Savage Love Letter of the Day: Her Partner Only Likes Having Sex with Hairy Old Gay Men

Comments

1
What jumps to my mind are the closet-case gay guys and lesbians married to straights finally acting on their attractions and the late-in-life coming out of some lesbians I've known (in their 20's and 30's versus in their teens).

Are most people, discovering the sexuality (or their new sexuality) inherently prone to the self-centered, think-with-your-gonads, turn-off-the-frontal-lobes behavior of stereotypical teenagers? It seems very common. I call it the "kid in a candy store" period and it can be ugly for the partner, any children involved, and raise public-health issues.

Maybe it's like any new drug that one hasn't learned to moderate yet.
Maybe it's making up for lost time.

And instead of being a teenager stuck in class five days a week and limited in finances and transportation; adults have a car, a credit card, a little more self-confidence, knowledge of the world, and the ability to go into a bar and rent a hotel room.

It can make for a series of dumpster fires and train wrecks.
2
I must be getting old cos I don't think 60 is that ancient. What age is Dan?
3
Test, test, check 1, 2
4
Dumas question:

Can a trans man contract STI's from performing penetrative sex?

LW, you've got yourself a "piece of work". a 30 year old alcoholic who doesn't want to have sex with and isn't comfortable being open with you about his sexual desires.

also
Krisansda had gone from exclusively dating women, to exclusively dating men. His experience isn't an uncommon one in the female-to-male (FTM) community.


This isn't uncommon in any community. Had Will not transitioned, he would have been yet-another-SLUG.
5
Jeez, it's not transphobic to dump a trans person. It's dumping--it's part of life. You don't even need a reason.
6
I disagree with Dan's emphasis on staying to get the partner help. LW needs to look out for herself first, since her partner clearly isn't. If he's lying and putting her health at risk, she has every right to get out and let him deal with his own problems.
7
I read Dan's response about testosterone, and I think, "Men may be awful sometimes, but given men's biochemistry, men hold shit together pretty well."

PAPAS, I'm going to disagree with Dan here on this one (something I think he knew would happen when he wrote his response). You don't owe your soon-to-be ex-partner anything, and you don't owe him months of your time in the hope he can get straightened out. He's moved on, but following Dan's advice leaves you stuck in the limbo of a zombie relationship that is dead, but keeps shuffling along. Your partner is DTMFA-worthy. End the relationship, do what you can for him thereafter, and look for someone with whom you're better suited as a single woman.
8
Masculinity does not come out well from this letter. 'Toxic masculinity' ... maybe just 'masculinity'. I have to say I've always noticed that an attractive woman in her 20s across from me on the subway is reading 'Americanah'--my bran hasn't been just 'tight top, tight top, tight top'! My dosages of testosterone were always too low. Thank God I was never a man.

Dan's advice is right. The partner transitioning is clearly going through a confusing time and needs help. He's behaving in a really grotty way--but let the LW put him first and see how things pan out with the relationship (maybe, badly) down the line.
9
Going through any gender identity modification in any capacity, even without using hormones, can be tricky to all involved.
In that sense Dan did an injustice to LW and others by focusing exclusively on FTM’s and “T”.

LW must be coming from a very vulnerable and thankless spot. Assuming she met her lover as a she, supported gf’s journey to become a he, and now facing all those changes of preferences, trust, and other issues.
As sad as it may be I’d say ending the relationship is a necessity at this point, and despite the present and future hardship likely to prove the right thing to do in the long run.

Both need to readjust their lives, and it seems like bf is already on a discovery path of his own. He should have the freedom to do so, and also deal with possible consequences and hardships. Sadly, those are part of the journey.
LW should be acknowledged for her support, but also has the right to live her life in a way that works for her.



10
This brings up an issue I would love SL reader advice on. My Male partner doesn't really enjoy sex much (but is happy to lend a hand/tonge any time). He says he has no feeling in his penis. I suspect it's because he has very low T. I know that there can be health concerns. If he talks to a doctor and goes on T maybe he could start to feel sexual pleasure. On the other hand it might change his personality. He is super caring and sweet and chill and is afraid he would turn into a raging dick monster. Thoughts?
11
@10 - Have him start on low dosages of T and ramp it up gradually over months, while keeping careful notes or a diary of erections, sensation, interest, etc. But before even that, he needs appropriate blood work up and/or consultation with a doctor to verify low T. There may be other things at play. I'm very suspicious of 'no feeling in his penis', because that's not a low T symptom as far as I know. That's more like nerve damage or degenerative nerve problems, or a complication from diabetes.

So, yeah, no one has to leap into the deep end of high T dosage. Titrate it up to effect, like my father did, like my boyfriend did, like I did. But each of us involved our doctors to make sure what we were dealing with and the best way to go about treating it. None of us have turned into raging dick monsters, although my father does report that he occasionally wakes up at night obsessed with thoughts of sex, which he finds odd given he's 70 and has a companionate relationship with my mother (as far as I can tell).
12
@2: Dan is just around the corner from being sexy, at 53, according to Wikipedia. Born October 7, 1964. Dan astrological sign is Libra.
13
David @1, I've had late-coming-out friends who acted like real jerks in the beginning, too - I think your theory has merit. And you're right, the combination of adult privileges and financial independence with that teenage all-about-me absorption can be a real train-wreck for the people who love them. Fortunately (at least for the two people I'm thinking about) it was only a temporary insanity and our friendship survived, but I spent a few rocky years hanging in there with each of them, basically ignoring their crap and waiting for my friends to become my friends again.

CMD, that was a very thoughtful and compassionate response from someone who has been there and done that (sorta-kinda). Thank you for sharing your first-hand experiences with LW.

Doodle @10, it sounds like you are both sorta-kinda OK with the status quo in your relationship, which makes me wonder why either of you would want to risk changing Partner's personality and suffering the multitude of potentially dangerous side effects from steroid treatments. Raging dick-monster syndrome could turn out to be the least of his issues. FTM folks on T will readily acknowledge the risks and downsides of the treatment, but they feel that living their life as a healthy but non-transitioned woman would be much worse. Everything's relative. I totally agree that you should urge Partner to check with his Doc about the low libido and the numb penis, though!
14
Use your judgement about whether to take Dan's "stay in for now as leverage to have him get help" advice. You know the situation better than we do. But I will say this, I way more often see people look back at that with failure stories than with success stories.

"I shouldn't have stayed, it didn't help him, it made me a worse person and now we hate each other" is a repeat pattern.

You're gonna want to have a packet of "I kind of want to leave but my partner is a mess and what will be do" advice columns on hand. Not focused on your specifics, but here's one: https://captainawkward.com/2015/10/24/i-…
15
Nope. Nope, nope, nope, noooooope. Don't stay with your cheating, lying, substance abusing boyfriend just because he's got other problems in his life right now. Leave. You need to be honest and tell him that the cheating was a dealbreaker, then leave. Don't lie and try to manipulate him into getting therapy for his own good. He'll just use it to hold himself hostage when you do try and leave - "if you leave me I'll backslide! I did all this for you!"

Get out. You aren't obligated to destroy your own emotional health just to support someone else's.
16
LW I agree with #15. Being Trans is not a get out of being dick free card. You shouldn't have to suffer through your partners lies and addictions because they're having a hard time. I can guarantee they'll always be having a hard time should you try to leave them.

#10 please have your boyfriend go to a doctor. Not being able to feel anything in his dick is worrying and could be the sign of a far worse health issue than low T.
17
DAVID @1: I believe so. Cis people learn to navigate strange hormones in our early teens. Trans people have to learn to do this when they are much older and haven't had years of practice. So in essence, this trans man is acting like a horny, reckless teenage boy. I know many trans women who have struggled to control their newfound estrogen-enhanced emotions and learn how to dress and do makeup, like the rest of us were experimenting with at 13.

Your "kid in a candy store" observation is not limited to queers. How many divorcés of both genders do you know who immediately went on an opposite-sex slut rampage? Same phenomenon.

Jodo @2: The characters in this letter are 30(ish). The "polar bears" (love that new term!) Mr PAPAS is seeking are at least twice his own age, which I think anyone would consider "ancient" from their own perspective.

Victorian @6: Except that he's not putting her health at risk, because they're not having sex. She needs to keep not having sex with him until he can sort his shit out, or they break up. I thought Dan's advice was great. This is a temporary phase of his transition; they may be able to work through it.

CMD @9: I don't think Dan did anyone a disservice by focusing on the LW and the partner of the LW. After all, the LW is the one who wrote in. Dan's required only to respond to her concerns, not write a universally applicable answer.

Doodles @10: A numb dick does not sound like a testosterone problem to me. I don't know why he hasn't seen a doctor yet. Go!

18
I'd advise LW to use the same techniques that work for people who love addicts or alcoholics - it's possible to be compassionate and loving while still taking care of yourself and getting your own needs met.

You can set boundaries and protect yourself while still caring for your partner and recognizing the challenges of what he's going through. Detach with love, keep your expectations realistic, and feel no guilt at all at doing what you must to have some joy in your own life. Try to avoid black and white thinking, or limiting your choices to just two alternatives.

You may end up having to leave anyway, but there is a difference in leaving with a "fuck you, asshole!" or a "I love you but I won't allow you to treat me this way".
19
Dan's advice to stay in the relationship and help this person transition is compassionate toward him, not so much toward poor LW. It's pretty obvious that her partner has moved away from a loving relationship with her. Loving partners don't unilaterally stop having sex with you and start engaging in risky behavior outside the relationship, regardless of transitioning. The testosterone gives a reason but not an excuse. So, PAPAS, stay if it will make you feel better (I didn't just cut and run, I tried to help). If it was me, I'd be out of there, but I'm not you. Do what feels right for your own moral code, but don't fool yourself. This relationship is over. Time to start preparing an exit strategy.
20
Thank you @BiDanFan and @Capricornius. It sounds like he should get it checked out, but probably not worth doing T if that even is the problem.
21
BDF @ 17
By “Dan’s disservice” I meant focusing entirely on this particular couple and the “T” doses of the person becoming a man.
As you yourself mentioned, those experimental outbreaks for adult transitioners are not limited to the situation described in the letter and not exclusively elated to “T” intake.

It would have helped LW and bf to put things in perspective if they joined a trans support group of some sort.
Not sure where they reside, but I know that in Savageville there’s at least one place that holds weekly meetings and activities for trans in all stages and interested family members and friends. They also offer discounted therapy services by people who have been there themselves.

Just to put things in perspective, I came out so to speak while in my mid-late 40’s and after already moving out.
Similar to what you touched on, it was an often too joyous a discovery journey in which I had to slow down on occasion.
It felt great to be able to experiment like a teenage girl while becoming a woman, yet had to remind myself that I’m also a middle age dude.

22
You do NOT want to be with someone who's not attracted to you. All the rest is irrelevant. Get out now.
23
Disagree with Dan here. He's obviously given this guy a pass b/c he's Trans. I don't see him offering this advice to a completely cis-relationship (is that an appropriate term to describe a relationship where both parties are the gender they were born with? If not, someone please let me know!)

@18 - your advice really rings spot on to me. It's possible to be kind while still DTMFA'ing. And I think arguably will lead to a better outcome. I think it's interesting that the person's trans identity is more heavily focused on, compared to his sobriety being at risk. Maybe that's just b/c this is "relationship/sex" advice column.
24
That testosterone TAL from fifteen years ago is BS. I'm a trans guy; testosterone initially jacked up my libido but many years in I'm pretty sure it's the same as it was pre-T. I believe what the guy reported about the shift in how he saw women, but that's absolutely neither universal trans- nor cis-dude experience/way of looking at people we're attracted to. It's impossible to know how much of that shift was some direct biochemical effect of testosterone & how much was his ideas about being a man, how much was the simple fact of (presumably) getting to feel more comfortable in his own skin. I can say with 100% certainty though that it wasn't all or only the T.
25
As many commenters here, I don't think it's right to expect this woman to "stick it out" to help this person. Regardless of the delicate position, this person has put their partner's health and safety at risk, and likely created some emotional damage as well. Dumping her partner is not transphobic, it's necessary for her own well-being. The longer she stays in such an unhealthy relationship, the more damage that will be done to her mental health. Her partner's hardships are real, but they have shown utter disregard for her experience, and that deserves a dumping.
26
To hell with all the T stuff!

When did over 60 turn into “old hairy men?”

Richard Gere, Pierce Brosnan, Jeff Bridges, Denzel Washington, and most men I meet are pretty great looking and are over 60! And the guys I personally know still can get it up a second time. And what’s the problem with being hirsute? Are Brazilian bikini waxes on men somehow important?

Wow--I guess I like sex a lot more than people who read this blog!
27
CMD @21: Gotcha, apologies for misinterpreting. Thank you for sharing your experience.

Lola @23: Cis people do not generally start taking hormones mid-relationship. This situation IS indeed trans-specific. Sorry. (I view it as analogous to two people in any relationship and one develops a medical condition requiring treatment. Should the other partner stick by them through the course of the treatment, even if that strains the relationship? Most would say they should at least try.)

Daniel @24: Thanks for your perspective.

Helen @26: Is it not possible to be old, hairy, AND sexy? You're the one who's assumed those terms were mutually exclusive. Hmm.
28
Dr. Helen @ 26
Rest assured, your greatness is well documented.
Feel free to write about the subject at hand every now and then.
29
CMD @28: No comments section would be complete without a shaming from "Dr" Helen!
30
No one cares what you think Helen. If I need haughty middle aged lady thoughts I have a Mom.
31
@27

Helen is basic.