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Obviously, she had a few quirks. One of them, apparently, was having no compunction about sharing this information. The uncle was in a poly marriage at the time, and while I don't think her parents ever found out, his wife of course knew and they all marched happily forward with their lives.
It made my head spin, but it definitely seemed like a "no harm, no foul" situation. I, personally, wouldn't risk blowing up my relationship with the entire family over something like this, but that's me.
One incestuous pairing doesn't necessarily make mutant babies. All the one-eyed royals and six-armed babies we're thinking of got that way through *generations* of inbreeding.
The long ancient taboo we have against incest is partially accounted for the fact that we used to have smaller, more isolated populations, which would make the effects of incest more pronounced. Not to mention scientific advances which mean that we can screen embryoes (which we already do for couples who carry diseases).
Ok, this is for cousins, but still:
"recent review (Bennett et al, Journal of Genetic Counseling, 2002) says that, on average, offspring of first-cousin unions have a 2 to 3 percent greater risk of birth defects than the general population, and a little over 4 percent greater risk of early death."
Just saying. I don't think it's a fear worth dismissing, but people kind of overblow the rhetoric.
If it were me, I'd start working on patience. I'd use my vibe in the meantime, but I'd take the next year attending munches to see if my uncle kept showing up. I'd get to know him as a kinky person (fetlife, parties, etc) during that year.
And in February 2011, I'd maybe drop a few hints and see how that went.
In a lot of ways, doing this is like coming out of a closet--it's not something you can undo. So while you enjoy a year or two of anticipation, feel it out. Make sure it makes sense for you and for him and within the context of your extended family.
You don't seem to be new, but do you read the other blog posts? Have you seen the rampage of unprovoked venomous attacks that go on here? Some individuals are treated abysmally because s/he disagrees with peoples sexual orientations and/or the religious beliefs. It seems that individuals here are sick of turning the other cheek, sick of being called pedophiles and such by this Loveschild who invokes the name of God. I can understand the need to lash out. To me it looks like s/he has earned this insult. His/her victims deserve the right to lash out and seem more worthy of your defending spirit.
But as I said, so what? We don't have genetic screening? Yes, you're *not* as likely to share a genetic disease with a stranger as you do with a close relative (duh), but I'm pointing out the situation is basically the same if you *did* hook up with someone like that, because there are many cases of that. The biological ickiness is quite similar (pretty much identical, actually), but we don't freak out about two people with identical diseases fucking. We let 'em be, and try to get around it.
I'd also point out that a lot of people *aren't* carriers of deadly diseases, and their families are relatively clean gene pools. Why are we so worried about a tiny population of diseased AND incest-leaning uncles and nieces?
(Also, can somebody whip up a Sliding Scale of Grossness for incest? Cousins > Uncles > Siblings > Parents. And make it colourful!)
Just the idea makes me queasy.
She would go for it. But, she would recognize the potential for horrible drama, and work to minimize it with a grand overcomplicated plan. Perhaps Z could wear a disguise, and seduce her uncle, getting all the fun of incest without him knowing and possibly saying anything? A big, fake moustache and a hat would do the trick.
She would go for it. But, she would recognize the potential for horrible drama..."
Wow. Talk about "Lucy, you got some 'splaining to do."
Side note: Did anyone else feel like they needed a Sex Positive Dictionary to read that first paragraph? No idea what CBT or munch mean, and I'm not about to google them at work. Guess I'm not as hip as I thought.
@122, Aww, you're so cute!
...And then go fuck her uncle. (Condoms!)
However, it sounds like she's apprehensive and ambivalent. I think those are compelling reasons to pass this by.
Sometimes fantasy should stay fantasy. Reality ruins it.
First, let's give her a name:
Nice Incest Enthusiast Considering Encounters
Now, on to the hard part. All you know about your uncle, NIECE, is two things. He and your aunt have some form of deal in which he is free to have sex outside of their relationship. You also know he is into incest role play just like you.
What you don't know, NIECE, is the specifics of the deal that your aunt and uncle have. Whether or not it is implicit or explicit, I suspect one aspect of the deal is that your aunt does not want to know ANYTHING about it what he is doing or who he is doing it with – hence his six hour trip to attend a kink munch. Not everyone is like you and your primary sweetie and interested in sharing / getting off on all the details about extracurricular activities, and what you propose feels like it would be a major deal breaker in the relationship between your aunt and uncle. Furthermore, if this is the fact pattern and the activity between you and your uncle was discovered and it resulted in their breakup, guess who will be blamed for destroying what appears to be a relationship that is working. Here's a hint, it isn't going to be your uncle. It's going to be YOU, NIECE. Yes, you will be the evil Niece who stole your uncle from your aunt. That is an awful lot of relationship damage to repair – if, and that is a big if, you can.
Here is the other thing, NIECE – it's called role play for a reason. Take it from someone who has both screamed, “Fuck me, Daddy! Let me be your little boy!” and had the same sentences screamed at me once my hair turned gray. It's play acting with the goal of enhancing sexual gratification. Role play and the real thing exist in parallel universes because the real thing (in this case incest) rightfully causes most people to act like Dan and want to throw up on the keyboard, and subsequently boil his brain, because it is reprehensible.
The past two paragraphs should give you enough pause to abandon this idea, but in case it doesn't, NIECE – DON'T DO IT!
PS: Both 95 and 104 note that some cultures approve of first cousin marriage to the point of vaunting it. According to the National Council on State Legislators, “Twenty-five states prohibit marriages between first cousins. Six states allow first cousin marriage under certain circumstances, and North Carolina allows first cousin marriage but prohibits double-cousin marriage. States generally recognize marriages of first cousins married in a state where such marriages are legal.” The link for all the gory details is, http://www.ncsl.org/default.aspx?tabid=4…. If that isn't a reason why states should give full faith and credit to a Gay Marriage done in another state, and why DOMA is an idiotic idea, I don't know what is.
and that is the basis of our dislike for incest on a strictly scientific level, leaving out the fact that it is eeweewyuckyuck to most.
I think that if you are willing to accept that there is a potential for pregnancy and decide- BEFORE you get into this messy affair- what you will choose to do IF it happens and whether it is worth the risk then you have your answer.
if the thought of that is too hard to contemplate then you will be putting yourself in way over your head if you choose to chance it.
you will also be bringing a damaged life into this world, knowingly. or destroying a life, knowing it would need to be destroyed, if this happens.
but, when you break it down, that is what the issue is on incest: the possible future child or abortion.
(that said, she's gonna do it anyway and regret it)
Imagine if he said, "what the fuck is wrong with you, I'm calling your mother/father."
An then you'll have to see him and make eye contact at every family function.
there are two main problems with incest- psychological damage to children, and genetic problems with babies born due to incest. thanks to the modern world, number two doesnt have to be an issue (besides, we dont even know if she is blood related to him). as for number one- i think that consenting adults should be able to do whatever they like with each other, but i acknowledge that in, say, a father/daughter situation there is a high potential for issues/trauma/nastiness/generally not ok things even if the daughter is consenting and over 18. However I dont get the sense from this letter that the uncle had a huge hand in raising Z, or that they have large roles in eachothers lives outside of family gatherings. So i dont see a reason not to go for it besides the normal potential for complications which comes with fulfilling any *highly* socially unacceptable fantasy.
So, Z, if you're confident in your sneakiness, I say, "Why not?" However, I do advise looking up your local incest laws. Where I live in British Columbia, nothing out side of brother/sister/parent is incest, however, in many places the margin is wider and sometimes includes relations by marriage. If your family were to find out, it'd be a lot messier if they phone the police. (Which is many a "concerned mother's" knee-jerk reaction)
Maybe I'm just getting too old and allergic to drama - but experience has taught me that trouble/disappointment or drama loves to follow in the wake of some fantasies becoming reality, and role-play jumping the fence and becoming real play.