Slog
News & ArtsTuesday, September 27, 2011
Transportation / Politics Eyman's Anti-Tolling I-1125 Gains Ground as Voters Lose Grip on Reality
Posted by Goldy on Tue, Sep 27, 2011 at 4:59 PM
According to the latest Elway Poll, initiative whore Tim Eyman's I-1125 is gaining ground, with 56 percent of respondents now saying they would vote for it, up from 49 percent a month ago. I-1125 would prohibit variable rate tolling, require revenues only go to the corridor tolled, and bar Sound Transit's East Link light rail from crossing the I-90 bridge.
Okay. Fine. No doubt many voters statewide fully understand this as another "Fuck Seattle" initiative, one that screws with our ability to tax or toll ourselves to pay for the infrastructure we need to prosper, but largely has no impact on them. But it also couldn't pass without at least moderate, if minority, support here in King County.
So here's my proposal: Go ahead and pass I-1125 if it makes you happy. And in return I propose that we never build another inch of new state highway anywhere in the state ever again. Not a single inch. Ever.
And no replacing crumbling roadways and bridges either. When the 520 bridge sinks, it sinks. Tear down the Viaduct and be done with it. I-405...? Wide enough as it is. As is every other state road running through all 39 counties.
Honestly, if we don't want to pay for a state highway system, then we shouldn't have one. Period. So if the rest of the state is so eager to prevent the Puget Sound from tolling ourselves to help pay for our transportation needs, then I say eliminate the state gas tax while we're at it, and not build or fix anything. I'm done with roads. So fuck if I'm going to pay for the rest of the state to maintain theirs, when they refuse to let us choose for ourselves what to do with ours.
1
It's been suggested before and worth suggesting again...King County needs to break out of Washington State.
3
Much shorter Goldy:
"Wwaaaaaaah! I hate democracy! Waaaaah!"
Maybe if so many of you Seattle Libtards werent such total smug sanctimonious pricks, there wouldn't be such a widespread "fuck Seattle" attitude.
"Wwaaaaaaah! I hate democracy! Waaaaah!"
Maybe if so many of you Seattle Libtards werent such total smug sanctimonious pricks, there wouldn't be such a widespread "fuck Seattle" attitude.
4
@2 Seconded.
The real reason The Stranger is against I-1125? The war on cars. They think tolling will get people out of their cars and into their already-jam-packed bridge-crossing buses. In reality, this is just putting the onus on the workers who live in Seattle.
Also, The Stranger thinks that anybody who commutes already makes enough money to pay the toll at rush hour. In reality, the majority of the people who make the most money either don't commute or live across the water already. And, they would not have to pay the rush hour toll as frequently.
The real reason The Stranger is against I-1125? The war on cars. They think tolling will get people out of their cars and into their already-jam-packed bridge-crossing buses. In reality, this is just putting the onus on the workers who live in Seattle.
Also, The Stranger thinks that anybody who commutes already makes enough money to pay the toll at rush hour. In reality, the majority of the people who make the most money either don't commute or live across the water already. And, they would not have to pay the rush hour toll as frequently.
7
Goldy's correct, if you look beyond the guise of flamboyant language. I think the more important question is how to effectively defeat this silly initiative.
How many voters have actually ridden -- nay, relied -- on light rail? It would be great for them to see the safety, convenience, cleanliness and pleasure that it offers. King County doesn't offer it, but other places do. And people are ecstatic about it. I'm willing to give up on the toll (even though it's a good idea). I'm not willing to give up on the mass transit.
Infrastructure should be investing in the future. Mass transit is the future.
How many voters have actually ridden -- nay, relied -- on light rail? It would be great for them to see the safety, convenience, cleanliness and pleasure that it offers. King County doesn't offer it, but other places do. And people are ecstatic about it. I'm willing to give up on the toll (even though it's a good idea). I'm not willing to give up on the mass transit.
Infrastructure should be investing in the future. Mass transit is the future.
8
Much shorter (3): "I am a Teatard pinhead whose sole purpose in life is to piss off people who pay to support my pathetic exurban lifestyle and then whine about having to pay for the services I use."
9
If it convinces them not to start building a tunnel they can't pay for or finish, them this would be the first and only useful thing Eyman has done.
That's not to say he wouldn't run an initiative to support the tunnel if it paid him enough to spare him from getting a real job.
That's not to say he wouldn't run an initiative to support the tunnel if it paid him enough to spare him from getting a real job.
10
Can't wait 'til Governor McKenna makes Timmy Secretary of Transportation. Then he'll make sure all transportation funding goes to roads, and all the people you see riding a bus or light rail will join your morning commute in their cars. That'll really stick it to those Seattle libtards..
11
or conversely, we toll every road and then use that money only on those roads... put up toll booths at every on and off ramp on 1-5 and 1-90, just like the new jersey/new york/mass (etc) turnpikes. It would even create some jobs!
13
@12, you're thinking of the monorail...you know, the one we voted for 117 times and voted down once, so it was cancelled...
14
@8. Nice try cutie pie.
My post at #3 was only 31 words long.
Your post at #8 is 37 words long.
Therefore, your post is NOT "much shorter" than my post.
Libtard.
My post at #3 was only 31 words long.
Your post at #8 is 37 words long.
Therefore, your post is NOT "much shorter" than my post.
Libtard.
18
Meh. Like most Eyeman initiatives, it will be found unconstitutional, or the adults will find a way around it. In the meantime, Tim will laugh all the way to the bank, the morons will be left holding the bag, and Seattle will get what it wants, because Seattle always gets what it wants. Without us, this place is Nebraska with mountains,
But once Kemper and Frank die off - and both of them already look like corpses - who will Eyeman get to bankroll his little schemes? I hope he's stashing a little something away.
But once Kemper and Frank die off - and both of them already look like corpses - who will Eyeman get to bankroll his little schemes? I hope he's stashing a little something away.
19
If you ask me "do you want to pay tolls on public roads?"--I'd answer "no, I don't." There's a lot of things, if you ask me, I'd rather not do.
But, of course, I love roads that go where I want to go...I love police departments that keep me safe...love fire departments that put out fires, etc. It shouldn't be up to asking me if I want to pay for them to have those things.
The reason we have a representative democracy is that we elect the "best" of us to represent us and our collective interest--to make the hard decisions for the betterment of all.
That's why I hate the initiative process...and why I wish we had more effective state and local governance. Make the tough decisions. Don't just sit on your hands and hope to get re-elected. Make things better, fix what's broken and be ready to make your case to the public that you've helped make the right decisions...that's what's missing in ALL politics these days.
Still...I'd rather there were non-regressive tax increases to pay for the services we need for the standard of living that we want and expect...rather than tolls. But if our elected representatives think that tolls are the way to go, I'd rather work to elect people that agree with me than simply take away their the right and responsibility we've given them to make decisions on our behalf with a cynical ploy towards our expressing our individual interests.
But, of course, I love roads that go where I want to go...I love police departments that keep me safe...love fire departments that put out fires, etc. It shouldn't be up to asking me if I want to pay for them to have those things.
The reason we have a representative democracy is that we elect the "best" of us to represent us and our collective interest--to make the hard decisions for the betterment of all.
That's why I hate the initiative process...and why I wish we had more effective state and local governance. Make the tough decisions. Don't just sit on your hands and hope to get re-elected. Make things better, fix what's broken and be ready to make your case to the public that you've helped make the right decisions...that's what's missing in ALL politics these days.
Still...I'd rather there were non-regressive tax increases to pay for the services we need for the standard of living that we want and expect...rather than tolls. But if our elected representatives think that tolls are the way to go, I'd rather work to elect people that agree with me than simply take away their the right and responsibility we've given them to make decisions on our behalf with a cynical ploy towards our expressing our individual interests.
21
I-1125 will cost taxpayers billions of dollars to design and build a dedicated light rail bridge across the lake.
Maybe Microsoft can make their new campus in South Lake Union.
Maybe Microsoft can make their new campus in South Lake Union.
23
I wonder how many I-1125 supporters just don't like tolling? The 520 toll is really poorly done, expensive all times of day, unlikely to generate the revenue projected, generally designed in a way that will just make people annoyed. I hate the 520 toll, but support a much higher gas tax. How many I-1125 supporters are similar?
24
OK, so then the fuckers don't get light rail across the lake. No skin off my teeth. Doesn't matter though, the initiative is unconstitutional.
Maybe we should have an initiative to stop initiatives.
Maybe we should have an initiative to stop initiatives.
25
How is I-1125 unconstitutional? And even if it is, who would have standing in the court?
I-1125 is bad all the way around and it needs to be defeated at the polls.
I-1125 is bad all the way around and it needs to be defeated at the polls.
26
I don't see why Seattle gets to set tolls on state thoroughfares.
Not everyone wants to go to Seattle.
In fact, more and more people simply want to get past it, but like the Troll on the Bridge, Seattle won't let people pass without paying a price.
Seattle is free to raise its parking rates and taxes sky high, as well as its commercial real estate taxes, and sales taxes and anything else that involves a person actually landing on it's squares on the monopoly board.
But why tax someone who just wants to avoid the Behemoth entirely?
27
@Supreme CroIssandwich
Oh you are so delicious, but oh so dumb.
There are no tolls in Seattle. The mayor has fought long and hard against tolls. He does not wish for Your Deliciousness to drive, but to enjoy transit.
Tolling currently only occurs in Tacoma and Renton.
Oh you are so delicious, but oh so dumb.
There are no tolls in Seattle. The mayor has fought long and hard against tolls. He does not wish for Your Deliciousness to drive, but to enjoy transit.
Tolling currently only occurs in Tacoma and Renton.
28
I agree wholeheartedly with The Dear Leader. I think I-5 should be re-routed through the eastside, from Southcenter to Alderwood, with twelve glorious lanes in both directions. That which is currently known as I-5 through Seattle should be largely demolished and redeveloped into workforce housing.
Actually, I rather do like that idea. Seriously, I-5 really screwed up downtown. Let all that crap run through the eastside. They love that sort of thing.
Actually, I rather do like that idea. Seriously, I-5 really screwed up downtown. Let all that crap run through the eastside. They love that sort of thing.
29
@26 in the rest of the country that isn't King County or the far western cities on the water, and is Very Sane, you routinely pay tolls when crossing bridges in cities. Been that way 100+ years in nearly each major eastern city.
31
The 520 project should be paid for by the regular highway budget, not tolls. It's part of the state road network, and deserves to be funded as such. Without 520, the entire region slows to a crawl - just look what happens when it's closed on occasional weekends for maintenance. Now imagine what it would be like during the week with no 520.
Do rural counties pay for their own state highways, or are they subsidized by gas taxes from larger counties?
Do rural counties pay for their own state highways, or are they subsidized by gas taxes from larger counties?
32
How can SLOG be against tolls when it comes to the viaduct tunnel, but be for tolls on everything else? Seriously, a few months ago, you were so close to endorsing Tim Eyman's plan.
Even if it passes, the state will strike it down. Eyman doesnt need a state constitutional lawyer to check the facts as it doesnt matter, he gets paid if it passes or fails, thats his sole job right now.
Even if it passes, the state will strike it down. Eyman doesnt need a state constitutional lawyer to check the facts as it doesnt matter, he gets paid if it passes or fails, thats his sole job right now.
33
Hey, wanna know where to get money to keep roads repaired? The gas tax!
Yeah, I know, too bad we're only spending pennies on the dollar from what we collect in gas taxes to actually fix roads instead of spending it on bike lanes used by 3% of the population or repainting lane markers rather than fixing chuck holes the size of hot tubs.
We're already paying how much in gas taxes every year, how about if we start putting 100% of that money into maintaining the roads?
Yeah, I know, too bad we're only spending pennies on the dollar from what we collect in gas taxes to actually fix roads instead of spending it on bike lanes used by 3% of the population or repainting lane markers rather than fixing chuck holes the size of hot tubs.
We're already paying how much in gas taxes every year, how about if we start putting 100% of that money into maintaining the roads?
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