Slog
News & ArtsSunday, February 7, 2010
Hetero Every Child Deserves a Mother and a Father
Posted by Dan Savage on Sun, Feb 7, 2010 at 11:13 AM
The war comes home:
A U.S. soldier has been accused of 'waterboarding' his four-year-old daughter because she couldn't recite the alphabet. Joshua Tabor admitted to police that he used the CIA torture technique because he was so angry. As his daughter 'squirmed' to get away, Tabor said he submerged her face—upwards—three or four times until the water was lapping around her forehead and jawline. Tabor, 27, admitted to investigators that his daughter was terrified of water and he had deliberately chosen the punishment.
It happened in Tacoma, Washington, while the girl's mother looked on. Thanks, I think, to Slog tipper Scary Tyler Moore.
1
This is triple post worthy material. Violence is a gas, filling every available space provided for it by any culture.
2
So how come we have to read about it in the British media? Sheesh. There's something about it in the Olympian
http://www.thenewstribune.com/partners/t…
but in their version he's merely "holding his 4-year-old daughter's head under the water in the kitchen sink."
"According to court records:
"Yelm police responded to a disturbance Sunday night after Tabor’s girlfriend reported that Tabor, a Joint Base Lewis-McChord soldier, 'was irate, intoxicated and walking around the neighborhood with his Kevlar helmet threatening to break windows.'
"Tabor’s girlfriend told Yelm police that Tabor beats his 4-year-old daughter and that the child’s back was covered in bruises. The girlfriend reported that the 4-year-old had locked herself in a closet because she was afraid of her father.
"The girlfriend also reported that when the child wets herself, Tabor 'makes her sit in the urine-soaked clothes' until he gives her permission to change.
"The girl spoke to a Yelm officer, and he observed that she “had severe bruising on her entire back,” along with scratch marks and bruising on her neck, throat, chin, arms, legs and buttocks.
"She 'was asked how she got the bruises and she replied ‘"Daddy did it."’
"Asked how or why it happened, the child would not reply, then said, 'I don’t know why he did it.'”
"Tabor spoke to a Yelm police officer and said that he and his girlfriend had 'held her down on the counter and submerged her head into the water three or four times until the water came around her forehead and jawline.' He said that she was face-up when her head was in the water. He added that they gave this punishment for the 4-year-old 'refusing to say her letters.'
"Tabor told police that his daughter is afraid of water 'and was squirming around trying to get away from the water. Joshua did not act as though he felt there was anything wrong with this form of punishment.'
"Yelm Police Sgt. Rob Carlson confirmed Tuesday that the alleged abuse occurred because the child would not recite her ABCs, according to police reports."
More...
http://www.thenewstribune.com/partners/t…
but in their version he's merely "holding his 4-year-old daughter's head under the water in the kitchen sink."
"According to court records:
"Yelm police responded to a disturbance Sunday night after Tabor’s girlfriend reported that Tabor, a Joint Base Lewis-McChord soldier, 'was irate, intoxicated and walking around the neighborhood with his Kevlar helmet threatening to break windows.'
"Tabor’s girlfriend told Yelm police that Tabor beats his 4-year-old daughter and that the child’s back was covered in bruises. The girlfriend reported that the 4-year-old had locked herself in a closet because she was afraid of her father.
"The girlfriend also reported that when the child wets herself, Tabor 'makes her sit in the urine-soaked clothes' until he gives her permission to change.
"The girl spoke to a Yelm officer, and he observed that she “had severe bruising on her entire back,” along with scratch marks and bruising on her neck, throat, chin, arms, legs and buttocks.
"She 'was asked how she got the bruises and she replied ‘"Daddy did it."’
"Asked how or why it happened, the child would not reply, then said, 'I don’t know why he did it.'”
"Tabor spoke to a Yelm police officer and said that he and his girlfriend had 'held her down on the counter and submerged her head into the water three or four times until the water came around her forehead and jawline.' He said that she was face-up when her head was in the water. He added that they gave this punishment for the 4-year-old 'refusing to say her letters.'
"Tabor told police that his daughter is afraid of water 'and was squirming around trying to get away from the water. Joshua did not act as though he felt there was anything wrong with this form of punishment.'
"Yelm Police Sgt. Rob Carlson confirmed Tuesday that the alleged abuse occurred because the child would not recite her ABCs, according to police reports."
3
Charge the mother with depravity and the father with conduct unbecoming an officer as well as Psychosis or PTSD maybe?
Although, someone else should have known something was very wrong when the father walked around the neighborhood in his Kevlar helmet threating to break windows.
This seems indefensible, but we all know they will give this child back to her bio's.
Although, someone else should have known something was very wrong when the father walked around the neighborhood in his Kevlar helmet threating to break windows.
This seems indefensible, but we all know they will give this child back to her bio's.
5
Time to take the children away from these parents...maybe their grandparents would do a better job...a father who would do that is capable of worse.
6
triple-post it.
oh my god. a recurring nightmare theme i have? water. drowning, floods, destruction, sharks, downpours...all i think bc of two childhood memories: momentarily feeling like i was drowning in a neighbors pool (it was like 5 sec and then my mom caught me as i stepped of an underwater stair!) and getting lost in the Calacademy aquarium.
that poor child. she could fear water and her parents for the rest of her life.
oh my god. a recurring nightmare theme i have? water. drowning, floods, destruction, sharks, downpours...all i think bc of two childhood memories: momentarily feeling like i was drowning in a neighbors pool (it was like 5 sec and then my mom caught me as i stepped of an underwater stair!) and getting lost in the Calacademy aquarium.
that poor child. she could fear water and her parents for the rest of her life.
11
I feel sorry for her parents and for her, rather than angry at them. When you tell someone that torture is okay under certain circumstances, it becomes easily justified in many other cases by the ever-churning human mind. Therapy for her, therapy for her parents, make sure that her mom and dad have the perspective necessary to properly raise a child before you start to think about giving her back to them.
Condoning torture destroys families. We (the US of A) should work on that issue instead of banging on and on about how gays are gonna do the same.
Condoning torture destroys families. We (the US of A) should work on that issue instead of banging on and on about how gays are gonna do the same.
13
We have to waterboard four year olds here so we don't have to waterboard them over there. Wait, they probably do that too. Hmm.
17
The PTSD from Brothers immediately came to mind when I read this. Is the father fucked up? Absolutely... but at least he might have some kind of psychosis to blame (still not okay.) But what the FUCK was the mother thinking here?
It takes more for a person to get a license to drive a car than it does to have a child.
It takes more for a person to get a license to drive a car than it does to have a child.
18
There IS no mother in this story- only a girlfriend, who is not the mother. Who knows where the girl's mom is, but not in this hideous story. Girlfriend is probably as terrified as the daughter. Too sad.
LC should be piping up in 3...2...1...
LC should be piping up in 3...2...1...
20
The real question is how does a guy stay in the military that long and not know the alphabet, and his wife is illiterate too? I can understand why he would want to know the secrets of the English language but maybe the military should have just taught him to read so he wouldn't have to beat the alphabet out of a 4 year old.
21
More of the mayhem that comes into children's lives when parents shack up.
Dan claimed it happened while the girl's mother looked on but it was the father's girlfriend.
Score one more for the traditional family.
Dan claimed it happened while the girl's mother looked on but it was the father's girlfriend.
Score one more for the traditional family.
22
@21: So...if it had been the little girl's bio mother, not her step-mom of sorts, this wouldn't have happened? This makes it seem like you're against adoption, since children OBVIOUSLY will be abused if they're not living with both biological parents.
25
This is an UPDATE to the original story posted this morning. The earlier post did not state that the girlfriend was not the mother of the child. It also did not state where the bio mother lived and that the father was confined to his base.
26
Looks like a classic case of combat-induced PTSD. It'd be interesting to see if he was a participant in our Enhanced Interrogation program.
Should all acquaintance be forgot, casualties of war don't stop at the dead and the maimed, but extend throughout all those who are forced to sup on its horror. This is the legacy that still remains unspoken in polite company, yet troopers come home on a daily basis rattled in a way that will never be cured, exasperated further by TBIs caused by IEDs.
Tell me, Allegedly, do you believe the water cure to be a method of torture? Your boys in office to whom you've claimed weren't / aren't conservative enough for your tastes don't think so. In fact McCain stopped claiming he was tortured as a POW in Vietnam on this basis. So do you, Allegedly?
Should all acquaintance be forgot, casualties of war don't stop at the dead and the maimed, but extend throughout all those who are forced to sup on its horror. This is the legacy that still remains unspoken in polite company, yet troopers come home on a daily basis rattled in a way that will never be cured, exasperated further by TBIs caused by IEDs.
Tell me, Allegedly, do you believe the water cure to be a method of torture? Your boys in office to whom you've claimed weren't / aren't conservative enough for your tastes don't think so. In fact McCain stopped claiming he was tortured as a POW in Vietnam on this basis. So do you, Allegedly?
30
Beating and scaring her is abuse, undoubtably; but as I read the article, the girl was face up, so the back of her head was under water, not her face. It's exactly the same position I use to wash hair, with my face out in the air. Now, since she was afraid of water, I can see why she'd be scared, but it's not waterboarding, which has the mouth and nose underwater.
The bruising is terrible enough. She must be terrified.
The bruising is terrible enough. She must be terrified.
31
SpookyCats, so you're trying to justify it by saying it couldn't have been that bad? Fuck you. Seriously, fuck you with a rusty rake.
When I was that age, my mother hated to wash my hair because I was so afraid of having my head under running water. She tried and tried, and I screamed and fought.
You don't know what that little girl was thinking, so just shut the fuck up.
When I was that age, my mother hated to wash my hair because I was so afraid of having my head under running water. She tried and tried, and I screamed and fought.
You don't know what that little girl was thinking, so just shut the fuck up.
32
Tragic, tragic, tragic, and the saddest story of the day. Here's hoping that little girl—and her dad—are capable of psychologically moving on.
33
Moving on? You're worried about her dad moving on? I'm worried that they won't keep him in prison the rest of his life.
34
SpookyCats: The article says two times that the girl's face was submerged. It doesn't say anything about her being face up, but since the article uses the word "waterboarding", it probably was. It's certainly possible for someone's face to be submerged while that person is face up, after all, and from my understanding, this is worse than being face down, since it will force water deep into the nose, and probably the mouth and throat, which is the entire point of waterboarding.
35
The article link now says that the child's mother lives in Kansas and the the father was awarded custody of the child four weeks earlier. The girlfriend is not the parent.
Someone ought to waterboard the fucking judge that gave this asshole custody.
Someone ought to waterboard the fucking judge that gave this asshole custody.
37
Children raised by their married biological parents have the best chance of a safe environment. It is not 100% but it is the best thing going for homo sapiens. Unwed mothers, divorce, live in boy/girlfriends, shacking up- all greatly increase the chances a child will be placed in danger.
Regular readers of Slog see it everyday in the various "Watches.."
Regular readers of Slog see it everyday in the various "Watches.."
38
37, children in gay families have been shown to be just as well adjusted as children in straight families.
41
40
"Children growing up in same-sex parental households DO NOT NECESSARILY have differences in self-esteem, gender identity, or emotional problems from children growing up in heterosexual parent homes."
That is not the same as "have been shown to be just as well adjusted".
"Children growing up in same-sex parental households DO NOT NECESSARILY have differences in self-esteem, gender identity, or emotional problems from children growing up in heterosexual parent homes."
That is not the same as "have been shown to be just as well adjusted".
42
40
"Studies from 1981 to 1994, including 260 children reared by either heterosexual mothers or same-sex mothers after divorce ..."
no cheating- we said married biological parents...
"Studies from 1981 to 1994, including 260 children reared by either heterosexual mothers or same-sex mothers after divorce ..."
no cheating- we said married biological parents...
43
40
""Some studies showed that SINGLE heterosexual parents' children have more difficulties than children who have parents of the same sex," Perrin says."
see @42...
""Some studies showed that SINGLE heterosexual parents' children have more difficulties than children who have parents of the same sex," Perrin says."
see @42...
44
40
"Another study of 37 children of 27 DIVORCED lesbian mothers and a similar number of children of heterosexual mothers ..."
see @42. again.
"Another study of 37 children of 27 DIVORCED lesbian mothers and a similar number of children of heterosexual mothers ..."
see @42. again.
45
40
" "And, the children of lesbian couples are less aggressive and more inclined to play with both boy's and girl's toys...."
Hey, I want THAY GUY in the covering my back in the next firefight....
" "And, the children of lesbian couples are less aggressive and more inclined to play with both boy's and girl's toys...."
Hey, I want THAY GUY in the covering my back in the next firefight....
46
This was NOT the girl's mother. This is the girlfriend. Daddy stripped the mother of custody 4 weeks before. I'd love to know who the hell the judge was who make this brilliant decision, and see if he or she will held accountable for this. But don't hold your breath.
48
After 3 or 4 generations of homosexual marriage and adoptions what percentage of the population will self identify as gay? What will be the effect on birthrates? Did you know that social security will pay out more than it takes in this year? Do you know what happens to a nation's economy when it stops having enough babies?
After 3 or 4 generations of homosexual marriage and adoptions what percentage of the potential military pool will be suitable soldiers? Lesbians raise kids who are nurturing and will play with dolls. Wonderful. Paris Island can redo it's barracks in pink and lavendar. When you call 911 because someone is beating your partner to death maybe they will send out an anger counselor to nurture the guy.
Where are the studies that measure the effects on society of 3 or 4 generations of homosexual marriage and adoption? ooops.
What society, in the whole history of the world, can we look to for an example of what the effects will be?
ooops.
When Wiley Coyote falls off a cliff he gets up and dusts himself off.
That's not the Real World, Bob.
When societies blindly throw themselves over a cliff the landing is messy.
After 3 or 4 generations of homosexual marriage and adoptions what percentage of the potential military pool will be suitable soldiers? Lesbians raise kids who are nurturing and will play with dolls. Wonderful. Paris Island can redo it's barracks in pink and lavendar. When you call 911 because someone is beating your partner to death maybe they will send out an anger counselor to nurture the guy.
Where are the studies that measure the effects on society of 3 or 4 generations of homosexual marriage and adoption? ooops.
What society, in the whole history of the world, can we look to for an example of what the effects will be?
ooops.
When Wiley Coyote falls off a cliff he gets up and dusts himself off.
That's not the Real World, Bob.
When societies blindly throw themselves over a cliff the landing is messy.
50
Political correctness aside, research suggests that single-mother households (which would include lesbians) and married couple households have much lower rates of abuse (abuse incidents per 1,000) than single-father households (which would presumably include a lot of gay fathers). This is one reason all the studies on "gay parenting" look so good--they're mostly limited to mothers.
Here's how NIS-3 compared the various groups (the recently released NIS-4 has refused to break down the data by mother-headed and father-headed households)
HARM STANDARD
MALTREATMENT
Overall maltreatment is abuse and neglect combined.
Children living with their only their mothers experienced maltreatment under the Harm Standard at a rate of 26.1 per 1,000 children.
Children living with only their dads: 36.6 per 1,000.
As NIS-3 notes, "This rate is more than two and one-third times higher than that of children in two-parent families."
ABUSE
Children living with only their moms: 10.5 per 1,000.
Children living with only their dads: 17.7 per 1,000.
Here's what NIS-3 says about that: "Children in father-only families had more than twice the risk of abuse as defined by the harm standard compared to children living in both-parent families. Their risk was more than one and two-thirds that of children in mother-only families, a marginal difference in this maltreatment category. Thus, the pattern in connection with abuse essentially reflects the higher risk of children who live with only their fathers."
PHYSICAL ABUSE
Physical abuse is a subcategory under abuse.
Children living with only their moms: 6.4 per 1,000 children.
Children living with only their dads: 10.5 per 1,000 children.
Here's what NIS-3 states: "When specific types of abuse under the Harm Standard are examined, it is apparent that the findings described in the previous paragraph stem from the disproportionate incidence of physical abuse among children in father-only households....An estimated 10.5 per 1,000 children living with only their fathers were harmed by physical abuse in 1993, which is more than two and two-thirds higher than the incidence rate of 3.9 per 1,000 for children living with both their parents. Children in mother-only families were not statistically different from those in both-parent households in their risk of physical abuse under the Harm Standard."
NEGLECT
Children living with only their moms: 16.7 per 1,000 children.
Children living with only their dads: 21.9 per 1,000 children.
EMOTIONAL NEGLECT
Emotional neglect is one of the subcategories under neglect.
Children living with only their moms: 3.4 per 1,000 children.
Children living with only their fathers: 8.8 per 1,000 children.
SEVERITY OF INJURIES
The data was said to be statisically unreliable for Fatalities, so let's turn to Serious Injuries.
Children living with only their moms: 10.0 per 1,000 children.
Children living with only their dads: 14.0 per 1,000.
And Moderate Injuries?
Children living with only their moms: 14.7 per 1,000 children.
Children living with only their dads: 20.5 per 1,000.
ENDANGERMENT STANDARD
MALTREATMENT
All maltreatment (abuse and neglect) for children living with only their moms: 50.1 per 1,000 children.
For children living with only their dads: 65.6 per 1,000.
ABUSE
All abuse for children living with only their moms: 18.1 per 1,000 children.
For children living only with their dads: 31.0 per 1,000.
PHYSICAL ABUSE
Physical abuse for children living with only their moms: 9.8 per 1,000 children.
For children living with only their dads: 16.5 per 1,000.
As NIS-3 concludes, "Similar to the pattern described above in relation to Harm standard physical abuse, children who live with only their fathers are at a marginally higher risk of physical abuse than those who live with two parents. (The father-only household is associated with two and one-third times greater risk.)"
More...
Here's how NIS-3 compared the various groups (the recently released NIS-4 has refused to break down the data by mother-headed and father-headed households)
HARM STANDARD
MALTREATMENT
Overall maltreatment is abuse and neglect combined.
Children living with their only their mothers experienced maltreatment under the Harm Standard at a rate of 26.1 per 1,000 children.
Children living with only their dads: 36.6 per 1,000.
As NIS-3 notes, "This rate is more than two and one-third times higher than that of children in two-parent families."
ABUSE
Children living with only their moms: 10.5 per 1,000.
Children living with only their dads: 17.7 per 1,000.
Here's what NIS-3 says about that: "Children in father-only families had more than twice the risk of abuse as defined by the harm standard compared to children living in both-parent families. Their risk was more than one and two-thirds that of children in mother-only families, a marginal difference in this maltreatment category. Thus, the pattern in connection with abuse essentially reflects the higher risk of children who live with only their fathers."
PHYSICAL ABUSE
Physical abuse is a subcategory under abuse.
Children living with only their moms: 6.4 per 1,000 children.
Children living with only their dads: 10.5 per 1,000 children.
Here's what NIS-3 states: "When specific types of abuse under the Harm Standard are examined, it is apparent that the findings described in the previous paragraph stem from the disproportionate incidence of physical abuse among children in father-only households....An estimated 10.5 per 1,000 children living with only their fathers were harmed by physical abuse in 1993, which is more than two and two-thirds higher than the incidence rate of 3.9 per 1,000 for children living with both their parents. Children in mother-only families were not statistically different from those in both-parent households in their risk of physical abuse under the Harm Standard."
NEGLECT
Children living with only their moms: 16.7 per 1,000 children.
Children living with only their dads: 21.9 per 1,000 children.
EMOTIONAL NEGLECT
Emotional neglect is one of the subcategories under neglect.
Children living with only their moms: 3.4 per 1,000 children.
Children living with only their fathers: 8.8 per 1,000 children.
SEVERITY OF INJURIES
The data was said to be statisically unreliable for Fatalities, so let's turn to Serious Injuries.
Children living with only their moms: 10.0 per 1,000 children.
Children living with only their dads: 14.0 per 1,000.
And Moderate Injuries?
Children living with only their moms: 14.7 per 1,000 children.
Children living with only their dads: 20.5 per 1,000.
ENDANGERMENT STANDARD
MALTREATMENT
All maltreatment (abuse and neglect) for children living with only their moms: 50.1 per 1,000 children.
For children living with only their dads: 65.6 per 1,000.
ABUSE
All abuse for children living with only their moms: 18.1 per 1,000 children.
For children living only with their dads: 31.0 per 1,000.
PHYSICAL ABUSE
Physical abuse for children living with only their moms: 9.8 per 1,000 children.
For children living with only their dads: 16.5 per 1,000.
As NIS-3 concludes, "Similar to the pattern described above in relation to Harm standard physical abuse, children who live with only their fathers are at a marginally higher risk of physical abuse than those who live with two parents. (The father-only household is associated with two and one-third times greater risk.)"
51
48, The only people children of gay parent need to fear are folks like you.
http://www.aacap.org/cs/root/facts_for_f…
http://www.aacap.org/cs/root/facts_for_f…
55
@46...if HE was the better parent (which is typically a burden of proof men really need to make beyond any possible doubt in order to gain custody over the birth mother), then it's probably good that the mother is out of the picture. She's probably a severe drug addict or something to lose custody to a father who's not even in the same state. The courts don't just willy-nilly pass custody around.
Of course, compared to the prior ECDaMaF installment, I'd take the waterboarding over being buried alive.
Of course, compared to the prior ECDaMaF installment, I'd take the waterboarding over being buried alive.
56
@48: "What will be the effect on birthrates"?
Are you shitting me? If the birthrate went down a bit, it would be a good thing; we are already over the carrying capacity of this planet and it's only our relentless use of fossil fuels that's keeping all of us alive. So gays and lesbians don't usually have kids if they're married. Big whoop! So what if they adopt? It only means that there are fewer kids in orphanages or foster care. Not to mention, gays and lesbians make up 10% of us AT MOST. That's not much of an impact, considering that gays and lesbians who aren't allowed to marry are not too likely to have kids anyway.
But you'd rather have gays and lesbians forced into heterosexual marriages to accommodate you. Get your bitch-ass self outta here!
Are you shitting me? If the birthrate went down a bit, it would be a good thing; we are already over the carrying capacity of this planet and it's only our relentless use of fossil fuels that's keeping all of us alive. So gays and lesbians don't usually have kids if they're married. Big whoop! So what if they adopt? It only means that there are fewer kids in orphanages or foster care. Not to mention, gays and lesbians make up 10% of us AT MOST. That's not much of an impact, considering that gays and lesbians who aren't allowed to marry are not too likely to have kids anyway.
But you'd rather have gays and lesbians forced into heterosexual marriages to accommodate you. Get your bitch-ass self outta here!
58
The girl's mother was nowhere around. The father had been awarded custody by the courts the girl was sent to live with the father and his new girlfriend by rule of the court. Fix your mistake, Dan.
60
Is this to say you weren't for the war, Allegedly?
Do you hate America, Allegedly?
Do you not support our troops, Allegedly?
Do you hate America, Allegedly?
Do you not support our troops, Allegedly?
62
#55 – When parents seek full custody of a child it is usually the parent with the best attorney who wins. Gender has very little to do with it anymore. Also, abusive men will often go for full custody as a way of retaliating against the mother. What happens with many stay at home mothers who are victims of abuse is they can't afford a good lawyer and lose custody of their children. That could be the case here. Yes she could be a junkie, but it could also be that she is not and he used the child as a weapon against her. He does not seem to have much love for the child.
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