Did she take any action? Did she complain to HR? Did she contact a reporter? Did she reach out at all?

Being silent and complicit is almost as bad as being the perpetrator.

Man, if Seattle's the most sexist place she's ever lived, she's in for a rude awakening.

@2/3: I mean

* Obviously some shitty events occurred
* Seattle can and should do better

I'd rather we just improved the tech culture rather than tell her her perspective is inaccurate?

Even if you feel it's not the worst, we have a long way to go to be the best. Shouldn't we just long for better?

@1,

HR does not represent the interests of the employees. HR represents the interests of the company. After all it is a department of that company, who who else would it represent?

She should reach out to the shop steward. Not every union is a good one. ASFSCME, for example, will never, ever strike. That was the grand bargain they struck with Gregoire. She made state employment a closed shop, and in return, the union agreed too all manner of concessions, such as a never-strike policy, a six month probationary period which can be extended to a full year on the whim of the supervisor, not even bothering to ask for a COLA unless the state is running a surplus. If you want to file a grievance, however, they will fight like hell to back you up, every step of the way. And if you come to them early with a problem, they will offer you invaluable advise on how to stay in the game.

I know its easy to play "blame the victim". Your earlier posts seem to indicate you're a fairly conservative sort of person, so I'm guessing you're not fond of unions (I could be wrong here-there are conservatives who are pro-union. Just ask any cop). That said, HR is not really working in your best interest as an employee. Especially not if your best interests conflict with that of senior staff or the company itself. Look at the way Uber treats its drivers, and you'll see what I mean. If you want someone in your corner, you need to go outside the company.

@5: There are no unions in Microsoft, Google, Amazon, or whatever "well-known software company" she is referring to.

Your opinions of HR are not always valid. I know Microsoft's HR department takes these things very seriously.

I'm just saying she should have spoken up, so don't twist that around and say that I'm blaming the victim.

@6,

I'm willing to accept that some HR departments are better than others. However, let's also keep in mind that tech encompasses a lot of things. Some folks consider Uber a tech company too, and you can see what their HR department is like. And even at Microsoft, a lot of those guys are contractors (Orange Badge vs Blue Badge) and can be dismissed on a whim. Many are actually subcontractors who work for companies like Aquent, where complaining just gets you fired.

And if you work under those circumstances, speaking up is actually a terrible idea. That's why I suggested a shop steward. Even lackluster unions like AFSCME (I cited them because they actually suck, as far as unions go. If I had cherry picked a really strong union (like SEIU), someone could reasonably say I shouldn't base my argument in favor of going to the shop steward on an example of one that works for a really good union. So I picked the worst I could think of.) will go to bat for you in ways HR won't.

Now, if there's no union at all, it's time to organize. That's allot easier said than done. Amazon will fire you if they catch on, and fight like hell against any organizing. But it sure beats tapping out a complaint on I, Anonymous.

I guess in that sense, you and I agree. She should have said something. While you hold she should have said it to HR, I hold that she should have said it top the union, and if there wasn't one, use that frustration and channel it into creating a union. Whether she says it through bullhorn or HR form, it is better than remaining Anonymous.

We can say she "should have" made a stink, and that would be nice for the next person, but it likely would get her nothing except blackballed from the industry, which she says she's still trying to work in.

From what I've heard in the Seattle software industry, all of the big companies are... different but none are what you'd call good. Some small companies are flat-out terrible (no HR to even keep an abuser rational), some say the right things from high up, so that may be the best option, but I'm not aware of any that have been publicly seen to put their actions in line. Interested to hear any counterexamples.

Anonymous probably knows all that, but it doesn't seem like everybody does.

On reread, what the hell, "almost as bad as being the perpetrator"? Really seriously that's what you want to be thinking?

Let me say this: I have personally never seen a case of "this abuser got away with it for too long because victims didn't report." I have seen lots of cases where they did report but it wasn't adequately acted on. That is what I'd call almost as bad. I get that reporting is a benefit to the rest of society, but the fact is it's rarely the limiting factor in busting abusers.

With a response like that "Being silent and complicit is almost as bad as being the perpetrator." "Pheobe" in Wallingford is probably one of the ones who harassed or propositioned the author, or at the very least is a wholly privileged asshole.

@1 going to HR will get you fired. Period. Been there done that (more than once). HR exists to protect the company, period. Also, if you are going to file a lawsuit, be prepared to lose. Companies like this (let's use Amazon as a hypothetical example) have a FLANK of lawyers at their disposal and nothing but time to wait you out, wear you down, take you for everything you have, and in the end you will lose. I've witnessed it. As someone who as been bullied by a female manager, been fired by an employer for getting sick with a serious illness (even while having an outside advocate and knowing full well the company I worked for was violating the law when they fired me), and as a witness to other women being abused, harassed, intimidated, bullied, beaten down, and fired I say firmly that it is not as easy as you think to report these things. Should people speak up? Absolutely. When the ACLU asked for submissions about gender discrimination against Amazon.com I know personally people who told them their stories. Notice nothing has happened. Nothing has happened because not enough people were willing to go on record with regard to what happened to them at Amazon or what they witnessed happen to others at Amazon. Period.

Finally, how many stories by women do we have to hear from so-called progressive enclaves that tell the same story of sexism? San Francisco, Seattle, Portland (to only name three) claim to be so forward thinking, so post-everything (racial, feminist, classist, whatever) when in reality they harbor so much of the same deep and destructive violence of the body and spirit against women, people of color, non cis heterosexual males, poor people, etc. Every time I hear "bullshit" with regard to a story like this or "why didn't THEY do blah blah blah" it reminds me that our society is wholly complicit in not only perpetuating the white supremacist racist heterosexual patriarchy, but fabricating a mask to pretend that it doesn't exist because denial is so much easier than facing it, changing it, growing, evolving, adapting, and moving forward. Humanity is a lost cause. It's seriously time for our extinction event. How many thousands of years have had to get a clue? We are the only species that harms our own kind for pleasure and profit. We are the only species that fouls our nest (there is no planet B, people). I love Seattle (just like I love New York and I love Portland) but the prevalence of white supremacist racism, misogyny, and classism in these places is just as bad as it is in the flyover states, it's just dressed up differently and fiercely denied.

The tech industry sucks, rarely pays fairly for the work done, is sexist and mysoginistic even though my boss is a woman

Every corporate officer (including the head of HR) has only one legal responsibility- the fiduciary responsibility (enforceable by law- they can go to jail if they don't do this) to the shareholders. Not the employees- there is not federal mandate requiring the HR department to serve the best interests of the employees at all. There is a federal mandate to serve the shareholders. Not you. The shareholders.

That means, if your best interests do not align with that of the shareholders- you lose. Always. It does not matter which company you work for. Now, some companies are more aggressive than others. Uber, for example, explicitly tells employee that it is an aggressive, transgressive company that is perfectly willing to step not only on your toes to get a profit, but your neck too, if need be.

Complaining to HR only works if and when your complaint is about something that could damage the bottom line. Not your bottom, the bottom line of the company. So don't think HR is there to save your ass. They are not.

The union, however, is.

Washington is a "At Will" State. She can fired at anytime. Without cause, or Prior Notice. When she says she cant be fired. Sounds kinda not true.

@14, you keep coming back to the "union" solution. I don't think you fully understand how incredibly rare unions are in tech. Not just in Seattle, but everywhere in the country. I agree as an industry we should start unionizing, but it's a huge uphill battle. There is basically no precedent for a tech company becoming a union shop, and suggesting that the proper course of action for an individual victim of workplace harassment is to form a union, is like telling a flood victim to terraform Mars and move there instead.

Why are so many of you assuming she didn't go to HR? And, once you've made that mental leap, why are you yelling at her on the internet for this transgression you have just decided she committed?

If you're making unfounded assumptions, try being a little nicer to the person you're assuming all kinds of crap about. You're telling her that she's almost as bad as the people hurting her, with no evidence at all that your first assumption is correct.

@17 tldr: "when i hear about bias, and I wasn't present and don't know what happened, I have such negative feelings I need to tell myself a lot about how I think it should have happened."

Anybody with this many problems may be part of the overall problem. Not defending the ways she has been treated, yet suspect there's more, much more, to this story.

@17 Spoken like someone who doesn't know or talk to any women or minorities. Your comment only proves the author's point. Just because she is a woman, you immediately assume she can't possibly be competent at her job. I'll just attribute your ignorance to your being young and inexperienced.

@15 Federal law supersedes state law, so you're assumptions are kinda not right.

@17 When someone brings up the reality of sexism and racism in the workplace your spidey-senses start to tingle? I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you're a white man, that you have no idea what systematic racism and sexism feel like, that on some level you don't believe that those things are as prevalent as they actually are and that maintaining that ignorant mindset makes your life more comfortable. If women just have a chip on their shoulder then you're off the hook for all of your misogynistic bullshit, right?

This doesn't ring true. I've worked with women, for women in tech jobs for large/small companies and the government. The described behavior wouldn't happen at the job level described. Would be way more subtle (not true when dealing with higher levels - Google Larry Ellison). Think race might be more of a factor. HR is never a help. Their sole purpose is to protect the company. Best practice is to bide your time, network within/outside company to change positions and ensure entrusted coworkers know why. Eventually their balls will wither and their position will be eliminated.

@23 Federal law is at will too, with a few exceptions

@15 State law may not prohibit firing without cause, but nothing in state law prevents a contract with tenure.

Discrimination of a class is federally protected and if you report bias, a company cannot fire you for reporting it and can be sued if they do. Even in at will states. Even in nonunion places. You do not sign away your federal protections against discrimination by living in Washington state.

Most of the people here are ignorant and assuming the law, not knowing the law.

Yes. What she describes does happen. Yes. Even at "top" companies.

Yes. HR does NOT protect workers against discrimination or hostile environments, but works to reduce litigation.

Get legal advice and good legal advice BEFORE going to HR. Yes, you must go to HR as a part of your due diligence if you want to pursue a case. But NO. Don't go without legal advice. Bear in mind, HR takes courses in how to lead an employee to tell them everything and paint it as negative to the employee as possible. They take training in leading the employee to trust them and that is what will probably happen for the first meeting. They will take down everything said and spin it and likely lie later. They are trained in doing "leading questions" and for you to give details and admissions they can use against you later while appearing "helpful." Employees get no defensive training.

Go get good legal advice. Never take advice from an HR person or a business columnist who represents HR people. Do everything of your account in writing completely before the HR meeting and deliver in email and get a lawyer to review it - or even an ex-HR person. Do not do it verbally so it can be twisted later. If they ask you a question, you do not have to answer. You can always say "I have to think about that." You do not have to sign anything or answer questions, even if they emotionally manipulate you. You can ask for your lawyer to be present in person or on the phone. They do not have to talk to you though if you bring a lawyer.

Bring up "hostile work environment." Also, if a co-worker appears mentally unstable or appears to be under the influence. All will require they take action to protect you - or seem to. Beware if the thing is to isolate you. Continue to interact with people fully on business, do not shrink on your job.

NEVER agree to meet with the person you are complaining about without HR present. NEVER. No hallways. No taunts about you reporting them. Do nothing and react no way to any thing the person does to engage you or to have outside of work contact or have contact through a message through a third person. No talking as you park your car. NONE. This can only end badly for you and the account of the exchange will be to paint you as unstable and awful no matter whatever happens.

In your HR account, do not guess at the motives of another, tell a personal back story, or make any excuses for yourself or others like a good girl. No "maybe I got it wrong - or misinterpreted..." comments like a good girl would to half apologize. No apologies in your account. Just as little information as possible. The facts and all of them - dates, times, etc - because adding later is suspect. You can add other incidents, but not to add about THE incident. Remember, to some degree, you can always add backstory later for items on context, you just can't take away.

Likely, they will say they will investigate and you are not to talk to anyone about it. Don't talk to anyone employed there - but people can ask and beware - some surprising people you trusted will turn on you in their accounts. Take great care in what you say to others if you want a case. They probably will be able to monitor your emails, chat, etc and will start. And calls on your business phone, even cellular as to who you call if it is a business phone. Do not use your business computer for anything to discuss the case or situation, except to do official emails. Let them wonder what's happening.

Be aware, there is NO engagement to HR that won't get back to your manager or his or her manager and is not documented in your record, no matter how friendly the person is or if they promised you can speak secretly. When you engage HR, it's serious.

I have seen cases where HR protected an employee. Usually because, this was not the first offense for an offender and now they are worried about legal exposure. Sometimes, there are HR people who have some power and are effective and do the right thing. But it will be a gamble to complain about a person. If you don't think that THEIR manager - the manager of the person you are complaining about will do anything your chances for a correction drops because HR often asks the Director or manager what they want to do about it and won't do anything they don't want to do. However, if they think this is a legal risk, they will tell a VP and that VP may make them correct it. You may or may not survive long term. It can work out. It might not. Be prepared to get another job but know that in your reporting it and doing it in a way that can be taken seriously - if this person continues to get reported, eventually the company will do something as reports pile up. Even if the offender is related to the owner, no company wants this liability and he will be watched or moved. If you leave the job, you might want to make sure people on the high levels know about your complaint. HR could have kept this from them. Exit interviews are useless. Totally useless. Say what you want to say to the Bosses' boss on your way out if you want to say something and do it directly to them - verbally or in writing. Preferably both.