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800 Maynard Ave S, Suite 200, Seattle, WA 98134
800 Maynard Ave S, Suite 200, Seattle, WA 98134
I guess what I'm saying is I don't think the letter writer should just tell this guy that if he's not in a relationship with her (him?) he's making a big mistake and he'll regret it forever. That's a little presumptuous.
Just thought I would relate your influence on me.
http://www.theonion.com/articles/fuckbud…
He doesn't want to marry you. How do people get this far? It's ridiculous.
You are. I agree with Dan that you don't always have to be, but it helps to not delude yourself about your starting position.
"We've been together two years and soon I'm going to be his wife!"
Two years too long. Run while you still have legs under you.
@9 Good analysis. BTB, listen to it. People who can't trust aren't trustworthy.
Straight guys and dykes:
Don't let a girl slut-shame you.
You want a full-blown relationship with emotional, intellectual and sexual connection, and she shows any hints of "Holyoke to bed, Smith to wed" (Western Mass joke)? DTMFA.
The baseline for respect is validating someone's story. Whatever else the hollering-and-deaf kid is doing, he's giving us his story. But sometimes women refuse to be that hollering-and-deaf kid so severely that they give no story of their own to associate with them. We see this in how Dan frequently gives advice to women to find out what they like sexually, and to tell their partner. Guys aren't like that. A guy should be afraid that years into a relationship, his partner finally develops her story of who they are, and that it has so little to do with his own story of their relationship, he may as well as have been the hollering-and-deaf kid all along.
This isn't to say there isn't slut-shaming. But there's also no defense against people feigning your own deafness, but still holding it against you. He shouldn't do the former to you, just like no one should do the latter to anyone.
Sounds like the dude was going through the old high school yearbook, and hitting on girls that he hadn't yet banged...you were in the H's or something.
You need to emphasize that if this guy doesn't want a relationship, SHE SHOULD WANT TO LOSE HIM. She's afraid to speak up because she'd rather settle for having him halfway than going for what she really wants and potentially scaring him out of her life. That's the wrong attitude.
Girl, if this guy is showing signs that he might not be into a relationship, and you're scared of losing him, you need to lose him. If he accepts your offer of a relationship, you got him; otherwise, cut your losses and run. Don't, under any circumstances, keep fucking him if he doesn't at least tell you he'd be open to a relationship.
What worries me is she says: "I don't know how to approach this subject without freaking him out. I don't want to lose him now that I have him in my life." That is the big ol red flag of someone who is willing to be strung along and hurt indefinitely. Don't let that shit into your life.
Want to feel like you're not just a booty call? Then start suggesting dates that aren't all about fucking. Get out of the house, go out to eat, see a movie/play/band, hit a bar and have a drunken discussion (and take a cab home).
If he likes you the non-sex dates will be just as fun and easy as the sex dates.
As for BTB I agree with #2. So obvious. Everybody I know who has been a cheater (or just someone who'd like to cheat but doesn't have the balls) ends up being that person who doesn't trust their spouse. Thieves think everybody steel, cheaters think everybody cheats.
For HOH, if he doesn't want a relationship, don't try to convince him. Don't try to manipulate him. 16 is right. If she scares him away by bringing up a relationship, she's the better for it, for not getting attached to someone who couldn't give her what she needed, in return.
Every girlfriend who accused me of being unfaithful-- every one -- cheated on me. (Since I've never cheated, I've never given an emotionally healthy person reason to suspect me of cheating.) CPOS are simply incapable of comprehending the ability to not cheat, and thus suspect everybody.
BTB - If he's treating you like this now, what shit will he try to pull after the wedding, or after 5 or 10 years of marriage? Get out now and find someone who doesn't force you to beg for his trust.
right up to the moment it no longer is.
but don't worry, Incredibly Hot Sex™ with whom/whatever you currently are infatuated with is a 100%Safe&Foolproof foundation upon which to build a lifelong relationship.....
2- Cheaters are cheaters. you. him.
expect it and you will not be disappointed.
1. Why is it that the people least affected by something, in your case "incredibly Hot Sex", are often the ones so vehemently against it?
2. Now I get it, good luck finding happiness with your narrow world view! Troll on!
Mostly, though, I'm incensed by the idea, which the LW has apparently internalized, that a willingness to have casual sex when single has anything to do with the ability to keep a monogamous commitment. Because clearly someone who would have sex for the sake of sex, as in a hookup, is an uncontrollable horn-dog and completely untrustworthy. Blekh. I can't believe Dan didn't yell about this more. She does need to DTMFA, but more importantly, she needs to stop believing this shit herself ("it was only this one time!").
Hoh should not try to have some heart-to-heart conversation about the relationship. That's too intimidating for the guy, even with the extra hook-ups. Instead, Hoh should slowly start trying to get him to do more and more things with outside of the bedroom. Eventually they will figure out they are good friends that also fuck. Then the heart-to-heart will happen. He might even bring it up.
#2 is the case where BTB should have a heart-to-heart. People are not perfect, and deserve a chance to change. Give the guy a chance to re-evaluate his double-standard.
you are so right.
everybody knows that promiscuous premarital sex is the best predictor of monogamous fidelity.
He is lacking in trust for her because she is, what in his eyes? Just like him. If he is a cheating piece of crap and sees his past as a sign of that then he is going to assume all people with a similar past are just as much of a cheating piece of crap.
Run from this guy. He is projecting his own crap onto you.
Both me and my partner were pretty slutty before we met. But we have never had problems trusting each other. We both know that despite that we were pretty much sluts before we met that we are still trust worthy. I know that I can be trusted despite how much I may have slept around before we met, and so I know that the fact that he slept around a bit before we met doesn't mean that he can't be trusted.
It's more than just a double standard this guy is displaying. It is an indication that he thinks that people who have had one night stands can't be trusted. Why? Obviously because he had one night stands and he knows he can't be trusted, and so thinks everyone who had one night stands can't be trusted either.
If he doesn't trust her because he thinks she's "easy," he's a hypocritical douchebag. He is exactly as "easy" as she is. If he thinks that easy is the same thing as untrustworthy, he is projecting, and she is probably the one at more risk of being cheated on.
as per btb, how do we know he sometimes doesn't trust her because they started as a one night stand (other than her use of 'because'..? does he explicitly state this? or is she/dan/us just assuming this? If they're right, then yes, he's a double-standard douche, but before DTMFA at least have one direct talk and say that the double standard is bullshit and he needs to stop if you're going to be together. If, however, this is just an assumption, then she's better having a direct "why do you feel like sometimes you can't trust me" and understand where this behavior is coming from. Maybe he has legitimate reason to have doubts but we don't know. Maybe he doesn't but regardless from what she writes, it's at least having one direct, call-him-on-it discussion before determining DTMFA...
I tend to think she should dump him. But at the very least, she needs to put the wedding on hold. If he had these doubts, he shouldn't have proposed or agreed to marry her. She should not marry someone who doesn't trust her. He shouldn't marry someone he doesn't trust. If she gives him a chance, he needs to decide either:
a. I am going to trust her; or
b. I do not trust her.
If the answer is A, he can marry her, but he can never bring up this issue with her again and he must suppress these doubts when they arise. If the answer is B, he breaks it off. He is emotionally immature and insecure, and he may be controlling or assholish as well. Even if his lack of trust stems from a previous bad experience, it does not excuse him for raising this issue or marrying her if he has doubts. His doubts are not fair, are hypocritical, and are lame.
Even if it's not a red flag that he's a cheater, it's a red flag that you shouldn't get married to that person.
It's only going to get worse post-marriage.
His response would be enlightening. A guy who is able and willing to examine his prejudices and change his mind is very much marriage material. If you have this conversation (in a relaxed way) and he comes back with any kind of bullshit, then Dan might be right.
A guy who gets engaged and on the cusp of marriage to someone he actively doesn't trust is not.
@21: Riddle me this, Alleged. If two single people spend a night fucking each other, who is being cheated on, hm?
When I was living in Amherst, it was "Smith to bed, Holyoke to wed".
BTB, sorry but you shouldn't consider putting up with slut shaming from anyone you would want to stay with. The person you should trust the most is using his own relationship with you against you. Flee.
Peace.
Elsewhere, I do not understand this urge to protect the poor delicate young 20-something male's fragile psyche by avoiding the word relationship. If you can't talk about the relationship you're having with your fuck buddy or no-sex-yet 15 year old girlfriend or all-night online scrabble partner, then you are probably too immature to be having those things. I'm not saying the talk might not be poorly conducted and turn into "but we're moving toward marriage, right?" or something else horrible. I'm not saying that the idea of just asking him for some non-sex (or not only sex) outings without the big talk is a bad strategy. But I just can't get on board with "You poor baby! Someone used the R-word in front of you!"
I was you, at age 20, it was indeed the BEST sex of my life at that point and *in a way* the best since. The part about it that I haven't been able to top? 100% pure years-confined adolescent lust for that guy, we had nothing else in common, or at least not as far as I knew. We didn't talk in high school and we didn't talk while we were hooking up either. After several ridiculously fun entanglements I caught my breath and started to wonder if this is all we had. And... yes, that was it, and the lack of communication was unfortunately a big part of what sustained the excitement. I've had better, deeper, more heady and more meaningful sex since with partners by connecting in a more mature way. But still no regrets and no pretending it wasn't the most exciting hookups ever.
That said, you have nothing to lose by asking your dude your question out loud. Something will change eventually, no matter what, so you should just step up and give it a shot. Just don't be surprised if that's the end of it all, it's still worth it. Like Dan says you might want to enjoy the sex while you can before taking the plunge.
And for the record, I agree with Dan about hookups having real relationship potential. My husband and I met one day, hooked up the next day after a night out, and a real relationship proceeded to unfold. However we were closer to 30 than 20 by the time that happened and the communication was real from hour 1, and that makes the sex and the life best.