October 23, 2008
Ending the Occupation
One Woman's Fight to Keep the Army Out of Seattle Parks
Kelly O
KATHY BARKER Not playing around.
Tools
Kathy Barker is at war with the U.S. Army and the Seattle parks department. Barker, a military "counter-recruiter" and mother of three high-school students, has already been
part of a push to limit military recruiters' presence on high-school campuses. Now she's set her sights on Seattle's parks department.
Stranger Personals
Last April, Barker, who sits on the board of Washington Truth in Recruiting, which provides students with alternatives to military recruitment, fired off a letter to the City Council and the parks department after army and navy soldiers showed up to a teen event at the Delridge Community Center in Southwest Seattle in a shiny black Hummer.
"[The parks department had] been advertising a teen-appreciation day [with] basketball, swimming, a DJ, and a barbecue," Barker says. She says the woman who alerted her to the recruiters' presence "pulled up with her kids and saw two guys in army fatigues in a black Hummer. She wanted them to go away and they wouldn't." Barker says she's also heard of recruiters showing up to events with climbing walls and video games.
In September, attorneys for the parks department killed a proposal that would have allowed recruiters at job fairs in parks facilities but prohibited them from passing out materials or appearing at other events in fatigues.
Dewey Potter, a spokeswoman for the department, insists that the soldiers "weren't recruiters," although she admits "their presence may have been to attract people" to the armed forces. Scott Lawrence, a spokesman for the U.S. Army's Seattle Recruiting Battalion, says that "if [military officers] show up in a Humvee," they're "probably" from the recruiting office, adding, "We go where there's an opportunity to show up."
This is exactly what Barker is concerned about. "I think the recruiting events are really predatory," she says. "The City Council passed a resolution against the Iraq War [in March 2007]. It seems almost crazy and against policy to be recruiting in parks."
So far, Barker says, only one City Council member, Richard McIver, has responded directly to her April e-mail. In his response, McIver wrote, "The military no doubt participated in part because it was an opportunity to present the military in a positive light... to eventually help with recruiting. The same could certainly be said of the participation of the navy's Blue Angels at Seafair. (Of course, that participation is opposed by some for just this reason.)"
In another e-mail, an aide for Council Member Tom Rasmussen told Barker the council was busy dealing with the annual budget and that Rasmussen—who chairs the council's parks committee—does not think the recruitment issue should fall to the council.
Despite Barker's hell-raising, the parks department says it doesn't
have any plans to restrict the access of recruiters or even announce
which events they'll be at. "It's a First Amendment issue as far as
we're concerned," Potter says. 
1
No one is forcing her children to join the army. She can educate her children and train them to not sign up, but other people have the right to be recruited by the armed forces. And elected officials are the ones who continue to drag on the war in Iraq, so maybe we should ban them from parks. Did the city council pass a resolution about the war in Afghanistan too? Plus, there is way more to the army than the war in Iraq. Families are dying of starvation and yet she spends her time on this?
2
There are a lot of dishonest recruiting techniques full of false promises targeted at teens. I think at the very least parents should be able to know what events recruiters will be at.
3
The Recruiters consistently misrepresent what they are recruiting our young adults to. It's common for boot camp to begin with the Sergeant telling the fresh meat that they can now forget everything their recruiter told them. If a credible argument could be made that crack dealers are serving our country, some people would support no doubt support them.
4
The military cannot be considered in the same light as other employers. Do military recruiters emphasize the fact that a recruit can be placed in the position of torturing prisoners? Are recruiters honest about other life shattering duties the military requires of people? Or do they just offer the high-tech recruiting games gauged to make the kid feel immortal in dangerous siuations?
Society has a duty to protect its children. Any 10th grader can use Google to find a recruiter if they must. The City has a higher and better duty than making military recruitment easy. They should be helping parents with knowledge that can keep their kids safe.
Society has a duty to protect its children. Any 10th grader can use Google to find a recruiter if they must. The City has a higher and better duty than making military recruitment easy. They should be helping parents with knowledge that can keep their kids safe.
5
You people whine about the Military recruiting, but would you rather a draft? We have an all "volunteer" military at the moment and that means they need new volunteers. My recruiter never lied to me and I think many of you have gotten your false opinions from the TV.
6
apparently it is only a free country who this woman believes it should be a free country for. Get a life
7
This woman is pretty damn elitist and judgemental. So, she's basically making the call for all of us that the military is bad. Tell that to the many people who serve and are proud of their jobs.
8
I am an iraq veteran, and i think recruiters are scum. they are lying cowards. they should all be driven into hiding.
i hope there is a lot of room in hell, because there are a lot of corrupt recruiters who will burn for selling kids into slavery!
hey, recruiters, I'm still here, and if i ever see your car in my neighborhood again i'll slash its tires. stay away from seattle!
i hope there is a lot of room in hell, because there are a lot of corrupt recruiters who will burn for selling kids into slavery!
hey, recruiters, I'm still here, and if i ever see your car in my neighborhood again i'll slash its tires. stay away from seattle!
9
I want to express that this is not a one woman fight but the view of numerous Americans--in fact 70% of Americans want us out of Iraq. The statistics are this: the U.S. has over 750 military bases in over 100 countries. We are 4.5% of the people on earth and use 25% of the resources on earth. This is unsustainable. Our wars are not fought to spread democracy and freedom but are fought for control of resources! We do not need a military presence in our city parks. What we need is the truth about what is really going on in our country.
10
No one individual, nor school district, nor city council should have the right to ban ideas. Banning military recruiters because you disagree with the war is synonymous with banning books or becoming thought police. If you disagree, fine, but all organization should have equal access to parks and other public property. It is a first amendment issue.
12
Military recruiters are scum. They stalk my twin boys at school, at the bus stops, everywhere...they have said "no". They need to leave em alone! The last one called my home at 8:00 am Sat morning and asked for my son, I asked who it was and when he stated he was a recuriter from the Navy I told him to take our number off their list and stop calling. Tough guy...he hung up on me. I love the people who serve, our family chooses to stay outta this criminal war... This lady rocks and she should keep doing what she is doing!!
14
Maybe many people don't really agree that recruiters should be using some of the tactics they are using (I certainly don't), but the parks are public property, and they have every right to be there. Free speech should be free to everyone, which means that they should have the right to recruit and that we should have the right to protest their recruitment. But I really don't think they should be shut down.
15
KATHY BARKER is a Seattle hero. She tirelessly works to assure that teens & families are clear on their rights when it comes to recruitment tactics. Kathy has also kept the school district, city of seattle and us military on notice that there are thousands of parents who want the military OUT of our public spaces and community celebrations. Teens across this region have been educated and protected by her good efforts.
16
The Seattle City Council should not knowingly allow solicitors in our pubic parks, especially including community centers where young minors gather, where predators can use our public gathering places to influence young people. Like sex offenders and salesmen, military recruiters are using single-minded, driven influencial techniques to take advantage of minors not yet able to fully evaluate the consequences of military enlistment and combat by joining the military. Let those of age come to the recruiter centers. I cannot send my child to Seattle City Parks knowing that our public officials are not going to take any steps to protect my him from dangerous solicitors whose influences have life and death consequences.
17
The 2009 Department of Defense budget proposal for recruiting was $20.5 billion, nearly double the 2008 expenditure. In 2003, the budget was $4 billion. That's not chump change. Of COURSE the military presence in the public parks is designed to lure young people into the military--and that's recruiting! These aren't IDEAS the recruiters are offering--they are SIGNING UP people to fight a war to kill people. And they can sign up minors in the "Delayed Entry Program." When they sign up adults, the contracts say the military owns their life. This isn't speech. This is sales. And sales of a deadly product. Ban recruiters from Seattle parks.
18
Some of these posters here make me sick. They have this confrontational us vs. them relationship with their own military. This Barker woman, and the author of the article, trying to pass off two military members in uniform as "military occupation" of public parks? Grow up already.
There is also a serious amount intellectual dishonesty going on with these folks. If you oppose the Iraq war, fine. But the recuiters aren't the reason we are in Iraq. They, and the rest of the military, are simply the tools of the policies enacted by our leaders. When Jayn Foy says 70% support Barker, she radically abuses statistics. That 70% want us out of Iraq. That has nothing to do with saying the US military should stay away from public parks.
Here's an idea for you, if want to change the way in which the military is used--Make them more visible, not less. Stop this fiction that our soldiers are mindless killing machines that should be kept locked up on bases at all times. Instead, see that they are citizen-soldiers, our brothers and sisters, and that we should think long and hard about how and why we risk their lives.
There is also a serious amount intellectual dishonesty going on with these folks. If you oppose the Iraq war, fine. But the recuiters aren't the reason we are in Iraq. They, and the rest of the military, are simply the tools of the policies enacted by our leaders. When Jayn Foy says 70% support Barker, she radically abuses statistics. That 70% want us out of Iraq. That has nothing to do with saying the US military should stay away from public parks.
Here's an idea for you, if want to change the way in which the military is used--Make them more visible, not less. Stop this fiction that our soldiers are mindless killing machines that should be kept locked up on bases at all times. Instead, see that they are citizen-soldiers, our brothers and sisters, and that we should think long and hard about how and why we risk their lives.
19
Disagreeing with the War is one thing. It's a position I can understand and that can be argued credibly.
But we have an all-volunteer military. We don't have a draft. We need recruiters to let kids know what their options are. Recruiters lying does happen-- very rarely.
They have as much of a right to be there as anyone else. Besides, the law would be completely unenforceable. It wouldn't stand up to any sort of constitutional scrutiny. It's a public place, anyone has a right to be there.
But we have an all-volunteer military. We don't have a draft. We need recruiters to let kids know what their options are. Recruiters lying does happen-- very rarely.
They have as much of a right to be there as anyone else. Besides, the law would be completely unenforceable. It wouldn't stand up to any sort of constitutional scrutiny. It's a public place, anyone has a right to be there.
20
I'm intrigued by the comments of Delridge Neighbor. First, "They, and the rest of the military, are simply the tools of the policies enacted by our leaders." Then, "Stop this fiction that our soldiers are mindless killing machines." Pretty dissonant.
So are 18- to 20-year-olds "simply tools," or are they "citizen-soldiers"? A good question for parents of 16- , 17- and 18-year-olds. And for anyone who wonders how the Nazi Germans, too, could function so well as "simply tools."
Wishing for human progress.
So are 18- to 20-year-olds "simply tools," or are they "citizen-soldiers"? A good question for parents of 16- , 17- and 18-year-olds. And for anyone who wonders how the Nazi Germans, too, could function so well as "simply tools."
Wishing for human progress.
21
Why can't they recruit 18-year-olds? Going after minors is predatory. They don't fully comprehend death or that joining the military means someday having to kill someone. And it's a proven fact that adolescents tend to think they are invincible and take stupid risks. Recruiting minors is taking advantage of them. Why do kids have to make such life-altering decisions at that age? Why can't the recruiters just wait a couple of years? There are plenty of universities where they can recruit.
22
I can't think of any other business or entity that has free, unrestricted access to public parks or rec centers.
If I rented a Hummer and drove to a community center to talk to kids (or even 18+ teens), I have no doubt I'd be asked to leave.
At the very least, the military should have to follow the same rules everyone else who wants access to teens follow. Book the facility in advance, pay any fees (including cleanup, concession, etc).
These rules exist to protect public property and the public. No exceptions. If military recruiters are not following the rules, they need to be told to leave and/or given any other consequences (fees, etc) that would be assigned to other folks.
We should, as a community, do more to limit marketing in public spaces--especially marketing to youth. They see enough marketing everywhere else.
If I rented a Hummer and drove to a community center to talk to kids (or even 18+ teens), I have no doubt I'd be asked to leave.
At the very least, the military should have to follow the same rules everyone else who wants access to teens follow. Book the facility in advance, pay any fees (including cleanup, concession, etc).
These rules exist to protect public property and the public. No exceptions. If military recruiters are not following the rules, they need to be told to leave and/or given any other consequences (fees, etc) that would be assigned to other folks.
We should, as a community, do more to limit marketing in public spaces--especially marketing to youth. They see enough marketing everywhere else.
23
They can and do lure minors into the delayed entry program and then when the time comes to sign the real papers tell them that they have to because they committed when they entered DEP. They'll threaten them with legal action if they change their mind.
Catching minors off guard without parents around is wrong. Everyone knows there is such thing as the military and they are always looking for people. If they are interested, they should go to the recruiting office.
I'm not saying the military is a horrible option, but I can show you the papers that I signed as a junior in high school, and I think it isn't something that should be put in front of a minor.
Stay out of the parks.
Catching minors off guard without parents around is wrong. Everyone knows there is such thing as the military and they are always looking for people. If they are interested, they should go to the recruiting office.
I'm not saying the military is a horrible option, but I can show you the papers that I signed as a junior in high school, and I think it isn't something that should be put in front of a minor.
Stay out of the parks.
24
The reason people don't like recruiters is they don't like the military.
The military is nothing to be feared from parents. It's just as diverse as the rest of the American population. And I was in the fucking corps. I told my recruiter I didn't like the Bush administration and that I believed the war in Iraq was immoral. I wanted nothing more than to be a part of the brotherhood and serve it honorably. And I have never learned so much about myself so quickly than in my time in the service.
I enlisted of my own volition. I agree some recruiters use some lame tactics, but they will not con you in to signing your life away. They will make sure you want what you're signing.
The military is nothing to be feared from parents. It's just as diverse as the rest of the American population. And I was in the fucking corps. I told my recruiter I didn't like the Bush administration and that I believed the war in Iraq was immoral. I wanted nothing more than to be a part of the brotherhood and serve it honorably. And I have never learned so much about myself so quickly than in my time in the service.
I enlisted of my own volition. I agree some recruiters use some lame tactics, but they will not con you in to signing your life away. They will make sure you want what you're signing.
25
Screw dis ho..... Service in America's Armed Forces is HONORABLE... better than them schleps lounging at Cal Anderson park.... or them fools hiding in the glory hole rhodies at Volunteer(Queer) Park...... Nuke "em all!!!!
26
hey Stop lossed, it's not your recruiter's fault that it happened to you. You signed the contract that agreed to those terms and accepted that possibility.
Most recruiters are honest. They need to be, b/c the military needs people who are willing to work hard at their jobs.
And yay parks department for realizing it IS a first amendment issue.
Most recruiters are honest. They need to be, b/c the military needs people who are willing to work hard at their jobs.
And yay parks department for realizing it IS a first amendment issue.
27
I was disheartened to read in The Stranger that military recruiters are appearing at Seattle Public Parks in what is an obvious public relations and recruitment effort. We should be able to take our children to Seattle parks without being subjected to military personnel on what is for all intents and purpose a recruitment effort. There has been ample documentation about recruiter's misrepresentations as they attempt to sell kids a potentially harmful product that less and less of them are interested in. The Seattle Parks Department has a responsibility to protect our children while they visit city parks and I would like to see the Seattle City Council institute a policy to make our parks "military free" zones. In lieu of this, I would request that they post clearly on their website when and where the military is scheduled to appear so parents might be forewarned and military counter recruiters might appear to provide some balance.
28
Droppingtherock wrote that he enlisted of his own volition and that recruiters “will not con you in to signing your life away. They will make sure you want what you're signing.”
I don’t think that’s always true. The recruitment contract has LOTS of fine print. If you want more good info on the contract that kids actually sign on entering the military, take a look here:
http://quakerhouse.org/documents/enlist.html
I believe that the military does have a right to recruit in high schools and public parks. As other people have pointed out, it's a volunteer army, and recruiters need some way to get people to join.
However, at the same time I believe that citizens have an equal right to confront the military about the misleading information recruiters sometimes put out. Recruiters are like car salesmen: They do lie, and there's plenty of evidence for that from other replies to this article. Or just consider the ads for the Army that you see on TV. They make the Army look like a big camping trip or adventure. They never show scenes of dead civilians or actual combat. That's lying by omission.
Like I said, I'm not against the Army per se, but I think that kids need to be presented with both sides of the issue before they sign on the dotted line. So wherever the military shows up to recruit on public property, I think that parents need to be told in advance.
I don’t think that’s always true. The recruitment contract has LOTS of fine print. If you want more good info on the contract that kids actually sign on entering the military, take a look here:
http://quakerhouse.org/documents/enlist.html
I believe that the military does have a right to recruit in high schools and public parks. As other people have pointed out, it's a volunteer army, and recruiters need some way to get people to join.
However, at the same time I believe that citizens have an equal right to confront the military about the misleading information recruiters sometimes put out. Recruiters are like car salesmen: They do lie, and there's plenty of evidence for that from other replies to this article. Or just consider the ads for the Army that you see on TV. They make the Army look like a big camping trip or adventure. They never show scenes of dead civilians or actual combat. That's lying by omission.
Like I said, I'm not against the Army per se, but I think that kids need to be presented with both sides of the issue before they sign on the dotted line. So wherever the military shows up to recruit on public property, I think that parents need to be told in advance.
29
TruthInAdvertising, I completely respect your opinion. As a former service member, I realize I have a biased opinion. I just want to point out that every recruiter, was once a kid just out of high school that wasn't sure whether they wanted to sign on the dotted line or not. A lot of recruiters are really passionate about their service, and want to pass that passion along to the next generation. I think everyone owes it to them to treat them with respect. Even if they don't want their children in the military.
30
I agree with Kathy Barker and with Patrick (post 10/26). "Seattle Parks Department has a responsibility to protect our children while they visit city parks" and I, too, would like to see the Seattle City Council institute a policy to make our parks "military free" zones." At the very least, Parks should let us know when the military is scheduled to appear with all their" toys" at public parks. Clearly, this action was meant to entice kids into the military, whether or not actual recruiting (signing up) was happening at Delridge. I, for one, am really happy there are people like Kathy Barker and her cohorts making sure that kids know there are alternatives to military service. There's a ton of our taxpayer money being spent on recruiting. Kathy Barker and other concerned parents do their work as concerned volunteers. The very LEAST our Parks department and city council can do is let us, the public part of public parks, know when and where the military is going to show up.
31
I have a child in the military, I served as a Cold Warrior in the post Vietnam 70's and my late father served in both WW II and Korea. All of us serve or served because we all know one thing that you don't Ms. Barker, your freedom to exercise your right to speak out against recruiters in parks comes at a price and some times that price is very high. We are engaged in an idiotic war and attacked a country that did not attack us but a war also rages on in a place where those who did attack us continue to find refuge. Maybe you do not want your sons serving but you have no right to interfear with those that would like to get information about serving. And just to show you what kind of snobish eletist bitch you are I hope they do enlist.
32
The fact that the military have basically unrestricted access to students and citizens, why shouldn't the anti military people have the same option?
33
If the Army recruiters are on PAID TIME, then by all means, we as voters, taxpayers, and responsible American citizens should be aware and acutely critical of how they behave and where they perform their 'duty' whether it be in POW prisons, in a tank on the battlefield, reporting to congress, or in recruitment. They work for the government, the gov is by/for/of us. Same reason we track spending habits of politicians, backgrounds of teachers, and morality of police. She's right to oppose their presence if they are getting paid by the public, to go into public parks, to recruit/interfere with public recreation... especially when there's a) a war on (shouldn't these girls & boys in the hummer go FIGHT instead?) b) no mandate/approval for the stoopid WMD-sparked war c) grey-area immoral marketing ploys like video games and hummers. ( How about take the kids to gun ranges and VA hospitals instead, Joe Camel??!?).
However, if they go on THEIR OWN FREE TIME in their OWN vehicle using their own cash to provide game stations, then in my mind she's got no ground to stand on, and their 'first amendment rights' are indeed the trump card. She can likewise set up an info station / sexy convertible / semi-topless women playing wii to counter the Army effort, per the 1st amendment.
Or let's grow a collective spine and write a people's inititive to outlaw all solicitation (recruiting, petitions, girlscout cookies) in public parks & city property. Why should public property provide free real estate and customers for anyone's profit? City Light doesn't give me free power for my storefront, Metro doesn't give me a free ride to go to 'first amendment' events. Army recruiters should be put out to the sidewalks and beg like all the other bums. Come to think of it, they might benefit; a few of those gents on the streetcorners already have military experience, I hear... [ imagine THEM as new recruiters ] .
More...
However, if they go on THEIR OWN FREE TIME in their OWN vehicle using their own cash to provide game stations, then in my mind she's got no ground to stand on, and their 'first amendment rights' are indeed the trump card. She can likewise set up an info station / sexy convertible / semi-topless women playing wii to counter the Army effort, per the 1st amendment.
Or let's grow a collective spine and write a people's inititive to outlaw all solicitation (recruiting, petitions, girlscout cookies) in public parks & city property. Why should public property provide free real estate and customers for anyone's profit? City Light doesn't give me free power for my storefront, Metro doesn't give me a free ride to go to 'first amendment' events. Army recruiters should be put out to the sidewalks and beg like all the other bums. Come to think of it, they might benefit; a few of those gents on the streetcorners already have military experience, I hear... [ imagine THEM as new recruiters ] .
34
Ex military is spot on.... would she be happy if there was a draft instead? The truth is that she is anti-military fullstop, & this is just another way for her to implement her political agenda.
Joining the military is an individual choice, & parents are free to try & dissuade their children from joining. Dissing military recruiters is yet another way that some people act as if they ashamed of our country.
Joining the military is an individual choice, & parents are free to try & dissuade their children from joining. Dissing military recruiters is yet another way that some people act as if they ashamed of our country.
35
I'm against the war, voting for Obama, and I've seen how misleading and high pressure recruiters can be.
They told a friend of mine who couldn't pass algebra that he was a lock to become a pilot in the Army. After my brother told the recruiters he would consider joining the Navy, their follow up was so manic and high pressure that they made car salesmen look restrained and thoughtful. And that was before the Iraq War and the shortage of people willing to go there.
But this is a free country. I also have a cousin who has served in the Army and later the National Guard who spent a year in Iraq and thinks joining the Army was the best thing he's ever done. And he's probably right: he was a knucklehead and the military straightened him out.
Military recruiters have just as much right to be in the park as ACORN voter registration canvassers, social workers, young adult librarians or anyone else.
If folks want to hand out info about the downsides of joining the military or suggest guarantees that potential recruits should get from their recruiters, I fully support that. But banning people who we happen to disagree with makes a mockery of a democratic society.
They told a friend of mine who couldn't pass algebra that he was a lock to become a pilot in the Army. After my brother told the recruiters he would consider joining the Navy, their follow up was so manic and high pressure that they made car salesmen look restrained and thoughtful. And that was before the Iraq War and the shortage of people willing to go there.
But this is a free country. I also have a cousin who has served in the Army and later the National Guard who spent a year in Iraq and thinks joining the Army was the best thing he's ever done. And he's probably right: he was a knucklehead and the military straightened him out.
Military recruiters have just as much right to be in the park as ACORN voter registration canvassers, social workers, young adult librarians or anyone else.
If folks want to hand out info about the downsides of joining the military or suggest guarantees that potential recruits should get from their recruiters, I fully support that. But banning people who we happen to disagree with makes a mockery of a democratic society.
36
Parks departments and military entities do not have first amendment rights, only citizens do. As far as I know the parks department cannot form opinions for or against the war. The parks department serves the people of Seattle, and for them to go rouge is infuriating. Fuck these warmongering pin heads. Is there a committee or a way to get rid of the people at the parks department that are trying to export our kids to the wars in the Mideast? And by the by, the military is not protecting my rights by dropping cluster bombs on kids in the Mideast.
37
I was on the fence about voting to give more money to the parks, but now I will not be voting for the parks levee now or anytime in the future.
38
It’s ironic that park officials would be working with military recruiters at a time when it is so apparent that our wars have bankrupted the nation. Our foreign policy boondoggles has taken precedent over American’s infrastructure needs. I can see this kind of stupidity taking place in red states, but Seattle? I am voting no on the park’s levee.
39
The military people at the community event were recruiters. They were not just community members who happened to be in the Army and just happened to show up in a Hummer- they were invited by Parks and the contact information I received from Parks was the number of the recruiting station.
Recruiters don’t just give opinions- they are trying ultimately to get kids to sign a legal contract. Take a look at the Army’s recruiting manual for schools- http://www.nodraftnoway.org/public_html/USAREC%20Pam%20350-13%2020040901.pdf and read, step by step, about plans for influencing youth to enlist.
As several people mentioned, the first amendment protects civilians against an overzealous government. It does not protect soldiers, who are technically government agents. It does not protect Parks in their refusal to let people know that recruiters will be at community centers. The first amendment protects those who write here, and will, protect those who go to protest the presence of recruiters in our Parks. Thank you, Bill of Rights.
We are one of the few countries in the world that recruits minors. No Child Left Behind says that schools must allow military recruiters in, or risk losing federal funding. This means public schools, of course- not most private schools. It is hardly a coincidence that this, and the other Parks-recruiting incidents we know of, were in the south end, and not up north. This is a poverty draft, and the military has had to resort to huge bonuses and promises of money for college to get people to go fight these horrible wars.
If the City is having trouble with the idea of preventing the recruiting of minors at community centers, they could start by letting the public know when military recruiters will be there. That they have refused to do even that suggests a shocking complicity.
Kathy Barker
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Recruiters don’t just give opinions- they are trying ultimately to get kids to sign a legal contract. Take a look at the Army’s recruiting manual for schools- http://www.nodraftnoway.org/public_html/USAREC%20Pam%20350-13%2020040901.pdf and read, step by step, about plans for influencing youth to enlist.
As several people mentioned, the first amendment protects civilians against an overzealous government. It does not protect soldiers, who are technically government agents. It does not protect Parks in their refusal to let people know that recruiters will be at community centers. The first amendment protects those who write here, and will, protect those who go to protest the presence of recruiters in our Parks. Thank you, Bill of Rights.
We are one of the few countries in the world that recruits minors. No Child Left Behind says that schools must allow military recruiters in, or risk losing federal funding. This means public schools, of course- not most private schools. It is hardly a coincidence that this, and the other Parks-recruiting incidents we know of, were in the south end, and not up north. This is a poverty draft, and the military has had to resort to huge bonuses and promises of money for college to get people to go fight these horrible wars.
If the City is having trouble with the idea of preventing the recruiting of minors at community centers, they could start by letting the public know when military recruiters will be there. That they have refused to do even that suggests a shocking complicity.
Kathy Barker
40
Obviously the military has to recruit new troops somehow. However, tactics such as targeting teenagers in parks and using the extensive access to public schools granted to them by No Child Left Behind are predatory and reprehensible.
41
Whether you are pro-war or anti-war is irrelevant, the dishonesty with which the military recruits the young, especially those who are economically disadvantaged, is dishonorable and embarrassing.
42
She's not saying the military is bad. Or that people shouldn't join. What she's trying to prevent are kids joining the military that think they have no other option because they are poor or don't get the best grades. The recruiters are predators and should stick to recruiting ADULTS, not children who can be easily influenced and drawn into their lies about what military life and service is really about. I respect anyone who wants to protect our country and fight for our freedoms, but these kids that join aren't joining because they love America and want to defend her. They are joining because they've been told they have no other path. Let's promote hope and choices to our kids, not limits to what they can do with their lives.
43
The military has no business being at a public park, unless it's a publicized, planned in advance event. Parks are meant to be a peaceful place to escape the stress of every daily life, not a venue
for preying on the young and vulnerable. It is underhanded and morally reprehensible at best.
for preying on the young and vulnerable. It is underhanded and morally reprehensible at best.
44
It sounds like Seattle is turning into the northern annex of the "People's Socialist Republic of Bezerkely." When the DOD reductions in force, massive lay offs at Boeing, PSNS, etc start happening in earnest not too soon from now- everyone now complaining about Recruiters in their midst will be wishing DoD would start recruiting and hiring again. Most people in Seattle have no idea how much of a military subsidised welfare state the Puget Sound region really is.
47
Our military is not the enemy!
Self righteous Seattle leftist. People like Barker will embrace Communism and Islam being taught in Seattle Schools - but heaven forbid teens have an oppurtunity to meet real soldiers.
I guess she wants them to learn about the army from action movies.
Also, it is a disservice to our military to treat them as something scary and horrible. They are an important of our country, history, and culture. They are a force of good in the world. They should be welcomed at all community events.
Self righteous Seattle leftist. People like Barker will embrace Communism and Islam being taught in Seattle Schools - but heaven forbid teens have an oppurtunity to meet real soldiers.
I guess she wants them to learn about the army from action movies.
Also, it is a disservice to our military to treat them as something scary and horrible. They are an important of our country, history, and culture. They are a force of good in the world. They should be welcomed at all community events.
48
If you truly hate the armed forces, have a discussion with your kids. Tell them why you would have a problem with their going into the service. Don't whine about how the city should be doing your job.
Just because a few recruiters show up to a teen event doesn't mean anyone is automatically enlisted. It means they may have talked to some recruiters. If the kids are actually serious about joining, the parents will have to know eventually.
Besides, if you think your kid is responsible enough to go to college, then your kid should have the common sense to make sense of what the recruiter tells them.
Just because a few recruiters show up to a teen event doesn't mean anyone is automatically enlisted. It means they may have talked to some recruiters. If the kids are actually serious about joining, the parents will have to know eventually.
Besides, if you think your kid is responsible enough to go to college, then your kid should have the common sense to make sense of what the recruiter tells them.
49
I say don't hate the military for wars. Hate the voters who voted the Politicians in office. Politicians start them. freedom is not free and the military is the one to pay that price. Definition of a politician??
50
The very freedoms this woman has have been purchased with the blood of our military service men and women. It's sickening that she does not appreciate their sacrifices or respect them as human beings who are doing what they think is right for our nation.
51
Instead of trying to limit their recruitment practices, how about trying to require them to provide legal representation to people considering enlistment?
We hear tales of recruiters lying to people. Let's make them legally responsible for their promises. You wouldn't buy a house without having an attorney look over the contract. Why sell yourself to the military without counsel?
We hear tales of recruiters lying to people. Let's make them legally responsible for their promises. You wouldn't buy a house without having an attorney look over the contract. Why sell yourself to the military without counsel?
52
Perhaps some truth in advertising would be useful to her cause. She could arrange a mock-up of a Hummer wrecked by an IED. The flimsy protection would be a sobering reminder of how frail and un-valued life can be.
53
The problem here is that the recruiters show up in glamorous vehicles, telling kids how cool the "stuff" is, and how they will be taken care of on a free ride scholarship. The truth of the matter is, there is nothing glamorous about being in the armed services. The reality they will face is a far cry from what is being portrayed in order to lure them into signing a contract that makes them the "property" of the U.S. government, takes away all their rights, and any say-so in where they go, what they do, how they dress, how they behave (when at all possible), when they sleep, eat and use the toilet, and - as if that were not deterrent enough for intelligent people - whether you should kill people you've never met for a reason you may never know, or simply become the casualty of a political chess game that ends up a mystery to everyone but the neo-con elitists who tricked you into doing it with their smarmy tactics. Honestly! If Gays were so smart, they wouldn't WANT to be in the military. It's like asking to be sent to Germany in the 1940's...
54
If we can't ban guns from parks, it makes sense that we can't ban free speech. But I still disagree!
55
I'm a Viet Nam Era Vet, and although I'm proud of my service, I wouldn't do it again because I feel I was lied to regarding my "contract and M.O.S.". All I can say is that the military made me grow up fast (I was 17, and signed with parental consent). Also, the military is still voluntary last time I checked. If by chance anyone that reads this is seriously wanting to join, READ THE FINE PRINT, AND HAVE YOUR RECRUITER SIGN A GUARANTY TO YOUR M.O.S. and place of duty! If by chance you're totally against joining, and are considering claiming "Con... Objecter Status, start doing it at a young age, like first year in middle school, stay out of trouble, join religious volunteer groups, AND make it known to your recruter that you are and in BIG LETTERS USING A MARK-A-LOT write that you are across every military document. That way you can serve, but stay out of battle zones. The only thing I really have against the military/government is that after serving 3 years over seas, after being discharged, I had to wait 5 months before I could legally buy a damn beer!
Also by Jonah Spangenthal-Lee
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