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Friday, September 11, 2009

Savage Love Letters of the Day

Posted by on Fri, Sep 11, 2009 at 4:27 PM

You're not an asexophobe, you're just ignorant. Monogamy in a sexless relationship probably is hard for you to define, since you're a sexual person. Between two asexual people, the meaning of monogamy is something that would have to be negotiated. As an asexual individual, I would simply define it as not cuddling or kissing with people outside of your relationship.

As for the wider question of when is the right time for an asexual to disclose his or her orientation, I agree that sooner is better. And it's possible that a lot of other asexuals think so, too! Don't make the mistake of assuming from the statements on one website, which cannot possibly be said to represent all of asexual individuals' opinions, that we're out to trap people with our sexlessness.

Ace Ventura

My response and more letters from asexuals—angry and otherwise—after the jump.

Thank you for writing, Ace. Now...

Representing as I do all sexuals everywhere—heterosexuals, homosexuals, and bisexuals—let me just say that we sexuals never assumed that any of the positions taken by the Asexual Visibility and Education Network represented the opinions of all asexual individuals everywhere. I was merely addressing the issues raised by AVEN in my capacity as the duly appointed representative of all sexuals everywhere. I apologize for any confusion my statements may have caused. And I appreciate your position on disclosure of an asexual identity: the sooner the better.

Dan, please get some asexual friends. I realize you're a sex advice columnist, and this is basically the opposite, but you're answer to TSIL was completely unfair and not thought out at all. My aunt got this figured out a long time ago. She married young, but found out she didn't want a sexual relationship at all, so got a divorce. Now she's been married to the same guy for thirty years in an asexual relationship. She dated a lot and when she and her date started "getting frisky" (her words) she would make it clear that she didn't want sex, just kissing and companionship. Back then asexuality wasn't well-known, or I'm sure she would have made it clear sooner. She got called a lot of nasty things sometimes and one guy tried to rape her (the typical "you just need a good dick in you" mentality), but then she found a guy who was perfectly happy with someone who's just a companion and they married because they're in love and wanted to have a home together and have been happy since. That's a monogamous relationship. They don't date outside the relationship, or try to find love or companionship in anyone else they way they do in their relationship. If there had been asexual communities back then, she would have probably only searched in the community.

Niece of Asexual Aunt

First off, I L-O-V-E your column, podcast and blog. Your brutally honest, snarky commentary never ceases to improve my mood and make my day a little less shitty. That said, I'm also asexual, and it kind of worried me when in the September 10th column some of that snarky awesomeness was aimed at asexuals; specifically the question of whether or not they exist.

Don't get me wrong; snark NEEDS to be aimed at the asexuals. Without frank, hold-the-sugar-coating discussion about sexual relationships and what sexually-inclined people expect from their relationships, how are these people ever going to realize that asexual-sexual relationships are doomed? I mean, have you actually looked through asexuality.org? It seems that half the people on there believe that with enough love, affection and talking that a sexual person can reconcile themselves to a sexless life. The asexuals need you, Dan, so please don't assume they don't exist. Surely a world that created people who have sex while wearing diapers and screaming for binkies is big enough to have popped out a handful of people who just don't want to have it at all.

A-OK in Midwest

PS: No, I'm not intimidated by the thought of sex and I consider myself reasonably well-adjusted. It's just that the thought of sex appeals to me about as much as vagina appeals to you.

Because you're someone a lot of youth look up to for advice on sex and relationships, I felt it was important to write in and let you know that you've been misinformed about asexuality. Asexual people are people who do not experience sexual attraction, full stop. People who identify as asexual can still be emotionally attracted or romantically attracted to other people. As you mentioned on the show, there are asexual people who are not romantically attracted to others, and they're called "aromantic asexuals", but they are not the only asexual people.

As an asexual person, I strongly believe asexual people should not get into relationships without disclosing their asexuality to their partner at the start. It is extremely unfair for the sexual person to then be trapped in an asexual relationship. Honesty and communication should be at the forefront of all relationships. If, at the start of a relationship, an asexual person and a sexual person mutually agree to try something out, then that's one thing, but having a year-long relationship before mentioning one's sexual preference is definitely unfair. Asexual people should not be barred from having relationships, but asexual people need to be vocal and honest from the start.

C. B.

 

Comments (33) RSS

Oldest First Unregistered On Registered On Add a comment
Baconcat 1
Asexuals are surprisingly rational and calm.

I think you need to do some more articles on furries, Dan. We need some excitement!
Posted by Baconcat on September 11, 2009 at 4:31 PM
gloomy gus 2
The asexuals you publish seem about as fun as the bisexuals you publish.
Posted by gloomy gus on September 11, 2009 at 4:37 PM
3
Are onanists sexual or asexual?

It's a rhetorical question...don't answer.
Posted by Jimbo Dumass on September 11, 2009 at 4:38 PM
4
Many folks are asexuals who don't realize it or are embarassed to disclose it so they find a million reasons to not have sex usually blaming the other person, the weather, anything except owning up to their own asexuality.

Posted by likes a roll in the hay on September 11, 2009 at 4:38 PM
kim in portland 5
Thank you for the food for thought.
Posted by kim in portland http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/11/fast-paced_video_provides_a_fu.html on September 11, 2009 at 4:41 PM
Vince 6
Boy, am I happy I'm not an asexual. B-o-r-i-n-g!
Posted by Vince on September 11, 2009 at 4:45 PM
Confluence 7
Those asexuals seem pretty mature and thoughtful actually. Must be nice not to have testosterone hijack your brain and make you do (or fantasize about) crazy shit. That being said, I could never date one. Would be an exercise in ongoing frustration. Hey, As, disclose early, wouldja?
Posted by Confluence on September 11, 2009 at 4:49 PM
8
I was going to say something like: "asexuals suck at head," but decided such low humor was beneath the level of discourse for this site.
Posted by carrma on September 11, 2009 at 4:51 PM
9
Sounds to me like asexuals are just people with mental baggage and plenty of time to think of new labels to hold onto instead of actually dealing with their issues. Give up the fucking labels and just be yourself and fight for everyone's right to be their own self. I'm sure we'll soon here about white asexuals just don't understand the special issues that black asexuals have. Or how we shouldn't lump bisexually oriented asexuals with monosexual asexuals. Or women, transgender, or intersexed asexuals with male asexuals. Deal with your shit and I'll defend and fight for your right to be whoever you decided to be for the moment.
Posted by hobosexual on September 11, 2009 at 4:58 PM
10
#2.

The asexuals you publish seem about as fun as the bisexuals you publish.


hahaha! Aww, A-OK in the Midwest seems pretty cool and fun.
Posted by jade on September 11, 2009 at 5:10 PM
smade 11
More sexuals for the rest of us, I say.
Posted by smade on September 11, 2009 at 5:15 PM
Will in Seattle 12
Projecting our own values on other people frequently doesn't work.
Posted by Will in Seattle http://www.facebook.com/WillSeattle on September 11, 2009 at 5:21 PM
balderdash 13
Asexuals: like furries, it was fun to make fun of them for about ten seconds, until it became clear that they were just yet another fringe group of people with a weird kink to their sexuality and sometimes a chip on their shoulders about it. I'd much rather just ignore them and leave them alone. Furries are fine. Asexuals are fine. Diaper fetishists? Fine. I just don't want to date any of them.
Posted by balderdash http://introverse.blogspot.com on September 11, 2009 at 6:20 PM
14
@13 - No way, I will never stop making fun of furries (or plushies.)

Are furries to fetishists as LARPers are to nerds?
Posted by JenV on September 11, 2009 at 6:43 PM
15
Many LARPers I know are nerds. The ones that aren't are the ones that really disturb me usually, but that could be because too few people do the non-Vampire LARPs where I live.
Posted by Shawn Landis, Philadelphia Asexual Examiner on September 11, 2009 at 7:57 PM
16
But but but.... I'm so confused. No other orientation actively dates people outside it's orientation. In fact... I was pretty sure that orientation is defined by who ya date. So why would you even try to date outside your self proclaimed orientation? ("before this goes any further, I just want you to know, that even though I know _you're_ straight, _I'm_ gay, so if you choose to keep dating me, that means no straight sex. OK?")
Posted by zapfizzle on September 11, 2009 at 7:59 PM
17
#16... Hmmm. Bisexuals have been known to date straights and gays, right?

Just FWIW, I do think asexual-sexual relationships are possible. They require, most importantly, communication and openness but also I think compromise on both parts. Personally I'd never compromise either on having sex or allowing my partner to have sex outside the relationship and think it would be unfair to expect a sexual to be happy with this arrangement, so these relationships are not for me.
Posted by michaeld on September 11, 2009 at 8:32 PM
18
Has Dan even said/typed "Asexual people are just wrong wrong wrong!!!11!1"? NO. If an asexual gets involved with someone and then the second or third date rolls around and they decide that they are "comfortable" enough with the "person they trust" to "come out of the closet", they need to be slapped. If a lesbian hid her sexuality from a man who was obviously sexually interested until the third date and then, as he moves in for the kill, decides that she "trusts" the guy enough to say, "Hey, I dont like dick, but can we cuddle?" Bitch would be slapped too. Suck it the fuck up.
Posted by bloodycarrot on September 11, 2009 at 8:50 PM
19
How is an asexual relationship any different than a really good platonic one? For me, the major difference between having a boyfriend and being best friends with a guy is that I don't sleep with or do anything sexual with the best friend. That's why my boyfriend shouldn't be jealous and/or intimidated if I have a male friend whom I'm really close with. Those same rules apply to gays, lesbians, and bisexuals.
Posted by Anna from Orlando on September 11, 2009 at 10:21 PM
20
I'm not trying to be snarky here. I really had this attack of curiosity.

Do asexuals masterbate?

Speaking of which, today is 9/11 and this is in the news:

http://www.theonion.com/content/video/am…
Posted by cracked on September 11, 2009 at 11:28 PM
21
Hey, not all of Dan's readers are twenty- or thirty-somethings still rampaging around in the sexual marketplace. Asexuality feels pretty natural to me (married in my mid-fifties to a sixty-something husband who went through hellacious prostate surgery).

He and I each had decades of all the sexual adventuring we could wish for, with lots of partners male and female. Now, it's sort of like being in a restaurant where you've already tasted every dessert on the dessert menu, and you're happy to just opt for a cup of coffee.

We touch, we laugh, we concentrate on our work and art and community without being pestered by that burning itch. Asexuality feels like a pretty comfy place to be right now for both of us.
Posted by Iris on September 11, 2009 at 11:35 PM
Gomez 22
For a group of people who simply aren't interested in sex (allegedly), they sure are bitchy about it.
Posted by Gomez http://gomezticator.livejournal.com on September 11, 2009 at 11:40 PM
23
@19 -- either your boyfriends are all very casual dudes, or your male friends are very confused. the most major difference between a friend and a lover should not be just the sleeping together ... or else you'd be treating your good friends like people you might very well sleep with, except that you're not.

perhaps that's not what you meant to say at all, but the fact that you don't have sex with your friends should be a symptom of how things are different between you, not the difference itself. i mean, sometimes people DO have sex with their friends, briefly, and nothing develops. but it's still a friendship with sex, not a relationship. but trust me, for most people of either gender, a friendship that's mostly separated from a relationship by the absence of fucking, is just an odd and miserable experience for one of the two people.
Posted by No Account on September 12, 2009 at 12:01 AM
Keekee 24
@19:
I am assuming you are female here. Your male best friend is either gay, or asexual. That's why he doesn't want to sleep with you & explains why your boyfriend isn't threatened either.

Or you are jus' in serious denial...
Posted by Keekee on September 12, 2009 at 8:34 AM
25
"Don't make the mistake of assuming from the statements on one website..."

Oh, but that's Dan's stock in trade.
Posted by bigyaz on September 12, 2009 at 9:52 AM
26
I'm not trying to be snarky here. I really had this attack of curiosity. Do asexuals masterbate?

Information answering this question - and so many more - can be found on the FAQ page at AVEN.

http://www.asexuality.org/home/general.h…

Google is your friend.
Posted by sootmouth on September 12, 2009 at 10:27 AM
jamiezane 27
Assexual is such a stupid term. Scientifically it means that they're able to reproduce on their own.

Fuck them and their stupid hypocritical rants about semantics and definitions on relationships.
Fuck them and their attacks on Savage.
Fuck them and...well...I guess we can't fuck them now, can we?

Too bad. Their loss.
Posted by jamiezane on September 12, 2009 at 4:37 PM
28
"Scientifically it means that they're able to reproduce on their own."

Actually, jamiezane, it doesn't. The Greek prefix -a just means no or non. Thus asexual = non-sexual. Nothing per se to do with reproduction at all.

There is a phrase "asexual reproduction" - reproduction not involving sex. But the reason this is about reproduction is not because it involves the word "asexual" but um because it involves the word... let's see... reproduction! Funny that.
Posted by michaeld on September 12, 2009 at 5:40 PM
Vampireseal 29
#27: Originally, bisexual meant that a particular species possessed two sexes, rather than one. For example, many whiptail lizards in the US are unisexual (are all females) and reproduce by parthenogenesis.However, a few species such as the six-lined racerunner are bisexual--that is they have males and females in their species.

Over time, society has changed or offered several different meanings of words that had other meanings in science. Bisexuality, asexuality, and hermaphroditism (typically referred to as intersexuality in most cases now) mean different things in biology.

To use the words in their original scientific form, all humans are bisexual (we have two sexes), none are asexual (no human clones that we know of yet), and none are hermaphrodites (no humans yet capable of being both a genetic sire and dam to offspring).

Posted by Vampireseal on September 12, 2009 at 10:27 PM
seandr 30
It's hard for me to fathom voluntary asexuality as anything but a hangup or a medical condition.

We are meant to fuck.
Posted by seandr on September 13, 2009 at 8:37 PM
31
seandr @30 "voluntary asexuality".

Asexuality isn't voluntary - it's an orientation like hetero-,bi- and homo- sexualities.

Perhaps you're confusing asexuality with celibacy?
Posted by sootmouth on September 14, 2009 at 3:11 AM
32
I'm amused by the "meant to fuck" comments. Perhaps we all have short memories..
what is "meant" to happen is a woman fucks a man and progeny result. But since very few of us are fucking as we are "meant" to, I suggest you chill out and stop hating.
Posted by tomatl on September 18, 2009 at 5:07 PM
33
JamieZane: You are very rude. I'm sorry that you got so upset about this issue. Let me clarify, an asexual could fuck you and fuck you well. Just like a gay man could fuck a woman and fuck her well. They just don't have the urge to. (your snarkiness wouldn't help either). That is all this is about: orientation.
Posted by tomatl on September 18, 2009 at 5:17 PM

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