Slog Comments
Your Daily Douchebag
1
What kind of miracle? That all the approve votes are dismissed?
I mean, thousands and thousands and thousands of folks in Eastern WA voted to approve this thing, so it's not just some Seattle-driven plague, it's all of Washington lurching toward equality.
The tide is turning. Even in Texas, you have things like the City of Austin passing an anti-discrimination ordinance, the mayor and police chief of San Antonio marching in the pride parade, Houston rebuffing homophobic ads to push an openly lesbian official to the top of their mayoral race and Fort Worth moving to pass an anti-discrimination ordinance after the big bar raid.
It's a great day in America.
I mean, thousands and thousands and thousands of folks in Eastern WA voted to approve this thing, so it's not just some Seattle-driven plague, it's all of Washington lurching toward equality.
The tide is turning. Even in Texas, you have things like the City of Austin passing an anti-discrimination ordinance, the mayor and police chief of San Antonio marching in the pride parade, Houston rebuffing homophobic ads to push an openly lesbian official to the top of their mayoral race and Fort Worth moving to pass an anti-discrimination ordinance after the big bar raid.
It's a great day in America.
2
Yes, Mr. Stickney, I'm praying, but my prayers ask the Lord to open and expand your tiny closed mind and free your heart of its vile and hateful bigotry. Hopefully God listens to positive prayers that enhance peoples' lives and ignores those which seek to opress others.
4
Ergo, God wants us to have DPs. Or they blaming this one on the devil? Convenient to be selective like that.
5
Like this is some surprise? Look how many decades has it been and people are still trying to overturn abortion rights.
We will all die with a large group of people who are still trying to deny gay folks rights that will have been around for years. It's like death and taxes....
Polls still find giant numbers of Americans who don't "approve" of interracial marriages, etc
Stupid is forever....
We will all die with a large group of people who are still trying to deny gay folks rights that will have been around for years. It's like death and taxes....
Polls still find giant numbers of Americans who don't "approve" of interracial marriages, etc
Stupid is forever....
7
Why do these people bother voting at all? They just need to pray harder.
Message to The Faithful: God is upset at your lack of faith, and that's why he didn't give you what you wanted. If you truly believed, you wouldn't show your doubt in divine providence by taking matters into your own hands and voting.
Message to The Faithful: God is upset at your lack of faith, and that's why he didn't give you what you wanted. If you truly believed, you wouldn't show your doubt in divine providence by taking matters into your own hands and voting.
8
I wouldn't doubt for a minute that there are votes yet uncounted, especially in light of the newly found boxes. But I'm well aware that regardless, the bigger issue boils down to what this hatemonger wrote:
http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archive…
They certainly aren't--(thank God). It boggles the mind that out of thirty-nine counties one can have a grip such as King has over the rest which make up the majority. But until the people of the state address that in a peaceful, democratic but resolute fashion, we will keep on seeing more of this.
"Atlanta cannot overpower the rest of GA the way King County overpowers Eastern WA. We're VERY lucky here. Most states are not that lucky."
http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archive…
They certainly aren't--(thank God). It boggles the mind that out of thirty-nine counties one can have a grip such as King has over the rest which make up the majority. But until the people of the state address that in a peaceful, democratic but resolute fashion, we will keep on seeing more of this.
11
@8:
Like voting?
The people have spoken, Loveschild. Remember that the population center of Washington State is only 16 miles from Seattle, and 9 other counties voted to approve R-71. That doesn't mean, however, that these results are invalid, since it's about population, not number of counties pro or con.
And it's also just a matter of time before more states follow. Like Texas. Austin approved domestic partnership benefits, and Houston, Dallas, El Paso and San Antonio are considering the same. Fort Worth is expanding their anti-discrimination ordinances, too.
But until the people of the state address that in a peaceful, democratic but resolute fashion, we will keep on seeing more of this.
Like voting?
The people have spoken, Loveschild. Remember that the population center of Washington State is only 16 miles from Seattle, and 9 other counties voted to approve R-71. That doesn't mean, however, that these results are invalid, since it's about population, not number of counties pro or con.
And it's also just a matter of time before more states follow. Like Texas. Austin approved domestic partnership benefits, and Houston, Dallas, El Paso and San Antonio are considering the same. Fort Worth is expanding their anti-discrimination ordinances, too.
12
@8: Yeah, it's a damn shame that the county holding 25% of the state population has a sizeable influence on state politics. I hope you'll join me in my fight to strip California and Texas of some of those unfair electoral votes!
14
@8 -- Why is it that your side always whines about "let the people decide," but the minute the people decide they don't agree with you, you whine about how the wrong people decided?
The commercials have started in New Jersey now. So far, I've only heard NOM's radio commercial, and the entire thing boils down to "Oh, noes! If teh gays can get married, I'll lose the right to pretend they don't exist! Call your legislators and the governor and tell them that freedom of religion mean I have the freedom to force everyone else to live according to the teachings of MY religion!"
The commercials have started in New Jersey now. So far, I've only heard NOM's radio commercial, and the entire thing boils down to "Oh, noes! If teh gays can get married, I'll lose the right to pretend they don't exist! Call your legislators and the governor and tell them that freedom of religion mean I have the freedom to force everyone else to live according to the teachings of MY religion!"
15
Aw, Loveschild, you're not going to act like a whiny bigot and keep pressing the issue, are you? You know, now that the people have spoken and all that hoo hah you're so fond of spouting?
But that doesn't apply to you, does it, you whiny bigot?
But that doesn't apply to you, does it, you whiny bigot?
17
@15 Certainly not you family-hater, look, just as legalized prostitution in NV and other vices that have been contained in other states have served as examples to other states to not have them legalized in them, i think that for the same reason that the hatemonger that i quoted @8 said the few remaining states that have not yet safeguarded themselves against litigations for same sex marriage will soon follow thru and will do so to avoid precisely the type of grip and overpowering force that a city like Seattle has over the rest of a state.
So to me this might well be a blessing in disguise. And coupled with Maine, the future for the American family to me looks very promising.
So to me this might well be a blessing in disguise. And coupled with Maine, the future for the American family to me looks very promising.
18
Loveschild, if God really exists, I am pretty sure he thinks you're a loser.
Keep your religion out of my life, please.
Keep your religion out of my life, please.
19
@17: The people have spoken, Loveschild.
A majority of voters affirmed what a majority of legislators approved. A majority.
You lied to us when you said you would respect the people's voice. You lied to us when you said you were okay with Domestic Partnerships. God have mercy on your soul if you aren't someone pretending to be a woman of faith, because your lies are not only disgusting, they're downright fascistic.
It doesn't matter where the people are from, it matters how many people vote. And if you want to get really technical, between today and 1997, 12 years, we gained 13 points against our performance when the anti-discrimination initiative failed, when even King County voted against it.
And as we've seen, 90% of americans support anti-discrimination measures versus 60% supporting domestic partnerships, so our gains with respect to that are monumental.
The people have spoken.
The silent majority of americans who believe in fairness and equality is just getting started. They're rising up against those who want to rule them with fear and sorrows. They're pushing back against people like you whose only defense is incoherent ideas that have yet to manifest. They are casting off the shackles of oppressive hatred and forced bigotry.
You're losing.
A majority of voters affirmed what a majority of legislators approved. A majority.
You lied to us when you said you would respect the people's voice. You lied to us when you said you were okay with Domestic Partnerships. God have mercy on your soul if you aren't someone pretending to be a woman of faith, because your lies are not only disgusting, they're downright fascistic.
It doesn't matter where the people are from, it matters how many people vote. And if you want to get really technical, between today and 1997, 12 years, we gained 13 points against our performance when the anti-discrimination initiative failed, when even King County voted against it.
And as we've seen, 90% of americans support anti-discrimination measures versus 60% supporting domestic partnerships, so our gains with respect to that are monumental.
The people have spoken.
The silent majority of americans who believe in fairness and equality is just getting started. They're rising up against those who want to rule them with fear and sorrows. They're pushing back against people like you whose only defense is incoherent ideas that have yet to manifest. They are casting off the shackles of oppressive hatred and forced bigotry.
You're losing.
20
Jesus NEVER EVER meddled in the politics of his day. He spoke to people and asked them to turn to the light of Love and Righteousness. He was a fisher of men. Loveschild and her band of bigots NEVER EVER follows Jesus' example. They are a gang of Hunters of Witches. Hence America is a nation torn apart with hate and bullets flying everywhere (Str8 Church/Mosque goers doing the shooting). Some day all Americans will be equal. Children will learn hate no more. The approval of R-71 is a step toward that bright future when children will not fear their families being torn apart by religious monsters.
I just love this dramatic writing class I'm taking!
I just love this dramatic writing class I'm taking!
21
The results were updated about 20 minutes ago and it's still 52% in favor.
http://vote.wa.gov/Elections/WEI/Results…
http://vote.wa.gov/Elections/WEI/Results…
22
19
The people HAVE spoken.
They have REJECTED homosexual marriage.
AGAIN.
For the 31st time.
In Liberal Maine.
In Liberal California.
Twice.
The American people have NEVER voted for homosexual marriage.
Ever.
The silent majority of Americans who believe in morality and the Family is just getting started.
The people HAVE spoken.
They have REJECTED homosexual marriage.
AGAIN.
For the 31st time.
In Liberal Maine.
In Liberal California.
Twice.
The American people have NEVER voted for homosexual marriage.
Ever.
The silent majority of Americans who believe in morality and the Family is just getting started.
23
When it's Christians vs. secularists, it's NO FAIR the Christians using prayer! Hoping is OK. Wishing is OK. But not praying. Prayer is to culture war politics as the spitter is to baseball.
25
@19 They have, and the overwhelming majority didn't think that this extension was such a good idea, but King county got the last word. Let it be so, and let it be used as an example for other states.
Both domestic partnerships and civil unions is something I have no problem with, but i know too well that the bus won't stop there with this new extension, the next step is the full dismantling of marriage and when that happens it too will be serve the exemplary purpose for other states to take this issue seriously and safeguard themselves.
Bacon, if anything you must learn this that i as a follower of Jesus Christ firmly believe this:
So to I know that this will work for the good to those who love this great God loving nation as has been exemplified by the beautiful residents of Maine.
Both domestic partnerships and civil unions is something I have no problem with, but i know too well that the bus won't stop there with this new extension, the next step is the full dismantling of marriage and when that happens it too will be serve the exemplary purpose for other states to take this issue seriously and safeguard themselves.
Bacon, if anything you must learn this that i as a follower of Jesus Christ firmly believe this:
And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God. Romans8:28
So to I know that this will work for the good to those who love this great God loving nation as has been exemplified by the beautiful residents of Maine.
26
Results of a vote are NOT the will of the people. It's merely the results of who showed up to vote that day.
A large precentage of "the people" cannot even vote, and the majority those who can, don't even bother themselves with it.
Stop all the hyperbole already, all of you.
A large precentage of "the people" cannot even vote, and the majority those who can, don't even bother themselves with it.
Stop all the hyperbole already, all of you.
27
@22: An issue that's been around for 5 years, and voters are apprehensive? Oh no, what are the odds!
It's like the silent majority that went after anti-discrimination ordinances, winning left and right against them except in Seattle, then losing almost every single one or having their attacks overturned by the courts in a couple of cases.
Remember Lou Mabon and Measure 9 in Oregon? It facilitated the collapse of organized opposition to anti-discrimination ordinances.
R-71 is our Measure 9.
Thank you for helping the pro-family/pro-equality movement gain traction.
It's like the silent majority that went after anti-discrimination ordinances, winning left and right against them except in Seattle, then losing almost every single one or having their attacks overturned by the courts in a couple of cases.
Remember Lou Mabon and Measure 9 in Oregon? It facilitated the collapse of organized opposition to anti-discrimination ordinances.
R-71 is our Measure 9.
Thank you for helping the pro-family/pro-equality movement gain traction.
28
Hey Hateful Bigot!!
I'm the 'hatemonger' you quoted above.
I could try and give you examples of gay kids and their lot in life (oh, did that already, no response from you)...reason with you (tried that, there is no such thing with people like you)...tried to open you mind just a tiny iota (just not possible, as I've learned this past couple of weeks).
I have hate, sure. It's for people like you. Who would deny someone else something based on how they were born. But, arrogance of arrogance, you know better how I and others like me were born.
FUCK YOU. FUCK YOUR GOD AND YOUR MAGIC BOOK. FUCK YOU, HATEFUL BIGOT.
OH, and FUCK. YOU.
I'm the 'hatemonger' you quoted above.
I could try and give you examples of gay kids and their lot in life (oh, did that already, no response from you)...reason with you (tried that, there is no such thing with people like you)...tried to open you mind just a tiny iota (just not possible, as I've learned this past couple of weeks).
I have hate, sure. It's for people like you. Who would deny someone else something based on how they were born. But, arrogance of arrogance, you know better how I and others like me were born.
FUCK YOU. FUCK YOUR GOD AND YOUR MAGIC BOOK. FUCK YOU, HATEFUL BIGOT.
OH, and FUCK. YOU.
29
@ 25 - "...the next step is the full dismantling of marriage..."
How does allowing same-sex couples to get legally married constitute the "dismantling" of marriage? That's quite a leap you're implying there. Honest question, LC, please reply if you can.
How does allowing same-sex couples to get legally married constitute the "dismantling" of marriage? That's quite a leap you're implying there. Honest question, LC, please reply if you can.
30
They have, and the overwhelming majority didn't think that this extension was such a good idea, but King county got the last word. Let it be so, and let it be used as an example for other states.
So let me understand this Loveschild, the majority of the people in the State of Washington voted to reject this initiative. So King County (and all the other counties that voted approve) arne't really people? What kind of bizarre world do you live in?
Also:
Both domestic partnerships and civil unions [are] something I have no problem with, except that I do because the only family construct that counts is the one that I have in my head, which is why I can also think that King County (and all the other populous counties that voted to approve) aren't real people whose votes shouldn't count because they go against that contstruct
Fixed that for you.
So in summary, you only want voters who will vote like you do, and if they don't vote like you do then they aren't real people. I'm know there's a word for people like that, but I won't say it for risk of Godwining this thread.
So let me understand this Loveschild, the majority of the people in the State of Washington voted to reject this initiative. So King County (and all the other counties that voted approve) arne't really people? What kind of bizarre world do you live in?
Also:
Both domestic partnerships and civil unions [are] something I have no problem with, except that I do because the only family construct that counts is the one that I have in my head, which is why I can also think that King County (and all the other populous counties that voted to approve) aren't real people whose votes shouldn't count because they go against that contstruct
Fixed that for you.
So in summary, you only want voters who will vote like you do, and if they don't vote like you do then they aren't real people. I'm know there's a word for people like that, but I won't say it for risk of Godwining this thread.
31
People, LC = Hateful Bigot. Name calling sets you free. Trust me. It's really quite enjoyable!
Oh, and Chris in Vancouver...get ready for some religious hoo-ha meant to disguise the fact this 'person' (term used loosely) hates the air we breathe.
It says 'I'm fine with Domestic Partnerships and Civil Unions'.
Well,, HB, I could care less what YOU are fine with.
Shut the fuck up.
Oh, and Chris in Vancouver...get ready for some religious hoo-ha meant to disguise the fact this 'person' (term used loosely) hates the air we breathe.
It says 'I'm fine with Domestic Partnerships and Civil Unions'.
Well,, HB, I could care less what YOU are fine with.
Shut the fuck up.
32
@25: The "overwhelming majority"? Last I checked, the overwhelming majority of citizens in this state are approving R-71, especially in places where there's more people and a larger likelihood of meeting and knowing gay families.
And you can couch this however you like, but the counties most rejecting of R-71 were the same who most overwhelmingly approved I-200, the racist and sexist initiative that ended affirmative action in Washington State. 9 of 10 counties voting to approve R-71 were close on I-200, but all those others? They approved it by huge margins.
The ONLY county to stand up against I-200 was King County.
Here's what it does: http://www.omwbe.wa.gov/aboutus/aboutus_…
So you can claim King County runs against Washington Values, but we're the only county to stand up against I-200, which was one of those most darkly racist measures in Washington State history.
Approving R-71 by such a margin is part of that fine heritage of working to better society.
And you can couch this however you like, but the counties most rejecting of R-71 were the same who most overwhelmingly approved I-200, the racist and sexist initiative that ended affirmative action in Washington State. 9 of 10 counties voting to approve R-71 were close on I-200, but all those others? They approved it by huge margins.
The ONLY county to stand up against I-200 was King County.
Here's what it does: http://www.omwbe.wa.gov/aboutus/aboutus_…
So you can claim King County runs against Washington Values, but we're the only county to stand up against I-200, which was one of those most darkly racist measures in Washington State history.
Approving R-71 by such a margin is part of that fine heritage of working to better society.
33
@32 - Why should the historically shat upon and disadvantaged be given any "special rights" anyway? That initiative just levelled the playing field. Bootstraps son!
34
People, do not reason with 'it'.
Hateful Bigot does not care what you think or how you feel.
And we sure the hell don't care what 'it' thinks or feels.
We will get what we are entitled to as tax-paying members of these United States, nationwide, through the courts, ('activist' when it's for 'us', non-activist when it's for 'them')...and bigots like this 'thing' will not be able to do an thing about it.
And to quote the gayest of all gay...Glinda the Good Witch.
"You have no power here. Be gone before somebody drops a house on you."
IF ONLY.
Fuck You, Hateful Bigot.
Hateful Bigot does not care what you think or how you feel.
And we sure the hell don't care what 'it' thinks or feels.
We will get what we are entitled to as tax-paying members of these United States, nationwide, through the courts, ('activist' when it's for 'us', non-activist when it's for 'them')...and bigots like this 'thing' will not be able to do an thing about it.
And to quote the gayest of all gay...Glinda the Good Witch.
"You have no power here. Be gone before somebody drops a house on you."
IF ONLY.
Fuck You, Hateful Bigot.
35
Baconcat, the Washington-hating Birthers want people who were too lazy to put a stamp on it to be counted.
Face it, if they couldn't be bothered to vote, they're not much of a threat to anyone. Except maybe squirrels.
Face it, if they couldn't be bothered to vote, they're not much of a threat to anyone. Except maybe squirrels.
36
Eh, I can't resist TRYING to get an answer out of HB anyways.
It says...those beautiful residents of Maine.
Um, what about the 47% who didn't go for your brand of bigotry, lies and garbage?
Are they the ugly residents of Maine?
FUCK. YOU. HATEFUL. BIGOT.
It says...those beautiful residents of Maine.
Um, what about the 47% who didn't go for your brand of bigotry, lies and garbage?
Are they the ugly residents of Maine?
FUCK. YOU. HATEFUL. BIGOT.
37
Stop with the "overwhelming majority" crap. Washington state has 6.5 million people, less than 2 million live in King County. So if the majority of the rest of the state didn't like R-71, they could have voted it down 2 to 1.
38
Loveschild, shouldn't you be off raising your kid?
You're not going to change your mind, not going to accept your errors, your prejudices, your paranoia (seriously? A Black person that disagrees with you is Uncle Tom? Bitch, please.)
And I do not live in King County, I actually live in Spokane, and been in Grant County for almost two years - trust me, there's PLENTY of people who have no problems with everyone having the same rights, you hateful, mud-raking sow.
I had roommates were lesbians in committed relationships, and last I heard, she's in a Marine base in Virginia - protecting your hateful ass and your wretched mouth. My cousin is gay, he's the family babysitter, because he is the one person everyone trusts - his boyfriend is the sweet guy you could ever meet, but should never be allowed to cook.
So, you stupid sow. Are you saying my family, my friends are not worthy of the SAME, BASIC RIGHTS as everyone else in the country? If my cousin falls sick, his BF would not be able to visit him in the hospital, or pay for my cousin's bills with his insurance.
So... fuck you, you ignorant pig and keep dwelling in that dark hole.
You're not going to change your mind, not going to accept your errors, your prejudices, your paranoia (seriously? A Black person that disagrees with you is Uncle Tom? Bitch, please.)
And I do not live in King County, I actually live in Spokane, and been in Grant County for almost two years - trust me, there's PLENTY of people who have no problems with everyone having the same rights, you hateful, mud-raking sow.
I had roommates were lesbians in committed relationships, and last I heard, she's in a Marine base in Virginia - protecting your hateful ass and your wretched mouth. My cousin is gay, he's the family babysitter, because he is the one person everyone trusts - his boyfriend is the sweet guy you could ever meet, but should never be allowed to cook.
So, you stupid sow. Are you saying my family, my friends are not worthy of the SAME, BASIC RIGHTS as everyone else in the country? If my cousin falls sick, his BF would not be able to visit him in the hospital, or pay for my cousin's bills with his insurance.
So... fuck you, you ignorant pig and keep dwelling in that dark hole.
39
Loveschild,
Apparently, your God loves you enough to honor your work in Maine, but not enough to honor your reject R 71 work in Washington. AND, your God doesn't love me enough to honor my work in Maine, but he does love me enough to honor my work approve R 71 work in Washington.
Which of us does your God love more based on the outcome of election night 2009? He hasn't honored all your requests, and I was smart enough to not ask your God. Frankly said, I don't think your God has a favorite.
Apparently, your God loves you enough to honor your work in Maine, but not enough to honor your reject R 71 work in Washington. AND, your God doesn't love me enough to honor my work in Maine, but he does love me enough to honor my work approve R 71 work in Washington.
Which of us does your God love more based on the outcome of election night 2009? He hasn't honored all your requests, and I was smart enough to not ask your God. Frankly said, I don't think your God has a favorite.
40
28
maybe your hate and hostility are rooted in resentment about 'how you were born'.
do you lack the reproductive yearning that drives humans to find someone of the opposite gender- that wonderful yin-yang attraction- the urge to make and raise little chics- to leave a bit of yourself behind-
did nature curse you with an 'orientation' that has no anatomical means of expression?
does that make you bitter, frustrated, resentful, angry?
Has that fate which condemns you to wallow in hate also denied you the joys of the flesh?
This orientation! - the infection which poisons your life
This orientation! - which spurred fear and self loathing
maybe your hate and hostility are rooted in resentment about 'how you were born'.
do you lack the reproductive yearning that drives humans to find someone of the opposite gender- that wonderful yin-yang attraction- the urge to make and raise little chics- to leave a bit of yourself behind-
did nature curse you with an 'orientation' that has no anatomical means of expression?
does that make you bitter, frustrated, resentful, angry?
Has that fate which condemns you to wallow in hate also denied you the joys of the flesh?
This orientation! - the infection which poisons your life
This orientation! - which spurred fear and self loathing
41
@39 This is not about favorites. This is not about you nor me, this is about a time-honored institution, this is about the family, this is about the peaceful right to vote that's granted to all citizens of our nation. This is not about name calling like your side does, this not about hating like you do while claiming that people like me hate you, which couldn't be further from the truth because i'm a follower of Christ and i've always said that gays are just as precious as i am in the eyes of the Lord. This about love, and you won this extension which will serve as a stepping-stone for the full-blown dismantling of marriage in WA, fine.
As a fellow human being, I don't want to belittle your 'work' the way you belittle and demonize mine and what's more grievous, the way you demonize a whole state like Maine. I won't, that's the sort of thing your side does not mine. I'll take the victory for the families in Maine and channel my energy to the next referendums that need to be hold so that the people can decide.
That's democracy not hate.
As a fellow human being, I don't want to belittle your 'work' the way you belittle and demonize mine and what's more grievous, the way you demonize a whole state like Maine. I won't, that's the sort of thing your side does not mine. I'll take the victory for the families in Maine and channel my energy to the next referendums that need to be hold so that the people can decide.
That's democracy not hate.
42
@41: How would two women getting married dismantle marriage? Or two men?
Quoting Norm Rice, when Seattle voters approved Seattle's first domestic partnership bill in 1990:
And here we are, to this day, still fighting your lies.
Quoting Norm Rice, when Seattle voters approved Seattle's first domestic partnership bill in 1990:
"Make no mistake, (the) vote was a victory of truly national proportions for the gay and lesbian community," said Seattle Mayor Norm Rice.
And here we are, to this day, still fighting your lies.
43
Loveschild, the rocks in my garden know more about Christ than you do.
Get the fuck out of my state, and get the fuck out of my Slog while you're at it.
Get the fuck out of my state, and get the fuck out of my Slog while you're at it.
44
If you pray. things will happen because you prayed!
It's true. I read that somewhere.
I also have severe OCD and believe that I have to lick the doorknob three times before entering a room.
It's true. I read that somewhere.
I also have severe OCD and believe that I have to lick the doorknob three times before entering a room.
45
You are amusing, Loveschild @ 41.
Do you even read what you write on other threads? Apparently not.
You've been the one calling names. Does your interaction with Riz, ring a bell? It seems not.
You're the one insinuating that the approval of R 71, is going against the will of the people. Insinuating that King county is holding the entire state hostage. Yet, it's the people who took the time to vote that have approved it in greater numbers than those who reject it, and that total includes people across the state.
Your the one who claims to love but acts hatefully. Is it any wonder that people doubt your sincerity? I think not.
Perhaps it's your lack of comprehension, but I haven't "demonized a whole state like Maine.". 47% of those who chose to vote, voted against Q 1. 47% of Maine residents (who chose to exercise their right to vote) support marriage equality. I rechecked all my comments, I haven't said anything derogatory towards the state of Maine. So that is an out right lie. Am I surprised. Certainly not.
Channel your energies were you choose. Perhaps next time you will honor your own words, "so that the people can decide". Apparently, the people of Washington who approve R 71 are not worthy of your respect, because their voice (as given in evidence of their ballot returns) does not agree with your opinion.
By the way, you live in a republic, this isn't a democracy. Basic elementary school civics, you really should know this by now.
And, as always your forgiven for lying and stating that I am demonizing the entire state of Maine. Your also forgiven for claiming that I hate people, especially you. I don't hate you, there isn't a person on this planet that I hate, I just think your opinions are irrelevant.
More...
Do you even read what you write on other threads? Apparently not.
You've been the one calling names. Does your interaction with Riz, ring a bell? It seems not.
You're the one insinuating that the approval of R 71, is going against the will of the people. Insinuating that King county is holding the entire state hostage. Yet, it's the people who took the time to vote that have approved it in greater numbers than those who reject it, and that total includes people across the state.
Your the one who claims to love but acts hatefully. Is it any wonder that people doubt your sincerity? I think not.
Perhaps it's your lack of comprehension, but I haven't "demonized a whole state like Maine.". 47% of those who chose to vote, voted against Q 1. 47% of Maine residents (who chose to exercise their right to vote) support marriage equality. I rechecked all my comments, I haven't said anything derogatory towards the state of Maine. So that is an out right lie. Am I surprised. Certainly not.
Channel your energies were you choose. Perhaps next time you will honor your own words, "so that the people can decide". Apparently, the people of Washington who approve R 71 are not worthy of your respect, because their voice (as given in evidence of their ballot returns) does not agree with your opinion.
By the way, you live in a republic, this isn't a democracy. Basic elementary school civics, you really should know this by now.
And, as always your forgiven for lying and stating that I am demonizing the entire state of Maine. Your also forgiven for claiming that I hate people, especially you. I don't hate you, there isn't a person on this planet that I hate, I just think your opinions are irrelevant.
46
@41 - If gays are precious in the eyes of the Lord, as you say, then why are you fighting to deny us our rights?
Is that what your God wants? Really?
Is that what your God wants? Really?
47
@45 Likewise, Kim. I also think that someone like you that claims to be a christian while favoring everything that goes against Christ's church is also irrelevant not in my eyes but unto that of the Almighty Himself.
Do yourself a favor and come out once and for all as the atheist that you're. Then at least you can stop blaspheming against the holy spirit by claiming as truth things that do not appears on the Bible. I know that it will be way more easier for someone like Uriel who defends a satanic 'church' (because he hasn't yet known Christ) to enter the kingdom of God than for someone (like you) who with knowledge of what the Bible truly says still opts to deliberately distorts His word and led astray his children.
Like it or not the people of Maine as all states where plain and simple same sex marriage has been brought up have reject it 52.82% to 47.18% the opposite to the 51.98% to 48.02% that allowed for the trojan horse of SB 5688 to barely make it in WA. So go ahead and deny it all you want the facts speak for themselves and you or any other here labeling as bigots, douchebags or lacking of comprehension anyone who either directly or indirectly worked for the yes on 1 Maine to inform the people is nothing short of demonizing and a total show of disrespect and contempt for the intelligence of Maine voters.
Embrace your atheism openly Kim cause you are as far away from Christianity as as far as the east is from the west. Prove of it is your repeated delusion of thinking that you are somehow greater than the One who created us all and that you can go on offering forgiveness when you yourself are sinner. I love you also Kim and not in a lesbian way, sorry, i don't go the way. In God's Love.
Do yourself a favor and come out once and for all as the atheist that you're. Then at least you can stop blaspheming against the holy spirit by claiming as truth things that do not appears on the Bible. I know that it will be way more easier for someone like Uriel who defends a satanic 'church' (because he hasn't yet known Christ) to enter the kingdom of God than for someone (like you) who with knowledge of what the Bible truly says still opts to deliberately distorts His word and led astray his children.
Like it or not the people of Maine as all states where plain and simple same sex marriage has been brought up have reject it 52.82% to 47.18% the opposite to the 51.98% to 48.02% that allowed for the trojan horse of SB 5688 to barely make it in WA. So go ahead and deny it all you want the facts speak for themselves and you or any other here labeling as bigots, douchebags or lacking of comprehension anyone who either directly or indirectly worked for the yes on 1 Maine to inform the people is nothing short of demonizing and a total show of disrespect and contempt for the intelligence of Maine voters.
Embrace your atheism openly Kim cause you are as far away from Christianity as as far as the east is from the west. Prove of it is your repeated delusion of thinking that you are somehow greater than the One who created us all and that you can go on offering forgiveness when you yourself are sinner. I love you also Kim and not in a lesbian way, sorry, i don't go the way. In God's Love.
48
@46 Have you ever read the Bible? I invite you to do so, you don't have to take me at my word, read it for yourself. Yes you're precious unto the eye of the Lord. You're not what you do, but if you want to do it God gave you free will to do so. That however does not mean that His institutions are up for whatever the latest fashion dictates is in or new. Marriage is not something that comes and goes with the latest trends.
49
@ LC, do you know how ignorant your comments about King County are? R-71 was a STATEWIDE race, not a COUNTY BY COUNTY race. King County isn't determining the outcome, all the voters of Washington are.
A MAJORITY of Washington voters have decided that domestic partnerships and gay rights are the law of Washington. King County may be large and progressive, but it took all those rural YES votes to pass the referendum. If they all voted 100% against it, you'd be celebrating another victory now.
A MAJORITY of Washington voters have decided that domestic partnerships and gay rights are the law of Washington. King County may be large and progressive, but it took all those rural YES votes to pass the referendum. If they all voted 100% against it, you'd be celebrating another victory now.
50
@47. LC, I can only hope that you are the most accomplished troll that has ever found this site after growing tired of 4chan. Because otherwise, you're completely unbelievable. Well no, actually, that's not quite true. I should say that you're the incarnation of every close-minded, arrogant, smug, hypocritical Christian that those of us atheists (and I'm damn proud to characterize myself as such, after my upbringing and my experiences) have in our minds whenever we think of Christians.
I could quote you chapter and verse to refute all your anti-gay rhetoric thinly veiled as scripturally-based, but you'd just ignore that, like all the other legitimate questions that people have thrown at you in the course of these comments. I'll instead save myself some work (that is only going to be ignored anyway), and inform you that I grew up with people like you, and I couldn't be more pleased that none are in my life now. I don't need their very withholding brand of love and tolerance, and neither does our country or our world.
Just remember that you're no better than any other religious extremist, passing judgment on your fellow human beings when the Bible specifically tells you not to (Romans 14:10-12. Thank you, sinful Internet), and leave that to God. But there I go again, throwing your own holy texts in your face. And I'm sure God will forgive me the quote mining, as he has forgiven you your straw man arguments.
I could quote you chapter and verse to refute all your anti-gay rhetoric thinly veiled as scripturally-based, but you'd just ignore that, like all the other legitimate questions that people have thrown at you in the course of these comments. I'll instead save myself some work (that is only going to be ignored anyway), and inform you that I grew up with people like you, and I couldn't be more pleased that none are in my life now. I don't need their very withholding brand of love and tolerance, and neither does our country or our world.
Just remember that you're no better than any other religious extremist, passing judgment on your fellow human beings when the Bible specifically tells you not to (Romans 14:10-12. Thank you, sinful Internet), and leave that to God. But there I go again, throwing your own holy texts in your face. And I'm sure God will forgive me the quote mining, as he has forgiven you your straw man arguments.
51
@48: The best part of your remarks is that he grew up in a rather devout household.
I've read the bible and various interpretive texts about the bible many times myself, and I know right away that the Pharisees have nothing on ya, snookums. How's that camel taste?
I've read the bible and various interpretive texts about the bible many times myself, and I know right away that the Pharisees have nothing on ya, snookums. How's that camel taste?
52
@40
My hate and hostility toward Hateful Bigot and those like her comes solely from the fact that she and others like her (maybe even yourself) use the ballot box to bash people who don't fit into her worldview. Yes, bash.
Because for as long as the Bible is used against gay people (and it is the SOLE reason HB exists - her holy fucking Bible) - ignorant fools will use it as good a reason as any to bash someone's skull in.
Dismantling of marriage - such an empty, useless, nothing phrase. It means nothing. We bang our heads against the wall when HB and folks like her say it. It means NOTHING.
Whether you realize it or not, a Reject 71 sign has an incredible amount of hatred behind it. An ENORMOUS amount of hatred. Because as I said in a previous post somewhere, very few who voted to Reject knew what the hell they were Rejecting, except that they were Rejecting Gay People. And to them, that is surely enough.
When these popularity contests are held (because, really, that's what they are)...all those times, 31 times over the past many years...and the gays are voted 'unpopular'...that just validates a bigots' worldview even further.
Hateful Bigot still hasn't answered one query I've posed...gay kids - why not choose to be straight again instead of suicide; when did she choose to not be gay, or are gay folks just special to get that choice. And on and on.
I have a special hatred for her, and I'll tell you why. She's using her precious religious teachings to rule over people who don't believe a whit of what her precious religious teachings say. Her way or the highway. Preferably, a highway littered with gay-bashed people.
Fuck Hateful Bigot and her religious phoney baloney. Fuck Her.
More...
My hate and hostility toward Hateful Bigot and those like her comes solely from the fact that she and others like her (maybe even yourself) use the ballot box to bash people who don't fit into her worldview. Yes, bash.
Because for as long as the Bible is used against gay people (and it is the SOLE reason HB exists - her holy fucking Bible) - ignorant fools will use it as good a reason as any to bash someone's skull in.
Dismantling of marriage - such an empty, useless, nothing phrase. It means nothing. We bang our heads against the wall when HB and folks like her say it. It means NOTHING.
Whether you realize it or not, a Reject 71 sign has an incredible amount of hatred behind it. An ENORMOUS amount of hatred. Because as I said in a previous post somewhere, very few who voted to Reject knew what the hell they were Rejecting, except that they were Rejecting Gay People. And to them, that is surely enough.
When these popularity contests are held (because, really, that's what they are)...all those times, 31 times over the past many years...and the gays are voted 'unpopular'...that just validates a bigots' worldview even further.
Hateful Bigot still hasn't answered one query I've posed...gay kids - why not choose to be straight again instead of suicide; when did she choose to not be gay, or are gay folks just special to get that choice. And on and on.
I have a special hatred for her, and I'll tell you why. She's using her precious religious teachings to rule over people who don't believe a whit of what her precious religious teachings say. Her way or the highway. Preferably, a highway littered with gay-bashed people.
Fuck Hateful Bigot and her religious phoney baloney. Fuck Her.
53
Oh, and Hateful Bigot? That fucking cartoon next to your idiotic, ignorant, prejudiced comments?
It's offensive.
To actual Christians who don't hate. Who give their time and money to help people instead of popularity contests to put others down.
You really would be better off with a swastika, something more indicative of your true inner filth.
Fuck You.
It's offensive.
To actual Christians who don't hate. Who give their time and money to help people instead of popularity contests to put others down.
You really would be better off with a swastika, something more indicative of your true inner filth.
Fuck You.
54
Loveschild @ 47,
Thank you for the compliments.
And, for contradicting yourself. You realize you shot your own self in the foot?
You continually make the mistake in thinking that I kowtow to religious bullies. I do not. Your opinion is and always be irrelevant on this issue.
I forgive you.
Thank you for the compliments.
And, for contradicting yourself. You realize you shot your own self in the foot?
You continually make the mistake in thinking that I kowtow to religious bullies. I do not. Your opinion is and always be irrelevant on this issue.
I forgive you.
55
10 You, then, why do you judge your brother? Or why do you look down on your brother? For we will all stand before God's judgment seat. 11 It is written:
" 'As surely as I live,' says the Lord,
'every knee will bow before me; every tongue will confess to God.' " 12 So then, each of us will give an account of himself to God.
Knat, you and I are in no disagreement here. He will be the one who will decide our fate in the end. But in the mean time what do you think the Bible is for? Is it just some book of made up stories (like most like to say here)?
God has provided us this blueprint instructional scripture so that we are able to discern between that which leds to life and that which leds to death, so that we're able to return to his path when we inevitably deviate from it due to our human condition. We are all sinners, you, Kim, Matt, chic65, Bacon, very bad and me, all of us, all of us our his children. How can you see that as me being "close-minded, arrogant, smug, hypocritical" while ignoring your own obvious arrogance and complex of superiority against those who follow the teachings in the Bible? It speaks volumes of what's in your heart, and it pains me to know that anyone could harbor such feelings inside of them.
Regardless, at least you know the truth about God's word even when you choose to ignore it. I know you do because of what you wrote in the end, at least you know that He is the only one with the power to offer true forgiveness to both to you and me. In God's Love.
56
Loveschild,
Is your Bible missing this?
Matthew 6:14-15 (New International Version)
14For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15But if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.
Is your Bible missing this?
Matthew 6:14-15 (New International Version)
14For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15But if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.
57
Loveschild,
And, is your Bible missing this as well?
Matthew 18:21-35 (New International Version)
The Parable of the Unmerciful Servant
21Then Peter came to Jesus and asked, "Lord, how many times shall I forgive my brother when he sins against me? Up to seven times?"
22Jesus answered, "I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven times.[a]
23"Therefore, the kingdom of heaven is like a king who wanted to settle accounts with his servants. 24As he began the settlement, a man who owed him ten thousand talents[b] was brought to him. 25Since he was not able to pay, the master ordered that he and his wife and his children and all that he had be sold to repay the debt.
26"The servant fell on his knees before him. 'Be patient with me,' he begged, 'and I will pay back everything.' 27The servant's master took pity on him, canceled the debt and let him go.
28"But when that servant went out, he found one of his fellow servants who owed him a hundred denarii.[c] He grabbed him and began to choke him. 'Pay back what you owe me!' he demanded.
29"His fellow servant fell to his knees and begged him, 'Be patient with me, and I will pay you back.'
30"But he refused. Instead, he went off and had the man thrown into prison until he could pay the debt. 31When the other servants saw what had happened, they were greatly distressed and went and told their master everything that had happened.
32"Then the master called the servant in. 'You wicked servant,' he said, 'I canceled all that debt of yours because you begged me to. 33Shouldn't you have had mercy on your fellow servant just as I had on you?' 34In anger his master turned him over to the jailers to be tortured, until he should pay back all he owed.
35"This is how my heavenly Father will treat each of you unless you forgive your brother from your heart."
More...
And, is your Bible missing this as well?
Matthew 18:21-35 (New International Version)
The Parable of the Unmerciful Servant
21Then Peter came to Jesus and asked, "Lord, how many times shall I forgive my brother when he sins against me? Up to seven times?"
22Jesus answered, "I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven times.[a]
23"Therefore, the kingdom of heaven is like a king who wanted to settle accounts with his servants. 24As he began the settlement, a man who owed him ten thousand talents[b] was brought to him. 25Since he was not able to pay, the master ordered that he and his wife and his children and all that he had be sold to repay the debt.
26"The servant fell on his knees before him. 'Be patient with me,' he begged, 'and I will pay back everything.' 27The servant's master took pity on him, canceled the debt and let him go.
28"But when that servant went out, he found one of his fellow servants who owed him a hundred denarii.[c] He grabbed him and began to choke him. 'Pay back what you owe me!' he demanded.
29"His fellow servant fell to his knees and begged him, 'Be patient with me, and I will pay you back.'
30"But he refused. Instead, he went off and had the man thrown into prison until he could pay the debt. 31When the other servants saw what had happened, they were greatly distressed and went and told their master everything that had happened.
32"Then the master called the servant in. 'You wicked servant,' he said, 'I canceled all that debt of yours because you begged me to. 33Shouldn't you have had mercy on your fellow servant just as I had on you?' 34In anger his master turned him over to the jailers to be tortured, until he should pay back all he owed.
35"This is how my heavenly Father will treat each of you unless you forgive your brother from your heart."
58
Okay, I shall not curse at you or call you names, LC. It's been a long week and I'm exhausted.
I'm going to explain my frustration, my name-calling, my cursing.
I was born gay. You and yours don't believe that, but I know it in my bones. You can shout to the high heavens about what the Bible says, but I and every gay person knows it in our bones.
We were born gay.
And after struggling with that fact for years (some more than others), we finally were able to just 'say it'. I'm gay. And that felt great.
It wasn't a choice. It wasn't a whim. It is what it is. I'm gay. I can never be straight.
But you cannot accept that. You cannot allow yourself to even entertain that thought.
You want us to be like you, to see life the way you see it, you and yours feel the need to legislate your BELIEFS.
And we curse, call you names, because that is arrogant. What would you call it?
It's your way or none at all. How is that fair?
Anyways, I already know the answer I'm going to get.
Bible this, Christian that.
Well, I'm a Jew so I clearly don't believe what you do, and was brought up in an entirely different world.
But, because you don't think I was born gay, I have to live by the Christian rules, the extreme Christian rules, that you and yours must make law. That's just the way it is, right?
I'm going to explain my frustration, my name-calling, my cursing.
I was born gay. You and yours don't believe that, but I know it in my bones. You can shout to the high heavens about what the Bible says, but I and every gay person knows it in our bones.
We were born gay.
And after struggling with that fact for years (some more than others), we finally were able to just 'say it'. I'm gay. And that felt great.
It wasn't a choice. It wasn't a whim. It is what it is. I'm gay. I can never be straight.
But you cannot accept that. You cannot allow yourself to even entertain that thought.
You want us to be like you, to see life the way you see it, you and yours feel the need to legislate your BELIEFS.
And we curse, call you names, because that is arrogant. What would you call it?
It's your way or none at all. How is that fair?
Anyways, I already know the answer I'm going to get.
Bible this, Christian that.
Well, I'm a Jew so I clearly don't believe what you do, and was brought up in an entirely different world.
But, because you don't think I was born gay, I have to live by the Christian rules, the extreme Christian rules, that you and yours must make law. That's just the way it is, right?
59
Loveschild,
And, is this one missing two?
Luke 6:37-42 (New International Version)
Judging Others
37"Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven. 38Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap. For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you."
39He also told them this parable: "Can a blind man lead a blind man? Will they not both fall into a pit? 40A student is not above his teacher, but everyone who is fully trained will be like his teacher.
41"Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 42How can you say to your brother, 'Brother, let me take the speck out of your eye,' when you yourself fail to see the plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye.
And, is this one missing two?
Luke 6:37-42 (New International Version)
Judging Others
37"Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven. 38Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap. For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you."
39He also told them this parable: "Can a blind man lead a blind man? Will they not both fall into a pit? 40A student is not above his teacher, but everyone who is fully trained will be like his teacher.
41"Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 42How can you say to your brother, 'Brother, let me take the speck out of your eye,' when you yourself fail to see the plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye.
60
Loveschild,
How about this one. Is it missing, too?
Ephesians 4:32 (New International Version)
32Be kind and compassionate to one another, forgiving each other, just as in Christ God forgave you
Your own words below, don't match the scriptures you proclaim your faith by. Or do you fail in understanding how it is applied?
"Embrace your atheism openly Kim cause you are as far away from Christianity as as far as the east is from the west. Prove of it is your repeated delusion of thinking that you are somehow greater than the One who created us all and that you can go on offering forgiveness when you yourself are sinner."
And, because I actually understand what I read and can apply it. I do forgive you, as always.
How about this one. Is it missing, too?
Ephesians 4:32 (New International Version)
32Be kind and compassionate to one another, forgiving each other, just as in Christ God forgave you
Your own words below, don't match the scriptures you proclaim your faith by. Or do you fail in understanding how it is applied?
"Embrace your atheism openly Kim cause you are as far away from Christianity as as far as the east is from the west. Prove of it is your repeated delusion of thinking that you are somehow greater than the One who created us all and that you can go on offering forgiveness when you yourself are sinner."
And, because I actually understand what I read and can apply it. I do forgive you, as always.
61
Sorry, one last thing...I re-read something above...you write this:
"How can you see that as me being "close-minded, arrogant, smug, hypocritical" while ignoring your own obvious arrogance and complex of superiority against those who follow the teachings in the Bible? It speaks volumes of what's in your heart, and it pains me to know that anyone could harbor such feelings inside of them."
And therein lies the rub. Follow the teachings of the Bible, LC. Follow them each and every minute of each and every day.
BUT, you and yours ARE arrogant because you expect ME to do the same, and if I won't, well, I just have to live by your rules nonetheless and you will make sure that is politically legislated so I have no choice but to.
See, allowing same-sex marriage doesn't affect you following your teachings.
You can still follow them. The Bible will still guide your life; is not being re-written.
There are 18K gay couples that are married in CA.
There are couples married in other states. The Bible has not been changed.
How has this affected you following the teachings of your Bible? Can you describe that for us?
You still quote the Bible...the Bible helps you in your day-to-day.
But gay people ARE married somewhere.
So, clearly, life goes on.
I'm ready for my religious brow-beating now.
"How can you see that as me being "close-minded, arrogant, smug, hypocritical" while ignoring your own obvious arrogance and complex of superiority against those who follow the teachings in the Bible? It speaks volumes of what's in your heart, and it pains me to know that anyone could harbor such feelings inside of them."
And therein lies the rub. Follow the teachings of the Bible, LC. Follow them each and every minute of each and every day.
BUT, you and yours ARE arrogant because you expect ME to do the same, and if I won't, well, I just have to live by your rules nonetheless and you will make sure that is politically legislated so I have no choice but to.
See, allowing same-sex marriage doesn't affect you following your teachings.
You can still follow them. The Bible will still guide your life; is not being re-written.
There are 18K gay couples that are married in CA.
There are couples married in other states. The Bible has not been changed.
How has this affected you following the teachings of your Bible? Can you describe that for us?
You still quote the Bible...the Bible helps you in your day-to-day.
But gay people ARE married somewhere.
So, clearly, life goes on.
I'm ready for my religious brow-beating now.
62
@61 chic65, I hope that's true. I wouldn't ever curse you or wish ill on you even when you do so to me.
I'm not a Jew but can you please tell me what the Tanakh and the Talmud says concerning homosexuality? I'm under the impression that is the same as what is says in the Bible but if I'm wrong can you please direct me to the quotes?
You and i are sisters in God's eyes, i have lost my cool too by calling you a hatemonger, so i'm guilty of name-calling against you too. Sorry.
I'm not a Jew but can you please tell me what the Tanakh and the Talmud says concerning homosexuality? I'm under the impression that is the same as what is says in the Bible but if I'm wrong can you please direct me to the quotes?
You and i are sisters in God's eyes, i have lost my cool too by calling you a hatemonger, so i'm guilty of name-calling against you too. Sorry.
64
I went to Hebrew school, I was Bar Mitzvah'd, I still go to synagogue on High Holidays, but, honestly, I don't care what Judaism says about homosexuality; what it says or doesn't say is not pertinent to my day-to-day existence; how I wake up in the morning, the love and caring I have for the person I've spent the last 4 years with...it doesn't matter to me one bit.
I'm lucky to have Jewish parents who didn't toss me out when I finally told them I was gay.
Whatever the Talmud etc says, I'm still gay, and will be til the day I die.
And again, this is the heart of the frustration 'we' have with 'you'.
If I'm not a religious person, I can't have access to what you have.
It's all comes down to a belief system.
But we all don't believe in what you believe. So, how does this eventually 'work'?
The courts will eventually rule. And you will still worship how you choose to, and I will not. Life will go on.
I'm lucky to have Jewish parents who didn't toss me out when I finally told them I was gay.
Whatever the Talmud etc says, I'm still gay, and will be til the day I die.
And again, this is the heart of the frustration 'we' have with 'you'.
If I'm not a religious person, I can't have access to what you have.
It's all comes down to a belief system.
But we all don't believe in what you believe. So, how does this eventually 'work'?
The courts will eventually rule. And you will still worship how you choose to, and I will not. Life will go on.
65
@64 I've asked that many times and nobody has been able to tell me, I was hoping you knowing more about Judaism than I do could clarify it for me.
It's my understanding that courts have are not there to go above the standards instituted by society, but rather work withing them based on the Constitution. It doesn't work any other way that way in this beautiful nation of ours.
It's "We the people" not We the courts.
@63 Look at the quote from chic65 @8, she was been honest there, she was being accurate there.
It's my understanding that courts have are not there to go above the standards instituted by society, but rather work withing them based on the Constitution. It doesn't work any other way that way in this beautiful nation of ours.
It's "We the people" not We the courts.
@63 Look at the quote from chic65 @8, she was been honest there, she was being accurate there.
66
Here we come to our impasse again, LC.
It's your way or the highway then.
If 'we' try to go 'state-by-state' and try to gain equal footing with you, then 'we' will never win equality and you and yours will use every trick in the book to make sure that we are turned back.
Even so-called 'liberal' states, like CA, or ME...still have plenty of people in them that see 'gay' and instantly recoil.
So, the courts, yes.
What about 'We the People' applies to just you and people who believe what you believe, but not me?
Why can't the courts rule in favor of me without you calling it activist?
Why did the courts have to intervene in 1967 with interracial marriage?
And I know that last statement is going to inspire the 'knee-jerk' reaction that the two are not equal.
But, see, LC...this is the heart of it. They are equal.
Two people in 1967 wanted to get married who loved each other, but happened to have different skin color, and had to have the courts make that possible, everywhere.
Two people in 2009 who love each other but happen to be born gay...must eventually go to the courts.
You think being gay is a behavior based on your beliefs..
I'm telling you its not, from experience of actually being gay.
Sorry, I'm seeing the arrogance rear its head again with that 'We the People' comment. I'm a 'people' too.
And also, I'm a 'he' not a 'she'...
It's your way or the highway then.
If 'we' try to go 'state-by-state' and try to gain equal footing with you, then 'we' will never win equality and you and yours will use every trick in the book to make sure that we are turned back.
Even so-called 'liberal' states, like CA, or ME...still have plenty of people in them that see 'gay' and instantly recoil.
So, the courts, yes.
What about 'We the People' applies to just you and people who believe what you believe, but not me?
Why can't the courts rule in favor of me without you calling it activist?
Why did the courts have to intervene in 1967 with interracial marriage?
And I know that last statement is going to inspire the 'knee-jerk' reaction that the two are not equal.
But, see, LC...this is the heart of it. They are equal.
Two people in 1967 wanted to get married who loved each other, but happened to have different skin color, and had to have the courts make that possible, everywhere.
Two people in 2009 who love each other but happen to be born gay...must eventually go to the courts.
You think being gay is a behavior based on your beliefs..
I'm telling you its not, from experience of actually being gay.
Sorry, I'm seeing the arrogance rear its head again with that 'We the People' comment. I'm a 'people' too.
And also, I'm a 'he' not a 'she'...
67
Here's some admittedly generalized stuff about Jews and homosexuality.
http://judaism.about.com/od/homosexualit…
And within, this interpretation...which says I was born this way, hallelujah. Still 'wrong', but instinctive.
According to Boteach, homosexual acts are wrong simply because the Torah says they are wrong, and not because they are an aberration or sickness. Sexuality as a whole is instinctive, and both heterosexuality and homosexuality are natural. Then why does G-d say that heterosexual love is holy and homosexual love is an abomination? Heterosexual love is the way the human race propagates itself. G-d demands that we regulate our sexual activity so that we will lead happier lives and fulfill our commitments to our communities.
But you know what, LC...it just doesn't matter to me what any of this says. I don't care. It doesn't affect me in November, 2009. It never has, and it never will.
What does matter is putting a roof over my head, providing for myself and those I love and caring for those I love.
And you and yours seek to not let me do that based on your beliefs.
http://judaism.about.com/od/homosexualit…
And within, this interpretation...which says I was born this way, hallelujah. Still 'wrong', but instinctive.
According to Boteach, homosexual acts are wrong simply because the Torah says they are wrong, and not because they are an aberration or sickness. Sexuality as a whole is instinctive, and both heterosexuality and homosexuality are natural. Then why does G-d say that heterosexual love is holy and homosexual love is an abomination? Heterosexual love is the way the human race propagates itself. G-d demands that we regulate our sexual activity so that we will lead happier lives and fulfill our commitments to our communities.
But you know what, LC...it just doesn't matter to me what any of this says. I don't care. It doesn't affect me in November, 2009. It never has, and it never will.
What does matter is putting a roof over my head, providing for myself and those I love and caring for those I love.
And you and yours seek to not let me do that based on your beliefs.
68
Loveschild - I was raised in a very Christian household. Then I grew up and realized that an ancient book of mythology has no bearing on reality, or on my life. Neither do you.
69
52
why does anyone commit suicide?
The teen years are difficult in just about every way and kids have questions about what and who they are and what they want and feel and believe.
Ideally it is a time one can explore and experiment without locking oneself into anything for life.
A 12-13-14 year old can go through a Goth stage or a Mohawk or an Emo phase and move on with little or no lingering effect.
Dabbling in homosexuality is different.
Kids who get trapped in the homosexual tarbaby- egged on by GayStraightAlliance Advisors eager to swell the ranks and starstruck by a popular culture that glamorizes, idealizes and misrepresents homosexuality, find it is a hotel they can check into but can never check out of.
Once an impressionable confused kid has been flimflammed into "outing" them self it is very difficult to put that toothpaste back in the tube.
And along the way collecting experiences the youth may come to see as perverted, deviant, disgusting and degrading make pretending it never happened even more difficult.
If they develop second thoughts or remorse about declaring them self homosexual they often feel there is no way to reverse that action- they are now trapped in something they deeply regret and deplore.
Popular figures like Dan increase the pressure on these kids by insisting that homosexuality is an innate characteristic that you "are" and cannot change.
When ask at a college Q&A if one could go from gay to straight Dan responded that 'you could tell people you had but no one will believe you'.
Is it any wonder that kids who want to disavow and recant their ill advised premature declarations of homosexuality feel no way out but suicide?
And it makes it all the more heinous that Dan would encourage American teens to engage in "GAY SEX" as a means of birth control.
What percentage of kids who experiment with homosexual behavior will feel trapped and unable to escape?
More...
why does anyone commit suicide?
The teen years are difficult in just about every way and kids have questions about what and who they are and what they want and feel and believe.
Ideally it is a time one can explore and experiment without locking oneself into anything for life.
A 12-13-14 year old can go through a Goth stage or a Mohawk or an Emo phase and move on with little or no lingering effect.
Dabbling in homosexuality is different.
Kids who get trapped in the homosexual tarbaby- egged on by GayStraightAlliance Advisors eager to swell the ranks and starstruck by a popular culture that glamorizes, idealizes and misrepresents homosexuality, find it is a hotel they can check into but can never check out of.
Once an impressionable confused kid has been flimflammed into "outing" them self it is very difficult to put that toothpaste back in the tube.
And along the way collecting experiences the youth may come to see as perverted, deviant, disgusting and degrading make pretending it never happened even more difficult.
If they develop second thoughts or remorse about declaring them self homosexual they often feel there is no way to reverse that action- they are now trapped in something they deeply regret and deplore.
Popular figures like Dan increase the pressure on these kids by insisting that homosexuality is an innate characteristic that you "are" and cannot change.
When ask at a college Q&A if one could go from gay to straight Dan responded that 'you could tell people you had but no one will believe you'.
Is it any wonder that kids who want to disavow and recant their ill advised premature declarations of homosexuality feel no way out but suicide?
And it makes it all the more heinous that Dan would encourage American teens to engage in "GAY SEX" as a means of birth control.
What percentage of kids who experiment with homosexual behavior will feel trapped and unable to escape?
70
65,
Come on, your smarter than that. King County has the highest population, and specific county elections, that likely led to an higher percentage of voter turn out. Have you never looked at Washington's break down in 2008's presidential election, you'd see the same break down; blue (Obama) islands in a sea of red (McCain). By your rational Washington should have supported McCain. Washington went blue because of the population density provided by King County, and other counties in the Puget Sound. You're too intelligent to claim that R 71 is a county initiative, it is a state wide initiative. And, you insult individuals who live in counties other than King that voted to approve R 71.
Come on, your smarter than that. King County has the highest population, and specific county elections, that likely led to an higher percentage of voter turn out. Have you never looked at Washington's break down in 2008's presidential election, you'd see the same break down; blue (Obama) islands in a sea of red (McCain). By your rational Washington should have supported McCain. Washington went blue because of the population density provided by King County, and other counties in the Puget Sound. You're too intelligent to claim that R 71 is a county initiative, it is a state wide initiative. And, you insult individuals who live in counties other than King that voted to approve R 71.
71
FamilyValues.
I've been nice to LC these last couple of posts, civil even, but, there you go being an arrogant fuck about something you have never experienced and know absolutely nothing about. (or, then again, maybe you have, and do...)
You have the arrogance to tell ME who I AM, when you've never taken a STEP in my shoes.
I'm not even going to argue your idiotic 'points' and statements.
Go fuck yourself.
I've been nice to LC these last couple of posts, civil even, but, there you go being an arrogant fuck about something you have never experienced and know absolutely nothing about. (or, then again, maybe you have, and do...)
You have the arrogance to tell ME who I AM, when you've never taken a STEP in my shoes.
I'm not even going to argue your idiotic 'points' and statements.
Go fuck yourself.
72
Seriously...kids get 'trapped'. No, they don't get 'trapped'.
They are born that way, you know-nothing.
YOU'RE the one trapped in the most narrow-minded, bigoted mindset a person can have.
Why don't you go outside and actually talk to a gay person.
Asshole.
They are born that way, you know-nothing.
YOU'RE the one trapped in the most narrow-minded, bigoted mindset a person can have.
Why don't you go outside and actually talk to a gay person.
Asshole.
73
@ LC, in a statewide election, all the state's voters decide. Not King County. So forget what 8 said because that's also idiotic.
Look at the numbers. Margins are close everywhere. A whole lot of rural voters are on board with R-71. Naturally, they lean conservative, but this isn't about carrying counties. It's about what all the voters in Washington want, and a majority of Washingtonians want gays and lesbians to enjoy domestic partnerships.
@ Chic65, don't bother with the name-shifting unregistered troll. He's only trying to get your goat. If he was really interested in honest debate, he would register and not use easily debunked crackpot ideas like he posts.
Look at the numbers. Margins are close everywhere. A whole lot of rural voters are on board with R-71. Naturally, they lean conservative, but this isn't about carrying counties. It's about what all the voters in Washington want, and a majority of Washingtonians want gays and lesbians to enjoy domestic partnerships.
@ Chic65, don't bother with the name-shifting unregistered troll. He's only trying to get your goat. If he was really interested in honest debate, he would register and not use easily debunked crackpot ideas like he posts.
75
Poor Loveschild. After all the drugs and the booze and the abortions, she finally found God. Granted, it's the wrong God, but it's the only one she has.
Besides heroin, of course. But she knows she can't go there anymore. The last thing she needs is to have the state take her kids again.
Besides heroin, of course. But she knows she can't go there anymore. The last thing she needs is to have the state take her kids again.
78
"Chaff" means (according to Dictionary.com): to mock, tease, or jest in a good-natured way; banter.
80
Another chapter LC's Bible is missing:
Matthew 8:
5When Jesus had entered Capernaum, a centurion came to him, asking for help. 6"Lord," he said, "my fuckslave lies at home paralyzed and in terrible suffering."
7Jesus said to him, "I will go and heal him."
8The centurion replied, "Lord, I do not deserve to have you come under my roof. But just say the word, and my fuckslave will be healed. 9For I myself am a man under authority, with soldiers under me. I tell this one, 'Go,' and he goes; and that one, 'Come,' and he comes. I say to my fuckslave, 'Do this,' and he does it."
10When Jesus heard this, he was astonished and said to those following him, "I tell you the truth, I have not found anyone in Israel with such great faith. 11I say to you that many will come from the east and the west, and will take their places at the feast with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven. 12But the subjects of the kingdom will be thrown outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."
13Then Jesus said to the centurion, "Go! It will be done just as you believed it would." And his fuckslave was healed at that very hour.
Matthew 8:
5When Jesus had entered Capernaum, a centurion came to him, asking for help. 6"Lord," he said, "my fuckslave lies at home paralyzed and in terrible suffering."
7Jesus said to him, "I will go and heal him."
8The centurion replied, "Lord, I do not deserve to have you come under my roof. But just say the word, and my fuckslave will be healed. 9For I myself am a man under authority, with soldiers under me. I tell this one, 'Go,' and he goes; and that one, 'Come,' and he comes. I say to my fuckslave, 'Do this,' and he does it."
10When Jesus heard this, he was astonished and said to those following him, "I tell you the truth, I have not found anyone in Israel with such great faith. 11I say to you that many will come from the east and the west, and will take their places at the feast with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven. 12But the subjects of the kingdom will be thrown outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."
13Then Jesus said to the centurion, "Go! It will be done just as you believed it would." And his fuckslave was healed at that very hour.
82
Why is "douchebag" such a common name to call undesirable people nowadays? I hear it all the time, everywhere. just wondering
83
82 - it's been a common name for a long time. I first heard it, though I didn't know what a douchebag was yet, in about 7th grade, which would mean 1977-ish.
86
81--I thought the point was obvious. Jesus was clearly gay-friendly. Jesus healed the Centurion's fuckslave without declaring an opinion upon the condition of fuckslavery. Such omission in this case amounts to outright endorsement in the minds of the many.
87
In the minds of the many desperate to justify perversion and deviant behavior.
He condemned adultery vigorously throughout His ministry but when dealing with the adulterous woman brought to be stoned and the Samaritan woman at the well did not condemn them.
He loved (and healed) the sinner without condoning the sin.
As do those who follow Him today.
Scripture is unambiguous in condemning homosexual behavior- had a new doctrine on the subject been the point of the story it would have been made clear.
He condemned adultery vigorously throughout His ministry but when dealing with the adulterous woman brought to be stoned and the Samaritan woman at the well did not condemn them.
He loved (and healed) the sinner without condoning the sin.
As do those who follow Him today.
Scripture is unambiguous in condemning homosexual behavior- had a new doctrine on the subject been the point of the story it would have been made clear.
88
87--I don't see how you can possibly regard Matthew 8:5-13 as anything short of condonation. There's no "go and sin no more" here as was said to the woman taken in adultery. There's no disapproving opinion expressed here. Nor is there when the story is repeated in Luke. Jesus clearly does not regard the Centurion's conduct as sinful.
Furthermore, even if you're right and sodomy is sinful, you're wrong. We're all sinners. And all of us face choices where we sin if we take one course and sin if we take the other. A gay man has the choice of openly dating other men, falling in love with a man, and partnering up with him (which I defy you to find a specific example of Jesus condemning) or bearing false witness. What is the moral choice here?
Furthermore, even if you're right and sodomy is sinful, you're wrong. We're all sinners. And all of us face choices where we sin if we take one course and sin if we take the other. A gay man has the choice of openly dating other men, falling in love with a man, and partnering up with him (which I defy you to find a specific example of Jesus condemning) or bearing false witness. What is the moral choice here?
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