Slog Comments
The Spike in Gun Sales
2
One defining feature of paranoia is that it is self-reinforcing; Every new piece of information is incorporated into the existing narrative. So the people who believe that the government is going to take all their guns as a prelude to imposing totalitarian rule will interpret even the feeblest half-measure towards gun control as part of the master plan.
3
Back in March DHS ordered 750 million rounds of hollow point ammunition. Then it turned around and ordered an additional 750 million rounds of miscellaneous bullets. That's enough ammo to empty five rounds into the body of every American citizen. Our military only expended 70 million rounds per year in the war in Iraq. Now whose planing for a war with whom again?
4
"they know some kind of gun ban is not unlikely, they feel it's now or never."
Given that choice, how about we choose 'never'.
Given that choice, how about we choose 'never'.
5
@3 I'm having trouble finding credible verification of your statement -- a bunch of loony sites linking each other isn't terribly convincing. Please provide sources. I'm genuinely curious as to whether your assertin is true.
6
"they know some kind of gun ban is not unlikely, they feel it's now or never."
Given that choice, how about we choose 'never'?
Given that choice, how about we choose 'never'?
7
That spike in gun buying inevitably follows the spike in craven, self-serving claptrap like THIS (web version of the) email the Tea Party sent out last Friday afternoon, just a few hours after Sandy hook killings.
8
Small towns huh? Well heeled Seattlelites have absolutely picked clean every AR platform, every magazine, and most ammo from local stores.
9
@7, that's pure genius. $45 for them to send some faxes. They must be making a killing. Most of the far right stuff is like this -- profiting on the stupid, paranoid, and gullible.
10
They may "know the president" and they may "know a gun ban is not unlikely". Neither is accurate: the President they "know" has little if any similarity to the President that exists, and we'll be damn lucky to get any meaningful action on the sale of oversized clip, requiring gunowner insurance, requiring gun safety training or practice, or stricter gun licensing - there damn sure won't be any sort of "gun ban"
11
@3 wants us all too be afraid because "Federal Law Enforcement Agencies Buy Ammunition." That's the headline on a story that debunks @3's claim, from that bastion of liberal politics, the NRA:
http://www.nraila.org/news-issues/articl…
By the way, "Back in March DHS ordered 750 million rounds of hollow point ammunition" shows up verbatim on a whole bunch of web sites in August suggesting a Democratic plot to violently take over the country. See http://dailycaller.com/2012/08/17/who-do…
This is why people rush off to buy guns. They are preparing for war.
http://www.nraila.org/news-issues/articl…
By the way, "Back in March DHS ordered 750 million rounds of hollow point ammunition" shows up verbatim on a whole bunch of web sites in August suggesting a Democratic plot to violently take over the country. See http://dailycaller.com/2012/08/17/who-do…
This is why people rush off to buy guns. They are preparing for war.
12
Below is a good op-ed about why, 1) effective gun control means banning nearly all guns and therefore 2) there will never be effective gun control in the US.
http://www.economist.com/blogs/lexington…
http://www.economist.com/blogs/lexington…
13
The thing is I have been contemplating a handgun purchase for quite a while. I've talked to a number of people, researched different guns, the laws in my state, etc. I'm just waiting to get enough money saved up and then I'll head down to the range (been recommended by a number of people) and try out some different ones. But since Newton, I've been thinking that the person who sees me walk into the shop is going to think one of two things about me right off the bat: 1) I'm some crazy, paranoid mother who wants to keep her babies safe or 2) I'm a crazy nutter who things Obama wants to take away my guns.
Typically I could give a rats ass what people think of me but in this case I know it will be a factor when it comes to the way I am treated as a customer as well as the people who will be around me (fellow customers). I don't have kids (just cats) and I do not currently own any guns (do have a nice sword though). I'm pretty sure there will be others in the store(s) who will fit into those categories and I know I will have to fight the urge to bitchslap the ones who talk about Obama and such.
Anyhoo...just needed to bitch.
Typically I could give a rats ass what people think of me but in this case I know it will be a factor when it comes to the way I am treated as a customer as well as the people who will be around me (fellow customers). I don't have kids (just cats) and I do not currently own any guns (do have a nice sword though). I'm pretty sure there will be others in the store(s) who will fit into those categories and I know I will have to fight the urge to bitchslap the ones who talk about Obama and such.
Anyhoo...just needed to bitch.
15
It's just as likely that knowing the landscape for gun ownership will change somehow, people want to get in with the laws they know, not wait for the unknown.
16
@13
So your thinking is that when mass killings and gun control are not in the headlines, the people you meet at the gun shop are going to be pleasant and sane? If you really want to join that club, might as well get down there now and get used to the kind of people you meet. If anything, the longer you delay, the weirder they're going to get.
Seriously. Look at the trend lines.
So your thinking is that when mass killings and gun control are not in the headlines, the people you meet at the gun shop are going to be pleasant and sane? If you really want to join that club, might as well get down there now and get used to the kind of people you meet. If anything, the longer you delay, the weirder they're going to get.
Seriously. Look at the trend lines.
17
@13: They dont give a shit who you are or why you want one. Do you know the expression 'Laughing all the way to the bank'? Because that's all the gun store owners are thinking about. How much is in your wallet and how much of it they will squeeze out of you.
18
@13
I recommend taking a class at West Coast Armory in Bellevue. They are in the top 10 ranges in the US. Also their staff are very professional and not intimidating, the surroundings are well kept, clean and organized.
I advise starting with something in .22lr while you learn the basics. It has low recoil, and is quite accurate. I recommend the Ruger Mk series of pistols. It is a dependable design that has been used for generations, my grandmother just handed down my grandfathers MK1 to me.
Next when you are comfortable move to a modern polymer framed pistol my a reputable manufacturer(not Taurus/hipoint/keltec) in a center-fire cartridge. I would recommend a Glock, though I carry a Walther p99. Mine is in .40S&W but I would recommend 9mm is the cheapest and easiest to shoot as it recoils less.
Have fun and stay safe.
@16
What is wrong with rich atheist with a pretty good gender ratio?
I recommend taking a class at West Coast Armory in Bellevue. They are in the top 10 ranges in the US. Also their staff are very professional and not intimidating, the surroundings are well kept, clean and organized.
I advise starting with something in .22lr while you learn the basics. It has low recoil, and is quite accurate. I recommend the Ruger Mk series of pistols. It is a dependable design that has been used for generations, my grandmother just handed down my grandfathers MK1 to me.
Next when you are comfortable move to a modern polymer framed pistol my a reputable manufacturer(not Taurus/hipoint/keltec) in a center-fire cartridge. I would recommend a Glock, though I carry a Walther p99. Mine is in .40S&W but I would recommend 9mm is the cheapest and easiest to shoot as it recoils less.
Have fun and stay safe.
@16
What is wrong with rich atheist with a pretty good gender ratio?
19
@ 5:
Back in March DHS awarded an indefinite-delivery/indefinite-quantity contract to this company:
http://www.atk.com/news-releases/atk-sec…
Then promptly ordered the maximum of 450 million rounds over five years:
http://www.businessinsider.com/us-immigr…
In late summer the National Weather Service ordered about 46,000 rounds of .40 S&W Jacketed Hollow Point bullets (the most vicious kind of ammo), to be delivered to four locations – offices in Florida, New Jersey, Maine and Massachusetts.
http://www.businessinsider.com/the-natio…
To clarify, NWS spokesman Chris Vaccaro did say the ammunition was not meant for the agency, pfew'..... It was actually delivered to “NMFS” or the National Marine Fisheries Service, also under the NOAA umbrella.....oh.
The Social Security Administration put in an order for 174,000 rounds of .357 Sig Jacketed Hollow Point bullets, for locations in Baltimore, L.A., Detroit, Oklahoma City, Dallas, Houston, Atlanta, Denver, Philly, Pittsburgh and Seattle ...... What?
http://www.businessinsider.com/why-does-…
DHS to buy a further 750 million rounds of ammo:
http://rt.com/usa/news/dhs-ammo-rounds-s…
Ka-blamo.
More...
Back in March DHS awarded an indefinite-delivery/indefinite-quantity contract to this company:
http://www.atk.com/news-releases/atk-sec…
Then promptly ordered the maximum of 450 million rounds over five years:
http://www.businessinsider.com/us-immigr…
In late summer the National Weather Service ordered about 46,000 rounds of .40 S&W Jacketed Hollow Point bullets (the most vicious kind of ammo), to be delivered to four locations – offices in Florida, New Jersey, Maine and Massachusetts.
http://www.businessinsider.com/the-natio…
To clarify, NWS spokesman Chris Vaccaro did say the ammunition was not meant for the agency, pfew'..... It was actually delivered to “NMFS” or the National Marine Fisheries Service, also under the NOAA umbrella.....oh.
The Social Security Administration put in an order for 174,000 rounds of .357 Sig Jacketed Hollow Point bullets, for locations in Baltimore, L.A., Detroit, Oklahoma City, Dallas, Houston, Atlanta, Denver, Philly, Pittsburgh and Seattle ...... What?
http://www.businessinsider.com/why-does-…
DHS to buy a further 750 million rounds of ammo:
http://rt.com/usa/news/dhs-ammo-rounds-s…
Ka-blamo.
20
@19
"The most viscous kind of ammo..."
What does that mean? Jacketed hollowpoint bullets are acknowledged as safer by anyone who knows what they are talking about.
They are less likely to ricochet or penetrate a wall and injure someone innocent.
Just another example of the amazing amount of misinformation from my fellow liberals.
It truly is astonishing to see so many people I identify with frothing at the mouth, clamoring for 'solutions' that would have no effect whatsoever preventing this tragedy.
I'm also astonished how few people are blaming the autistic guy who actually pulled the trigger and did the killing.
"The most viscous kind of ammo..."
What does that mean? Jacketed hollowpoint bullets are acknowledged as safer by anyone who knows what they are talking about.
They are less likely to ricochet or penetrate a wall and injure someone innocent.
Just another example of the amazing amount of misinformation from my fellow liberals.
It truly is astonishing to see so many people I identify with frothing at the mouth, clamoring for 'solutions' that would have no effect whatsoever preventing this tragedy.
I'm also astonished how few people are blaming the autistic guy who actually pulled the trigger and did the killing.
21
I think we need to get Trey Parker and Matt Stone to change the definition of 'fag' yet again to mean anyone who needs a lethal space age projectile flinging gizmo to feel like a big person.
22
@18
Thanks for the info. I don't live in Washington State anymore. I found a somewhat local place that has a 12 hour CC course. It goes well over the minimum requirements for here (Ohio). In fact, for my fellow "libtards" did you know that here in Ohio I do not need a license to own a gun? I just need a license for concealed carry. The course would be more for me to have some hands on instruction and get a good feel for all the ins and outs of safe handling, ownership, cleaning, etc. I don't plan on carrying, but if I'm going to take the course I might as well get the darn license.
@20
Tons of people are talking about him but you might not understand it...all of this discussion about access to mental health care and our health care system in general is in direct connection to him. Last I heard he was only suspected of having Asperger's; it was thrown out by media source but was never confirmed. Regardless of if he did or did not have ASD, it does not negate the fact that meaningful changes need to occur to our gun laws and our health care system. I should not be able to purchase a gun without being licensed, that's just messed up. I should not be able to purchase a gun without having some sort of regulated coursework and testing, mental screening and criminal criminal background checks.
With the way it's set up now, in many (if not all?) states a person who has been diagnosed with specific mental disorders cannot own a firearm. This specific diagnosis and length of time since that diagnosis can affect their ability to purchase said weapon. But how do we ensure that people who have a mental disorder but are unable to get diagnosed (let alone treated) are not acquiring these weapons?
Thanks for the info. I don't live in Washington State anymore. I found a somewhat local place that has a 12 hour CC course. It goes well over the minimum requirements for here (Ohio). In fact, for my fellow "libtards" did you know that here in Ohio I do not need a license to own a gun? I just need a license for concealed carry. The course would be more for me to have some hands on instruction and get a good feel for all the ins and outs of safe handling, ownership, cleaning, etc. I don't plan on carrying, but if I'm going to take the course I might as well get the darn license.
@20
Tons of people are talking about him but you might not understand it...all of this discussion about access to mental health care and our health care system in general is in direct connection to him. Last I heard he was only suspected of having Asperger's; it was thrown out by media source but was never confirmed. Regardless of if he did or did not have ASD, it does not negate the fact that meaningful changes need to occur to our gun laws and our health care system. I should not be able to purchase a gun without being licensed, that's just messed up. I should not be able to purchase a gun without having some sort of regulated coursework and testing, mental screening and criminal criminal background checks.
With the way it's set up now, in many (if not all?) states a person who has been diagnosed with specific mental disorders cannot own a firearm. This specific diagnosis and length of time since that diagnosis can affect their ability to purchase said weapon. But how do we ensure that people who have a mental disorder but are unable to get diagnosed (let alone treated) are not acquiring these weapons?
23
@20
I'm all for licensing of individuals and mandatory gun safety and education courses, particularly if they involve the legal and moral responsibilities associated with firearm ownership. I'm also in favor of better communication and reporting by mental health professionals to the background check database.
What I most have a problem enough is the state of mental health care in this country.
There is no meaningful mental health system in the United States. Essentially the mental health system in the U.S. consists of county jail, the emergency room and homeless shelters.
Why? Because there's no money in it for Big Medical, which is a direct result of no single-payer healthcare system in this country.
All of the countries my fellow liberals recite when they talk about gun bans are in countries where there is national health care that covers mental illness.
I'm all for licensing of individuals and mandatory gun safety and education courses, particularly if they involve the legal and moral responsibilities associated with firearm ownership. I'm also in favor of better communication and reporting by mental health professionals to the background check database.
What I most have a problem enough is the state of mental health care in this country.
There is no meaningful mental health system in the United States. Essentially the mental health system in the U.S. consists of county jail, the emergency room and homeless shelters.
Why? Because there's no money in it for Big Medical, which is a direct result of no single-payer healthcare system in this country.
All of the countries my fellow liberals recite when they talk about gun bans are in countries where there is national health care that covers mental illness.
25
@20 WTF are you talking about? And sir I am no liberal. Hollow points are designed to explode on penetration of a target to disrupt more tissue maximizing the damage. It's not "safer" for the person getting shot.
26
I think it's a little more basic than that. Remember, growing up, how some toys would be declared forbidden for whatever reason? Maybe they got a bad rap in the press or they were deemed too unsafe. Well, that just made those toys exponentially more desireable! Danger! Big authorities trying to tell you what to do! You're too dumb to be safe with your toy! So we wanted to buy the toy and all that went with it before it became impossible.
Democrats, not Republicans, are associated with gun control. Both times he was elected, but particularly the first time, Obama came in with the public expectation that he would act as a moderate leftie. Now all the Democrats are clamoring for gun control. If I was somewhat interested in guns, particularly the dangerous ones, I would get mine now while it's easy.
That's all it is. I know it's not a very interesting angle, but it's the likeliest one.
Democrats, not Republicans, are associated with gun control. Both times he was elected, but particularly the first time, Obama came in with the public expectation that he would act as a moderate leftie. Now all the Democrats are clamoring for gun control. If I was somewhat interested in guns, particularly the dangerous ones, I would get mine now while it's easy.
That's all it is. I know it's not a very interesting angle, but it's the likeliest one.
27
@13
The same thoughts go through my mind when I go to the range. It's really strange to walk into the gun shop knowing you're the antithesis of all the obama-hating, fear mongering conservative dogma that's going on these days. But if you think having a firearm is appropriate for you, don't let this bother you. The people at the gun shop are considerate and will not inquire about your politics or even hint at them (in my experience at a reputable gun shop).
You can assume every other customer talks to them about how Obama is gonna take their guns--we have to accept that, move on, and do some target practice. But they won't bring that up if you don't. Anyways, most reasonable people think all this assault rifle shit should be banned.. but if you think you need a handgun, go to a good shop and get it over with. I go to West Coast Armory and the staff has never said a thing about politics.. just guns.
The same thoughts go through my mind when I go to the range. It's really strange to walk into the gun shop knowing you're the antithesis of all the obama-hating, fear mongering conservative dogma that's going on these days. But if you think having a firearm is appropriate for you, don't let this bother you. The people at the gun shop are considerate and will not inquire about your politics or even hint at them (in my experience at a reputable gun shop).
You can assume every other customer talks to them about how Obama is gonna take their guns--we have to accept that, move on, and do some target practice. But they won't bring that up if you don't. Anyways, most reasonable people think all this assault rifle shit should be banned.. but if you think you need a handgun, go to a good shop and get it over with. I go to West Coast Armory and the staff has never said a thing about politics.. just guns.
28
@13 If you are set on a semi-auto pistol with a >10 round capacity, good luck buying one for a while. Panic buying is in full swing. OTOH, if you just want something accurate for recreational shooting, revolvers will probably remain cheap and plentiful. A Smith and Wesson made many decades ago can still be perfectly serviceable.
The crowd here will give you lots of good advice without any right-wing politics:
http://www.theliberalgunclub.com/phpBB3/…
The crowd here will give you lots of good advice without any right-wing politics:
http://www.theliberalgunclub.com/phpBB3/…
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