Exactly. Blaming the messenger (Buttigieg) fits in with what Obama was referring to with 'circular firing squad'.

He's an old white man who yells at and talk over women. Therein lies his appeal to the old white men and the white women who don't like other women.

I wonder how many Hillary voters went over to Romney because they didn't like the Obama boys, the totally made up boogeymen just like her campaign made up Bernie bros.

More people went and voted Hillary than did otherwise and this is complete nonsense unless you put it in context of how many of these voters went R in previous elections along with how many just flat out abstained, voted for 3rd party or wrote in Vermin Supreme.

The people I know who did this, they wanted everyone to see how bad it could be, to advance their radical agenda. Not that I disagree with the agenda, but I can't see damning the short term and all its casualties to (maybe???) win a longer battle.

@3 Lol, yes, it was older white people who supported Bernie. Not at all younger people. No, Hillary was the candidate of the youth!

No, Hillary was the candidate that appealed to an older white audience. An audience that ultimately chose Trump over her. Because older white people are terrible and unreliable when it comes to voting Dem. Meanwhile, back in 2008 over 20% of Hillary primary supporters switched to McCain due to their fear of black men and obsession with having a woman in the White House (even if that woman is Sarah Palin). We just lucked out in 08 because young people overwhelmingly supported Obama in the general.

And just in case anyone forgot...

"Schaffner tells NPR that around 12 percent of Republican primary voters ... ended up voting for Clinton. And according to one 2008 study, around 25 percent of Clinton primary voters in that election ended up voting for Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., in the general. (In addition, the data showed 13 percent of McCain primary voters ended up voting for Obama, and 9 percent of Obama voters ended up voting for McCain"

Now, I'm just an individual who enjoys evidence supported opinions so it seems to me that a 9% change between primary support and party support in the general is pretty average when it comes to voter behavior. Then again, feels over reals, yo!

https://www.npr.org/2017/08/24/545812242/1-in-10-sanders-primary-voters-ended-up-supporting-trump-survey-finds

By the Holy Ghost's vaporous genitals, Buttigieg is a worse pick for president than Tim Caine was for VP, and half as interesting.

Lol you could have at least googled "did Sanders supporters swing the election" because this has been known for 2 years now. The answer is no.

@10: As if there's one group of voters or "thing" that swung the election.

Butty's Awesome in that he can easily/succintly point out
the so-called right's perpetually-snowballing Hypocrisy.

While Bernie's got the Youth Vote, Butty'd make a GREAT
running mate for Warren or Sanders.

I sugest a Biden Buttigieg ticket.

14,

I was going to suggest Bernie and Buttigieg. Call it the B&B ticket.

There are pretty much two wings of the progressive left. One is focused on economics, the other on identity politics. The ticket so proposed offers both. Bernie can get Faux News watches to support Medicare for All by talking to them for two minutes. Buttigieg has no skeletons in his closet, has said maybe one offensive thing his entire life, and if Bernie dies of old age while in office, Pete can run the country capably. He's also attractive enough to get Tucker Carlson horny.

The point is, such a ticket will confuse the Right. The Right will want to hate them, because it's led by a socialist and the Veep is gay, but against all their best efforts, they find the ideas of the first something even they cannot refute (as the Town Hall showed), and the manner of the second is so fundamentally harmless, so Disney Prince level of nice, that its not really possible to hate him, either. Many Trump supporters will vote for this ticket, because well... why the hell not?

@14 I hated him the moment he questioned clemency for Chelsea Manning. I'd hold my nose if he was on the ticket with Bernie but Bernie has always been the lesser of two evils to me anyhow.

@13 Right, and some people were interested in Jill Stein and Vermin Supreme. If he can offer good policy proposals and ideas then he'll be good to hear on the national stage, but unless he can bridge the gap between the Sanders/Trump go-between Obama voters that didn't show up for Hillary, then he should be taken as seriously as the aforementioned.

People don't want what the traditional Democrats have to offer. The Washington consensus is over for the voters. That's how an avowed Democratic Socialist and a dumpster fire did as well as they did the last time around. Both parties serve capital, not the people and the non rich non corporate population of this country can feel it deep in their bones (and bank accounts).

A big problem for Democrats is Millennials think traditional Democrats are the party as its has been since the mid- to late-90s.

No. Traditional Democrats (the Liberals) championed the same issues that today's so-called Socialists (a big misnomer if ever there was one) are championing.

Traditional Democrats advocated for: working Americans, social and financial equality for all, a robust social safety net, high employment and decent wages, access to a good education for all, taking care of those disadvantaged by race, age, gender, disability, being born into extreme poverty with no immediate way out, protecting the environment.

We have to stop using the term "traditional Democrat" as a pejorative and spreading the fiction that "traditional" Democrats created the American we now hate.

Traditional Democrats made this country great. It was the uber right-wing conservatives and the GOP that brainwashed and pushed the US into the morass where we now find ourselves. Meanwhile, Democrats were forced to abandon their traditional focus in order to avoid total extinction because that's what thoroughly brainwashed American voters have wanted throughout the 80s, 90s, 00s, and most of the 2010s.

Well, if you don't like the America of today, place the blame squarely on the shoulders where it belongs - the Republican Party and Ronald Reagan, the Bushes, New Gingrich, Karl Rove, Tom Delay, Mitch McConnell, Paul Ryan, and on and on, and now Donald Trump.

Thank you, Eli, and Mayor Buttigieg, for aptly pointing out what has baffled me for two and a half years now since the disastrous 2016 election. What avid Bernie supporters would so spitefully turn Trumpist when their enthusiastic Feel the Bern candidate didn't make the Democratic nomination? Voters who will never elect a woman as President of the United States, plain and simple, not matter what the irreparable damages and consequences at home and abroad, that's who. What are people so afraid of? World peace? Democracy? Equality? Embracement of cultural diversity? Fair and sustainable wages? The insanely wealthy actually paying their fair share of taxes? Women having full say-so about their bodies?

@19 Purris: Thank you. Agreed and seconded. And I do.

social media has given all of you the idea that you now have the conch. That isn't great.

@22 It's not social media, It's The Beast. And now they can't kill Piggy with sticks.

20

"Voters who will never elect a woman as President of the United States, plain and simple, not matter what the irreparable damages and consequences at home and abroad, that's who.

What are people so afraid of? World peace?"

Yes, many are, Auntie (great questions!); the status quo's all they know (imagine if you were in Iraq and had been at war for Generations and that was all you ever knew or could hope to know); they're afraid if we shake things up, it'll only get worse. With one side gunning / praying for Armegeddon, if we don't shake Hard enough, they'll be right.

I can see a woman at the Helm within two Elections.*

Look at Dick Cheney's scion, eg. Or Chelsea.
Bridget McCain and Bristle Palin! One for the Ages!
I have a lot of Great suggestions, for the right.
Well, not Chelsea.

*and I'd LOVE to see Warren in two.
Fucking Years.

22

Just think of the Damage we could do
if only we were (inheiritantly) Rich.

@15

“Bernie can get Faux News watchers to support Medicare for All by talking to them for two minutes.”

No.

“[Pete’s] also attractive enough to get Tucker Carlson horny.”

No.

Democrats shouldn’t chase non-stop Fox News viewers and Rush Limbaugh dittoheads. They’ve already made their decision (insane), and they’re too busy chanting “no collusion, no obstruction” to listen to counter arguments. Focus on the left, the center, and the politically-disaffected.

26,

Despite your admirably concise denials, both things have demonstrably occurred. Did yo7s er that Town Hall? What I said is literally true. Bernie described Medicare for All for exact.y two minutes, and ten crowd was on its feet clapping.

As for Tucker Carlson, well, he needs to come out of the closet. There’s this weird clip on social media of him describing his hunger for Pete, something about stew and chicken soup. It’s kinda scary, because I think Carlson has a cannibalism fetish or something, but he does seem to be jacking off under the desk.

You are correct that the Democratic Party has to include the Left if it is to succeed. It would be great if you could tell the liberal centrists (like Dan) to quit working themselves into apoplectic rage every time someone mentions the Green New Deal, AOC, Bernie or Kshama. However, they tend to swoon to the right and punch to the Left.