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News & ArtsWednesday, May 25, 2011
City / Chow Street Food Fight Resumes This Morning
Posted by Cienna Madrid on Wed, May 25, 2011 at 8:59 AM
In half an hour, the Seattle City Council's Built Environment committee will once again be discussing street food, specifically, innovative legislation that would create food truck zones—much like loading zones—in specific areas and allow up to two sidewalk vendors to sell food per city block face (but not within 50 feet of a restaurant's door).
- JeanineAnderson via Flickr
But city council members aren't sold on the proposal—they want to impose curfews on street food. And some business owners want to make it mandatory for food vendors to get permission before setting up stands in front of their stores, which is frankly illegal (sidewalks and streets are public right-of-ways controlled by the city, not private businesses).
Meanwhile, some restaurateurs are lobbying council members to increase the restaurant setback from 50 to 100 feet, which would cripple the proposal (sidewalk vendors are ideal for the active Pike/Pine corridor, for instance, but city blocks are between 200 and 300 feet long in that area, so setting up a sidewalk stand 100 feet away from every food-selling business would be virtually impossible most places).
It's an interesting fight and right now, the opposition is dominating. So if you want great street food, I suggest you email council committee members and let them know.
The meeting starts at 9:30 a.m. You can watch it live over here.
2
Any idea which restauranteurs are lobbying against it, so I can be sure to never eat at their establishments?
3
I sent this:
Dear Councilmembers,
As a frequent world traveler I have seen an endless series of cities that are more vibrant than Seattle. We like to talk a lot about increasing pedestrian interest but in reality this city works hard to stamp it out wherever it can. Even compared to our West Coast neighbors our downtown blocks are dull and lifeless. Compared to forty years ago, yes, Seattle is "lively", but compared to LA, San Francisco, Vancouver, or even Portland our town is gray, corporate, and uninviting.
One of the reasons is STREET FOOD. Street food is one of the great joys of urban living. I've enjoyed amazing Thai noodles on the street in Portland, fantastic roasted nuts in New York, fish and chips in Liverpool, and absolutely astonishing tacos al pastor in Mexico City. There's nothing comparable to that here, aside from some of the street fairs. Have you had a slice of Veraci pizza at the Fremont Sunday Market? THAT is what city living is all about.
The most exciting trend in Seattle in the past decade has been the advent of taco trucks. My wife and I gladly drive all the way down to Burien or up to Shoreline to seek out new ones. This is some of the best food in the city, and more than that IT IS A KEY METHOD OF ENTRY INTO THE ECONOMY FOR POOR IMMIGRANTS. Unless you are happy seeing Seattle ossify into a bedroom community for rich white people like yourselves, who drive back and forth to their suburban campus jobs, you need to do everything you can to inject life and culture into Seattle.
I encourage you to pass the most liberal street food ordinance you can come up with. Go ahead, block the sidewalks! Busy sidewalks are GOOD for cities (see the work of William Whyte on this subject). Simplify the permit process.
And especially NO CURFEW. I'm in bed most nights by 9:30, so I don't care, but there is no reason on earth why food cart vendors themselves can't decide when a good time to shut up shop is. Late night food is a world tradition, and will actually work to pacify sometimes unruly bar crowds late at night.
Do the decent thing. Say yes to street food.
--
Fnarf
(Steve Thornton)
More...
Dear Councilmembers,
As a frequent world traveler I have seen an endless series of cities that are more vibrant than Seattle. We like to talk a lot about increasing pedestrian interest but in reality this city works hard to stamp it out wherever it can. Even compared to our West Coast neighbors our downtown blocks are dull and lifeless. Compared to forty years ago, yes, Seattle is "lively", but compared to LA, San Francisco, Vancouver, or even Portland our town is gray, corporate, and uninviting.
One of the reasons is STREET FOOD. Street food is one of the great joys of urban living. I've enjoyed amazing Thai noodles on the street in Portland, fantastic roasted nuts in New York, fish and chips in Liverpool, and absolutely astonishing tacos al pastor in Mexico City. There's nothing comparable to that here, aside from some of the street fairs. Have you had a slice of Veraci pizza at the Fremont Sunday Market? THAT is what city living is all about.
The most exciting trend in Seattle in the past decade has been the advent of taco trucks. My wife and I gladly drive all the way down to Burien or up to Shoreline to seek out new ones. This is some of the best food in the city, and more than that IT IS A KEY METHOD OF ENTRY INTO THE ECONOMY FOR POOR IMMIGRANTS. Unless you are happy seeing Seattle ossify into a bedroom community for rich white people like yourselves, who drive back and forth to their suburban campus jobs, you need to do everything you can to inject life and culture into Seattle.
I encourage you to pass the most liberal street food ordinance you can come up with. Go ahead, block the sidewalks! Busy sidewalks are GOOD for cities (see the work of William Whyte on this subject). Simplify the permit process.
And especially NO CURFEW. I'm in bed most nights by 9:30, so I don't care, but there is no reason on earth why food cart vendors themselves can't decide when a good time to shut up shop is. Late night food is a world tradition, and will actually work to pacify sometimes unruly bar crowds late at night.
Do the decent thing. Say yes to street food.
--
Fnarf
(Steve Thornton)
4
Only problem I have with food trucks.
#1) If they dont offer hot water or cold ice, DO NOT BUY! If they cant keep foods hot or cold, then you might as well eat hotdogs made from rat meat in Somalia.
#2) Instead of seeing trash from fast food places 1-2 blocks from the establishment, we'll see trash from these food trucks at random locations.
#1) If they dont offer hot water or cold ice, DO NOT BUY! If they cant keep foods hot or cold, then you might as well eat hotdogs made from rat meat in Somalia.
#2) Instead of seeing trash from fast food places 1-2 blocks from the establishment, we'll see trash from these food trucks at random locations.
5
Curious - what other US cities allow food to be cooked and sold on public streets in this way? Much/most of Portland's vending occurs on private lots, and I suspect that a lot of what goes on in California isn't entirely legal (San Francisco has/had hilarious contradictory restrictions on food carts).
I have seen spaces reserved for food trucks in Halifax, but they were all filled with generic lunch trucks that all seemed to be selling the same things (burgers, fried fish, poutine). That would be sad to see happen here.
I have seen spaces reserved for food trucks in Halifax, but they were all filled with generic lunch trucks that all seemed to be selling the same things (burgers, fried fish, poutine). That would be sad to see happen here.
7
On sunny days (both of them) I go up to Starbucks HQ where there is nice wide walkway in front (and ample free parking) that has tables, chairs, and several "street food" trucks.
To me, that's the perfect way to do it. If they want street food, then select an appropriate European style plaza where they can put seating. Have it be in a place where standard restaurants are distant, so it's not pulling any business from them. And have the vendors congregate say at the edges, so people can see the selection, and take their food back to their chairs. Maybe even set up a tent on the 98% rainy days.
Really, just take a bus Starbucks headquarters and eat there and forget about all the red tap.
To me, that's the perfect way to do it. If they want street food, then select an appropriate European style plaza where they can put seating. Have it be in a place where standard restaurants are distant, so it's not pulling any business from them. And have the vendors congregate say at the edges, so people can see the selection, and take their food back to their chairs. Maybe even set up a tent on the 98% rainy days.
Really, just take a bus Starbucks headquarters and eat there and forget about all the red tap.
8
One concern is that every food truck is counting on parking on Pike/Pine between Broadway and 12th on the nice weekends. Not exactly the most under-served blocks in the city. Or Ballard Ave And other strips that independent restaurants and stores have revitalized. (Hint to truck entrepreneurs: try around the South Lake Union Amazon buildings, at noontime, there's almost nothing between Subway and Tom Douglas).
Fnarf cites Mexico City and other Latin American cities, however those vendors use small propane or charcoal stoves and a table*. Same in Asia and Africa. Not the huge diesel generators standard on the 15ft+ yuppie food trucks. See today's NYTimes food section about the fabrication of them, they start at $50K and use the energy of a house. If I had created a thriving independent restaurant or business, I wouldn't want one parked in front, blowing it's exhaust inside and blocking the streetview. For just a $3500/year permit when I pay much more in rent every month? Gee, why is there some resistance from existing business owners?
These are not reasons to ban food trucks or street food, but they should be considerations. The pro-curfew argument however is horseshit, after 10 is when we need them.
*I've lived on and off for years in Mexico so I would love it if the Seattle street food was fresh traditional tamales, sopes, huraches, pozoles, or tlayudas. However I'm expecting a lot of "Korean tacos" made by people with no real link to either culture.
Fnarf cites Mexico City and other Latin American cities, however those vendors use small propane or charcoal stoves and a table*. Same in Asia and Africa. Not the huge diesel generators standard on the 15ft+ yuppie food trucks. See today's NYTimes food section about the fabrication of them, they start at $50K and use the energy of a house. If I had created a thriving independent restaurant or business, I wouldn't want one parked in front, blowing it's exhaust inside and blocking the streetview. For just a $3500/year permit when I pay much more in rent every month? Gee, why is there some resistance from existing business owners?
These are not reasons to ban food trucks or street food, but they should be considerations. The pro-curfew argument however is horseshit, after 10 is when we need them.
*I've lived on and off for years in Mexico so I would love it if the Seattle street food was fresh traditional tamales, sopes, huraches, pozoles, or tlayudas. However I'm expecting a lot of "Korean tacos" made by people with no real link to either culture.
9
Food trucks would LOVE to park near Amazon. Every truck owners have tried to find a willing lot owner near SLU and have yet to receive a positive response. We do have the option of parking illegally, like Taco El Tajin that parks on streets of Boren and Republican... ironically next to a bunch of SDOT cars that don't seem to have a clue that this is their jurisdiction to enforce. Cascade People's Center (run by City of Seattle Parks) have closed off invitation to food trucks on their lot with exception of two trucks on Mondays and Wednesdays. Yes, this is because brick and mortar establishments complained. The City listened.
There seems to be a misconception that a food truck business is significantly cheaper to operate than brick and mortar restaurants. Trucks are required to prep out of a commissary, hence paying monthly rent, AND most often time pay rent for parking to private lot owners. So really, it's not that cheap.
Truck cost: $50-200K
Commissary rent: $400-2000/month
Parking rent: $50-150/day
General liability insurance: $1500-2000/yr
Vehicle insurance and licences: $3000-5000/yr
Gas and propane (vehicle, generator and cooking): $100-200/week
This is just some of the basic operational cost, and does not include hired labor, food costs, licenses and taxes (which cost the same for mobile or brick and mortar). Food trucks also serve food out of compostable ware, adding more cost than say... real plates and silverware.
Hopefully the public understands that food trucks are not in existence to take away business from restaurants. We're here to offer delicious diversity; and serve in areas where there's a disproportionate ratio of food needs vs food served.
There seems to be a misconception that a food truck business is significantly cheaper to operate than brick and mortar restaurants. Trucks are required to prep out of a commissary, hence paying monthly rent, AND most often time pay rent for parking to private lot owners. So really, it's not that cheap.
Truck cost: $50-200K
Commissary rent: $400-2000/month
Parking rent: $50-150/day
General liability insurance: $1500-2000/yr
Vehicle insurance and licences: $3000-5000/yr
Gas and propane (vehicle, generator and cooking): $100-200/week
This is just some of the basic operational cost, and does not include hired labor, food costs, licenses and taxes (which cost the same for mobile or brick and mortar). Food trucks also serve food out of compostable ware, adding more cost than say... real plates and silverware.
Hopefully the public understands that food trucks are not in existence to take away business from restaurants. We're here to offer delicious diversity; and serve in areas where there's a disproportionate ratio of food needs vs food served.
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