Slog Comments
SL Letter of the Day: You Cucked Up
1
Thanks for sticking up for us loser hetero's Dan. I must admit, I skip over the letters about gay sex myself. Kind of squicks me out. You are a champ for reading AND advising on all that gross pussy and tit stuff!
2
[The world] wants us to get married and have kids, forchristsake! They're not going to stop until we're as bored and miserable as they are!
Huh, I must have missed that particular memo from the world.
3
I know I'm supposed to be on-topic and all, but I'm caught up in the last link.
Dan, next time you have a guest spot to offer, can you bring Perla Nation in to answer some questions?
Dan, next time you have a guest spot to offer, can you bring Perla Nation in to answer some questions?
4
Wow, the bonus letter was a little fucked up. I don't relish the thought of straight sex either but I feel no need to go on a diatribe about how straight folks are disgusting. Can't we all just fuck along?
5
MiM, Dan is married and has a kid. I don't think he's going to tell Terry and DJ to take a hike just to make you happy.
6
I love hearing a variety of letters. I like knowing the problems all people face in their relationships. It's called insight. It helps me understand what it means to be human.
7
Dear Dan,
In order to make MIM happy, would you please change all the pronouns in all the letter's from straight couples so that they read as homosexual, in all the letters pertaining to unplanned pregnancy?
Thanks.
In order to make MIM happy, would you please change all the pronouns in all the letter's from straight couples so that they read as homosexual, in all the letters pertaining to unplanned pregnancy?
Thanks.
8
Breeders getting sex advice from a homo - that novel setup was one of reasons Savage Love initially became so popular.
Who better to arbitrate matters of heterosexuality than someone who doesn't have a horse in that race? And who better to channel the sex positive, matter-of-fact, and cutting edge attitudes towards sex so readily found in gay culture?
Personally, I've learned a lot of things from letters dealing with sexual orientations, identities, and kinks that I don't share. Gay men in particular have taught me a lot about men in general.
Who better to arbitrate matters of heterosexuality than someone who doesn't have a horse in that race? And who better to channel the sex positive, matter-of-fact, and cutting edge attitudes towards sex so readily found in gay culture?
Personally, I've learned a lot of things from letters dealing with sexual orientations, identities, and kinks that I don't share. Gay men in particular have taught me a lot about men in general.
9
I think the second LW isn't complaining about het, he's complaining about having to read about women. It's just a garden-variety misogynist.
11
I may be a gross, disgusting STRAIGHT, but MiM's statement that "Now guys fucking other guys is about as edgy as Methodism" made my day.
Of course, the only thing that made guys fucking guys edgy in the past was societal shame, which cost more than a few thousand gays their live,s, from suicide AND homicide, and untold millions of gays unnecessary mental anguish, but I suppose if one near-sociopathic queer gets to be edgy, maybe it's time to roll back the clock and support GOP efforts toward that end.
Of course, the only thing that made guys fucking guys edgy in the past was societal shame, which cost more than a few thousand gays their live,s, from suicide AND homicide, and untold millions of gays unnecessary mental anguish, but I suppose if one near-sociopathic queer gets to be edgy, maybe it's time to roll back the clock and support GOP efforts toward that end.
12
Betting MiM was being a little satirical-- I read it as poking fun at people who feel that grossed out reading about homosexual sex.
13
The attitude that sex must be "dangerous" to be exciting is the basic concept behind making it a sin, or illegal; it's what fuels the Catholic Church, and their long-standing history of sexual depravity. So fuck you, MIM. Go convert and live your life in the closet.
14
Da-aaa-aaa-an, stop writing about stuff I find disgusting! It makes me wanna throw up! Why can't you take out the shit I hate in a popular advice column and just write the stuff that makes MEEE happy???
15
I feel like MiM would be just as squicked out if Dan took only letters from sleazy, WILD lesbians. Be careful what you wish for.
16
In an ideal world, there would be as many Same-Sexer resources of top quality as there are Opposite-Sexer resources. In this world, there are precious few first-rate resources. Mr Savage is perhaps the ONLY one with any decent level of understanding of same-sexer issues. He may be a LITTLE too assimilationist, but, if so, the error lies in overestimating the capacity for acceptance or excessive gratitude that the column's exclusively straight readership permitted it to expand without mass defection. It is not a question of sincerity; he is not trying to be the House F* the way Phyllida Erskine Brown (nee Trant) became the Token Woman in various legal circles and then actively opposed attempts to bring in more of the sisterhood to join her.
I do not side with Mr MIM (granted my interest can wear thin after too long a run of heterocentrism from Mr Savage, but that rarely happens, and when it does I just push myself into being more homonormative than comes entirely naturally to me), but can make a point for him with reference to Emma. Readers such as Mr MacTavish above get invited to Hartfield and Donwell and Randalls, where they get to mix with the cream of Highbury society. The same-sexers with nothing to say about or no interest in opposite-sexer problems get packed off to Miss Bates, or Mrs Goddard, or the Coles, or even - shock! horror! - the vicarage. While it is hardly obligatory, it could be considered gracious for those with the good fortune to be offered a bowl of gruel by Mr Woodhouse and supplied far more adequately by his daughter to spare a thought for those forced to put up with being patronized by Mrs Elton.
Back to the ideal world, where one could be an exclusively same-sexer resource and be as richly remunerated as an opposite-sexer resource, even there, Mr Savage has tastes a little too catholic to suit such a role. And that is fine. Probably it's even necessary, although it can at times feel rather as if we're being pushed to the back of the line AGAIN even when it's not really the case. Be given crumbs too often and one starts to anticipate them.
So now, having done little besides convince myself that there will never be true equality in the world (except perhaps for women), I have nothing left to say other than to absolve Mr Savage of all blame, hope that he's more right than I am, and try to sleep without the palliative of tears. Dormez bien.
More...
I do not side with Mr MIM (granted my interest can wear thin after too long a run of heterocentrism from Mr Savage, but that rarely happens, and when it does I just push myself into being more homonormative than comes entirely naturally to me), but can make a point for him with reference to Emma. Readers such as Mr MacTavish above get invited to Hartfield and Donwell and Randalls, where they get to mix with the cream of Highbury society. The same-sexers with nothing to say about or no interest in opposite-sexer problems get packed off to Miss Bates, or Mrs Goddard, or the Coles, or even - shock! horror! - the vicarage. While it is hardly obligatory, it could be considered gracious for those with the good fortune to be offered a bowl of gruel by Mr Woodhouse and supplied far more adequately by his daughter to spare a thought for those forced to put up with being patronized by Mrs Elton.
Back to the ideal world, where one could be an exclusively same-sexer resource and be as richly remunerated as an opposite-sexer resource, even there, Mr Savage has tastes a little too catholic to suit such a role. And that is fine. Probably it's even necessary, although it can at times feel rather as if we're being pushed to the back of the line AGAIN even when it's not really the case. Be given crumbs too often and one starts to anticipate them.
So now, having done little besides convince myself that there will never be true equality in the world (except perhaps for women), I have nothing left to say other than to absolve Mr Savage of all blame, hope that he's more right than I am, and try to sleep without the palliative of tears. Dormez bien.
22
I'm going to retract the qualifier "a little" off my first post (@4). There's nothing worse than a gay man who thinks his minority status is a license to shit on everyone else. I'm a gay black man and if I said some ignorant shit like that I'd expect to be called on it. And, no, it's not cuz I'm so very sensitive. It's cuz it would make me an asshole like anyone else who said it.
23
If being perceived as "edgy" by vanilla folks is the most important thing you get out of your sex life, you're doing it wrong.
24
Not all straights are breeders!!! Just sayin'. And Dan's a homo and he bred. Is that even the correct past tense? If the letter-writer was looking for a funny term for straight people, how about "p-in-v-ers."
29
I read MiM's letter as humor. I'm surprised so many people took offense and thought it was serious.
30
It could be fascinating to see a full analysis of the Savage mail with regard to authors and subject matters. We've been told, for instance, that mail on the subject of Doubting LW's Partner's Orientation runs strongly from straight women. I'm too sleep-deprived to delve deeply into possibilities, but a competent statistics wonk on staff could probably produce a document comparable in length to health care, budget or tax legislation, only much more interesting to read.
31
Speaking for myself, this gay guy is very happy to read all the letters from the straight folks.
In this world where gay people are still struggling for equality it's nice to see we are all equal in one area. We are all equally fucked up.
And again, speaking for myself, I have no desire to be edgy. I much prefer to be fulfilled. My marriage, as hum drum and vanilla as that may make me in some folks eyes, makes me feel fulfilled. I leave the need to be edgy for the more desperate folks out there.
In this world where gay people are still struggling for equality it's nice to see we are all equal in one area. We are all equally fucked up.
And again, speaking for myself, I have no desire to be edgy. I much prefer to be fulfilled. My marriage, as hum drum and vanilla as that may make me in some folks eyes, makes me feel fulfilled. I leave the need to be edgy for the more desperate folks out there.
32
BLW: "I check your column for fun, interesting questions each week." and yet he finds all these squicky lady parts and girl juices described.
That he find it like a car wreck - horrible to see but you can't turn away - says less about Dan (working at our relationship crashes as some sort of sexual EMT?) and more about the BLW's self control - "I hate it, but I keep coming back." because, as the links show, there are pure-as-the-rainbow-colored-driven-snow options.
That he find it like a car wreck - horrible to see but you can't turn away - says less about Dan (working at our relationship crashes as some sort of sexual EMT?) and more about the BLW's self control - "I hate it, but I keep coming back." because, as the links show, there are pure-as-the-rainbow-colored-driven-snow options.
33
I thought Dan's so brave and confident that he even puts FOUR links up to competitors. Then I read a little bit on each site. Dan has no competition.
34
Mr Fortunate - I'm recalling Jake Morgendorffer going into a tizzy because he hasn't a clue what edgy even means. FTWLTSOTTITSOTTL.
The details of the letters never bother me much; I had such a specialized sex life that I almost never see anything from any LW to which I can relate directly in that regard. I've no complaints, but I have no more connection with letters concerning the "standard" MM letters than I do with anything one or more Fs can devise.
The one pro-straight thing I can say, and sorry if it seems too faint by way of praise, is that at least here the overall level of straight entitlement to be the focus of everybody's time, attention and best efforts is lower than it is almost anywhere else. It's not enough to make me feel hopeful, but at least it's instructive.
The details of the letters never bother me much; I had such a specialized sex life that I almost never see anything from any LW to which I can relate directly in that regard. I've no complaints, but I have no more connection with letters concerning the "standard" MM letters than I do with anything one or more Fs can devise.
The one pro-straight thing I can say, and sorry if it seems too faint by way of praise, is that at least here the overall level of straight entitlement to be the focus of everybody's time, attention and best efforts is lower than it is almost anywhere else. It's not enough to make me feel hopeful, but at least it's instructive.
36
As one who dips his wick in both, uh...sides of the candle shop[?]...I guess I took for granted the inclusive nature of the column.
I suppose that I can relate to the 'mos who check out a column only to find no letters of interest, as the problems are irrelevant to their lives: Dan seemed to hit a spate of sexless marriage questions a while back that I found uninteresting, and I didn't even bother with the columns about poly-as-orientation. Not every issue is going to have everyone enthralled.
On the other hand, I know that some hets get squicked out by the very topic of gay sex...but why the hell do they read this column then? For me the perfect Savage Love has a little straight, a little gay, and a little squick.
Or a lot of squick. The squickier the better I say.
I suppose that I can relate to the 'mos who check out a column only to find no letters of interest, as the problems are irrelevant to their lives: Dan seemed to hit a spate of sexless marriage questions a while back that I found uninteresting, and I didn't even bother with the columns about poly-as-orientation. Not every issue is going to have everyone enthralled.
On the other hand, I know that some hets get squicked out by the very topic of gay sex...but why the hell do they read this column then? For me the perfect Savage Love has a little straight, a little gay, and a little squick.
Or a lot of squick. The squickier the better I say.
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