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So, Donald Trump told a bunch of people at a rally in Florida on Wednesday night that Barack Obama founded ISIS.

He wasn't being metaphorical about it, or saying "just joking," as he did on Tuesday, when he suggested, oh, so very delicately, that gun nuts exercise their Second Amendment rights to stop Hillary Clinton from appointing the Supreme Court justices of her choosing.

Here's the quote, from the New York Times: “He’s the founder of ISIS. He’s the founder of ISIS. He’s the founder. He founded ISIS.”

Seems pretty cut-and-dry as far as opinions go. But today, just to be sure, a few outlets asked Trump to clarify his stance. Let's look at this exchange between Trump and conservative radio host Hugh Hewitt:

“You meant that he created the vacuum, he lost the peace,” Mr. Hewitt suggested, leaving Mr. Trump an opening.

“No, I meant he’s the founder of ISIS. I do,” Mr. Trump said. “He was the most valuable player. I give him the most valuable player award. I give her, too, by the way, Hillary Clinton.”

Mr. Hewitt replied, “But he’s not sympathetic to them,” referring to President Obama. “He hates them. He’s trying to kill them.”

“I don’t care,” Mr. Trump said. “He was the founder. His, the way he got out of Iraq was that, that was the founding of ISIS, O.K.?”

Clinton then released a statement, refuting Trump's claim that she is one of the co-founders of a terrorist organization, which is right up there with "I believe in science" as something a presidential nominee should not have to clarify.

More from the Clinton camp:

"This is another example of Donald Trump trash-talking the United States," senior policy advisor Jake Sullivan said in a statement. "What's remarkable about Trump's comments is that once again, he's echoing the talking points of (Russian President Vladimir) Putin and our adversaries to attack American leaders and American interests, while failing to offer any serious plans to confront terrorism or make this country more secure."