the womb.
83
@77

I think you're creating an inconsistency where one doesn't exist. The suggestion that I discourage people from eating meat but encourage abortions is false. I don't think abortion is "fine" just like I don't believe that the mutated chickens created for KFC are fine - I discourage both and would like to see more public education in ways to diminish them. It would be wonderful if everyone who was sexually active took birth control and removed the need for abortions; similarly I would be happy if most people gave up the meat in their diets. That is not the same as saying I want abortion to be illegal, nor do I think eating meat should be illegal.

@ 66

You're missing the actual point. It's not about drawing one single line for everyone. It's not about MY line as opposed to YOUR line, it's about living up the best I can to an ideal of non-suffering, a belief most people - when you get right down to it - actually identify with. Will animals, and hell possibly people, die from the result of my existence? Yes, but I will do what I can to decrease harm and increase compassion.

I mentioned in my previous post: for some, their belief in non-suffering stops at eating meat three times a week instead of everyday. I don't judge them, I encourage them. There is no master list, there is only the evidence you choose to research and the choices you decide to make everyday.

84
Vegans have lots of feel good rules, but it seems to boil down to. It's not okay to kill animals for food. But it's okay to kill them if they are icky, and they are in your house. Oh, and when they die in the harvest, transportation, and storage of food, that's acceptable too, as long as they the animals are left to rot. Well accept for the insects that are mixed in with all grains, dried fruit mixes, etc. But most importantly, only vegans are capable of determining when it's morally acceptable for animals to die. (Which is when they can pretend that they are not part of the killing and eating of animals.)
85
Eat what you want, I really don't a fuck. We are all going to die in 2012 per the Mayan calendar when The Frozen Beast awakes from his eternal slumber to feed on the living. Then shall it return to Valhalla and humanity will be forever lost.
86
" I'm done."

Until the next time you plan on interrupting a nice, quiet evening out at Lark I have with the family.

Can you tell me where you eat out so I can come ruin your dinner?
87
So is it ok to eat cows that die from natural causes? Or if I hit a deer with my car, can I eat it? Or if you want a scientific argument...

Salmon is a good source of omega-3 fatty acids, which are essential for brain function and development. Studies have suggested that supplementing with DHA, which is found in fish oil, is beneficial for the development and maintenance of memory performance

Including moderate portions of lean beef in your diet is beneficial in enhancing your memory because of its iron content, AskMen.com says. While most men get enough iron in their diet, those who are on a strict diet and are sticking mostly to chicken, egg whites and fish as sources of protein may be running a bit low. Iron deficiency can have a big impact on brain function and impair learning abilities, eventually putting you at an increased risk for developing Alzheimer's disease

Eggs are a terrific source of choline, as long as you consume the yolk with the egg white. So, when you have a mentally exhausting day coming up, try scrambling some eggs before heading off to work

Not my information.... it's taken from askmen.com. This is only information on brain health. You could go further and find more information.

Bottom line. I don't mess with vegans/vegetarians... as long as they don't mess with me.
88
"It's not about MY line as opposed to YOUR line"

Really Sam? So you don't support NARN's efforts to have the government outlaw my right to eat foie gras (your line) in Seattle?
89
Stupid White Man lives up to his name. Yay!
90
@perplexed I wouldn't be taking all of my nutritional advice from askmen.com and by the way, doctors were featured in cigarette ads up till the 1950's so I think it is also appropriate to sometimes question the sources of information as well. And you are more than welcome to question my beliefs, but I'm going to keep on believing them and talking about them. What I do know is that last time I ate fish was when I was about 5 years old. 20 years later, I feel extremely healthy, I'm the tallest person in my family and I graduated cum laude from college. I do get those nutrients though! Just not from fish. Eat walnuts, tofu, flaxseed oil, these all have omega-3 acids in them.

Iron you can get from soy, lentils, spinach, etc. So I get plenty of that as well. And protein is the same deal. As long as you eat healthy and diversify your food, you are going to be just fine as a vegan. And yes, meat does have those nutrients as well, but the fact of the matter is that if you share my view on the matter as far as ethics are concerned, then there is no need to eat meat because it is all available in non-animal sources.

And to my friend Stupid White Man, I'm not sure that I've weighed in on the foie gras debate...I'm also not sure that I've ever interrupted anyone's dinner...

Are you still on the side of being able to do whatever we want to all animals, because they have no rights?
91
"Are you still on the side of being able to do whatever we want to all animals, because they have no rights?"

I'll answer that one when you let me know at what month is it not ok to kill a baby in the womb. Unlike you, I accept the world is full of moral ambiguities so I won't impose my morality on you; unlike NARN which is trying to tell me what I can and cannot eat without fear of arrest in the city of Seattle.
92
@91 I don't think my being vegan necessarily impacts my views on abortion. I am not a woman, so I don't feel it appropriate to tell a woman what to do with her body. I agree with you that there is a difference between an embryo that is a week old and one that is 7 months old. I have absolutely no idea what the cutoff should be or even if there was one. Would I have a problem with someone saying that they wanted to end a pregnancy in the third term just because? Yes. But I don't think that that actually happens. Third trimester abortions as I said before happen extremely rarely, and really only happen because of extreme health issues for either the mother or the fetus. I'm also not sure that I want the government telling women what they can and cannot do with their own bodies.

To your point about government regulating what food you eat, I also am not sure on this. I think it's better that you don't but I don't know if a law will stop you, or is the best means of doing so.

I also don't think that I have put my morality on you. I've simply said what I believe, after it was brought up here.
93
@74 "When I grow up, I'm going to Bovine University!"
94
@ 90: "but the fact of the matter is that if you share my view on the matter as far as ethics are concerned"

but how far are you really in terms of ethics?

do you drive?
do you fly?
do you pay taxes?
do you own property/have investments or pension or pay for insurance?
you must have a computer, do you pay for internet access?

the reason I ask, is all of those could be called in some form, into question ethically, if you answered yes to any of those then it just looks like you are on a singular crusade, whilst ignoring some of your other ethical inconsistencies.

you are not as progressive as you think, you kind of seem like a preachy ass.
95
@93: "Heh heh heh. Ooh, yeah, right, Lisa. A wonderful, magical animal."
96
@94 Once again, as has been said here MANY times, Vegans do as much as they can to reduce suffering in the world, including of animals. Does this mean that it's perfect? No. But is it better than willfully torturing and killing animals? Yes. I said it before, just because I may accidentally step on an ant doesn't discount everything else I do in the interest of animals.

I actually don't own a car, and I walk as much as possible, same with flying. I recognize that my taxes go to things that I ethically disagree with, but I also campaign and vote against those that put those policies into place. I do not actually own property and I pay as much attention to where I invest the money I have as I can.

There are a ton of issues in this world that need to be dealt with, and none of us are perfect, nor can any of us individually fix these issues. But I can be conscious about all of them, and dedicate my time and money to as many as I possibly can. One of those things is not eating animal products.
97
would there be any fun in the world without over generalizations about subgroups? i think not. in my personal experience, omnivores are much more nosy about vegans diets than the other way around. i don't know any self righteous vegans or vegetarians, maybe there's this small group of annoying vegans that everyone seems to know and i just haven't met but i really think it's just a construct in people's minds. kind of like the news media having a general liberal bias, if you just say it enough people believe it even though there is no evidence of it. people love to point out one case as proof of an across the board trait.
98
"so I don't feel it appropriate to tell a woman what to do with her body"

Well I'm an evolutionary-determined omnivore who likes foie gras. Don't tell me what to do with my body.

"I also don't think that I have put my morality on you"

Do you support NARN? If you do, you are shoving your views down my throat because they are actively lobbying the city of Seattle to ban certain foods they find morally objectionable. NARN wants me to be arrested for buying foie gras. If that's not imposing your morality on me, what is?
99
Stupid White Man, fetuses aren't children. End of debate.
100
" i don't know any self righteous vegans or vegetarians,"

LMAO, next you're gonna tell us the same thing about Critical mAss cyclists.
101
@98 Again, I already said I don't think that a law is necessarily the best way of putting that policy into place. You are free to eat whatever you'd like, but in many cases I'm going to be on a different page than you. The only time I'm going to bring it up is if you ask me about it or in a forum like this which is clearly discussing the issue at hand.

You told me that if I answered your question you would answer mine about animals having rights, and if it is ok to kick a dog...

    Please wait...

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