Slog Comments
Hey, Europe! How's That Austerity Working Out for You?
2
Austerity works great, but only when you need to lower interest rates. If you have already artificially set interest rates at basically zero, all austerity does is further stagnate the economy.
What a surprise: if you take the biggest, and sometimes only, investor out of the picture, the economy does not improve. The stimulus was too small, and could only serve to slow the decline, not put a bottom under it.
Just glad for our country's economic and politcal sake that the economy is sluggishly improving. History tells us the economy will not regain its current strength until about 2017, if everything keeps going as it is.
What a surprise: if you take the biggest, and sometimes only, investor out of the picture, the economy does not improve. The stimulus was too small, and could only serve to slow the decline, not put a bottom under it.
Just glad for our country's economic and politcal sake that the economy is sluggishly improving. History tells us the economy will not regain its current strength until about 2017, if everything keeps going as it is.
3
@2: I keep hearing about how long it will take for the US economy to regain its former strength. But is that a fair measure, considering our former apparent economic strength was all coked up on a real estate bubble?
4
But you know, modern governments are big, so if we shrink them, then magic market confidence something something.
5
@4 The reason you think it requires magic is that you don't understand that "shrink" is a code-word of specific meaning.
Notice that they are working to remove regulations for big business, but not subsidies. Notice that the tax burden isn't so much lowered as shifted down the ladder towards those without lobbyists or huge campaign donation capability.
Ultimately, this isn't about growing the pie or even making sure that we'll have pie in a generation or two, this is simply about grabbing as big of a share of it in the short run as possible.
Notice that they are working to remove regulations for big business, but not subsidies. Notice that the tax burden isn't so much lowered as shifted down the ladder towards those without lobbyists or huge campaign donation capability.
Ultimately, this isn't about growing the pie or even making sure that we'll have pie in a generation or two, this is simply about grabbing as big of a share of it in the short run as possible.
6
Austerity, like all other IMF Chicago school of economics concepts, is a net drag on both the GDP and employment.
Period.
Always has been.
Always will be.
Just say no to Gold Bugs!
Period.
Always has been.
Always will be.
Just say no to Gold Bugs!
7
Republicans say that but don't actually do it.
The republican party is the party of Big Government, out-of-control-spending, raising taxes, and moving power away from the states and into the federal level. Just look at their history.
How they convinced everyone that they're the opposite of that astounds me.
The republican party is the party of Big Government, out-of-control-spending, raising taxes, and moving power away from the states and into the federal level. Just look at their history.
How they convinced everyone that they're the opposite of that astounds me.
8
Adding some situational awareness to what @2 said about austerity lowering interest rates...
The Germans fear inflation above all else. The Germans control the central bank. The German economy didn't get hit as badly as everyone else so naturally they don't see a problem with the austerity measures imposed on everyone else.
The Germans fear inflation above all else. The Germans control the central bank. The German economy didn't get hit as badly as everyone else so naturally they don't see a problem with the austerity measures imposed on everyone else.
10
Nobody should believe that we don't have austerity in the US. Over the last 4 months of 2011, 100% of job loss is due to budget cuts at the state and federal level. Instead of crowing about unemployment levels going down (while employment levels are more or less stagnant), libs would be better off pointing out that cuts to public budgets are undermining our ability to recover.
11
Keep saying it Goldy. Loud and often. It's another Republican red herring. Same as the rest of their ridiculous and failed ideology.
12
@9:
Bullshit. Obama's stimulus, weak as it may have been, didn't DELAY anything, for the simple fact that, if a Republican had been in the White House for the past four years, we'd probably be in a full-out depression right now, in large part precisely BECAUSE of the GOP mantra of "shrink the Gubbamint Uber Alles".
Bullshit. Obama's stimulus, weak as it may have been, didn't DELAY anything, for the simple fact that, if a Republican had been in the White House for the past four years, we'd probably be in a full-out depression right now, in large part precisely BECAUSE of the GOP mantra of "shrink the Gubbamint Uber Alles".
14
@3: You certainly make a valid point, and of course no one knows for sure. Since we really can only guess at the future, it makes the most sense to me to apply the lessons learned from the past. With industrial purchasing, and employment going up regularly though, it appears to me we are on a pretty steady path, save an unforeseen catastrophe (like the GOP taking back the white house, or a total european crash).
I recently heard on NPR that people are buying houses and land at increased rates, which is an excellent indicator that things are slowly getting back to "normal." But a counterpoint to that would be the mild winter not putting a kibosh on people doing business, as cold, snowy winters often do.
I recently heard on NPR that people are buying houses and land at increased rates, which is an excellent indicator that things are slowly getting back to "normal." But a counterpoint to that would be the mild winter not putting a kibosh on people doing business, as cold, snowy winters often do.
15
@9, I'd love to hear how a Republican administration would have fixed this almost before the crash.
The Republican solution to the problem they created by encouraging the housing bubble and stripping regulators of any enforcement resources was austerity. The evidence is that the Republicans wanted a Depression in order to create a huge poor class and deprive them of Social Security, medicare, any rights to organize and any sort of workplace safety. The Republican goal is to turn the US into a state like China.
The Republican solution to the problem they created by encouraging the housing bubble and stripping regulators of any enforcement resources was austerity. The evidence is that the Republicans wanted a Depression in order to create a huge poor class and deprive them of Social Security, medicare, any rights to organize and any sort of workplace safety. The Republican goal is to turn the US into a state like China.
16
Privatized profits, socialized losses. Whoops, did I say "socialized losses?" I meant "austerity."
17
... well we don't ... ehm I think you mean "hey anyone still listening to the IMF (or being forced to)"?
Our economy is better than yours for the moment but give our right wing government here in Sweden a few years and they will probably screw that up (they have already privatized allot of schools, doctors and trainssystems - our trains have run pretty ok for 60 decades and now, as if by magic it all crashes... yay...)
Our economy is better than yours for the moment but give our right wing government here in Sweden a few years and they will probably screw that up (they have already privatized allot of schools, doctors and trainssystems - our trains have run pretty ok for 60 decades and now, as if by magic it all crashes... yay...)
19
Socialized losses = Bailouts of companies, the saving of CEO's who did illegal and immoral things, the gifting of public money to private hands for no reason. Bush when he did that $600 stimulus, that was socialized losses, you took money from people who had more and gave it to people who had less.
Austerity - the raising of taxes on poor people, the raising of taxes on industry, the cutting of public services to save money, raising the price on services the government helped provide in the hopes that private industry will take over what the government used to help provide. Basically you're trying to use an economic downturn to radically reshape the world's image as one without a government through thinly veiled propaganda that clearly doesn't work. Everyone loves socialism, everyone votes for their own socialism, but no one ever wants to pay the bill.
Austerity - the raising of taxes on poor people, the raising of taxes on industry, the cutting of public services to save money, raising the price on services the government helped provide in the hopes that private industry will take over what the government used to help provide. Basically you're trying to use an economic downturn to radically reshape the world's image as one without a government through thinly veiled propaganda that clearly doesn't work. Everyone loves socialism, everyone votes for their own socialism, but no one ever wants to pay the bill.
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