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News & ArtsWednesday, September 9, 2009
City On My Way to Work
Posted by Charles Mudede on Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 11:31 AM
A few moments ago, in the middle of the city, as I'm listening to an interview with a specialist in gene archeology (the podcast is here): all of a sudden, everywhere screaming, mind-stunning sirens. Two fire trucks shutdown downtown and head past the library (the most significant building in the city) up to Freeway Park (the most important park in this city). What is the emergency? This ends up being the emergency:
1
Charles, I can put you on to some people who can talk to you about the provision of homeless services. Seattle spends a fortune on them. Enough? No. But you make it sound like they've never even thought about it before.
2
We do provide the homeless with real places to sleep and keep their belongings; they're called apartments, group homes and hospitals. The problem is that you have to be on your meds and willing to work within society to use them. We did have another place for homeless people who couldn't work within society to keep their shit, but they were all shut down because it was inhumane to keep them there.
3
Downtown Emergency Services Center (DESC) in Seattle has a shelter that houses people for the night and places to for transitioning people. They also run Evans House and other facilities for chronic alcoholics. It fills up quickly. It won national awards and before the inevitable criticisms come, it is a hell of a lot better than most other cities have at this time.
4
Actually, I think the least costly option would be for them to get real jobs and contribute to society rather than perpetually leeching from it.
7
Using a large truck to drive four otherwise unoccupied fireman to bandage a homeless person isn't so different from driving a single occupant SUV to a downtown office to process mortgage applications. Our urban culture is basically a big boring potlatch.
8
Charles, the same two cops and four firefighters would probably fill out the same reports and apply the same Band-Aid if you were hit by something or someone in Freeway Park.
Banna @ 2 -- Many homeless are in no need of meds (much less hospitalization), are nowhere near qualified for group homes, and most "work within society" invisibly enough on a regular daily basis. They're just homeless.
The atypical, stereotypical visible homeless - perhaps like Mudede's "young man who appears to be homeless" - are more likely affected by psych or addiction problems, but some of them are also "just homeless".
Banna @ 2 -- Many homeless are in no need of meds (much less hospitalization), are nowhere near qualified for group homes, and most "work within society" invisibly enough on a regular daily basis. They're just homeless.
The atypical, stereotypical visible homeless - perhaps like Mudede's "young man who appears to be homeless" - are more likely affected by psych or addiction problems, but some of them are also "just homeless".
9
WELL....If I ever some into a lot of cash that is my first order of biz: A safe, posh-hotel-like place for homeless people and their dogs to crash for free/shower/ do their thing:
Needle Exchange
Therapists on Staff
Med Care
BC if I keep bringing them home to sleep in our music room, my husband is gonna get really annoyed.
Most homeless people don't like the Shelters bc of all the rules...just ask em..they can't drink/smoke etc...yet they don't have access to the med care required to quit if they want to
Needle Exchange
Therapists on Staff
Med Care
BC if I keep bringing them home to sleep in our music room, my husband is gonna get really annoyed.
Most homeless people don't like the Shelters bc of all the rules...just ask em..they can't drink/smoke etc...yet they don't have access to the med care required to quit if they want to
12
try LA. or DC or..nevermind, seattle does a way better job than most cities, it is actually a lot more compassionate and proactive. yes there are problems, and some things can be done better but trust me is not like downtown LA where u see fragile elderly citizens cracked out or people in wheelchairs abandoned by the hundreds in front of the downtown shelter. actually, "the real cities" are a lot more cruel to the house challenged.
14
Charles,
I'm gonna part with you on this one. The homeless must admit that "they", themselves are part of the problem of homelessness. I'm losing empathy for them. It's already been mentioned but Seattle has among the nation's best programs and shelter availability for the homeless. I am tiring of the solicitations and litter (yes, they cause most of the litter in the city from bodily fluids to trash especially after consuming food and/or alcohol). I give to a food bank. I have offered them coupons in lieu of cash and they refuse. They want cash handouts. And, yes they know about the shelters but many refuse to sleep at them because of restrictions or rules.
This fellow is getting free emergency care something many nations don't offer. Four people are attending to him. Maybe he's homeless or unfortunate or both. But, he has it better than many places on earth.
I'm gonna part with you on this one. The homeless must admit that "they", themselves are part of the problem of homelessness. I'm losing empathy for them. It's already been mentioned but Seattle has among the nation's best programs and shelter availability for the homeless. I am tiring of the solicitations and litter (yes, they cause most of the litter in the city from bodily fluids to trash especially after consuming food and/or alcohol). I give to a food bank. I have offered them coupons in lieu of cash and they refuse. They want cash handouts. And, yes they know about the shelters but many refuse to sleep at them because of restrictions or rules.
This fellow is getting free emergency care something many nations don't offer. Four people are attending to him. Maybe he's homeless or unfortunate or both. But, he has it better than many places on earth.
15
Charles, I can assure you as a resident of San Francisco that expunging "these dead country (red state) anti-social values and become a rational radiation" as you put it is not a guarantee that the homeless will be properly cared for.
16
@14...That is bullshit...ANY person could become homeless and as a decent human, you should treat homeless people as you would want to be treated if you were in their shoes.
18
We already do have a lot of services for the chronically homeless and the occasionally homeless. For a number of reasons, those who rarely wind up homeless don't stay homeless for long. They're motivated to use the available services to get themselves in transitional housing or permanent housing as soon as possible.
I'm skeptical that chronic homelessness can ever be fully solved in this country. Among other things, the excuse that shelters have rules and regulations wouldn't fly in other First World countries. When the Dutch or the Danish provide shelter for their homeless, the homeless better damn well use it. Americans are strangely permissive of transgressive behavior.
I'm skeptical that chronic homelessness can ever be fully solved in this country. Among other things, the excuse that shelters have rules and regulations wouldn't fly in other First World countries. When the Dutch or the Danish provide shelter for their homeless, the homeless better damn well use it. Americans are strangely permissive of transgressive behavior.
21
No it's not. You have to burn a shit load of bridges before you wind up on the streets. A shit-load. Most people don't do that. See the difference?
25
It's not about burning bridges...sometimes shit happens in life and sometimes people don't have the resources they need to deal...
Do most of us?..yep...but not everyone does...so it wouldn't kill us to offer a little something to those who lack those resources.
True story:
Met some street kids with a dog about 3 months ago. Both had jobs but were living in their car b/c of a lack of cash/ parents poor also/ past hx of drug use.
Developed a relationship with em, got em an apt (just paid first/last and deposit) and now they have paid their rent 2 months in a row!!! They rock!
Dog is spayed and in training and they offer to do yard work around my house to say thanks.
If we all did little things like this from time to time...we'd all be a lot better off.
Do most of us?..yep...but not everyone does...so it wouldn't kill us to offer a little something to those who lack those resources.
True story:
Met some street kids with a dog about 3 months ago. Both had jobs but were living in their car b/c of a lack of cash/ parents poor also/ past hx of drug use.
Developed a relationship with em, got em an apt (just paid first/last and deposit) and now they have paid their rent 2 months in a row!!! They rock!
Dog is spayed and in training and they offer to do yard work around my house to say thanks.
If we all did little things like this from time to time...we'd all be a lot better off.
26
"so it wouldn't kill us to offer a little something to those who lack those resources."
Fine, a bowl of soup and a shelter bed are easily available in Seattle. We spend enough on bums. Spend anymore and this Seattle will be even more of a bum magnet.
" sometimes people don't have the resources they need to deal.."
You make it sound like a case of 'bad luck' vs. a series of bad decisions and choices these individuals make.
Call us in a year from now when your new buddies get enough $$ to start up their drug problem.
Fine, a bowl of soup and a shelter bed are easily available in Seattle. We spend enough on bums. Spend anymore and this Seattle will be even more of a bum magnet.
" sometimes people don't have the resources they need to deal.."
You make it sound like a case of 'bad luck' vs. a series of bad decisions and choices these individuals make.
Call us in a year from now when your new buddies get enough $$ to start up their drug problem.
29
"bad decisions/ bad luck"
We all have bad luck. Some of us plan for it though. I support the city's programs to feed/house the homeless, but fact is, the ones we see on the streets, the bums, are beyond help. It's a waste of money. Funds are limited, give them to those who are truly willing to help themselves.
We all have bad luck. Some of us plan for it though. I support the city's programs to feed/house the homeless, but fact is, the ones we see on the streets, the bums, are beyond help. It's a waste of money. Funds are limited, give them to those who are truly willing to help themselves.
31
That is an easy statement to make when you come from privilege.
Not everyone does.
I'm just saying if more individuals did little things to help people out, we'd be better off...not that the state needs addtl. funding...some of the existing programs don't work
Not everyone does.
I'm just saying if more individuals did little things to help people out, we'd be better off...not that the state needs addtl. funding...some of the existing programs don't work
32
"That is an easy statement to make when you come from privilege. "
How do you know my background?
How do you know my background?
35
I used to have this argument with my sister when she was attending Dartmouth College (which my Mom and Dad were paying for)
You approach it the same way she did...that the homeless were somehow to blame for their situation..She couldn't grasp that not everyone had a Mommy and Daddy who would buy them everything, pay for their education, clothing, etc and make sure they made their way in life...Thankfully she grew up and began to understand the world in more realistic terms...see there is hope for you
You approach it the same way she did...that the homeless were somehow to blame for their situation..She couldn't grasp that not everyone had a Mommy and Daddy who would buy them everything, pay for their education, clothing, etc and make sure they made their way in life...Thankfully she grew up and began to understand the world in more realistic terms...see there is hope for you
38
"not everyone had a Mommy and Daddy who would buy them everything, pay for their education, clothing"
You're right. So how come I see so few Somali, Ethiopian or Vietnamese bums? They all came to this country with nothing, some without mommies or daddies. You don't see any of them down on 3rd ave twitching, bumming ciggies and asking for change.
You're right. So how come I see so few Somali, Ethiopian or Vietnamese bums? They all came to this country with nothing, some without mommies or daddies. You don't see any of them down on 3rd ave twitching, bumming ciggies and asking for change.
40
@38, this is a good point. as an immigrant, im very aware of the fact that and have to form explanation for it. immigrants, however, do use (and often depend on) social services like subsidized housing and food banks.
41
@38..An interesting point..One, I think, that speaks to the way our culture "fosters and cultivates" many probs other cultures do not see/experience in the same way we do (mental health issues etc) but that is a sep. issue and I am long-winded enough
MY POINT, however, was that YOU strike me as someone who does have such a Mommy & Daddy, thus it is difficult for you to see outside of your own circumstances. That is all I am asking you to do...Look at homeless people as potentially good people worthy of your $1/$5/ Cup of coffee/ conversation... A little dignity and compassion can go a long way
MY POINT, however, was that YOU strike me as someone who does have such a Mommy & Daddy, thus it is difficult for you to see outside of your own circumstances. That is all I am asking you to do...Look at homeless people as potentially good people worthy of your $1/$5/ Cup of coffee/ conversation... A little dignity and compassion can go a long way
42
people who navigate the complex legal, financial, social and linguistic challenges of immigration are better prepared (in their internal capabilities, mindset, culture,) then the people who do not. Thus they are more likely to effective utilize the social resources available when they get here, and less likely to become homeless then a US born person with no support from family, history/family history of drug abuse/ mental illness. People who immigrate are self selected to be some of the more functional people from their home population. The US born homeless are exactly the opposite.
I've worked with the children of the chronically homeless, and it is truly tragic how little help they are equipped to receive.
I've worked with the children of the chronically homeless, and it is truly tragic how little help they are equipped to receive.
43
@38:
Ian, I would argue that the Somali/Ethiopian immigrants are also part of this problem. I work next to the large "subsidized housing" project on Yesler (Yesler Terrace?) that is pretty much primarily inhabited by Somalis and Ethiopians. And let me tell you, they are all at home- all day- it's pretty obvious no one is working. Each house has 10 kids running around by themselves, dad is sitting on the porch, mom is watching tv. They leave trash (old toys, shoes, fast food containers, tires, etc) all over their yards and pile it on the sidewalks and streets when the trash cans the city provides them with start to overflow. They don't take care of the housing and are clearly not making much of an effort to move on to housing that they actually pay for. I see no pride, responsibility, or effort from the residents of the subsidized housing. From my view it just looks like they are sponging off limited county resources and using this as a permanent solution instead of a transitional helping hand. Funny also how people who are in subsidized housing can afford cars...there is never any street parking because the entire neighborhood is filled with residential cars with their zone 7 permits. If you can afford a car, you can afford to pay your own rent. The city should have a time limit on subsidized housing- once you are on your feet after immigrating here, you move on and let someone else take your place.
Ian, I would argue that the Somali/Ethiopian immigrants are also part of this problem. I work next to the large "subsidized housing" project on Yesler (Yesler Terrace?) that is pretty much primarily inhabited by Somalis and Ethiopians. And let me tell you, they are all at home- all day- it's pretty obvious no one is working. Each house has 10 kids running around by themselves, dad is sitting on the porch, mom is watching tv. They leave trash (old toys, shoes, fast food containers, tires, etc) all over their yards and pile it on the sidewalks and streets when the trash cans the city provides them with start to overflow. They don't take care of the housing and are clearly not making much of an effort to move on to housing that they actually pay for. I see no pride, responsibility, or effort from the residents of the subsidized housing. From my view it just looks like they are sponging off limited county resources and using this as a permanent solution instead of a transitional helping hand. Funny also how people who are in subsidized housing can afford cars...there is never any street parking because the entire neighborhood is filled with residential cars with their zone 7 permits. If you can afford a car, you can afford to pay your own rent. The city should have a time limit on subsidized housing- once you are on your feet after immigrating here, you move on and let someone else take your place.
44
#43: Who is hiring poor immigrants or other poor people not part of mainstream white culture? Is Microsoft hiring uneducated poor people with accents? Is Boeing hiring uneducated poor people with accents? Amazon, Chase, Safeco, Harborview, Children's Hospital, Group Health, UW, King County, the City of Seattle? If you offer them a decent job and they refuse, then you can maybe complain about lazy poor people.
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