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Eric Arrr 1
Ironically (to me), it turns out that my apartment window is in the foreground of the video's first frame.
Posted by Eric Arrr on November 27, 2012 at 2:06 PM · Report this
Mike McGinn doesn't control the police department as the civil authority empowers him to do so. In fact, he covers for them. He lies and obfuscates for the, How does that make you feel? Progressive? This is the price you paid for your road diets and his lavishing gifts on Seattle's local NGO scene. Have a nice day.
Posted by hmmmmm on November 27, 2012 at 2:16 PM · Report this
huh, looks like he was resisting arrest pretty clearly. Not saying the punch was warranted but it is very clear that he wasn't allowing the cops to put the cuffs on.

Rule #1; if the cops go to cuff you, let them. You will always lose otherwise.
Posted by nador on November 27, 2012 at 2:16 PM · Report this
@3. The SPD and people like you always look for the excuse to look the other way. Maybe they should have just shot him outright?
Posted by hmmmmm on November 27, 2012 at 2:17 PM · Report this
ScrawnyKayaker 5
Well, that looked TOTALLY justified when the cop punched him in the face for no apparent reason.

Posted by ScrawnyKayaker on November 27, 2012 at 2:19 PM · Report this
Eric Arrr 6
Hmm. So at 4:26, Etherly refuses to give his name, and Faust makes the decision to arrest him.

#1, the cops didn't know who they were arresting. So much for the "he had a rap sheet as long as my arm" talk, that's just a convenient excuse established after the fact.

#2, where's the probable cause to initiate the arrest? Etherly's refusal to give his name is not a crime, since this was an investigative stop, not a traffic stop.
Posted by Eric Arrr on November 27, 2012 at 2:20 PM · Report this
I wanted this to be really damning. I wanted this to be everything Egan claimed. Instead it looks a lot more like a dipshit acting stupid and some cops acting like cops, which is to say acting like Tackleberry from the Police Academy movies.
Posted by Chris Jury on November 27, 2012 at 2:20 PM · Report this
ScrawnyKayaker 8
@2 Right, because psycho cops naturally follow from street restriping. Valid!
Posted by ScrawnyKayaker on November 27, 2012 at 2:21 PM · Report this
meh i was expecting worse... the cop seemed to have an open palm most of the time on the guy's face.. I was relentlessness in my criticism of Ian Burke but this isn't on that level or a Rodney King. They guy was clearly combative. Probably should have just pepper sprayed him, would have looked nicer on camera. The primary cop seemed verbally aggressive which probably antagonized the guy even more but the suspect looked like he was going to fight/resist regardless.
Posted by hifiandrew on November 27, 2012 at 2:23 PM · Report this
@3 Huh is right. What video were you watching exactly?

The third character to enter the frame there (the primary protagonist) pretty clearly has no business being armed and wearing a badge.
Posted by Rhizome on November 27, 2012 at 2:23 PM · Report this
hmmmmmmm. Let me see. Was he punched BEFORE or AFTER he was resisting being cuffed? I said that I didn't think the forearm punch was necessary. Just like I don't think it was necessary that the suspect was resisting being cuffed. @4, I'm guessing you would always under all circumstances assume that you should resist arrest? How should the suspect behaved in this situation? Are you suggesting that he was correct in fighting off being cuffed?
Posted by nador on November 27, 2012 at 2:23 PM · Report this
Hernandez 12
@3 It's difficult to stay still when you're being choked and in pain.
Posted by Hernandez on November 27, 2012 at 2:24 PM · Report this
CC-Rob 13
Amazed at some of the comments here. The guys arms were pinned down - by 2 cops. Cop # 3 punches him in the face. How is this justified?
Posted by CC-Rob on November 27, 2012 at 2:27 PM · Report this
Hernandez, you are correct. But why was he resisting. Clearly he was trying to prevent the police from bring his arms around. Sorry, he'll get a settlement for the punch but he was being combative from the start. Brushing off the cops arm as he sat down etc. I agree that the cops were idiots and thugs and seemed to be overly aggressive - but again. Let the cops cuff you. Sort it out later.
Posted by nador on November 27, 2012 at 2:32 PM · Report this
Janell8me 16
I was a law enforcement officer for a while and we were taught never to handcuff a subject while they face you.
It shows to me that their professionalism needs some work.
The third officer to the scene should be let go. He obviously cant handle authority the public trusts him with.
Also he choked him with an open cuff?? That could be construed to be deadly force, sloppy to say the least..
Posted by Janell8me on November 27, 2012 at 2:33 PM · Report this
Just ignore what is obvious and repeat three times: inconclusive.
Posted by hmmmmm on November 27, 2012 at 2:34 PM · Report this
Hernandez 18
@14 You know, I really do think it's debatable whether or not that was deliberate.

In the seconds leading up to the punch, officer #3
- briefly choked Everly (you can clearly see the hand around the throat) and
- had his hand pushing down on Everly's face, covering his mouth and nose.

To me it looks like he couldn't breathe. I don't know if you've ever been around a person whose airways are being constricted, but some spittle when they do get some air is not unusual or questionable.
Posted by Hernandez on November 27, 2012 at 2:38 PM · Report this
This whole thing could have been avoided.. had he just taken Chris Rock's advice...
Posted by hifiandrew on November 27, 2012 at 2:41 PM · Report this
Some Old Nobodaddy Logged In 20
One of the things I get from this is that the SPD has no respect for the DOJ lawsuit. They knew they'd been investigated, judged, and found wanting. What is their response? Business as usual. We can argue about "how bad" this is, but for me that's just silly hair-splitting. If the SPD understood the charges against them, they'd be on their best behavior. These cops know they're being taped, and they simply don't care.

Conclusion: the SPD are not an entity to be reasoned with. They have no self-awareness and either are refusing to or are incapable of understanding that their actions are unacceptable and to account for them. It may be impractical to dismantle the organization entirely and build from the ground up, but that is where the discussion needs to start.
Posted by Some Old Nobodaddy Logged In on November 27, 2012 at 2:42 PM · Report this
venomlash 21
It's no Rodney King, but the police were out of line. He was resisting arrest, but passively. He didn't attempt to strike any of the officers, so they had no cause to strike him.
Also, zero probable cause.
Posted by venomlash on November 27, 2012 at 2:50 PM · Report this
DOUG. 22
This is fucking terrible. It is troubling that many people commenting here don't see that.
Posted by DOUG. on November 27, 2012 at 2:57 PM · Report this
Car audio and loud radio traffic is on the left audio channel while the body mic. is on the right audio channel. If you want to hear the post incident dialog between the cops fade your balance over to the right.

It looks like a case of playing stupid games and winning stupid prizes but I think we all expect better from our police department.
Posted by restlessnative on November 27, 2012 at 2:58 PM · Report this
@16 I'd totally agree with you there. It was absolutely sloppy and bad technique. Whether or not it rises to the level of excessive force is debatable. But you are right, you never try to cuff someone before you have them under physical control. And ya, the aggressive cop does seem like a hothead. Should probably be disciplined, maybe even fired. But this isn't like the KCSO Matthew Paul who body checked Christopher Harris into the wall of Cinerama and paralyzed him for life. How Paul wasn't prosecuted for clearly excessive force is beyond me. I'll come down on cops when it's called for. Being a cop is tough, on one hand you have to be aggressive and take control of a scene or else it can get out of hand fast or invite assault. But on the other side of the coin, you have to know when to be cool as a cop and not react when provoked.
Posted by hifiandrew on November 27, 2012 at 3:08 PM · Report this
long-time reader 27
Yes, he was resisting arrest. No, choking him and punching him in the eye is not an appropriate response. And cop #3 has a clear case of poor anger management, maybe 'roid rage? He definitely escalated the situation.
Posted by long-time reader on November 27, 2012 at 3:16 PM · Report this
Joe Szilagyi 28
What legal justification did they even have for cuffing him? I thought in Washington we had no legal obligation to identify ourselves if not arrested for a crime and if not driving?
Posted by Joe Szilagyi on November 27, 2012 at 3:17 PM · Report this
Posted by gloomy gus on November 27, 2012 at 3:18 PM · Report this
Will in Seattle 30
@25 is right on. Cops have tough jobs, but they need to step up their game.
Posted by Will in Seattle on November 27, 2012 at 3:18 PM · Report this
psbirch 31
Violence aside, if I understand this video correctly:

SPD walk up to a guy standing at a bus stop and ask if he just got out of a van. The guy says he didn't. They ask him his name. He doesn't give it. They arrest him.

Is that really all it takes to get arrested in this town?
Posted by psbirch on November 27, 2012 at 3:19 PM · Report this
Will in Seattle 32
@28 true, but being right and being shot to death because the cops feel like it are two different things.

They have that option. We don't. We're serfs.
Posted by Will in Seattle on November 27, 2012 at 3:21 PM · Report this
JonnoN 33
@31 if you're a minority, yup. Recently the DoJ has been a little upset about this.
Posted by JonnoN on November 27, 2012 at 3:21 PM · Report this
Will in Seattle 34
@33 which is why our prisons are filled with innocent people who just happen not to be white and rich.
Posted by Will in Seattle on November 27, 2012 at 3:22 PM · Report this
SPG 35
If you spit in my face I will punch you. But then again I'm not a cop.
Posted by SPG on November 27, 2012 at 3:26 PM · Report this
T 37
@35 If you choke me, you absolutely deserve to get spit in your fucking face.
Posted by T on November 27, 2012 at 3:40 PM · Report this
Nine times out of ten, I come down on the side of cops. They have an extraordinarily difficult job, seeing the worst of humanity, and always under a threat of assault or death. They aren't paid enough and aren't trained nearly well enough.

But this? I can't believe some of the comments I am reading. This is despicable. This is a guy who was questioned for a hit and run (a charge that was eventually DISMISSED AT ARRAIGNMENT, which means it was paper thin), and the cops escalated this into an arrest and an assault.

I am stunned that this is happening in the shadow of the DOJ investigation. And stunned that anyone would think this was okay or justified.
Posted by karion on November 27, 2012 at 3:42 PM · Report this
@ 25; "But you are right, you never try to cuff someone before you have them under physical control." here a bunch of cops recently peppersprayed, assaulted with a longbaton (which are about a 1.5 long and can break your skull with one blow) and kneed some guy to drunk to stand in the face and groin... (video of part of the incident here:…) they got off beacause the internal police conduct commision ruled it justifiable defence. "how that?" you ask?, well you see they did a piss poor job handcuffing him so they only cuffed him on one wrist and then he was waiving his arm around (he was pissed drunk remember and also Polish so he couldnt understand what they wanted from him) and this heavy metal object being waved arround presented apperently a clear and pressent danger do the cops (who gave him the "weapon" on the first place by bungeling up the handcuffing)...
Posted by dutchie on November 27, 2012 at 3:43 PM · Report this
Eric Arrr 40

"Career criminal" ? -- the cops didn't even know who he was
"Drives a white van" ? -- the cops didn't even know whether he had gotten out of that white van

Must be nice for you guys to discover these things after making a violent arrest. But you can't turn around and say that they somehow justified the arrest when they weren't known to the cops on the scene at the time.

(That whole "the law no hindsight bias" thing? it cuts both ways.)
Posted by Eric Arrr on November 27, 2012 at 3:45 PM · Report this
pfffter 41
All of them should be fired. The one who went apeshit, and the other two who just stood by and let it happen AND HELPED HIM. Fuck the SPD and Mike McGinn for this shit.
Posted by pfffter on November 27, 2012 at 3:49 PM · Report this
Rotten666 42
@33 you think this shit doesn't happen to white people? Get real.

Overall not too bad, but definitely unprofessional. This situation could have easily been deescalated if one of the cops decided to not treat him like a fucking animal. But they kept ratcheting it up until they got what they wanted.

These fucking morons need to be taught how to deal with people.
Posted by Rotten666 on November 27, 2012 at 3:49 PM · Report this
T 43
This is absolutely disgusting, but even worse is those of you defending the cop's actions. Refusing to give your name shouldn't escalate to being choked and handcuffed. Getting spit in your face does not equal a punch to the face. This cop isn't able to think on his feet and should not be a member of the SPD. But with the way things are currently, he'll probably get paid leave and a free ham.
Posted by T on November 27, 2012 at 3:52 PM · Report this
My jaw hit the floor when they walked up to the guy, grabbed him and detained him. For nothing. For being black?

Everything after that just compounds it. None of those cops should ever work again.
Posted by Brooklyn Reader on November 27, 2012 at 3:56 PM · Report this
Like yeah. I mean, they didn't do him to the back of the head execution style, so the outcome is debatable. Your empathy and indignation should not be a factor here.
Posted by hmmmmm on November 27, 2012 at 3:57 PM · Report this
we need a new police chief.
Posted by go bulldogs on November 27, 2012 at 4:00 PM · Report this
pfffter 47
That the good citizens of Seattle sit idly by and let the do-nothing mayor and the SPD continue their war on the citizenry is also a travesty.
Posted by pfffter on November 27, 2012 at 4:01 PM · Report this
Some Old Nobodaddy Logged In 48
For those of you sticking up for the cops, let me remind you that in nearly every city in America, the police force have been able to do their job w/o prompting a fucking investigation by the bloody Department of Justice and found out that there is a pattern of racism and brutality.

Why is that so hard to grasp for you? The SPD is incompetent, from hiring to training to execution to leadership. They've actually proved this! By the fucking FEDS! Yes, yes, they couched it in nice language, so those poor cops widdle fee-fees don't get hurt, but that's what it basically amounts to.
Posted by Some Old Nobodaddy Logged In on November 27, 2012 at 4:02 PM · Report this
sperifera 50
@40 - @36 is an SPD shill that has been preemptively slandering the agrieved party since the moment this landed on Slog, so consider the source.

From what I saw in the video, there was no probable cause to arrest the suspect. Once the determination was made to arrest him, and they instructed him to put his hands behind his back, I'm not sure that the opportunity was given to the suspect to comply, and their force at that point became excessive in my mind. He may not have been agreeable up until that point, but he did seem to be reluctantly compliant with their instructions.

I would prefer not to continue paying the salary of the 3rd cop to arrive on the scene, his punch in the face to the suspect was far more than he needed to do to apprehend the suspect, who again, should not have been arrested based upon what we know.

The other two should be reprimanded.

The suspect should be compensated for his injuries, and civil actions against the 3rd officer should be entertained by the suspect.

All that being said, this is hardly of the level that we have seen before here in Seattle and beyond. Perhaps we are becoming softened to the "police brutality videos", and what would have been outlandish 10 or 20 years ago is now "routine" to us. Cops have tough jobs. I have good friends that are cops, and recognize that the vast majority of them are good people and citizens. They do their jobs well, and they don't overreact like officer 3 in the video.

The real question to me, though, is why was the SPD so reluctant to release this? They allowed a situation to fester, and it turned into something much more explosive and public than it would likely have been if they had just released it (or allowed Egan to).
Posted by sperifera on November 27, 2012 at 4:19 PM · Report this
Watched the crux moments a few times. I don't think he was choked, or only for a moment at most. You can see the cop actually opening and raising his fingers so as not to cover his mouth and nose too much. The spitting looked deliberate to me; that's an assault, officers shouldn't have to put up with being spit on as they do their jobs. Comes down to what is the appropriate response. I'd imagine it is legitimate to use some force to prevent further spitting. That was a hard shot, though....

Didn't watch the beginning, won't comment on cause to arrest.
Posted by Adversary on November 27, 2012 at 4:38 PM · Report this
Not as bad as described but still bad.

1) Lack of probable cause is not grounds to resist arrest. I am not sure the video really tells us one way or the other on that as we don't know what other information the cops had.

2) He pretty clearly resisted and spit at the cop. They had grounds to be forceful with him over that. Initially the cops were simply restraining him to cuff him and he was fighting them.

3) There was zero reason to punch the guy. The cop got made and hit the guy. Kind of understandable when you've just been spit on, but a cop should be able to control himself and if he can't then he should not be a cop.
Posted by giffy on November 27, 2012 at 4:46 PM · Report this
Sargon Bighorn 54
This whole thing is like a bad bad marriage. The police know Etherly and Etherly knows the police. One eggs the other, the other eggs back. Etherly probably goes out of his way to be un-civil and the police go out of their way to find Etherly. No one wants to back down. But given a choice, I'd rather have the police doing good things like police do most often rather than have Etherly running about doing what ever the hell he likes with no ramifications. I do not for one minute think the Police woke up and decided to beat up on some Black guy just because it was a sunny day.
Posted by Sargon Bighorn on November 27, 2012 at 4:47 PM · Report this
The video clearly demonstrates that lack of control the officers had over themselves and the situation. They took every opportunity to escalate. That is the mark of people who like to hand out the beat-downs and protect themselves legally.

The officers in this video, and many others, and the SPOG have no interest in serving the public, but only the self serving interests of their group. This is sport to them. They find their little justification and rationalization, enough to sow doubt in the press, and there you have it.

The police are supposed to be the professionals, are supposed to de-escalate, not let a situation get so far out of control to the point where the citizen's injury (or death) is inevitable, while they hide behind a neato labor relations clause in their contract that the city doesn't have the balls to change.

They are one of the highest paid forces in the country, yet they behave like two-bit redneck suburban rent a cops. Pathetic.
Posted by hmmmmm on November 27, 2012 at 5:21 PM · Report this
@50 the mayor's office was the problem here too. The progressive, green, bike riding, touchy feelie mayor.
Posted by hmmmmm on November 27, 2012 at 5:26 PM · Report this
psbirch 57
@54 "I'd rather have the police doing good things like police do most often rather than have Etherly running about doing what ever the hell he likes with no ramifications."

What exactly did the guy do that requires there to be "ramifications?"

The guy is walking through a parking lot (2:04), goes to talk to some people at a bus stop, the cops come up and he follows them to their car (2:26) lets Cop #1 frisk him, and he answers their questions relevant to their investigation ("I didn't get out of no white van."). He stood "in the position" for about a minute / minute and a half, putting his hand back down on the hood when Cop #1 asks him to, then moves to go sit on the bumper once they stop talking to him (4:03). Cop #2 grabs his wrist (off camera 4:10) and he shakes it off saying what sounds like "I didn't do anything, alright?". They ask him to sit on the bumper and he does. So Cop #3 runs up at 4:17, he give Cop #3 lip ("What are you gonna do, knock me out?") and Cop #3 asks his name, he declines and says, "What's your name?" (4:26).

Now how exactly is this "running about doing what ever the hell he likes?"
Posted by psbirch on November 27, 2012 at 5:35 PM · Report this
I wonder if any of the arm-chair lawyers / police critics posting comments would care to describe how they would handle this situation.

For the sake of this exercise, please consider the police had cause to detain the suspect. Also please consider the suspect successfully spit into the arresting officer's face.
Posted by six shooter on November 27, 2012 at 5:36 PM · Report this
@57 -- It sounds as if the registration on the white mercedes van matches someone who did not fit the suspect's description. The first police officer escalates his interrogation upon dispatch returning this information.

I am willing to assume the police had cause to believe this suspect was somehow associated with a vehicle seen leaving the scene of a crime.
Posted by six shooter on November 27, 2012 at 5:40 PM · Report this
As someone who's done police liaison work during marches and demonstrations, I've dealt with all three of these cops. Cop #1 is generally watchful, tense and a man of few words. The Asian cop is generally pretty reasonable. Cop #3 is a pig of the worst sort - arrogant, hot headed, violent and views civilians as filth to washed from the streets. Pretty sure he idolizes Travis Bickle.
Posted by Pol Pot on November 27, 2012 at 5:48 PM · Report this
@54 sure they may not have done it for kicks, but the third cop was angry and going for force no matter what. You cannot be the sort of person that overreacts like that and be a cop.
Posted by Hanoumatoi on November 27, 2012 at 5:52 PM · Report this
@58. I would have tried additional questions in a more relaxed tone. I would have let the other cops handle the situation if he reacted that negatively to me. I wouldn't have been spit on, because I wouldn't have choked the guy. If it did escalate to an arrest, I would have been trying to get the guy's arms behind his back, rather than pinning him facing me.
Posted by Hanoumatoi on November 27, 2012 at 6:14 PM · Report this
Westlake, son! 64
The cop that came over later in the middle that wasn't bald or asian is an asshole. Fuck him. I don't want to pay his salary with my taxes.
Posted by Westlake, son! on November 27, 2012 at 6:21 PM · Report this
biffp 66
This is such bullshit. The mayor and police chief should be tendering their resignations.
Posted by biffp on November 27, 2012 at 6:44 PM · Report this
The cop was not under any sort of threat and had literally NO reason to rape-choke and cold-cock a completely helpless suspect.

That said this video is also not going to be seen as the horrific demonstration of abuse it was hyped to be. And why most people in the thread are mostly shrugging it off.

I strongly disagree with shrugging off ANY police abuse, but this is the problem with Goldy and Cienna and The Stranger over-hyping the shit out of this video BEFORE anybody saw it. (Stranger you guys need to treat this shit more seriously and stop acting like local TV news and more like journalists. WWED. Ask "What Would Eli Do?")

You can see immediately with the demeanor of the other cops (and the offending officer) that they all knew there was an over-reaction. Which I suppose bodes well. Because there was a time Seattle cops would just beat the living shit out of you — no EMT's or patrol supervisor would be fourth coming to the scene and any video would just magically disappear. So I suppose maybe the cops at least recognize when they fuck up now.
Posted by tkc on November 27, 2012 at 6:46 PM · Report this
But what is really funny is watching the real crime go down before all this happened with crazy legs. Sticking the drugs in his mouth, dropping the wrapper, and then "Oh there after that guy" pick up the wrapper take the drug out if his mouth back in the wrapper and stick the drugs back into his pocket and roll away.
Posted by sugarbear on November 27, 2012 at 7:00 PM · Report this
Supreme Ruler Of The Universe 70


The suspect clearly pulled his arm back and had his fist clenched to punch.

Whatever follows after that is justified for subduing a person about to attack an officer.

Case closed.
Posted by Supreme Ruler Of The Universe http://_ on November 27, 2012 at 7:24 PM · Report this
Rotten666 71
@68 Good eye!

Posted by Rotten666 on November 27, 2012 at 7:30 PM · Report this
@69 Don't be a menace.
Posted by sugarbear on November 27, 2012 at 8:56 PM · Report this
Eric Arrr 75
@68, that's awesome. Nice catch!

@58 / 59 I am always game for some armchair policing. :) So!

I'll stipulate that the officers did have reasonable suspicion to detain Etherly. (I'm not sure what the basis of their suspicion was, but let's run with it.)

#1 thing they should have done differently is spend more time gathering information, instead of leaping to the decision to arrest Etherly with no apparent probable cause.

Yes, I will grant that it's possible there were additional facts not shown on video or otherwise reported yet which supported the arrest decision. But it's hard to get away from the fact that when Etherly says, "Don't worry about my name -- what's your name?", that's the moment when Faust responds, "Turn around and put your hands behind your back."

If the arrest was illegal, as I suspect it was, then they should have done everything differently in terms of how they handled Etherly from there on out. But for the sake of discussion, we'll assume they had PC. So...

#2 thing they should have done differently is not resorted instantly to the force tactic of placing both hands on Etherly's neck. (I'm referring to how, the moment Etherly draws his left hand away from Faust's reach, Faust responds by grabbing Etherly's neck with both hands and only removes his hands from Etherly's neck after Etherly has been pushed down onto the hood of the patrol car by his neck.) I don't think it's humanly possible to not physically struggle with someone who has just pinned you to a car by your neck. Bottom line, I think Faust's mistake here was selecting a force tactic that was guaranteed to result in a struggle. Once he did that, the escalated levels of force that came later were inevitable.

Posted by Eric Arrr on November 27, 2012 at 9:27 PM · Report this
If McGinn has an ounce of self-preservation left (especially in light of the Burgess announcement), then earlier this evening he was on the phone w/Diaz saying the following: "John, it's you or the cop. One of you has to go. Your choice. I'll need an answer by 7 tomorrow morning."

If McGinn wants another term he's got to step up and let SPD know that a new day is here. They can act like professionals or get jobs in Idaho.
Posted by gnossos on November 27, 2012 at 11:25 PM · Report this
From the start, the officer was way too aggressive. He didn't establish a sense of calm or authority over the situation; instead, he's pacing without direction, shouting semi-coherently, and generally acting like being an on-duty police office doesn't merit a certain tact in dealing with citizens, even one whom you suspect is disrespecting you.

The amazing thing is the officer behaved this way knowing he was on video tape. Who knows what could have happened off camera.
Posted by foodmart on November 28, 2012 at 1:56 AM · Report this
Karlheinz Arschbomber 78
That's why there are police unions, to make getting rid of assholes like this virtually impossible.

It is frustrating to be a cop and have to deal with crap characters like this idiot, but that's a big part of the job. Can't handle it? Do something else.
Posted by Karlheinz Arschbomber on November 28, 2012 at 3:15 AM · Report this
shame on police. forever. shame shame shame. i wish they could feel something at all... something to make them know how much pain, desperation, and destruction they have caused, but they seem to feel nothing!!! they are like empty violence machines set upon our community. they could make peace, but instead they beat and choke and maim and threaten and kill. police are thugs spreading a virus of dishonesty, violence, and hatred throughout history and all through our community. And this arrest, by these particular cops: i spit on that too.
Posted by peskypoop on November 28, 2012 at 4:39 AM · Report this
watchout5 80
This thread really makes me regret my vote for McGuinn, I can't wait to replace him. It's not like it's that hard to see what's going on. He's just in the tank for them. What a crook.
Posted by watchout5 on November 28, 2012 at 5:08 AM · Report this
i'm just gonna keep saying it. we need a new police chief. NOW.
Posted by go bulldogs on November 28, 2012 at 6:35 AM · Report this
Were the officers too aggressive? Yes, especially the one who forcibly subdued Etherly.

As the situation escalated, were the officers' tactics effective in de-escalating the situation? Nope, they made it worse - far worse.

Was Etherly an innocent victim? At first, yes - they rolled up on him like he was a perp, not someone they wanted to get information from. But man, he was willfully and progressively more uncooperative. Egan loses a lot of credibility by not admitting the obvious - he spat on the officer. I don't blame him for doing it, and it doesn't justify the officer's response; but it rightly changes the legal context, as well as public perception.

Will it result in criminal charges against the officer(s)? Not a chance.

Will it result in discipline against the officer? Yes, probably a mild rebuke.

Does it uphold the DOJ findings? 1000%.

Does it mean it's business as usual at SPD? Not necessarily. It takes time to undo years of training and culture. The fact that it was already referred internally to OPA suggests maybe at least leadership recognizes the problems with the way this encounter was handled, even if it's not yet proactively preventing them.

Do Diaz and the SPDG need to go? Probably. I don't see how you can change the culture of the department without major structural change.

Is McGinn to blame? He's come off weak-willed in relation to the SPD and SPDG, but I'm not sure any mayor would have much choice. Both organizations are a little too entrenched. It'll take years of DOJ involvement to break the faustian bargain we have with law enforcement today.

Did Egan and the Stranger oversell this video? Egregiously. It's bad, but not nearly as cut and dry as they made it out to be. Not even close.
Posted by Centrists Rule the World today on November 28, 2012 at 6:36 AM · Report this
@75 --
they should have done differently is spend more time gathering information, instead of leaping to the decision to arrest Etherly with no apparent probable cause.

Given the situation -- the police were outnumbered in a somewhat hostile environment -- I'm willing to grant them a little leniency when judging the speed of their decisions. Of course, I'm also willing to grant they had probably cause or at least reason to control the suspect while questioning him.

I promise the police know both of the other men at the bus stop and had reason to fear their ability to quickly become threatening.

Heck, I know crazy legs by reputation and from his history with the SPD.

I think Faust's mistake here was selecting a force tactic that was guaranteed to result in a struggle. Once he did that, the escalated levels of force that came later were inevitable.

That's reasonable. This seems like a failure in training. Keep in mind, the suspect is a big man in a very public setting. I doubt he would have stood and detained / arrested himself if only the police asked nicely. Then again, if one of the officers had at least tried asking nicely, we'd be without a scandal.
Posted by six shooter on November 28, 2012 at 6:46 AM · Report this
psbirch 85
@58 -- I can't envision any scenario that doesn't end in violence without the removal of Cop #3. The situation appeared to be in control until Cop #3 showed up. If Cop #1 or Cop 32 had said to Cop #3 "Dude, chill, we got this" I would expect the whole thing to have gone down much better for everyone involved.
Posted by psbirch on November 28, 2012 at 9:04 AM · Report this
This looks like brutality to me, but above all it's just sloppy police work. Even if Officers 1 and 2 had a good reason to arrest based on his answers (or not) to their questions, why'd they start trying to cuff him when he was facing them? That was just amateurish. And Officer 3 is an out-of-control cowboy. Congratulations, sir, you showed that unarmed man who's boss when two of your buddies are holding him down. You're the king of the middle-school parking lot. Is this really the finest Seattle has to offer?
Posted by Prettybetsy on November 28, 2012 at 1:03 PM · Report this
Its a breath taking video
Posted by Upload videos online on November 28, 2012 at 10:30 PM · Report this

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