Where is it discussed or shown that the tunnel would meet any less terrifying fate in the very same earthquake?

Earthquake SCARY... Tunnel GOOD.
Am I missing something or is this two entirely different discussions?

Why no link to the video?

The evidence continues to mount about the "fix" being in on the tunnel project. This is getting out of hand.

"behooves"?

Of all the possible options, I think the deep bore tunnel actually leaves the viaduct in place the longest during construction. That means the deep bore option is actually the most likely to see a disaster strike.

It is incorrect to say that the stakeholders group recommended the tunnel option. The only bored tunnel that group actually considered was rejected because it was too expensive. Some members supported the final choice made by Governor Gregoire, but the group did not as a whole ever recommend a deep bore tunnel.

Dom, you know damn well that the stakeholders advisory group never recommended the tunnel. Has Tayloe gotten to you too?

@ 8,9) WSDOT told me that "the stakeholder group pushed back on us. There was sense that a single bore would work." I've clarified in the post. After WSDOT came back with costs for a single-bore tunnel (rather than double-bore) some members of the group supported it, but that was after the process was complete and the full group never gave the tunnel its blessing.

Mallahan will take Gregoire down with him.

Excellent.

Senator Lisa Brown for Governor, 2012!

LOL.

Like you think they aren't trying to make you vote their way for their insider-chosen elite comrades ....

Too bad it's starting to backfire.

Um, wouldn't the tunnel be affected by liquefaction as well? Instead of trapping and killing people in a double-decker freeway like the 880 in the '89 Loma Prieta quake, they'll be trapped hundreds of feet below the surface. And this would be better how?

Why does the scenario in the video start at 8:30pm? Why not 6am or 6pm? How did they select "8:30pm in summer"? For the lighting?

Wait a minute, I thought the Stranger said that this video, (like every oher fact reported by the Stranger) proves that we should vote for McGinn. How can the Stranger simultaneously claim that the video represents a WSDOT conspiracy to discredit McGinn and that the video shows that McGinn was right all along?

@1 - a bored tunnel built to today's seismic standards is not directly comparable to a double-deck viaduct barely built to 1950s standards. @14 - the tunnel will be bored under downtown, presumably out of the liquefaction area along the seawall. It's worth noting that in the Loma Prieta quake, two viaduct structures and one section of the bay bridge failed, while no tunnels collapsed.

On the bright side, we'd get plenty disaster relief to pay for the replacement. It worked for Minnesota.

@21: The South Portal of the tunnel is about 1,900-2,000 feet into the liquefaction zone under 90-120 year old fill with another 500-600 feet continuing under 120-150 year old fill.

Here are some reference maps:
http://geomaps.wr.usgs.gov/pacnw/lifelin…
http://earthquake.usgs.gov/regional/pacn…

@17 - So if the Stranger was for Mallahan, you'd be for McGinn, right? Because the most important thing about this election is how it will reflect upon the Stranger, right?

The video was released for Halloween, yes? Needs more blood!

Can we at least make "Run to the hills" the sound track for this.

@23 - I'll grant you that-- there's no way the WHOLE tunnel can avoid the liquefaction zone. Still it's a lot less dangerous than what we have. And for that matter, a tree can fall on you while you're driving or biking. There are no guarantees in life.

Hey, Dom, nice way to "forget" to mention that Carey Moon, in addition to being "a member of the viaduct stakeholder's group" is also a head of the People's Waterfront Coalition, a self-described "fast-growing association of organizations and individual citizens who want to prevent the construction of a new highway on the shore of Elliott Bay in Downtown Seattle."

Using the Fair-and-Balanced™ reporting model up 11th Ave E now, huh?

Wow. Just... wow.

@29 - so? It's valid for Chris Gregoire or Joe Mallahan (or, hell, the whole WSDOT) to have an opinion on viaduct replacement, but not for Cary Moon? what's your point, exactly?

@28: It's more important to make sure the portal isn't in one or in the drainage zone of one.

Unfortunately, both portals fail the above criteria. It'll be really expensive to engineer that problem out, which is probably why they're so gungho about it.

Do they think that by not showing hordes of flesh-crazed zombies rising up from that apocalyptic hellscape, they're fooling us into thinking there will be no zombies? Look at that scene. If that's not zombie country, then there's no such thing, am I right? If you don't see zombies in that picture it's not because they aren't there. It's because they're right behind you!

The later released this simulation of what would happen to the Chase (nee Wamu) Tower:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tfC0RyRPW…

Oh my gosh, should we go ahead and close the 105-year-old Great Northern train tunnel that has outlasted every earthquake since it opened in 1904, and is still in use today?

http://www.historylink.org/index.cfm?Dis…

There is a similar tunnel under the city of Everett, it has been there nearly as long.

Both came before, and will outlast our viaduct by a few decades.

Ya, 29, you just should have said McGinn endorser, and left it at that.

http://mcginnformayor.com/endorsements/

@34: Neither were built in filled-in tidal flats, neither have the diameter of the proposed DBT, neither were built with city money, neither were built without advance engineering, neither were built with an as-yet undesigned piece of tunneling equipment, neither had to incorporate escape features, neither are as long, neither are as deep, neither are as technologically advanced, and both receive extensive renovation work every few years.

It took 10 years of engineering work before they began the Great Northern tunnel, and that was using relatively simple tunneling techniques that have been around since the 1500s.

Furthermore, the Everett "tunnel" is actually a cut.

Do your homework next time.

@26

Needs more zombies too.

@23 and 21,

Thanks for beating me to the tunnel liquefaction herring.

@23

Those maps you linked to, looked like they were more maps of faulting, ground acceleration, and sediment deposits. I guess you can extrapolate liquefaction potential from that, but I don't know that they are really direct representations of such.

@29 - That description would seem to make Ms. Moon objectively pro-tunnel and therefore, pro- Mallahan, yes? Wow -- just, wow.

@39: http://www.seattle.gov/emergency/library…

There's a good map in there in the appendix about earthquakes. There's also, ahem, a section on snowstorms that is so terribly thin that it removes all shock.

@32 for the win.

Worst Slog conspiracy theory ever.

An October surprise. How fitting.

Joe M., Derek, Baconcat: Thanks for the discussion and info, worrisome as it may be.

This is sad how a topic this important is subject less to reason than to politics.

of course there's no tsunami... which would occur from a subduction quake which could only occur miles off the coast and *shock* Seattle's not on the coast. It's bullshit to even put "tsunami not expected" ...well neither is a tornado or swarm of locust.

Even the NOAA Tsunami report says:

"Because the nature of the tsunami depends on the initial deformation of the earthquake,
which is poorly understood, the largest source of uncertainty is the input earthquake. The
earthquake scenario used in this modeling was selected to honor the paleoseismic
constraints, but the next Seattle fault earthquake may be substantially different from these.
Sherrod and others (2000) show that an uplift event at Restoration Point predating the A.D.
900–930 event was smaller. Trenching of subsidiary structures to the Seattle fault that are
thought to be coseimic with the main fault trace (Nelson and others, 2002) indicate that there
were at least two earthquakes in the 1500 years before the A.D. 900–930 event. These,
however, did not produce prominent uplifted wavecut platforms similar to the one made by
the A.D. 900–930 event, suggesting that significant earthquakes have occurred on the fault
that had different and smaller uplifts in central Puget Sound."
http://www.pmel.noaa.gov/pubs/PDF/wals27…

In English: "We really are just speculating with this ridiculous map and the largest quake in known history did not produce tsunamis anywhere near the height as this scare tactic scenario aimlessly speculates at and quakes before that didn't even register."

This is definitely one of the more legitimate conspiracy theories ever reported on Slog. The casual overlap and job switching between top DOT PEs & directors with those of huge 9-figure contract-holding firms (PB, CH2MHill, Parametrix...), not just on AWV, but also 520 and the 405 projects, should be enough to make anyone skeptical. And Paananen isn't a spokesman -- he's the AWV project director. The fact that they had someone at his level covering this is iffy too.

I file requests under PDA with Seattle Public Schools quite a lot. It's amazing how long it can take for simple information (like minutes of a public meeting). Sorry, I see manipulation here.

The state has no business giving video to a news outlet rather than the person who ORIGINALLY asked for it.

I'm sure the state Attorney General will back the Governor.

@24 your my hero

a much more exciting version of this video here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dtjGmrPK…