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News & ArtsMonday, October 19, 2009
History We Think of Hobsbawm
Posted by Charles Mudede on Mon, Oct 19, 2009 at 12:59 PM
Thomas L. Friedman clumsily connects a victory for freedom with an attack on freedom:
A few weeks ago, Americans “observed” the eighth anniversary of 9/11 — that day in 2001 when the Twin Towers were brought down by Al Qaeda. In a few weeks, Germans will “celebrate” the 20th anniversary of 11/9 — that day in 1989 when the Berlin Wall was brought down by one of the greatest manifestations of people power ever seen.
To middle with: The fall of the Berlin Wall is far more significant than the set of spectacular terrorist actions that happened on American soil. The first event closes the short 20th century (to use the language of Eric Hobsbawm—though he ends the 20th century in 1991) and opens the 21st century. The terrorist actions only intensified the 21 century, or closer yet, accelerated it, in the way Hiroshima accelerated but did not inaugurate, the 20th century—which began with the end of World War I and began the ideological contest between what LKJ called "Di Eagle An' di Bear."
To end with: The 21st century will not terminate in the land of the eagle, or the bear, but the panda bear.
1
There won't be any pandas left to mark the end of the 21st century, Charles.
You're just being silly.
You're just being silly.
2
i'm sorry charles, you may think of hobspawn, but the term "hobspawn" only makes me think of "hobospawn" which leads me down the path of trying not to think about hobo semen.
3
The weekly peaceful protests at 600 locations across the former GDR, "die Montagsdemos," make the case for the fall of the wall the result of a people's movement, not "competing systems."
4
more Hobsbawm! nice one charles.
i agree with his notion of the short 20h century. but you haven't indicated what is accelerating in the 21st. ?
i agree with his notion of the short 20h century. but you haven't indicated what is accelerating in the 21st. ?
5
Good Afternoon Charles,
First of all, who is LKJ? I don't know who you are exactly talking about. I know of and have read Eric Hobsbawm. He is a left-of-center British historian. I don't tend to think of him regarding 1989.
Second, it is good to acknowledge that 1989 was an extraordinary year. It really was. The Cold War ended peacefully (no small feat) and the Berlin Wall fell (I have a piece of it). Never forget that in Oct. 1962, the USA & USSR were on the brink of (nuclear?) war. That was the closest the 2nd hand came to "midnight" (ie. nuclear war according to the Bulletin of Atomic Scientists who monitor the possibility that way) in human history. Germany is now unified and France is now a full standing member of NATO.
Finally, I do believe that Islamofascism is the new Communism. Obama's Cairo speech was very conciliatory toward Islam and Bush said similar stuff ("We are not at war with Islam" etc. in the wake of 9/11). Back in the day, our diplomats had to tread carefully (ie. be conciliatory) with dictator Stalin and Communism (by 1949, the USSR exploded its 1st atomic bomb) and similarly, today our diplomats are delicate with Amadinejad, Iran and reactionary forces in the Islamic world. Clearly, The Islamic Republic of Iran isn't the Soviet Union (militarily, there is a huge difference). But, we still must exercise caution and negotiate from strength. No, I don't want Iran to acquire nuclear weapons. I don't mind negotiating with Iran but the Occident must remain steadfast.
First of all, who is LKJ? I don't know who you are exactly talking about. I know of and have read Eric Hobsbawm. He is a left-of-center British historian. I don't tend to think of him regarding 1989.
Second, it is good to acknowledge that 1989 was an extraordinary year. It really was. The Cold War ended peacefully (no small feat) and the Berlin Wall fell (I have a piece of it). Never forget that in Oct. 1962, the USA & USSR were on the brink of (nuclear?) war. That was the closest the 2nd hand came to "midnight" (ie. nuclear war according to the Bulletin of Atomic Scientists who monitor the possibility that way) in human history. Germany is now unified and France is now a full standing member of NATO.
Finally, I do believe that Islamofascism is the new Communism. Obama's Cairo speech was very conciliatory toward Islam and Bush said similar stuff ("We are not at war with Islam" etc. in the wake of 9/11). Back in the day, our diplomats had to tread carefully (ie. be conciliatory) with dictator Stalin and Communism (by 1949, the USSR exploded its 1st atomic bomb) and similarly, today our diplomats are delicate with Amadinejad, Iran and reactionary forces in the Islamic world. Clearly, The Islamic Republic of Iran isn't the Soviet Union (militarily, there is a huge difference). But, we still must exercise caution and negotiate from strength. No, I don't want Iran to acquire nuclear weapons. I don't mind negotiating with Iran but the Occident must remain steadfast.
7
5 - WTF are you talking about? Do you have a point that's germane to the post, or are you just prattling on in a public forum?
Leave the peripatetic rambling circumlocution to Charles, please. He's got more than enough for us...
Leave the peripatetic rambling circumlocution to Charles, please. He's got more than enough for us...
8
@5 France is not a member of NATO
http://www.nato.int/cps/en/natolive/nato…
Islamofascism, as you put it, is nothing like communism. One is a religious based system of control. The other is state sanctioned theft.
Finally, Islamofacsism is no more a threat to the U.S. than the mafia.
But other than your whole post, you are spot on.
http://www.nato.int/cps/en/natolive/nato…
Islamofascism, as you put it, is nothing like communism. One is a religious based system of control. The other is state sanctioned theft.
Finally, Islamofacsism is no more a threat to the U.S. than the mafia.
But other than your whole post, you are spot on.
9
Every time I think of panda bears, it makes me think of that song by Muse with the giant scary teddy bears.
Actually, France has a right-wing government, @5, which you'd know if you didn't depend on Fox News for your lies.
Actually, France has a right-wing government, @5, which you'd know if you didn't depend on Fox News for your lies.
10
I think that unless the Chinese govt gets a lot more open that this century will very likely be the Century of the Tiger.
The Indian economy is freer and in a (some-what) post industrial age the dependence of the economies of the west on the knowledge and information workers in India are just as likely to deliver power to them as the manufacturing power will to the Chinese.
The Indian economy is freer and in a (some-what) post industrial age the dependence of the economies of the west on the knowledge and information workers in India are just as likely to deliver power to them as the manufacturing power will to the Chinese.
11
@8
France is a full standing member now:
http://www.france24.com/en/20090311-fran…
Islamofascism is a threat (9/11, Bali, Madrid, London, Moscow, Mumbai and the assassination of Pakistani PM candidate so lethally prove it)
@9 I don't watch FOX News
France is a full standing member now:
http://www.france24.com/en/20090311-fran…
Islamofascism is a threat (9/11, Bali, Madrid, London, Moscow, Mumbai and the assassination of Pakistani PM candidate so lethally prove it)
@9 I don't watch FOX News
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