Comments On: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him... by Dan Savage

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

Littia's Auntie — Sat, 20 Apr 2013 01:44:56 -0700

Her name was Littia May Schwarz. She was my only niece. She committed suicide on my mothers birthday. She was 16 years old. She was bright, funny, compassionate, and had a smile and a light inside her that touched the world. No she was not gay. Yes she was homeschooled. She had a 4.0 gpa and was coming to look at colleges so she could become a pediatric nurse because she loved babies so much. She had a boyfriend and the day before she died she secretly carved "I <3 U" in the back of his pumpkin. He didn't see it until the next day, after she died. Yes she was bullied/abused, but the people responsible are not who you think. That's really all I can say here because I am on the process of making sure that Littia gets justice for what she was put through. I am also in the process of enacting "Littia's Law" so as to help other minor children not have to endure the same as she did. The fact is that it is up to everybody, ie the school system, law enforcement, Dhs, parents/guardians, ect... to make sure we keep our children safe. No child should ever, ever have to feel like suicide is their only way to be safe from torment. If there are any other questions please feel free to email me at jvannattan@hotmail.com. Thank you and God Bless.
Posted by Littia's Auntie

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

Kelzey — Mon, 04 Feb 2013 11:35:17 -0800

I was home schooled after not being able to cope at school and it saved my life. It truly helped the youth in my circle that could not cope at school anymore. They were not all gay, in fact i was not even aware I was gay then so its beside the point. Bullying is life altering. Im almost 30 years old and I remember the torture an that was before things like FB and texting. Homes schooling is not only for the well off, there are many, many online programs and schools that even supply laptops for the schooler. All you need is a safe space! We can debate for ever about the nature of man and cruelty etc but the fact is, we need options. These kids need options for a safe space to go during those years that they have the lowest self esteem and are most victimized. The most sensitive people are going to be the ones that change this world for the better and they are also the ones that can not tolerate ongoing abuse.
Posted by Kelzey

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

human68 — Sun, 03 Feb 2013 09:29:30 -0800

Speaking as someone who was bullied in school and found CBT very helpful: when you are bullied you learn all kinds of false lessons about your (lack of) worth as a human being and your relationship to other people. CBT helped me learn to be kinder to myself, and to direct my very appropriate anger at what happened to me toward the right sources -- the people who did it, not me. In other words I was finally able to accept that I was bullied because some other people decided to be assholes, not because something was wrong with ME.

To each his own. No mental health treatment is right for everyone. But it sure does work for some people and it doesn't mean there's something wrong with you for trying it.
Posted by human68

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

teresairene — Fri, 01 Feb 2013 10:52:33 -0800

It is sad that it took something like this to help people in La Grande address bullying, but I thought I would share this article about some of the things that Jadin's class mates have been doing to honor him: http://www.lagrandeobserver.com/News/Loc…
Posted by teresairene

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

gr8lakesgrrl — Thu, 31 Jan 2013 11:29:08 -0800

@13 & 30, great idea, perhaps an underground railroad of sorts. Seems like the internet would make that a lot easier then it was in the 1800's.
Posted by gr8lakesgrrl

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

EclecticEel — Wed, 30 Jan 2013 15:40:57 -0800

@27 If you can't see the difference in difficulty and training needed to teach 1-5 kids that you've known since birth and that needed to manage a classroom of 30+ kids of all different backgrounds and abilities, then, yes, you're right that you are 100% unqualified to homeschool.

However, if it ever becomes a matter of saving your child's life, I hope that you'd use these things we call "books" to correct your deficiency.

Posted by EclecticEel

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

reneee — Wed, 30 Jan 2013 15:26:11 -0800

Not all parents are, by virtue of their financial situation, able to homeschool their kids, or put them in a different school. Comfortably middle-class people sometimes forget these things.

Still, good advice for anyone who *can* swing it.
Posted by reneee

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

koliebo — Wed, 30 Jan 2013 13:41:28 -0800

It's nice to see Dan finally recognizing there's at least one legitimate reason for not-crazy people to homeschool.

...okay, I don't actually mean for that to sound as snarky as it does. But reacting to every crazy homeschooler by pointing out they're homeschooled is like reacting to every crazy woman by pointing out she's a woman, and therefore there MUST be some connection. Ditto for crazy Christians, crazy gay people........ every group has its crazies, but it doesn't mean the entire group is crazy. So it's heartening to see homeschooling suggested as a viable, logical, and *good* choice for some people.
Posted by koliebo

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

Whoop Di Doo — Wed, 30 Jan 2013 11:43:21 -0800

I also get frustrated when suggesting that psychological help could help bullied kids means you're blaming them - like anyone is at fault for their particular mental chemistry. But no, I think it blames the school if they think that the high school years, when everybody is at their most emotionally and mentally vulnerable, is the time to scale back the psychological support and have their counselors just be there for helping kids get into college - like mine did.
Posted by Whoop Di Doo

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

Whoop Di Doo — Wed, 30 Jan 2013 11:28:27 -0800

@31: Or maybe stop using your own bad experiences of therapy to make massive generalizations about the entire profession. First of all, therapists can't prescribe drugs; you have to be a psychiatrist in order to do that. Second of all, the notion that they give them out willy-nilly without regard for diagnoses is bullshit. They don't want to be sued for medical malpractice, which is totally possible when you're talking about drugs that play with your mind. Too much anti-depressant can make someone so lethargic they stop doing work, and they risk failing out of school or losing their job. Psychiatrists don't want to be responsible for that shit. In my case, even though I'd been diagnosed with depression and anxiety, my psychiatrist didn't put me on drugs until *I* felt therapy wasn't doing enough. He wanted to make sure therapy worked first.

Second of all, is it really so bad to put the kid on anti-depressants if it means the difference between a suicidal kid and a kid who is able to survive the bullying? Why do we always see psychiatric drugs as a negative thing? While the anti-gay bullying is what pushes them to the point where they commit or seriously contemplate suicide, the vast majority of people who have the POTENTIAL to be pushed to that point have a psychiatric condition. If a kid is suicidal, drugs and therapy may do more to help them than simply pulling them out of school would.

And beside all that, there's the fact that, far from just teaching them "coping mechanisms," counselors who are there to truly counsel kids on personal problems - not to just help them get into the best college, as most high school "counselors" are - are probably the best way to convince a parent that the kid really needs to get the fuck out of their awful school if that is the case. The parents might not listen to their teenager, but they would listen to a professional. Nobody who is certified in psychology or psychiatry wants to just teach a kid how to "cope" in an environment that is going to wreck them psychologically. They want to put them in a place where that isn't going to be the case.
Posted by Whoop Di Doo

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

JohnAGJ — Wed, 30 Jan 2013 10:39:15 -0800

Homeschooling isn't an option for everyone, but in this situation if the parents are able to they should. Just do a lot of research on how to homeschool your kids before you do so and get a copy of the book "Homeschooling for College Credit" at Amazon (among others) to help.
Posted by JohnAGJ

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

MarleyBarley — Wed, 30 Jan 2013 08:12:21 -0800

On the subject of the affordability of homeschooling -

In Ohio, we have ECOT - http://www.ecotohio.org/ - which I think is also available in other states. It's a great alternative to traditional public schools - it's a combo of homeschooling plus public school. All your materials are free (they even provide computers and internet connections to those who don't already have them, and for families that provide their own connections they offer an office supply stipend to pay for ink/paper/etc). All the kids get tailored attention from their teachers. All the interaction is monitored by the teachers.

My niece graduated from the program last year, and my daughter started Kindergarten through ECOT this past fall, and we've all loved it. So, if you know someone who wishes they could homeschool but feels like it's unattainably expensive, tell them to check out ECOT.
Posted by MarleyBarley

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

butterflyrose83 — Wed, 30 Jan 2013 06:22:37 -0800

Cyber school is also an option in some states. Here in PA, you can have a setup where you "attend" classes through video chats or you can self-pace. It's an option for those that can't afford to leave a job to homeschool a child. By middle school, a parent does not need to be present in the house during "school" hours. Also, PA cyber schools are funded by the same taxes that fund public schools so there is no extra cost to the parents. They even provide all the books, a computer and pay for an Internet connection.
Posted by butterflyrose83

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

Global Traveler — Wed, 30 Jan 2013 01:31:07 -0800

As someone who was bullied in school, and considered "suicide" (I put it in quotes not to diminish the pain of others, but because I didn't really want to kill myself, but I so desperately wanted help out that untenable situation that this seemed to be the only way to get it). My parents had no idea, since I hid it so well, and I was so ashamed and afraid to tell them (all my failings, and none of my parents).

I was also a teacher for a while, and I can tell you from both of my experiences that there is NO WAY that the staff at these schools are unaware of the bullying that is going on. I refused to teach one kid who was bullying another kid. When I told his parents he was a bully the response reminded me of the scene in Casa Blanca when the inspector is shocked, yes shocked to find out that there is gambling going on at Rick's Cafe American.

This makes the victim suffer twice over. It makes them believe that if the adults who should be protecting them turn a blind eye, then they are "getting what they deserve".

They have to get the schools involved, probably with the threat of legal action, since they would then be put on notice.

All that aside, my heart breaks for these families.
Posted by Global Traveler

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

Fire Chief — Tue, 29 Jan 2013 22:08:43 -0800

Kids: if you know of another kid being bullied, please tell a teacher or parent! So often, the parent of a bullied child hasn't any idea it's going on. Tell someone, and save a life. Please.
Posted by Fire Chief

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

vennominon — Tue, 29 Jan 2013 21:59:05 -0800

Better yet: Start an LGBTetc. school.
Posted by vennominon

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

lolorhone — Tue, 29 Jan 2013 20:41:57 -0800

@16: Go fuck yourself, troll. The simple fact that you need to belittle dead children and those who sympathize with their plight proves you're precisely the kind of asshole who these kids needed protection from. Do you think attacking the vulnerable makes you stronger? You're what's called an unnecessary motherfucker- the kind of moron who makes living life more difficult than it already it is for no other reason than that you can. Or maybe it's because you need the distraction from your own empty, wanting little life.
P.S. @28: Fuck you too. If you're not going to suggest something productive, don't waste everyone's time with your petty sarcasm. You're not only cruel, you're useless.
Posted by lolorhone

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

Ms. D — Tue, 29 Jan 2013 20:24:44 -0800

*you need to learn the WHY and *THEN* the HOW... Yes, you DO need to learn the how...
Posted by Ms. D

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

Ms. D — Tue, 29 Jan 2013 20:16:10 -0800

I agree that you should do whatever necessary to protect your kids. I'm not sure that homeschooling should be the first option. I'd think that moving, changing schools, or sending the kid to a relative in a more accepting area would be the best first, second, and third steps. High school (and even middle school) is as much about socialization as it is education. So, people are being brutally mean to your kid, and you pull them from that environment. Great, that solves one problem...but what about friends, dances, football games? Yes, there is the opportunity for *some* of these things in good geographical and homeschool communities, but I'd imagine (as I was once a high school student myself, though not one who was ostracized widely, even if I was only pleasant and not "tight" with the "cool kids," even to this day when a reunion rolls around), that it would be quite heartbreaking to know your peers were doing all these things regularly, without special effort, while you were sitting home and going to only planned activities. It's certainly an improvement over constant harassment and even physical violence (in some cases), but it could still be quite distressing. I'd argue, first, try to find a different school nearby (so as not to upend everything (home, community, and *having* a school environment), even if it upends your schedule getting the kid there or budget paying for private school), second move, third - if possible - send your kid to a more accepting area with relatives willing to help out, and THEN homeschool.

But, FWIW, and, yes, I'm pretty damn good at math and science, I think I could pull off homeschooling if I needed to, to the naysayers. My best friend has 3 kiddos, and when I visit her, I'm the "homework guru." I dunno, maybe it's 4 years of tutoring college kids (between undergrad and grad school) and spending several years at work in a position where I regularly train people on how to do stuff, but I just seem to be able to get them to get it. Not that she's a slouch...she has advanced degrees (yep, that's plural) in education. She can drill it into their head, but I come around and am, like, "let me show you how you'll use this when you have a job," or "hey, I don't know much about that, but it's really interesting, should we research it?" and they just take to that. Especially when I confide to them that there are FREQUENT circumstances at work when I look things up from other people's work or the internet to make sure I'm doing it right, so there's no shame in asking ANY question, you just need to learn the WHY and not the HOW, and ask about the HOW until you learn to do it. Yes, it's the job of teachers to instruct them in the HOW, but the HOW can be discovered in any number of places, including teachers, textbooks, and electronic resources (including the internet at large). Meh...maybe it's just me. I still do cross-multiplication for conversions because I know that and know it works, wherever it is needed... Of course, I can also do pretty advanced calculus in my sleep, but, for something simple, if it ain't broke, why fix it.
Posted by Ms. D

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

Vicky Bellevue — Tue, 29 Jan 2013 19:28:43 -0800

Home schooling and Running Start certainly helps although kids can still experience cyberbullying if they choose to use Facebook, Tumblr, Skype and other messaging/social media.

UCLA recently released a study showing that the "cool" kids are most likely to bully and that anti-bully programs are most effective when they focus on the role of bystanders. http://newsroom.ucla.edu/portal/ucla/coo…
Posted by Vicky Bellevue

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

Vicky Bellevue — Tue, 29 Jan 2013 19:24:37 -0800

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

givesgoodemail — Tue, 29 Jan 2013 15:56:58 -0800

@2: Littia was 16 (jives with Dan's information), and there is no mention of cause of death (suspicious, particularly in a small town where all the other obituaries go into detail), and was homeschooled (a frequent haven for bullied public school kids).

I'd bet she's the one we're looking for.
Posted by givesgoodemail

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

TheMisanthrope — Tue, 29 Jan 2013 15:56:57 -0800

@35 I would hope that the parents would find a gay positive therapist. I mean, if they're going through that much for their kid, chances are they know enough to research the kid's therapist.

@37 10/10. The use of ad hominem was a nice touch. :-D
Posted by TheMisanthrope

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

OutInBumF — Tue, 29 Jan 2013 15:16:28 -0800

I might have actually gone on to college had I been able to stay home and do coursework. As it was, I learned to cut class and hate school, all because of bullying. Had I been my parents, I'd've had me at home in a heartbeat. But that was in the early '70's.
No gay kid being bullied should have to endure that shit. It's taken years to overcome that damage.
Posted by OutInBumF

Re: If Your Gay Kid Is Being Bullied At School And He Begs You To Homeschool Him...

puppydogtails — Tue, 29 Jan 2013 15:10:20 -0800

Can someone explain how a school can't be sued if a child under their supervision commits suicide due to bullying? The US makes a court case about everything, no?
Posted by puppydogtails