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Thursday, January 19, 2012

SL Letter of the Day: Frustrated Sex Columnist

Posted by on Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 4:56 PM

My boyfriend and I have been together for 5 years and we are perfect for each other and we have plans to get married. Our relationship is perfect except for the fact that we don't have sex as much as I would like to. I am a sexual person and have always been, but my boyfriend is the opposite. He has a very low sex drive so he is perfectly happy with having sex once a week if that. I could live with two but would prefer more. When we do have sex it's amazing! I love him so much and he is everything I want in a guy but this one problem is a big one. My self esteem is greatly affected by this and I am way too nervous to initiate sex because I always get rejected, which always ends up with us getting into a huge fight. When he does want to have sex it is always planned and never spontaneous. Since we don't have sex that much it's always over quickly so I try to prolong foreplay which gets too routine. We have talked about this so many times and he says that when he says no to sex I get upset and that makes sex a huge deal which makes it feel like a chore for him. I understand what he means but I would be happy if once in awhile he would go with it when I am coming on to him. One of the problems that could be holding us back is the fact that I live with my parents, so we always have to be quite, which is never fun. We try to have sex as often as we can when my parents are not home but that rarely happens. Do you have any advise for me? Thank you!

Very Frustrated Girlfriend

My response after the jump...

···············

I fucking hate this question.

And I get it all the time... and I've answered it a million times... and I've sworn off answering it again. But I want to blog/tweet/watch the GOP debate tonight so I told myself to just respond to the first SL letter that I opened to get the SLLOTD out of the way... and yours is it, VFG.

So here goes:

Don't marry this motherfucker. You're not "perfect for each other." Far from it. He's making you miserable. And it won't get better, VFG, no matter how much you work at it. It's only going to get worse and sooner or later you'll cheat on his on ass and then you'll be the villain in the piece divorce. And the longer you stay with him the more damage his constant rejection—to say nothing of his efforts to blame and shame you for having a perfectly average sex drive—will do to your self-esteem. Stay with him long enough and his bullshit will destroy your self-esteem.

Face facts, VFG: you're not sexually compatible. And, yes, sexual compatibility is a big part of a (presumably) sexually-exclusive relationship. However perfect he is for you in other ways... he's not the right guy for you because SEX. And when you're selecting a sex partner for life, sex and sexual incompatibility are (or should be) deal breakers.

DTMFA and ATMFTOMOOYPH. ("Move the motherfucker to move out of your parents' house.") There are 3.5 billion other men on the planet, VFG, so it's not like you don't have options.

 

Comments (86) RSS

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emma's bee 1
VFG: I'm kind of sorry to have to agree with Dan on this one. There are many, many men out there for whom your libido would be a huge plus and turn-on. There may also be a few men out there whose libidos are cranked even higher than yours. The challenge is in deciding how close is enough to round up (or down) to "the one", as Dan frequently says. Only you can answer this for sure--and life experience can help you find that answer.

But, experience shows that these kinds of deep mis-matches early in a relationship seldom fix themselves in the long haul. Good luck.
Posted by emma's bee on January 19, 2012 at 5:05 PM · Report this
GlamB0t 2
hyperlink fail. ;)
Posted by GlamB0t on January 19, 2012 at 5:07 PM · Report this
Fifty-Two-Eighty 3
If she thinks it's bad now, just wait til after they're married. Hoo boy.
Posted by Fifty-Two-Eighty http://www.nra.org on January 19, 2012 at 5:22 PM · Report this
Canadian Nurse 4
Another possibility is move out and see if things improve when there's more flexibility to be spontaneous. I'd have a lot of trouble with my libido if I always had to be quiet and if I could never do the kinky stuff that takes more time and needs to allow for using rooms other than the bedroom.

Definitely don't marry him or commit to anything long term, though. If you aren't old enough to be out of your parents' house, you aren't old enough to be considering marriage.

I know that the economy is tough, but three people sharing a 2-bedroom apartment can be affordable and still give you the chance to figure out if there's something that works better when the constraints are missing.
Posted by Canadian Nurse on January 19, 2012 at 5:30 PM · Report this
wishicould 5
I'm pretty sure I was married to this guy. Dan's right. It gets worse. The resentment just starts piling up and then you both shut down. Then you won't even WANT to have sex with him anymore because he makes you feel so crappy about it. But you'll still want to have sex because, well, people want to have sex. It's a recipe for disaster. Get out while the gettin's good.
Posted by wishicould on January 19, 2012 at 5:34 PM · Report this
seandr 6
Stay with him and cheat. He'll never find out, and big whoop if he does.
Posted by seandr on January 19, 2012 at 5:45 PM · Report this
laterite 7
Honestly, my eyes kind of glazed over about 1/3 of the way through the letter, due to it being onelongblockoftextwithlittletonopunctuation, andbasicallysayingthesamethingoverandoveragain. She's probably hot as hell, which means she needs to stop wasting time with this dude and hop on some dicks, stat. Get to it!
Posted by laterite on January 19, 2012 at 5:47 PM · Report this
biffp 8
It's true that it's not going to get better. It's certainly not a fact that it's a huge issue in all or maybe even a majority of marriages. VFG really needs to decide if she can live with the current sexual situation forever. There is porn and vibrators.
Posted by biffp on January 19, 2012 at 5:48 PM · Report this
9
So whenever they have sex, it's always amazing... but it's also over too quickly and so the LW tries to prolong the foreplay, which gets routine?

Life is too short to be content with bad sex. Break up with him and find someone about whom you can say that the sex is always amazing without having to add so many qualifiers that, in the end, *no one* believes you're actually having good sex.
Posted by R.Taylor on January 19, 2012 at 5:51 PM · Report this
nocutename 10
@8: Porn and vibrators don't address the fact that she's being rejected again and again. They won't make it okay. VFG, break up, and find someone who makes you feel beautiful, sexy, and desirable.
Posted by nocutename on January 19, 2012 at 5:51 PM · Report this
11
Do not marry this man, VFG. Imagine how you're going to feel when once a week sex turns into once a month sex.

It has nothing to do with living with your parents and needing to be quiet - fixing that is not going to fix this problem. Oh, and the fact that sex is over so quickly? It's because he's an inconsiderate lover and doesn't want to make it last for you to make you feel good: he just wants to come and get it over with. It's all about him.

With regards to him getting stressed because you get upset when he says no: try being really sweet and reassuring when he rejects you, try not even asking him for sex (for fear of hurting his little feelings). Know what that's going to get you? A boyfriend who is no longer stressed and who is no longer having sex with you.

Get out now before you waste the best years of your life on this man. Do not sign a lease with him or enter into any other financial obligations together, do not get married, and especially don't get pregnant. Ditto everything Dan said, especially about the destroyed self esteem and villianous cheating.

Syndrome 1: years of sadness and deprivation leading to bitterness and depression; syndrome 2: freedom, hope, and sooner or later a better boyfriend. You choose which sounds more appealing to you!
Posted by LiveAndLet on January 19, 2012 at 6:04 PM · Report this
treacle 12
Ok, the biggest flag I see here is that your initiation of sex turns into a fight. This is seriously bad news. A compassionate person, a person with better communication skills wouldn't escalate into a fight. If he doesn't have the personal interest and motivation to not escalate situations into an argument, then you can count on him not changing (you certainly can't change him). Can you imagine 15-30 years of that?

Another potential option is arranging an open relationship, one where you can get the sex you want without pressuring him. But it sounds like that would be a lesser -- and more complicated -- option.

So I dunno If this is helpful, but there seem to me to be 7 different compatability dimensions between people:
Sexual
Emotional
Intellectual
Spiritual
Quotidian (daily living styles/skills)
Physical
Interests

I figger that if you have four or five of those, it's wor making a go of it. Although some people would weight certain compatabilities more than others in making a decision.

Make of that what you will. Best of luck!
Posted by treacle on January 19, 2012 at 6:09 PM · Report this
DAVIDinKENAI 13
How much sex have you had with him in the last year? That's how much sex you'll have with him FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE! Get out now.

He could be a great guy. But he's a great guy for a low-sexed girl. Or a closeted lesbian. That's not you.

Maybe some girls with average sex drive could put up with this guy by using a vibrator a lot, but that's not you, either. This is hammering your self-esteem and both of you are resenting your current sex life more and more.

A reasonable "price of admission" is that he wears stupid-looking hats. Or doesn't put down the toilet seat. It is not reasonable to sign up for an obvious conflict which eats away at each of you and which is only going to get worse with time.
Posted by DAVIDinKENAI on January 19, 2012 at 6:10 PM · Report this
eclexia 14
Also: He's gay.
Posted by eclexia on January 19, 2012 at 6:24 PM · Report this
Foggen 15
Congratulations. You're a guy.
Posted by Foggen on January 19, 2012 at 6:26 PM · Report this
16
Of course your self esteem is affected by this: your one-and-only admits that it is a chore for him to have to have sex with you. If that's not a self-esteem killer, I don't know what is.

You seem to be fairly young. It's going to be so much easier to dump him now than to have to face the prospect of starting over in your 40's. And it's going to be so much easier to break it off with him before you get married, rather than to have to deal with a divorce. Not to mention the lifelong entanglement of having children together.

You're lucky: it's not too late to dodge this bullet. You have to be strong enough to make the right decision, to feel pain in the short term, but avoid a lot of long-term suffering.
Posted by LiveAndLet on January 19, 2012 at 6:36 PM · Report this
17
On my usual theory that I would not want to see anyone I liked or respected with either of these two, I wish they would marry tomorrow.

If forced to approach the situation from the point of view of the advantage of VFG, I'd say that the main concern should be to move out and live on her own for a bit. My hunch is that a few months of growing up will probably cure her of him, but she's so self-contradictory that I don't want to say anything about the relationship based on her word alone. She should get him to write in.
Posted by vennominon on January 19, 2012 at 6:47 PM · Report this
Supreme Ruler Of The Universe 18

First of all, I have a brand new theory on the female orgasm. I totally disagree with the whole theory of the man having to work her up, and then satisfy her with hours of lovemaking.

Girls who are truly sexy get off right away...in fact, it occurs on penetration. Most of time, girls who are really sexed up cum at the beginning of sex and then stay with it as long as the guy wants to, even giving him oral if he can't blow his load.

So, really in this case, I think it's the girl that has the "problem" if she can't ever be satisfied. I think she's making up reasons to leave the person, and if you asked him about it, I imagine we'd get a different story.

But then, females do this a lot. They can't actually be just like guys and say that they want to leave for whatever reason, so they make up some convoluted story to justify what they would do anyway.

That's just the way it is...now and forever.
Posted by Supreme Ruler Of The Universe http://www.you-read-it-here-first.com on January 19, 2012 at 6:52 PM · Report this
19
A guy who would rather fight than have sex? Time to find one of the many horndog average males who would be psyched to find out that his gf has a healthy libido. Most guys would consider a sexed-up girlfriend to be a plus and not a negative. Also, once couples marry and have family obligations, bills and responsibilities, the amount of sex drops, at which point VFG will remember the good old days of "once a week".
Posted by not a keeper on January 19, 2012 at 7:02 PM · Report this
Lance Thrustwell 20
@6 - Seandr - You're a refreshingly evil presence on SLOG. Don't ever change.

Posted by Lance Thrustwell on January 19, 2012 at 7:17 PM · Report this
Alanmt 21
Neither one of them sounds GGG. If she can't take no for an answer without freaking out, she has some growing up to do. But Dan is right: bottom line is sexual incapatability with nor reasonable way to fix it.

DTMFA!

And that advice is for each of them.
Posted by Alanmt on January 19, 2012 at 7:20 PM · Report this
22
Does anyone else get the sense that she is 16 or so years old? The style of writing, "plans to get married" (but not saying "engaged"), the idea of having sex when the parents are out of town, the "great" sex but it being over too fast and foreplay being a chore. Maybe a young adult but it sounds really, really young. The advice remains the same but I'd probably stress (even as someone who did marry a HS sweetheart (and remain married more than 2 decades later)) that planning to get married at her presumed age should be put on hold for a while.
Posted by From the South (as in CA) on January 19, 2012 at 8:11 PM · Report this
Eva Hopkins 23
Letter writer: Advice #1: Take a basic English composition course, so you can master the fine art of punctuation & paragraph structure, get a better job so you can afford to not live w/ your parents, & ask for "advice" not "advise". I've no idea how old you are but as other readers have commented, you sound about 16.

#2 - Your guy: What is your BF's living situation, that you always have to have quiet sex at your parent's place? A destructive cycle has begun - sex is already an issue here, & you already feel weird for asking for it & you feel rejection when you don't get it. I dunno what else your mate brings to the table, but this sounds like a relationship doomed to fail. His rejection of you indicates lack of regard for your happiness. Surely you can do better.
Posted by Eva Hopkins http://www.lunamusestudios.com on January 19, 2012 at 8:28 PM · Report this
Helenka (also a Canuck) 24
@22
Yup, she does sound 16. Would that put her in the middle of the ::shudders:: Twilight Generation? In any case, her run-on description of her oh-so-dreamily-perfect-except-for-this-one-teensy-problem relationship is an incitement to nausea.
Posted by Helenka (also a Canuck) on January 19, 2012 at 8:31 PM · Report this
25
and indeed, it is 'quiet' not 'quite'. Just because that's really fucking annoying. Even yahoo or hotmail has spell check, UTMFA.

Dear Dan, please ban this question for the entire month of February. Please. As a special happy birthday to me gift. You should no longer answer this question, because not one person appears to be able to apply the response to their very own identical situation. SO fuck them, no sex advice for them. Please.
Posted by catballou on January 19, 2012 at 8:52 PM · Report this
26
@25, to be fair, quite/quiet and advise/advice won't trigger spellcheck.

I agree that reading that was annoying. To community college with you, LW!
Posted by clashfan on January 19, 2012 at 9:15 PM · Report this
seatackled 27
@22, 24

Yeah, she comes across as very young. It seems like they started dating her freshman year of high school and she's 19 or thereabouts.
Posted by seatackled on January 19, 2012 at 9:28 PM · Report this
seandr 28
@20: Evil?

If I'm advocating adultery, it's entirely out of my concern for the common good. Imagine what an interesting world this would be if we dropped all the pretense and agreed that we were all entitled to get a little on the side, be it on the sneak or otherwise.
Posted by seandr on January 19, 2012 at 9:53 PM · Report this
29
Yeah I get tired of this one too and it ain't even my job. My sex drive is not as high as my bf's but if I realize it has been 3 or 4 days I say too myself gee, I better go stick my hand down his pants. Not because I'm particularly horny but BECAUSE I LOVE HIM and I want him to be happy and feel satisfied. And plus it's not like I'm scrubbing the toilet, it feels good and can very easily take like 30 minutes out of my life.
And @18: Nice trolling, I was ALMOST inspired to rebut. Keep working on it!
Posted by chi_type on January 19, 2012 at 10:04 PM · Report this
30
Take it from a man who married into the same sort of mess, even though "we were perfect for each other in every other way." Run! Run away fast. Do not look back. Do not come back no matter how he claims he will change. You will never be satisfied with porn, dildos, or whatever if you want sex with a warm, living human being like the vast majority of us do. Then you will, sooner or later, find yourself "cheating" on this piece of work. Actually, you will have cheated yourself of a sex life and a true partner well before you cheat. There a plenty of women who feel the same as he does. I know. I married one. Stayed married for over 20 years, but that cold-hearted selfishness, and the insinuations that I was sexual perv because I liked sex more than once a decade, spread to every part of the marriage. I began to feel as cold toward her and then reached the point that I would not have fucked her had she paid me.

Leave him!
Posted by but4u on January 19, 2012 at 10:16 PM · Report this
31
Agree with @21. She should dump the guy because of their incompatibility, but I don't think anything in her letter indicates that he's "blaming or shaming" her for having a "perfectly average sex drive". She says they often fight when she tries to initiate sex and he's not in the mood, but the fights stem from her feeling rejected and becoming upset with him. It sounds like she's taking his lower sex drive very personally and guilt tripping him about it. I'd give the boyfriend the same advice: DTMFA.
Posted by Amanda on January 19, 2012 at 10:33 PM · Report this
32
@31 - I agree with that take. And if she's as young as I think she is, no harm no foul. One reason to date and experience different people is to figure out the types with which you match well. Her error is thinking they are "perfect for each other" and "have plans to get married." They are not perfect for each other. They probably had a good BF/GF relationship before they became sexually active. And now she likes it, he doesn't as much (is it possible because he feels inadequate (like a lot of teenage boys)). And that's fine. He may grow to like it, to feel better about it. And she may find someone NOW (or soon) who is more sexually compatible with her. So they should break up ("DTMFA" seems overly harsh terminology in this case), deal with 5th period English, and experience the rest of senior year with another boyfriend.
Posted by From the South (as in CA) on January 19, 2012 at 10:48 PM · Report this
33
I was married to a guy with a lower sex drive than mine and it only go worse as the marriage progressed. I always thought we were having "fabulous sex". But then we got divorced and I went through a phase I affectionate refer to as a "manpage" where I went out and fucked as many hot guys as I could, and it turned out that the "fabulous sex" I was having with my husband wasn't so fabulous. I would now rank it as average.

What the LW describes as "awesome sex" doesn't sound that awesome to me. Get out now and go out there and find out what actual awesome sex really feels like. Just be safe about it.
Posted by SherBee on January 19, 2012 at 10:50 PM · Report this
34
ATMFTOMOOYPH should be MTMFTMOOYPH, I think. Hard to keep track of all those m's and o's.

Like Eva @23 I'm curious where this guy is living (with his other girlfriend? with his boyfriend?) that means they can't have sex there instead of her parents' house.

Other than that, I got nothing. Everyone's right. Except seandr and SROTU, of course :-)
Posted by EricaP on January 19, 2012 at 11:28 PM · Report this
balderdash 35
Yeah, stick a fork in this situation. It's done.

Both of you move out of your damn parents' house. To separate places.
Posted by balderdash http://introverse.blogspot.com on January 20, 2012 at 12:30 AM · Report this
36
VFG,

First, your boyfriend should get an apartment of his own. See what effect being on his own turf has on his libido, keeping in mind it is his turf. You have to follow his rules about when you can come over. This is an exercise in building his self confidence and self reliance. Being stuck in my in-laws place, before they were my in-laws, was a total non-starter for sex (quiet or otherwise). See what happens on neutral ground, and then work your way up to "the new normal"; sex without sound effects just feels wrong once you can let it out when you want to.

Peace.
Posted by Married in MA on January 20, 2012 at 3:47 AM · Report this
37
Maybe it was edited out or I'm skimming since I'm busy but I didn't see anything about either of them being against an open relationship.

Finding a life partner you're compatible with on things OTHER than sex is not easy either -- so if he really is perfect except for sex, the open route is the no brainer.
Posted by delta35 on January 20, 2012 at 6:19 AM · Report this
Canadian Nurse 38
@37: The open route would be a no brainer if she didn't take his lack of libido so personally. If she sees his lack of libido as rejection, she'll eventually fall in love with someone who never rejects her.
Posted by Canadian Nurse on January 20, 2012 at 6:32 AM · Report this
39
Dan, how about featuring a big fat "Mismatched Sex Drives? Click Here!" link to an archive of the many, many, answers you've given to the many, many variations on this question? That way the many, many people with this problem can get advice without driving you insane. Win win!
Posted by Evn on January 20, 2012 at 6:49 AM · Report this
40
A partner with a lower libido who faces that difference and tries to make this as good as (s)he can is worth keeping, at least for a while.

A partner with a lower libido who makes you feel bad because of it deserves nothing, even consideration. Walk.
Posted by seeker6079 on January 20, 2012 at 6:51 AM · Report this
41
@39 - definitely win.
Posted by seeker6079 on January 20, 2012 at 6:56 AM · Report this
starsandgarters 42
I'm disappointed that Dan and other commenters think it's so easy for a person to move out of their parents' house. Do you think they're living there by choice? The economy sucks. Lots of college grads have had to move back home. Jobs don't pay enough, if the kid even has a job to begin with. Lay off.

(And before the ad hominems start, I live in my own apartment and feel very blessed to do so, but I have a friend who has been living at home with her parents for years, hates it, and can't get out.)
Posted by starsandgarters on January 20, 2012 at 7:13 AM · Report this
43
I will confess to some (meagre) sympathy for the bf on the context. It's not always easy to respond sexually in somebody else's parents' house where you "always have to be quiet" and they're pretty much always home. Some contexts are just boner-killers, but our society treats any guy who isn't instantly priapic as somehow incomplete or dysfunctional. We (rightly) give women the proper space for feelings like "I want you but this place turns me right off", but we (wrongly) don't extend that to men.

If the only place they can have sex is a place which makes him feel like he's under observation, limp and miserable then that might be a reason why he's lashing out at her. It doesn't make him any less of a prick for doing so, but it is a potential explanation.
Posted by seeker6079 on January 20, 2012 at 7:34 AM · Report this
geoz 44
If you are going to write on Abby's desk, you are going to get quesions that Dear Abby got. And I remember her saying something similar, albeit without "hate" or "fucking" in the answer. People are often sexually incompatible, but don't feel empowered to end a relationship based on said incompatibility. Why is that? The easy answer (for me) is that sex is de-valued by our society. It is shameful. To want it, is to be bad. Is that it?? We have got to get over that.
Posted by geoz on January 20, 2012 at 7:46 AM · Report this
45
I really think that moving out on their own (separately) is not an option here. These are HS kids. I have a healthy respect for the problems of high schoolers (as I brace myself for being the parent of one next fall) - I don't want to sound dismissive of the incompatability but figure that applying some general advice (probably best to move off of him) with some adult-specific advice (move out of your parents' home) is only partially helpful.

If she is feeling rejected b/c of his lower libido, she needs to better understand that people are wired differently - it is not a personal affront if someone wants less sex than you. LW can break up with her BF and see whether the next guy matches better. And he will as well. And, maybe, if it is "meant to be", you two will find each other later and perhaps your experiences in between being together will result in better compatibility. LW - you are really different than you were 5 years ago when you started dating. And he is, too. Just step back and talk about how much you love each other and how much you want each other to be happy. And say, it is time to move on.

Good luck.
Posted by From the South (as in CA) on January 20, 2012 at 7:55 AM · Report this
46
I keep rereading this part, "But I want to blog/tweet/watch the GOP debate tonight so I told myself to just respond to the first SL letter that I opened"

Damn. Santorum should be out by the next state, and in the meantime, boy do I feel sorry for Dan
Posted by Marrena on January 20, 2012 at 7:59 AM · Report this
nocutename 47
@45 (and others):
We don't know that these are high school kids. The lw might be any age (though young seems to be pretty clear in light of the bf's living with his parents, especially in this economy, it isn't unusual for 20-somethings to live with their parents); immaturity and poor writing are no indicators of age.

She says that they've been together 5 years and plan to marry. That suggests to me that they are at the very least 19-20, and could easily be a few years older.

Not that the age they either are or aren't have much to do with the problem of mis-match and poor response to it they have.
Posted by nocutename on January 20, 2012 at 8:22 AM · Report this
48
@47: I know they could be any age. However, the tone of the letter (not just the style of writing) is very similar to the teenagers who are around me (my kid, his friends, my nieces and nephews). I add the tone to the facts that she writes and I am thinking it is more likely that she is around 16 and this is her first sexual experience than she is in her 20s and has a bit more (albeit, it seems certain she is not very experienced). Many seem to be suggesting that moving out is a possibility and my own read says that that may not be possible for either of them.

Do I know any of this? Of course not. No more than anyone else knows more than the LW includes in her letter. I am trying to be sympathetic and realistic, as others have, and taking a slightly diffferent view than you might have. Both are reasonable.
Posted by From the South (as in CA) on January 20, 2012 at 8:34 AM · Report this
49
@ 39: Brilliant idea. Please Dan, have the Tech Savvy At Youth Risk collect all the mismatched sex drive letters and podcasts in one place, so that I can send the link to all my friends who complain to me about this problem. All your letters and podcasts could have taglines on topics so that it's easy for readers and listeners to find all your sage advice over the episodes and columns.
Posted by Sally Hemings' daughter on January 20, 2012 at 8:38 AM · Report this
nocutename 50
@48:
If she's 16, that means they've been together since she was 11! How likely is that?
Posted by nocutename on January 20, 2012 at 8:46 AM · Report this
nocutename 51
@49: Great idea.
Posted by nocutename on January 20, 2012 at 8:47 AM · Report this
52
@50: I agree that it is not common in many areas but very common in others. I have HS classmates who started "dating" in 7th grade. They have been married over 20 years and are still together in their mid-40s. I had the same girlfriend, off and on, in 7th, 8th and 9th grade. I could have written that letter back then (or a version of it). Whether 16, 17, 18, 25, 35, 45 - none of us knows with certainty but the letter just strikes me as from a kid. And the general advice - drop him - applies either way. Is the additional advice that may differ depending on age, living arrangements, etc.

I will expand my sample size and say that while I know a number of teens who speak/write like the LW, I don't know many folks in their young 20s who do. Just speculating - just like everyone else here (other than those who might know the LW).
Posted by From the South (as in CA) on January 20, 2012 at 9:20 AM · Report this
53
VGF, LEARN TO SPELL! or at least proofread ...
Posted by shawnshawnshawny on January 20, 2012 at 9:42 AM · Report this
54
Dan,
Answer this letter as many times as you have to. Cut and paste the same answer, I don't care. But this happened to me -- I didn't marry the guy, but we kept breaking up and getting back together -- and it did a number on me that took years to undo and it's still kind of lingering. When she says it's messing with her self esteem, or however she put it, THAT is the big deal, and tied in with the fear of initiating anything. That's going to carry over to the next fella. It's awful awful awful. I really hope she takes your advice.
Posted by Phoebe on January 20, 2012 at 9:48 AM · Report this
55
Also, learn to spell "quiet" correctly.
Posted by truthspeaker on January 20, 2012 at 9:48 AM · Report this
56
Once a week now will be once every two weeks soon, then once a month, and then who the fuck knows. And no, living with your parents is not the problem. If he wants to fuck you, he'll find a way to fuck you, whether people are around or not.

Dan's right. Both of you need to accept that you're not perfect and not compatible before you get married, buy a house, have kids, etc.
Posted by eddence on January 20, 2012 at 9:55 AM · Report this
57
VFG, I used to be you! Don't marry him! I was in a relationship with a man with a very low sex drive for almost 4 years. It was miserable!! He was a good man in other ways (& in fact, we are still friends), but I was so unhappy, I seriously had thoughts of suicide. How nuts is that?!? I left him & started looking & within just over a year, I met my 5th husband! We just got married a few weeks ago, the sex is AWESOME, & (almost) every day! Unless sex is not important to you, which clearly it is since you are unhappy & fighting over this issue; this situation is hopeless. Get out now!!!
Posted by Michaelann_D on January 20, 2012 at 10:00 AM · Report this
undead ayn rand 58
@42: "I'm disappointed that Dan and other commenters think it's so easy for a person to move out of their parents' house. Do you think they're living there by choice?"

If it's potentially ruining your relationship, you need to decide what's more important to you.

You're missing the point here.
Posted by undead ayn rand on January 20, 2012 at 10:03 AM · Report this
btmom 59
I'm in a relationship myself where we have so much more in common than most other couples we know, but our libidos are totally mismatched. I'm really frustrated and feel rejected, yet I know he loves me and that in most other respects, we have a better marriage than the majority of couples. We've been married for over 20 years. He had a libido once but even then, he was an underachiever as a lover. Not very good at it and too uptight to have an open conversation about each other's likes and dislikes, or trying new things. Hell, he seemed to be grossed out by touching me below the waist. So I'm not interested in divorce, but I really think I'd like to broach the subject of opening our marriage, since he's refusing to meet my needs. Dumping him was never an option. Sometimes you have to look at other solutions. I'm just trying to work up the courage.
Posted by btmom on January 20, 2012 at 10:07 AM · Report this
60
Good luck, btmom.
Posted by LiveAndLet on January 20, 2012 at 10:28 AM · Report this
BedlamBabe 61
This letter is so full of contradictions it hurts. "When we do have sex it's amazing!" then "Since we don't have sex that much it's always over quickly" or "we are perfect for each other" vs "I always get rejected" and "we always have to be quite[sic], which is never fun"
She specifically said -she- lives with her parents, so where does he live? Why do they never have sex at his place? And what in the name of Freyja is she getting out of the relationship? No satisfaction, low self-esteem, fights…

Also #18 is a loony. Silly troll.
Posted by BedlamBabe on January 20, 2012 at 10:31 AM · Report this
Lose-Lose 62
Regarding @6, horrible advice. IF you get married (sigh) AND you cheat, you will definitely find someone who IS perfect, ie nice guy with compatible sex drive. Then you'll have to get a divorce and BOY won't that be fun!

Don't do it. Listen to Dan and everyone else. Better yet, go out and have a fling now, before you're married. It'll be easy for you to find a nice guy who's also horny. And then you'll know what a mistake you've been making.
Posted by Lose-Lose on January 20, 2012 at 10:38 AM · Report this
63
Step #1: have testosterone levels checked. low libido is often a symptom of low t in males (and females)
Step #2: do the things that can increase testosterone. this often leads to increased horniness
Posted by sunbear on January 20, 2012 at 10:39 AM · Report this
64
Step #1: have testosterone levels checked. low libido is often a symptom of low t in males (and females)
Step #2: do the things that can increase testosterone. this often leads to increased horniness
Posted by sunbear on January 20, 2012 at 10:43 AM · Report this
65
I used to be so down on Dan's dtmfa answers. But, to be honest he's right on and after 11 years of marriage to a frigid, sarcastic low sex drive female, I'm totally on board. Everybody settles just don't settle for a pile of poop. I'm so happy to be getting my divorce. At least the person who supposedly loved me can't continuously reject me anymore. I only wish that I would have listened to Dan years ago and had the balls to DTMFA then.
Posted by jaansdornea on January 20, 2012 at 11:05 AM · Report this
66
@59, do you think it's possible he's gay? Or asexual... "grossed out by touching me below the waist" seems very revealing. What has stopped you from asking about opening up the marriage? Does he also read Dan Savage?
Posted by EricaP on January 20, 2012 at 11:09 AM · Report this
67
What about when you used to have a good sex life but your partner is struggling with depression? Admittedly I've always had a higher sex drive, but ever since my partner suffered a loss about a year ago, there has been a struggle with depression and we've only had sex a handful of times. We've talked about it but nothing seems to get resolved, and she'll use pretty much anything as an excuse to not have sex.
Posted by BrianCHG on January 20, 2012 at 11:23 AM · Report this
BEG 68
Given the list of issues you cite, you cannot possibly be having "fantastic sex" with him. That's not fantastic sex. Dump him, and keep looking.
Posted by BEG http://twitter.com/#!/browneyedgirl65 on January 20, 2012 at 11:52 AM · Report this
69
Thanks to those who've pointed out what I was thinking--it sounds like she might be the one turning the rejection into a fight. My boyfriend wants sex SLIGHTLY more often than I do; if he got pissy every time I said "not tonight," I'd want sex less and less.
Posted by Belle Starr on January 20, 2012 at 12:49 PM · Report this
undead ayn rand 70
@68: "Given the list of issues you cite, you cannot possibly be having "fantastic sex" with him. That's not fantastic sex. Dump him, and keep looking."

Note that she doesn't mention how many OTHER people she's had sex with. I doubt she's got much to compare this to.
Posted by undead ayn rand on January 20, 2012 at 1:01 PM · Report this
71
swts
Posted by In my head on January 20, 2012 at 1:58 PM · Report this
72
Yes don't do it! I'm in that marriage. 14 years of it. I got pregnant early on (yes I was careful but nothing is 100%) I didn't have time to find this out. We are so incompatible when I asked about 9 years ago to be tied up, he said yes and I am still waiting. I just sort myself out while he sleeps, hope one day he will wake up and give me a hand.
Weird thing is though he cheats on me (but appears to be an ego rather than sex thing and in a way the sex part turns me on, the lies however don't)! He doesn't see if he talked dirty to me like he did to other girls occasionally I'd be a happier person. Oh the things we could do if he'd even talk about sex, but it's like getting blood out of stone. Apparently he likes what I like and he has no fantasies of his own and doesn't want to hear mine. I'm so jealous of friends who complain they are pestered for sex, their husbands buy sex toys or look at porn. I'd kill for a life like that.
By the time I can afford to leave him I'll be too old to do all the naughty things I wanted to do. I'm in therapy, no self esteem left at all now. Hardest bit is having nobody I can be myself with, my sex life is a secret world in my head.
Posted by In my head on January 20, 2012 at 2:21 PM · Report this
73
I was in the same exact situation and I ended up breaking up with my boyfriend of 9 years. It was hard, but in the end it was the right thing to do. I never had low self-esteem until I was repeatedly rejected by him. We are still friends and I wish it could have worked out, but if she marries him she will continue to be incredibly unhappy.

The only other thing I would suggest is to see a couples therapist to try to work it out. It's really easy to get into the same argument again and again, and maybe a therapist will get her boyfriend to see the error of his ways. I might have stayed with my ex if he at least pleasured me in other ways when he didn't want to have sex, but as it was, our arguments were too explosive to even have considered it at the time.

We've talked about it since and he can't really pin down why he was so sexually disinterested, except to say that we had other problems that we were ignoring (ignorance is bliss!) and maybe if we had worked on those it would have brought us closer and he would have wanted sex more.
Posted by My Name Here on January 20, 2012 at 3:10 PM · Report this
74
@72, have you discussed his decision to have sex with other women? Does that mean you're entitled to have sex with other men? It seems like that would be a reasonable expectation, and then you might find someone who will let you be your fully sexual self.
Posted by EricaP on January 20, 2012 at 3:33 PM · Report this
undead ayn rand 75
@72: Eek. That's not an issue of libido, though. Sounds like his libido's is "working" just fine when he cheats.
Posted by undead ayn rand on January 20, 2012 at 3:44 PM · Report this
76
Learn the difference between "affect" and "effect."
Posted by My Name Here on January 20, 2012 at 6:59 PM · Report this
77
I disagree on this one. It sounds like the problem is living with the parents! ick!! they should try living WITHOUT the parents for a few months and see if the sex life improves.
Posted by little_kitten on January 20, 2012 at 8:42 PM · Report this
78
With all you people who said that maybe they should move out of the parents' house: I've stayed in parents' houses and had good sex, and when I haven't been comfortable with having sex in the house (for example, when I was a teenager), there are these wonderful things that most households have called "cars" that one can drive to a secluded spot and have sex inside. If he wanted to fuck her more often, they'd find a way.
Posted by alguna_rubia on January 22, 2012 at 1:35 PM · Report this
julie russell 79
It MIGHT get better...odds are it won't, but it could. Had this same problem w/ my hubby and it did get better. MUCH better. BUT it required me taking a serious look at WHY it wasn't working.

Took a lot of work, which kinda goes against the whole idea that chemistry is either there or it isn't, but the work paid off. At least for us.
Posted by julie russell http:// on January 22, 2012 at 2:02 PM · Report this
80
I did marry the guy, 23 years years and 4 kids ago, and it did get worse. I also did the work to figure out why and improve things as much as possible, but at the end of the day, different drives are different drives. We had to open things up in order for me to stay and not cheat. So far, so good. I am officially an Ethical Slut.
Posted by curiouser on January 22, 2012 at 2:58 PM · Report this
81
Yes. I've totally been there and done that. Dan's absolutely right. HOWEVER- it can be really really hard to leave someone in a relationship like this. It's hard to leave a wonderful guy who loves you and is kind and generous and caring- just for the sex. Sure- sex is a very good reason to leave- just just hard to do.
Posted by takomama on January 23, 2012 at 4:04 PM · Report this
82
I think she needs to help with his chores around the house. She should give him a massage now and then, without expecting any sex. Really listen to his concerns, and not pester him all the time for sex. If it becomes one more chore for him to address her needs, he will really shut down.

Only after she curbs her appetites may his come back up. But right now, she must stop her need for sex and focus on him. Because his lack of libido is her fault.

At least, that is what you guys say when a man writes these letters...>=p
Posted by A man's low libido=a woman not doing it right on January 23, 2012 at 5:34 PM · Report this
83
I have to be one of the lone dissenters here - with a very different kind of "It Gets Better" message.
First, is the boyfriend on antidepressants or another type of medication that could be affecting his libido? Or, perhaps he should get a complete physical to rule out that there are no other physical causes.
I am speaking from experience. I have been with my husband for 15 years - married for 9 - one kid, another on the way - and completely monogamous. From the very beginning, sex was one of the few things we argued about. I had very low libido and my husband had what I would consider to be an average sex-drive (still does). It became a very emotional issue becuase he felt rejected and I felt like I was being used if I had sex when I didn't want to. However, because we felt very well matched in almost every other aspect, we continued our relationship. Now, I think we are both lucky that we didn't consider our sex life to be a "deal-breaker." And in the back of our minds, we had an inkling that my anti-depressants were at the root of my problems. We felt sexually compatible in other areas of the bedroom - outside of frequency.
Well, for the past year or so, I've been on a new anti-depressant. All hail Cymbalta! Not only is my anxiety and depression under control, but I have a libido. And fantasies. And lost inhibitions. And the sex is better than ever! So, yes, it can get better!
Just like every other area of a relationship, you can compromise on sex, as long as you don't feel like you are compromising yourself. And if everything else is working, why throw it all away before looking for physical causes or other ways to work it out?
Posted by happywife on January 23, 2012 at 8:03 PM · Report this
84
I have to be one of the lone dissenters here - with a very different kind of "It Gets Better" message.
First, is the boyfriend on antidepressants or another type of medication that could be affecting his libido? Or, perhaps he should get a complete physical to rule out that there are no other physical causes.
I am speaking from experience. I have been with my husband for 15 years - married for 9 - one kid, another on the way - and completely monogamous. From the very beginning, sex was one of the few things we argued about. I had very low libido and my husband had what I would consider to be an average sex-drive (still does). It became a very emotional issue becuase he felt rejected and I felt like I was being used if I had sex when I didn't want to. However, because we felt very well matched in almost every other aspect, we continued our relationship. Now, I think we are both lucky that we didn't consider our sex life to be a "deal-breaker." And in the back of our minds, we had an inkling that my anti-depressants were at the root of my problems. We felt sexually compatible in other areas of the bedroom - outside of frequency.
Well, for the past year or so, I've been on a new anti-depressant. All hail Cymbalta! Not only is my anxiety and depression under control, but I have a libido. And fantasies. And lost inhibitions. And the sex is better than ever! So, yes, it can get better!
Just like every other area of a relationship, you can compromise on sex, as long as you don't feel like you are compromising yourself. And if everything else is working, why throw it all away before looking for physical causes or other ways to work it out?
Posted by happywife on January 23, 2012 at 8:05 PM · Report this
85
Now, I think we are both lucky that we didn't consider our sex life to be a "deal-breaker."


I can see how you would feel lucky. Your husband, who suffered sexual rejection for over a decade... he doesn't seem so lucky, to me.

But that opinion may have more to do with my feelings about my own sad situation, than yours.

I'm glad you guys found a solution to your problem.
Posted by LiveAndLet on January 24, 2012 at 10:41 PM · Report this
86
If you insist on staying with him, here's what you do: Tell him sex is really important to you and you'll be miserable without sex every day, so he needs to give it to you even if he doesn't "feel like it," if he actually cares about you. Him not feeling like it doesn't matter: it's something he does to please you, like a massage. Tell him you can't continue the relationship otherwise, then test him out and see if he sticks to it for the next year.

That'll show you just how much he cares about you.

Same goes if the genders are reversed. I really, really wish everyone who complains about a sexless marriage/mismatched libidos would do this. Because the real issue isn't the sex, it's the partner not giving a fuck about your happiness.
Posted by BlackRose on January 25, 2012 at 8:35 AM · Report this

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