Comments On: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I by Goldy http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2012/06/11/a-taxing-conversation-about-arena-taxes Comments On: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I by Goldy en-us Copyright 2013 The Stranger. All rights reserved. This RSS file is offered to individuals, The Stranger readers, and non-commercial organizations only. Any commercial websites wishing to use this RSS file, please contact The Stranger. webmaster@thestranger.com (The Stranger Webmaster) Thu, 23 May 2013 00:00:01 -0700 Thu, 23 May 2013 14:00:00 -0700 Foundation http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> Posted by Will in Seattle]]> Tue, 12 Jun 2012 13:07:06 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> Posted by Weekilter]]> Tue, 12 Jun 2012 10:50:55 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> Posted by Joe M]]> Tue, 12 Jun 2012 09:48:46 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]>
And relatively, we've had it easy. Thinkprogress just posted about 5 city's that got fucking screwed when building a stadium for a sports team. http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2012/06…

Nothing you can tell me about this proposal will convince me it's a good idea because every proposal for every stadium ever built has been pie-in-the-sky-dreams, brilliant projections for economic unicorn jizz. And the people always get royally fucked by the most heavily subsidized of billion dollar private for-profit industry of all.
Posted by CrankyBacon]]> Tue, 12 Jun 2012 09:40:54 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]>
Oh wait, governments taking on risky finance deals never get the capitalist upside, that way, it wouldn't be a subsidy!

next question, compare this to investment (ha, ha) of government time, attention, campaign donor flattering, public credit, dollars and substituted tax dollars with similar levels of gummint investment in r and d, roads, transit, education, public health, or, say public art.

THEN look at WHO benefits.

It's fucking obvious that in the arena deal the ONE PERCENTERS who're investors benefit the most, while the lower quintiles of society get no benefit, not being able to afford the pricey tickets even if they want to do. (Yes, there are other gummint schemes to tax the many tohelp the rich, like the subsidies to the symphony; this just proves there's other waste, too). Whereas investing in oh I dunno COMPTER SKILLS CLASSES for the public in elementary school, or say voc tech loan assistance, or filling, I dunno a god damned fucking pothole or a bridge falling down? That benefits all alike, rich and poor.

the rich fuckers who want to own teams can do it without our help. The fairly well off sports fans who want to pay for tickets can pay $75 a ticket instead of the $50 at ticket they get to pay if we subsidize it all. We need to be thinking about overall public benefit and helping the bottom half. The top half didn't even suffer the decline in weatlh over the last twenty years reported today. Why on god's earth would we adopt hte trickle down charade known as a sports deal as proposed by hansen? oh wait, even liberal politicians like mcginn and faux progressivces are happy to screw the poor and the public for harebrained schemes like this one.

You want to cheer for a basketball team? go fucking cheer for your high school team. Then give them money, they need some new uniforms. Stop with the adulation of the one percenters, it's soooo regressive.
Posted by arena: welfare for 1%]]> Tue, 12 Jun 2012 08:15:12 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> Posted by Karlheinz Arschbomber]]> Tue, 12 Jun 2012 03:58:13 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> Posted by Teslick]]> Mon, 11 Jun 2012 22:46:47 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> "The irony is that if these guys could prove that assertion, they'd have all the credit need to secure private financing."

Seconded.
And, as always, I will bring up the fact that we still owed money on the Kingdome when it was finally demolished. Something like EIGHTY MILLION DOLLARS.

If this deal is so good then the investors would not be worried about the city.

And there wouldn't be a rush to get it approved.

They'd spend their own money and keep their own profits.
Posted by fairly.unbalanced]]> Mon, 11 Jun 2012 22:23:10 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]>
Basketball would divert some of these out of towners away from existing venues. But we're supposed to believe that the new area WILL bring in even more people beyond the ones it takes away from existing attractions.

The irony is that if these guys could prove that assertion, they'd have all the credit need to secure private financing. It's because this thing is such a gamble with a murky future, as through a glass darkly, that they have to try to pick the tax payer's pocket. They know private capital is too smart for this shit.

(Oh, and either way, if you're one of the existing businesses getting the shaft courtesy of your own city government with this new competing attraction, well, fuck you, I guess. Should have had more millionaire friends, loser.)
Posted by Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn]]> Mon, 11 Jun 2012 21:36:16 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> You're welcome.
Posted by MrBaker]]> Mon, 11 Jun 2012 19:49:27 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> Posted by MrBaker]]> Mon, 11 Jun 2012 19:47:19 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> Posted by Gus]]> Mon, 11 Jun 2012 19:01:30 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> That’s a lot of money.

Substitution is 25% of that (so, discount the 1.9% before attending Gold's’ math class).

Mike OBrien asked for a breakout of all that from council staff.

Last week Dively mentioned that Metro would see a $200 or $300 thousand dollar increase. I would like more, and more precise numbers.
Posted by MrBaker]]> Mon, 11 Jun 2012 18:23:20 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> Posted by Goldy]]> Mon, 11 Jun 2012 18:13:41 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]>
So, 25%.

The story from Oklahoma was that the number of people from out of town isn't the big deal, it's that they spend far more money.
Posted by MrBaker]]> Mon, 11 Jun 2012 18:04:47 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> Comprehension Section

Read the passage below and then chose the best answer to the question.

A bunch of rich guys get together and offer the people a "special tax deal" that is going to "benefit us" with jobs, sports and a "better place".


Does this mean that:

(A) All will end up with more
(B) It will be a fantastic screw job which will drain your wallet for years to come

You have 30 seconds.

Posted by Supreme Ruler Of The Universe]]> Mon, 11 Jun 2012 17:58:21 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> Posted by Free Lunch]]> Mon, 11 Jun 2012 17:54:37 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]>
Bad, on this deal: sports suck

Seaport, on this deal: don't give a shit, where is our enhanced connection to the I-5 and I-90 interchange?
Posted by Joe Szilagyi]]> Mon, 11 Jun 2012 17:22:04 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> Posted by "not as wasteful" argument?]]> Mon, 11 Jun 2012 17:14:26 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> Posted by gloomy gus]]> Mon, 11 Jun 2012 17:05:59 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> Posted by Goldy]]> Mon, 11 Jun 2012 16:58:34 -0700 The Stranger <![CDATA[Re: A Taxing Conversation About Arena Taxes, Part I]]> Posted by gloomy gus]]> Mon, 11 Jun 2012 16:54:25 -0700 The Stranger