Slog Comments
The 4-Day School Week: Republican Education "Reform" in Action
1
Lets face it though, for many parents school is a ages 4 through 18 day care center. Is everyone paying fair value for the service? 4 days might be a good solution if augmented with a lot of webucation and self driven projects ala Evergreen.
2
On the bright side, the coming generation of kids who graduate from 4-day-week school systems will increase America's pool of poorly educated, unskilled labor desperate for any job, at any wage. With enough Americans incapable of doing any but the worst kind of work under the most unspeakable conditions, the flood of illegal immigrants will dry up, unable to compete against Eatonville kids for lowly jobs. Eventually, even sweatshop and borderline-slave-labor factory jobs will flow into, not out of, Pierce County.
Yeah, China, you heard me. Suck on that.
Let's think big, though, shall we? Do I hear a 3 day school week? Three days anybody? Anybody?
Yeah, China, you heard me. Suck on that.
Let's think big, though, shall we? Do I hear a 3 day school week? Three days anybody? Anybody?
3
"when Republicans talk about reform, they're most talking about reducing or eliminating government services"
It seems to me, that whatever we're talking about, whenever I save $1 on taxes, it ends up costing me $2 or $3 out of pocket in increased "private economy" costs.
I'm not opposed to government efficiency, I just define it differently than the Repugnicants do. My definition is whatever provides me the most goods and services at the least out-of-pocket cost, which is almost always the exact opposite of whatever the Repugs are supporting.
It seems to me, that whatever we're talking about, whenever I save $1 on taxes, it ends up costing me $2 or $3 out of pocket in increased "private economy" costs.
I'm not opposed to government efficiency, I just define it differently than the Repugnicants do. My definition is whatever provides me the most goods and services at the least out-of-pocket cost, which is almost always the exact opposite of whatever the Repugs are supporting.
4
Driven by financial concerns rather than...
What isn't driven by financial concerns? So, if the evidence is that this results in improved academic performance via e.g. reduced absenteeism then it's a bad thing because of Republican philosophy and tactics that have what to do with the Eatonville school district? C'mon, Goldy, at least try.
What isn't driven by financial concerns? So, if the evidence is that this results in improved academic performance via e.g. reduced absenteeism then it's a bad thing because of Republican philosophy and tactics that have what to do with the Eatonville school district? C'mon, Goldy, at least try.
6
There is a district here in Louisiana, St. Helena Parish, that moved to that a couple years ago for budgetary reasons. Not coincidentally, in my opinion, they are the district with the highest poverty rate and lowest performing schools. Also not coincidentally, in this very partisan and racist state, their racial makeup is mostly black, and their politics are mostly Democratic. Therefore, they have absolutely no voice in state government.
7
Yeah, but if everyone did as the Republicans told them to do, there'd be a mom at home every day to take care of the kids.
9
So! From a greater-metro-area-public-school-teacher:
1) We could look at this academically, and say that 4 longer days give a similar number of hours, but if the kids can focus for that long, shouldn't we be in school for the extended hours and 5 days?
2) To save the most money, they'll likely be closing the school on Monday or Friday (to combat the heating/cooling costs, etc). But the longer you're away from input, the faster you forget it (I believe increasingly as time goes. So you forget more on the second day than you did on the first, more on the third, etc). Really, then, you should have the day off be on Wednesday. But as Goldy says, if the reform is based on money, that seems unlikely.
3) @4: Some people would have those things that are in the public's interest (clean water, schooling, certain - if not all - environmental regs) be pushed to a high standard before figuring the cost. Especially in the case of teaching (and unlike something like water), where the ROI is set so far away in time from the outlay that it can be difficult for any of us to directly map the effects it is having.
m!
1) We could look at this academically, and say that 4 longer days give a similar number of hours, but if the kids can focus for that long, shouldn't we be in school for the extended hours and 5 days?
2) To save the most money, they'll likely be closing the school on Monday or Friday (to combat the heating/cooling costs, etc). But the longer you're away from input, the faster you forget it (I believe increasingly as time goes. So you forget more on the second day than you did on the first, more on the third, etc). Really, then, you should have the day off be on Wednesday. But as Goldy says, if the reform is based on money, that seems unlikely.
3) @4: Some people would have those things that are in the public's interest (clean water, schooling, certain - if not all - environmental regs) be pushed to a high standard before figuring the cost. Especially in the case of teaching (and unlike something like water), where the ROI is set so far away in time from the outlay that it can be difficult for any of us to directly map the effects it is having.
m!
10
a 4 day school week with longer days. Sounds like while the number of days of attendance will be reduced, the total numbers of attendance will remain the same. This is not automatically a reduction in education, provided that the scheduling of the 4 days is designed to maximize instruction. And the trade off to maintain full day kindergarten is well worth it.
This is the kind of shit compromises a district has to make when referendums for additional funding get voted down.
This is the kind of shit compromises a district has to make when referendums for additional funding get voted down.
11
Oh! And!
In reaction to a friend asking me about my pay in student-hours, I looked at my class load (admittedly large - I'm a music teacher and sometimes have large class sizes), hours a day I was with students (not including prep, etc) and figured those into my salary. The realization was that each student I see essentially pays me 50 cents for every hour they are in my classroom.
If parents want to save money, they should be petitioning to have the schools have longer days, and maybe throw some time in on Saturday. Plus, you know, there are probably some other benefits there. Like educating students.
Sorry for posting twice in a row!
m!
In reaction to a friend asking me about my pay in student-hours, I looked at my class load (admittedly large - I'm a music teacher and sometimes have large class sizes), hours a day I was with students (not including prep, etc) and figured those into my salary. The realization was that each student I see essentially pays me 50 cents for every hour they are in my classroom.
If parents want to save money, they should be petitioning to have the schools have longer days, and maybe throw some time in on Saturday. Plus, you know, there are probably some other benefits there. Like educating students.
Sorry for posting twice in a row!
m!
12
First they came for mental health services but I wasn't mentally ill so I so I took my tax cut and didn't say anything. Then they cut public health services for people below the poverty line but I wasn't below the poverty line so I took my tax cut and didn't say anything. Then they came for public education but I didn't have kids in public schools so I took my tax cut and didn't say anything. Then I got old and didn't have a pension and I went down to the government office to get my Social Security check and they said "Oh, that? We spent that years ago paying for tax cuts!" and by then there was nothing anybody could do about it.
On my way home I was stabbed by an illiterate mentally ill vagrant with diptheria, and the emergency room refused to take me...
On my way home I was stabbed by an illiterate mentally ill vagrant with diptheria, and the emergency room refused to take me...
13
Let em do it, I say. They're only breeding more Seattle-hating dittoheads, why should we give a shit?
14
"...for many parents school is a ages 4 through 18 day care center. "@1
Really and your proof of that is...?
Many parents don't care about their children being educated?
I have to wonder where you get your information.
Really and your proof of that is...?
Many parents don't care about their children being educated?
I have to wonder where you get your information.
15
Here in Spokatropolis the commenters love to say that there's no correlation between student performance and class size, or between student performance and teacher pay, or between student performance and tax $$$ expenditure per student... so it wouldn't be a big stretch to say that there's no correlation between student performance and the actual amount of school attended. *sigh*
16
Meh, you might as well close down public schools entirely because that's what Republicans will eventually do anyway. They've already hamstrung them to the point of uselessness as it is.
18
This is truly a terrible and shortsighted idea. There is plenty of in research that shows a strong correlation between the number of days in school and academic achievement. Furthermore, it is one thing that can make a significant difference in making up the achievement gap between rich and poor kids.
Anyone that follows education knows about this. Republicans clearly care more about lower taxes than actual academic achievement in our public schools. Assholes.
Anyone that follows education knows about this. Republicans clearly care more about lower taxes than actual academic achievement in our public schools. Assholes.
20
Oh well good, let's cut some of that wasteful spending and help shrink big government! Fuck those underage parasites, anyway. They aren't entitled to handouts any more than any other man! If they want an education, they should get an education and work for their money so they can afford an education, just like anyone else.
Besides, ignorant people vote Republican, so frankly it's both a practical and a philosophical victory!
Besides, ignorant people vote Republican, so frankly it's both a practical and a philosophical victory!
22
I can see the benefits of offering a reduced work week to adults who should be able to predict how well they'll cope squeezing in an extra hour or two into a workday, equalling the number of hours they worked in a 5-day week (though self-prediction isn't always reliable).
But, considering that children already have attention spans of a gnat, thanks to brains that are overly-stimulated by TV and videogames (not to think but to consume), how well are they going to learn when they're stuck in school during a lengthier day? I could definitely see an additional recess being required (uh ... do schools still have those?).
But, considering that children already have attention spans of a gnat, thanks to brains that are overly-stimulated by TV and videogames (not to think but to consume), how well are they going to learn when they're stuck in school during a lengthier day? I could definitely see an additional recess being required (uh ... do schools still have those?).
24
And won't this just shift some of the costs back onto parents in two-income households, who will now have to pay for 30 days of childcare?One in four U.S. schoolchildren are being raised in single-parent (thus, single-income) households.
Just sayin'.
25
Only two-income households need be concerned about the extra costs of child care? Children growing up in single-parent households are already far more likely to be living in poverty, this kind of plan places an enormous burden on the people who can least afford it.
27
@24, 25, 26: Yup. That was a poorly thought out shortcut on my part, meant to distinguish from families with a stay-at-home parent. So I just struck out that superfluous wording.
29
I can't imagine elementary age kids paying attention through that whole day without an extra recess, but that's impossible because they need the instruction hour. It's going to hurt everything except the bottom line. This is the kind of thinking you get when people think government should be run like a business.
30
@10 Kids, including right up through juniors in HS, can't really concentrate for the whole length of school now.
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