Jan 22
waffle commented on Tuesday Morning News: Followed by Theater at the Butcher's.
It's rain_shadow_ meats.
Jan 19
waffle commented on If Only Someone At That Gun Show—and That Other Gun Show, and That Other Other Gun Show—Had Been Armed.
It just goes to show that guns are perfectly safe as long as theyre in the care of conscientious experts.
Dec 27, 2012
waffle commented on Nancy Thinks We're Being Too Mean to People with Guns.
Dipshit, if you want to try to make a point like "switzerland shows that gun ownership does not equate to gun crime," you are implicitly making a COMPARISON between switzerland and other COMPARABLE countries with presumably less/equal gun ownership but more gun crime. Without another country as a basis for comparison, you just have some statistics about switzerland which would be totally meaningless. How else do you define "low" crime or "high" crime?
So while you're apparently too stupid and/or lying to admit it, you ARE comparing switzerland to the US, and it's a fucking fruity comparison because switzerland is an animatronic clock with a lot of bank accounts and the US is a large, diverse country with an inequality problem.
Here, let me save you the trouble of replying: "same as it ever was, you think your opinion is more worthy than mine just because your opinion is backed by logic and data and mine is backed by irrational prejudices. in reality all opinions are equally valid and therefore we can't have any gun control because crazy peoples' opinions differ and the second amendment. straw man, x+1+1, something something, switzerland. thank you and good night."
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So while you're apparently too stupid and/or lying to admit it, you ARE comparing switzerland to the US, and it's a fucking fruity comparison because switzerland is an animatronic clock with a lot of bank accounts and the US is a large, diverse country with an inequality problem.
Here, let me save you the trouble of replying: "same as it ever was, you think your opinion is more worthy than mine just because your opinion is backed by logic and data and mine is backed by irrational prejudices. in reality all opinions are equally valid and therefore we can't have any gun control because crazy peoples' opinions differ and the second amendment. straw man, x+1+1, something something, switzerland. thank you and good night."
Dec 27, 2012
waffle commented on Nancy Thinks We're Being Too Mean to People with Guns.
Oh, for fuck's sake.
1. Switzerland is the 4th wealthiest country in the world, up there with Qatar and Luxembourg. Your link is "adjusted for purchasing power," which is beside the point.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cou…
2. Poverty rate in Switzerland is 7% compared to 15% in the US.
3. Income inequality in Switzerland is low, comparable to the UK/France. The US is medium high, comparable to the Philippines, Jamaica and Iran.
4. Unemployment in Switzerland is 3%. It's more than double that in the USA.
5. Switzerland is 93% German, French and Italian. It's extraordinarily homogenous so there's less ethnic conflict.
6-100. You can't possibly believe that an honest way to look at the preponderance of the data is to say, "oh, _Switzerland_ has lots of guns and low gun crime, and _Mexico_ has few guns and lots of gun crime, therefore guns and crime are in no way correlated!" Those two countries were deliberately chosen by fairly_unbalanced precisely because they're outliers from the general trend, which is more guns == more gun crime, with the USA at the extreme on both axes for wealthy first-world countries.
Why is Mexico an outlier? Oh, right, drug war.
Why is Switzerland an outlier? It's Disneyworld in country form, and as pointed out up-thread their gun ownership is part of a very well-regulated militia, not a bunch of rednecks with assault rifles.
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1. Switzerland is the 4th wealthiest country in the world, up there with Qatar and Luxembourg. Your link is "adjusted for purchasing power," which is beside the point.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cou…
2. Poverty rate in Switzerland is 7% compared to 15% in the US.
3. Income inequality in Switzerland is low, comparable to the UK/France. The US is medium high, comparable to the Philippines, Jamaica and Iran.
4. Unemployment in Switzerland is 3%. It's more than double that in the USA.
5. Switzerland is 93% German, French and Italian. It's extraordinarily homogenous so there's less ethnic conflict.
6-100. You can't possibly believe that an honest way to look at the preponderance of the data is to say, "oh, _Switzerland_ has lots of guns and low gun crime, and _Mexico_ has few guns and lots of gun crime, therefore guns and crime are in no way correlated!" Those two countries were deliberately chosen by fairly_unbalanced precisely because they're outliers from the general trend, which is more guns == more gun crime, with the USA at the extreme on both axes for wealthy first-world countries.
Why is Mexico an outlier? Oh, right, drug war.
Why is Switzerland an outlier? It's Disneyworld in country form, and as pointed out up-thread their gun ownership is part of a very well-regulated militia, not a bunch of rednecks with assault rifles.
Dec 27, 2012
waffle commented on Nancy Thinks We're Being Too Mean to People with Guns.
I understood the first time around what you were trying to say by citing Switzerland. It remains a bogus comparison. Switzerland is much wealthier than the us and would have fewer gun crimes regardless of gun laws, just like Mexico has more gun crime regardless of gun laws because it's a fucking drug war zone. You dolt.
That's not a straw man, it's you being either stupid or mendacious. I'm still waiting to here which.
That's not a straw man, it's you being either stupid or mendacious. I'm still waiting to here which.
Dec 27, 2012
waffle commented on Nancy Thinks We're Being Too Mean to People with Guns.
... and in case it was unclear, I am:
(B) ok with X deaths given a certain level of gun laws Y.
The US currently has a very, very high X and a very, very low Y. I believe there is majority support for lowering X by raising Y. That's my personal opinion. I find people who believe the opposite, given our current extremely high X and extremely low Y, pretty revolting. That is also a personal opinion.
Are we all in agreement about the meaning of "opinion" yet?
(B) ok with X deaths given a certain level of gun laws Y.
The US currently has a very, very high X and a very, very low Y. I believe there is majority support for lowering X by raising Y. That's my personal opinion. I find people who believe the opposite, given our current extremely high X and extremely low Y, pretty revolting. That is also a personal opinion.
Are we all in agreement about the meaning of "opinion" yet?
Dec 27, 2012
waffle commented on Nancy Thinks We're Being Too Mean to People with Guns.
@79 you correctly point out I am making fun of you. I was not trying to be undercover about it.
As long as you keep making assertions that aren't based on evidence, I'm going to keep calling you paranoid/irrational/dim-witted. For instance, repeatedly citing Switzerland as a model for the US: you're either intentionally trying to trick people with a comparison you know is bogus, or you're dimwitted enough to believe it's apt. Which one is it?
The US has the most permissive gun laws of any G20 country, and only Brazil and Mexico beat us on gun violence. It's not opinion but common sense that a move away from permissiveness would shift the US closer to the better outcomes enjoyed by those other 17 countries, and that nothing disastrous would happen as a result because it hasn't in any of the 19 countries that have tried it. The part that's my OPINION is that given the above, stricter regulation would be a good idea rather than a bad idea. I come to that opinion because I value the lives of children more highly than I value the gun-boners of paranoid weirdoes like you.
You are entitled to draw your own conclusion, but when you start saying that we can't possibly add one more gun law because creeping fascism and Switzerland, then you're just being a nutter.
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As long as you keep making assertions that aren't based on evidence, I'm going to keep calling you paranoid/irrational/dim-witted. For instance, repeatedly citing Switzerland as a model for the US: you're either intentionally trying to trick people with a comparison you know is bogus, or you're dimwitted enough to believe it's apt. Which one is it?
The US has the most permissive gun laws of any G20 country, and only Brazil and Mexico beat us on gun violence. It's not opinion but common sense that a move away from permissiveness would shift the US closer to the better outcomes enjoyed by those other 17 countries, and that nothing disastrous would happen as a result because it hasn't in any of the 19 countries that have tried it. The part that's my OPINION is that given the above, stricter regulation would be a good idea rather than a bad idea. I come to that opinion because I value the lives of children more highly than I value the gun-boners of paranoid weirdoes like you.
You are entitled to draw your own conclusion, but when you start saying that we can't possibly add one more gun law because creeping fascism and Switzerland, then you're just being a nutter.
Dec 27, 2012
waffle commented on Nancy Thinks We're Being Too Mean to People with Guns.
@71
Of course it's an opinion, you simpleton! We're arguing about public policy here. There's no such thing as an objectively correct policy. But it doesn't follow that all opinions are equally valid -- some opinions are supported by mounds of evidence from all the countries that have had success with stricter gun regulation. Other opinions -- like "any additional gun regulation will always lead to calls for even more gun regulation until something terrible happens!" -- are not supported by any evidence at all, just your paranoid fantasies.
If the majority of Americans agree with the opinion that "more gun regulation in exchange for less gun violence would be a good trade-off," then we can ban your silly gun the same way we can ban knives on airplanes despite your God-given constitushnal' right to bear arms.
Also, let me respond in advance for you: "But SWITZERLAND!!!" Next you will prove that sugar can't possibly contribute to diabetes because Usain Bolt likes Cocoa Puffs.
Of course it's an opinion, you simpleton! We're arguing about public policy here. There's no such thing as an objectively correct policy. But it doesn't follow that all opinions are equally valid -- some opinions are supported by mounds of evidence from all the countries that have had success with stricter gun regulation. Other opinions -- like "any additional gun regulation will always lead to calls for even more gun regulation until something terrible happens!" -- are not supported by any evidence at all, just your paranoid fantasies.
If the majority of Americans agree with the opinion that "more gun regulation in exchange for less gun violence would be a good trade-off," then we can ban your silly gun the same way we can ban knives on airplanes despite your God-given constitushnal' right to bear arms.
Also, let me respond in advance for you: "But SWITZERLAND!!!" Next you will prove that sugar can't possibly contribute to diabetes because Usain Bolt likes Cocoa Puffs.
Dec 27, 2012
waffle commented on Nancy Thinks We're Being Too Mean to People with Guns.
@66 you keep arguing slippery slope, so let's repeat: EVERY OTHER first world country has stricter gun laws than the US. EVERY ONE has fewer guns per capita.
If the game we're playing is "let's choose the acceptable # of gun deaths to trade off against the acceptable amount of regulation," then judging by the rest of the world we're nowhere near the sweet spot.
What percentage of America do you think agrees with the statement "I value Nancy Lanza's right to her crazy, suicidal arsenal more than I value the lives of 20 children?" I'm all for having that vote.
Let's call it "gun security." Right-wingers love "security," right? We can get those fabled "security moms" in on this.
If the game we're playing is "let's choose the acceptable # of gun deaths to trade off against the acceptable amount of regulation," then judging by the rest of the world we're nowhere near the sweet spot.
What percentage of America do you think agrees with the statement "I value Nancy Lanza's right to her crazy, suicidal arsenal more than I value the lives of 20 children?" I'm all for having that vote.
Let's call it "gun security." Right-wingers love "security," right? We can get those fabled "security moms" in on this.
Dec 27, 2012
waffle commented on Nancy Thinks We're Being Too Mean to People with Guns.
Wait, really @35? Your idea of an argument is "let me cherry-pick one country with tight gun laws [... also the world capital of drug trafficking, but let's leave that out] and one country with slightly looser laws [... also the fourth-wealthiest country in the world per-capita, also notoriously small and homogenous, but let's leave that out too] to make the point that ..." what exactly? Gun control isn't so powerful a force that its effects overwhelm every other contributing factor in predicting crime?
Devastating!
How about if we look at ALL the comparable countries and then you try to argue there isn't a trend with the US (most guns per capita! gun crime levels comparable to third-world countries!) as an extreme outlier.
Devastating!
How about if we look at ALL the comparable countries and then you try to argue there isn't a trend with the US (most guns per capita! gun crime levels comparable to third-world countries!) as an extreme outlier.
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