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News & ArtsWednesday, August 19, 2009
Politics Health Care Reform: Turn It Sideways And Shove It Down Their Throats
Posted by Dan Savage on Wed, Aug 19, 2009 at 8:12 AM
Okay, so the Obama administration only wasted seven months—more than an eight of his first term (and perhaps his presidency)—trying to make nice with the GOP and the shrieking lunatics in its base and the talking heads on Fox News who are trying to get him killed. No could've predicted that that wouldn't get 'em anywhere. So now the Democrats are talking about going it alone...
Given hardening Republican opposition to Congressional health care proposals, Democrats now say they see little chance of the minority’s cooperation in approving any overhaul, and are increasingly focused on drawing support for a final plan from within their own ranks.Top Democrats said Tuesday that their go-it-alone view was being shaped by what they saw as Republicans’ purposely strident tone against health care legislation during this month’s Congressional recess, as well as remarks by leading Republicans that current proposals were flawed beyond repair.... [Such] a change could alter the dynamic of talks surrounding health care legislation, and even change the substance of a final bill. With no need to negotiate with Republicans, Democrats might be better able to move more quickly, relying on their large majorities in both houses.
Shove it through, Democrats, and then when the dust settles and Americans have access to health insurance—including a public option—and the sky doesn't fall and no one is forced to stand before death panels and health-care-expense-related bankruptcies come down and the whole thing is, in retrospect, insanely popular and people can't remember what all the fuss was about, then you can claim 100% of the credit for health-care reform. Stop trying to bring the Rs along. Fuck 'em.
2
YES PLEASE. there is no reasoning with the crazy people. the democrats are IN CONTROL and need to start acting like it.
3
Conservatives have been dragged KICKING AND SCREAMING through every major social policy or project since FOREVER. There's really no reason to stop now. They're like spoiled children. Put 'em to bed, Ds.
5
We can only hope that this means that they are seriously considering moving on with out the Republicans. Of course, just because they're thinking about it doesn't mean that they'll actually use the power of their majority - the pressure has to be kept up on them to make them follow through and leave the Republicans behind.
7
And you know what? If they do move on without the Republicans and push through reform, I will be out there supporting them, I will be behind them 110%. I just cannot support the wimpy timidity and futile attempts at "bipartisanship" that have been the status quo for the last seven months.
8
Exactly. The Dems spent eight years being shat upon by Republicans who believed that two consecutive slim electoral "victories" gave them a mandate to do whatever the fuck they wanted, and now they're walking on eggshells because "no one likes us"? Seriously?
Two houses of Congress and the Presidency didn't fall into their laps for them to fuck around with the future.
Two houses of Congress and the Presidency didn't fall into their laps for them to fuck around with the future.
9
... and the talking heads on Fox News who are trying to get him killed.
Wow, let's turn the heat up on this just a tad more, shall we?
10
Damn.Straight.
It is like giving in repeatedly to a toddler having a tantrum. "here here...want some ice cream, just be good. You want to break that toy, okay be quiet." We should let the GOP lie on the floor and scream and cry and we will ignore it.
We have better things to do with our time.
It is like giving in repeatedly to a toddler having a tantrum. "here here...want some ice cream, just be good. You want to break that toy, okay be quiet." We should let the GOP lie on the floor and scream and cry and we will ignore it.
We have better things to do with our time.
11
If it were up to conservatives, WE'D STILL HAVE FUCKING SLAVERY!! To hell with them. Best wishes.
12
9 Telling the truth is not turning "the heat up", is stating reality.
Pass it thru, repubicans won't vote Democrat no matter how much is conceded to them and the base of the party is behind you on this Mr President one hundred.
Pass it thru, repubicans won't vote Democrat no matter how much is conceded to them and the base of the party is behind you on this Mr President one hundred.
13
Sorry, Timmytee, but much as I hate and disagree with everything that the modern Republican Party stands for, they, not the Democrats, were responsible for ending slavery. Indeed, opposing slavery was the reason that the GOP came into existence.
From Wikipedia: "The Republican Party is one of the two major contemporary political parties in the United States, along with the Democratic Party. Founded by anti-slavery expansion activists in 1854..."
The southern Democrats fought equal rights every inch of the way.
Since this no longer reflects the reality of the parties positions, I fully agree with your conclusions: "To hell with them".
From Wikipedia: "The Republican Party is one of the two major contemporary political parties in the United States, along with the Democratic Party. Founded by anti-slavery expansion activists in 1854..."
The southern Democrats fought equal rights every inch of the way.
Since this no longer reflects the reality of the parties positions, I fully agree with your conclusions: "To hell with them".
14
@13:
In Timmytree's defense, (s)he didn't state that "If it were up to the GOP...", but I think purposefully chose the word "conservatives" rather than "Republicans", which in the context of their statement would be correct.
In Timmytree's defense, (s)he didn't state that "If it were up to the GOP...", but I think purposefully chose the word "conservatives" rather than "Republicans", which in the context of their statement would be correct.
15
In the background of all this, of course, is the Economy.
In 1992, Bill Clinton inherited a droopy stock market and set his wife on Congress to push health care. 2 years later, Republicans gained control of Congress. 2 more years later the economy is booming.
Now that the economy seems to have recovered, and may even boom, I think Obama will have a hard time with health care. Reason? Because there will be so many available jobs with health care.
My joke:
What's the difference between a Republican and a Democrat.
A Democrat thinks that everyone wants a health care plan.
A Republican thinks that everyone wants a job...with a health care plan!
In 1992, Bill Clinton inherited a droopy stock market and set his wife on Congress to push health care. 2 years later, Republicans gained control of Congress. 2 more years later the economy is booming.
Now that the economy seems to have recovered, and may even boom, I think Obama will have a hard time with health care. Reason? Because there will be so many available jobs with health care.
My joke:
What's the difference between a Republican and a Democrat.
A Democrat thinks that everyone wants a health care plan.
A Republican thinks that everyone wants a job...with a health care plan!
16
The title of this post needs to be printed on t-shirts and worn to every remaining goddam town hall crazyperson meeting.
17
I agree Dan. And if he gets flack and criticism for not working with the GOP he can say "I spent eight months trying and all I got was questions about my birth certificate and comparisons to Hitler".
Instead of trying for bi-partisanship he should just say that there is room in the Democratic "Big Tent" for any moderate Republicans who are left (Snowe, Collins) and leave it at that.
Instead of trying for bi-partisanship he should just say that there is room in the Democratic "Big Tent" for any moderate Republicans who are left (Snowe, Collins) and leave it at that.
18
Yes, do it Democrats. They hate you anyways, this will rally the base and prove you can get things done. For the love of all that is holy, please get this passed! I don't want republican overlords in 2012.
20
11
In 1864, after hundreds of thousands of lives lost and with victory in sight, the (Northern) Democratic Party ran on a platform of quitting the war, letting the South go and retaining slavery. Democrats have always been pussies.
In 1864, after hundreds of thousands of lives lost and with victory in sight, the (Northern) Democratic Party ran on a platform of quitting the war, letting the South go and retaining slavery. Democrats have always been pussies.
21
@20, north america would be a more interesting place if the south was a separate country. and california, and the PNW, etc.
23
Dan: The problem isn't Republicans but conservative Democrats. A public option isn't going to pass in the senate without their backing.
24
What most of you quoting Wikipedia don't realize is that political parties throughout the United State's history have been incredibly fluid- so much so, that the Republican party of Lincoln's era turned into the Democratic party of ours.
Just look at the policies of the Republican party in the 1800s, and you'll see that it runs completely counterpoint to the Republican party of today... which is why (as #14 mentioned) Timmytee chose the word "Conservatives" instead of the misleading "Republicans".
Just look at the policies of the Republican party in the 1800s, and you'll see that it runs completely counterpoint to the Republican party of today... which is why (as #14 mentioned) Timmytee chose the word "Conservatives" instead of the misleading "Republicans".
26
'shove it down their throats'...
haha
that's pretty funny
the democrats are silly from the bitchslapping they've taken
and won't be shoving anything
but still it's good for a laugh
haha
that's pretty funny
the democrats are silly from the bitchslapping they've taken
and won't be shoving anything
but still it's good for a laugh
27
The one big thing I've never understood about the '08 campaign is how eagerly Democrats embraced the Obama rhetoric of "bipartisanship" after a generation of fierce unrelenting GOP partisanship.
HRC in '08.
HRC in '08.
28
@ 27...I'm with you to a point, but what makes you think a Clinton would be any better? Who do you think invented this detestable "Third Way" bullshit? She would have done the goddamn comprimising, concilatory, water-it-down-so-much-it-becomes-useless thing too.
If you were really serious about sticking it to the fucking conservatives, Kucinich was your man.
If you were really serious about sticking it to the fucking conservatives, Kucinich was your man.
29
24
maybe
But the Democratic Party that defended slavery in 1864 was also the Democratic Party that invented Jim Crow and the KKK and ran the segregated Old South with iron fisted one-party rule until Nixon came along and made the Great Society that devastated the black family and substituted the slavery of Welfare for chattel slavery...
maybe
But the Democratic Party that defended slavery in 1864 was also the Democratic Party that invented Jim Crow and the KKK and ran the segregated Old South with iron fisted one-party rule until Nixon came along and made the Great Society that devastated the black family and substituted the slavery of Welfare for chattel slavery...
32
One of the problems I see is the democratic coalitions that have threatened to not cooperate unless things are done their way. One of the big ones is the democrats who refuse to allow abortion (and in some cases, birth control) be covered by the public option. even when abortion is a non-elective measure.
Of course, we could just hammer it through the system now and change it later.
Of course, we could just hammer it through the system now and change it later.
33
it's pretty stupid to compare the political parties of today with the political parties of the past...yet, the parties themselves still do it.
it's about on par with trying to interpret what the Founding Fathers meant/intended when they wrote the Constitution in relation to contemporary problems/situations they had no way of forseeing...
it's about on par with trying to interpret what the Founding Fathers meant/intended when they wrote the Constitution in relation to contemporary problems/situations they had no way of forseeing...
34
I support President Obama's search for the center, but I have to agree that if the Republicans can only lie to their constituents, to promote ideas that are harmful to those same constituents, in order to prevent the democrats from doing something useful for everyone, then yes the democrats must shoulder the burden and move forward.
That having been said, however, I can understand why President Obama tried to help the Republicans get out of their own way and form a centrist government. It was worth the effort because the country has become ever more deeply divided and forming a center would have, and still can have (given a small miracle like FOX talking sense instead of insanity), a healing for the nation.
That having been said, however, I can understand why President Obama tried to help the Republicans get out of their own way and form a centrist government. It was worth the effort because the country has become ever more deeply divided and forming a center would have, and still can have (given a small miracle like FOX talking sense instead of insanity), a healing for the nation.
37
Hold their feet to the fire. Make it very clear they won't be serving another term if they don't come through.
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