Seriously Dan? I'm squicked by the letter too, but you think this is so horrible and disgusting you won't write about it, when you just had half of a Savage Love devoted to talking about the premise of "good pedophiles?"
All right, I actually had a friend who fucked her blood uncle, for realz, as a consenting adult, and loved it. She also later went on to marry her first cousin. I know NO ONE BELIEVES ME, but I swear to fucking god it's true.

Obviously, she had a few quirks. One of them, apparently, was having no compunction about sharing this information. The uncle was in a poly marriage at the time, and while I don't think her parents ever found out, his wife of course knew and they all marched happily forward with their lives.

It made my head spin, but it definitely seemed like a "no harm, no foul" situation. I, personally, wouldn't risk blowing up my relationship with the entire family over something like this, but that's me.
Ok, re: genetic problems of uncle-fucking ... isn't this only a serious, *likely* problem if you're both carriers of a particular disease (which, frankly, could happen to complete strangers) or if the interbreeding is continued?

One incestuous pairing doesn't necessarily make mutant babies. All the one-eyed royals and six-armed babies we're thinking of got that way through *generations* of inbreeding.

The long ancient taboo we have against incest is partially accounted for the fact that we used to have smaller, more isolated populations, which would make the effects of incest more pronounced. Not to mention scientific advances which mean that we can screen embryoes (which we already do for couples who carry diseases).

Ok, this is for cousins, but still:

"recent review (Bennett et al, Journal of Genetic Counseling, 2002) says that, on average, offspring of first-cousin unions have a 2 to 3 percent greater risk of birth defects than the general population, and a little over 4 percent greater risk of early death."…

Just saying. I don't think it's a fear worth dismissing, but people kind of overblow the rhetoric.

If it were me, I'd start working on patience. I'd use my vibe in the meantime, but I'd take the next year attending munches to see if my uncle kept showing up. I'd get to know him as a kinky person (fetlife, parties, etc) during that year.

And in February 2011, I'd maybe drop a few hints and see how that went.

In a lot of ways, doing this is like coming out of a closet--it's not something you can undo. So while you enjoy a year or two of anticipation, feel it out. Make sure it makes sense for you and for him and within the context of your extended family.

Good Luck,
@105 - You're twice as distantly related to your cousins as to your aunts and uncles. You're both much more likely than you and a stranger to be carriers of THE SAME genetically based diseases. It's not as bad as sibs or parents, genetically, but it's worse than for cousins. IF this is the genetic uncle, of course.
@ 54, Aussie Steve, good on ya for pointing out that you find the insult "cuntwhorebitch" offensive and that it drips of misogyny. Ta for that.

You don't seem to be new, but do you read the other blog posts? Have you seen the rampage of unprovoked venomous attacks that go on here? Some individuals are treated abysmally because s/he disagrees with peoples sexual orientations and/or the religious beliefs. It seems that individuals here are sick of turning the other cheek, sick of being called pedophiles and such by this Loveschild who invokes the name of God. I can understand the need to lash out. To me it looks like s/he has earned this insult. His/her victims deserve the right to lash out and seem more worthy of your defending spirit.

Just say-in...
This is so gross and shouldn't even be a question. It goes against all societal moral standards (I'm a bi, kinky person myself, so don't think I'm getting all bible thumping), and if found out could lead to terrible consequences within the family--such is the nature of actual incest. I think you should look for a new munch and get off each others Fetlife (no pun intended).
You know who else had sex with his niece? HITLER.
@Z - Do you _like_ your aunt? Regardless of her vague comments regarding her okness with him having affairs, would she be ok with him having an affair with _you_? You mentioned you're poly. I'm sure you already comprehend that permission to fuck other people does not necessarily mean permission to fuck any person. These people (your aunt and uncle) do not appear to be practicing the sort of poly that would allow them to have discussed and figured out their boundaries. Which means you are working with tacit boundaries. Family being off limits, is a likely tacit boundary. Don't fuck your uncle. This is not a nice thing to do to your aunt.
@107: Yeah, I said so; I know it's not the same, but I'm too lazy to Google incest studies for every specific member of the family.

But as I said, so what? We don't have genetic screening? Yes, you're *not* as likely to share a genetic disease with a stranger as you do with a close relative (duh), but I'm pointing out the situation is basically the same if you *did* hook up with someone like that, because there are many cases of that. The biological ickiness is quite similar (pretty much identical, actually), but we don't freak out about two people with identical diseases fucking. We let 'em be, and try to get around it.

I'd also point out that a lot of people *aren't* carriers of deadly diseases, and their families are relatively clean gene pools. Why are we so worried about a tiny population of diseased AND incest-leaning uncles and nieces?

(Also, can somebody whip up a Sliding Scale of Grossness for incest? Cousins > Uncles > Siblings > Parents. And make it colourful!)
Would it make a difference to any of the posters here if she and the family member were of the same gender? Just curious...
I might be able to handle seeing my niece at sex oriented gathering. I could not handle it if she came on to me. Ugh. Goodness.

Just the idea makes me queasy.
You know what? Fuck all these prudes. I say do it. You wouldn't ask if you didn't, deep down, want it, and here it is falling into your lap. Fuck him till he cries uncle.
I think this is one of those moments when we have to ask ourselves "What would Lucy Ricardo do?"

She would go for it. But, she would recognize the potential for horrible drama, and work to minimize it with a grand overcomplicated plan. Perhaps Z could wear a disguise, and seduce her uncle, getting all the fun of incest without him knowing and possibly saying anything? A big, fake moustache and a hat would do the trick.

No fucking way, terrible idea. Like 34 said, not worth the aftermath. This person and her uncle are going to remain in the same family until they die. Why risk complications of either party acknowledging they've engaged in incest (fair chance of regret, I mean sheesh) when there are billions of other people in the world to fuck
If you have to ask a stranger if screwing your uncle is a good or bad idea, you've got bigger problems than getting laid.
"I think this is one of those moments when we have to ask ourselves 'What would Lucy Ricardo do?'

She would go for it. But, she would recognize the potential for horrible drama..."

Wow. Talk about "Lucy, you got some 'splaining to do."
Personally, I think the relationship of Soon-yi Previn and Woody Allen (i.e. father / daughter) is a heck of a lot creepier than Z with her presumably unrelated Uncle. I think Dan is pulling a fast one - just to see how stressed out we all get.

Side note: Did anyone else feel like they needed a Sex Positive Dictionary to read that first paragraph? No idea what CBT or munch mean, and I'm not about to google them at work. Guess I'm not as hip as I thought.
Incest is illegal in most states, especially if he's a blood relative rather than an uncle by marriage. Check your state laws and consider whether you want to risk a criminal record in addition to your family going nuts if anyone ever finds out.
I'm with the people who say the risk is too great for the potential reward. Don't do it.
I'm with @10 and others. Don't do it. The potential for a pile of repulsed relatives should it ever come come out that you got kinky with Unky should be enough to dissuade. You'd be legendary, and not in a good way.

@122, Aww, you're so cute!
I'm not poly but I've read enough to know you should clear this sort of thing with all primary partners. That's the respectful and right thing to do. You say your primary is fine with it, but what about your uncle's wife? Yeah, I'm going to guess there's no way in hell you want to call your aunt up and have that conversation. *eyeroll*
I suggest she read "To Sail Beyond the Sunset" by Robert Heinlein.

...And then go fuck her uncle. (Condoms!)
If this is what the girl and her uncle really want, who are the rest of us to tell them no?

However, it sounds like she's apprehensive and ambivalent. I think those are compelling reasons to pass this by.
I'm just glad I won't have to spend Thanksgiving with either of them. My own family is bad enough with the drama and weird interactions. I'm just picturing one too many Jack Daniels' and little Z here ending up doing a couch-dance for Uncle Fester right in front of the whole fam-damily.

Sometimes fantasy should stay fantasy. Reality ruins it.
So, it's my turn to play Dan for a few moments.

First, let's give her a name:

Nice Incest Enthusiast Considering Encounters

Now, on to the hard part. All you know about your uncle, NIECE, is two things. He and your aunt have some form of deal in which he is free to have sex outside of their relationship. You also know he is into incest role play just like you.

What you don't know, NIECE, is the specifics of the deal that your aunt and uncle have. Whether or not it is implicit or explicit, I suspect one aspect of the deal is that your aunt does not want to know ANYTHING about it what he is doing or who he is doing it with – hence his six hour trip to attend a kink munch. Not everyone is like you and your primary sweetie and interested in sharing / getting off on all the details about extracurricular activities, and what you propose feels like it would be a major deal breaker in the relationship between your aunt and uncle. Furthermore, if this is the fact pattern and the activity between you and your uncle was discovered and it resulted in their breakup, guess who will be blamed for destroying what appears to be a relationship that is working. Here's a hint, it isn't going to be your uncle. It's going to be YOU, NIECE. Yes, you will be the evil Niece who stole your uncle from your aunt. That is an awful lot of relationship damage to repair – if, and that is a big if, you can.

Here is the other thing, NIECE – it's called role play for a reason. Take it from someone who has both screamed, “Fuck me, Daddy! Let me be your little boy!” and had the same sentences screamed at me once my hair turned gray. It's play acting with the goal of enhancing sexual gratification. Role play and the real thing exist in parallel universes because the real thing (in this case incest) rightfully causes most people to act like Dan and want to throw up on the keyboard, and subsequently boil his brain, because it is reprehensible.

The past two paragraphs should give you enough pause to abandon this idea, but in case it doesn't, NIECE – DON'T DO IT!

PS: Both 95 and 104 note that some cultures approve of first cousin marriage to the point of vaunting it. According to the National Council on State Legislators, “Twenty-five states prohibit marriages between first cousins. Six states allow first cousin marriage under certain circumstances, and North Carolina allows first cousin marriage but prohibits double-cousin marriage. States generally recognize marriages of first cousins married in a state where such marriages are legal.” The link for all the gory details is,…. If that isn't a reason why states should give full faith and credit to a Gay Marriage done in another state, and why DOMA is an idiotic idea, I don't know what is.
110 + 117 = FTW
well, in my personal opinion, what it comes down to is whether you're willing to bring a mentally harmed child into the world and raise it, or if you are willing to abort said child. because there is ALWAYS with ANY straight sexual encounter the chance of pregnancy.
and that is the basis of our dislike for incest on a strictly scientific level, leaving out the fact that it is eeweewyuckyuck to most.
I think that if you are willing to accept that there is a potential for pregnancy and decide- BEFORE you get into this messy affair- what you will choose to do IF it happens and whether it is worth the risk then you have your answer.

if the thought of that is too hard to contemplate then you will be putting yourself in way over your head if you choose to chance it.
you will also be bringing a damaged life into this world, knowingly. or destroying a life, knowing it would need to be destroyed, if this happens.

but, when you break it down, that is what the issue is on incest: the possible future child or abortion.
don't do it, your uncle might be really bad in bed

(that said, she's gonna do it anyway and regret it)
no! Even if you think you could go there in real life with your real uncle, don't assume he would feel the same! Sometimes the "vibes" you get can be completely in your head, and this is someone you'll have to face for the rest of your life, regardless of his response.

Imagine if he said, "what the fuck is wrong with you, I'm calling your mother/father."
i don't mean to pull the osmond card here but this seems like a bad idea and you probably won't know how bad it really is until after you indulge it. seems there's a lot to lose with little to gain. it could have astounding repercussions depending on if your family catches wind of it.
Don't do approach him. What if he recoils and blurts out "What?! NO!!"

An then you'll have to see him and make eye contact at every family function.
i'm really shocked by how many normally open minded readers had a 'vomit and boil the brain' reflex on this one. seriously. people who are ok with reading about other people's rape fantasies, poop/farting fetishes. feet, cuckolding, what have you, cant even *think* about this girl sleeping with her uncle?

there are two main problems with incest- psychological damage to children, and genetic problems with babies born due to incest. thanks to the modern world, number two doesnt have to be an issue (besides, we dont even know if she is blood related to him). as for number one- i think that consenting adults should be able to do whatever they like with each other, but i acknowledge that in, say, a father/daughter situation there is a high potential for issues/trauma/nastiness/generally not ok things even if the daughter is consenting and over 18. However I dont get the sense from this letter that the uncle had a huge hand in raising Z, or that they have large roles in eachothers lives outside of family gatherings. So i dont see a reason not to go for it besides the normal potential for complications which comes with fulfilling any *highly* socially unacceptable fantasy.
She says in the letter that she will be highly discreet. Many people do fool around without their families finding out. (If you read this column you know that)

So, Z, if you're confident in your sneakiness, I say, "Why not?" However, I do advise looking up your local incest laws. Where I live in British Columbia, nothing out side of brother/sister/parent is incest, however, in many places the margin is wider and sometimes includes relations by marriage. If your family were to find out, it'd be a lot messier if they phone the police. (Which is many a "concerned mother's" knee-jerk reaction)
Sometime a fantasy is a fantasy because it only really works as a fantasy. Z, you yourself mention that your initial take was "Real Family=ick, Fantasy Family=hot" I'd say stick with this, for while this situation seems ready made - there is a chance that there is going to be a moment, if you go through with this where a voice will scream inside your head "oh My GOD, WHAT THE HELL AM I DOING?" Who wants THAT? Or the psychological baggage that come with actually and knowingly fucking your uncle? In addition, I'm assuming that if you were to share what you are planning to do with your family, that there would NOT be a lot of "Atta girl's" or support THERE. Sure, Aunties SAYS she wouldn't mind him get sex elsewhere - but do you really know how she respond to him really having one (you said you THOUGHT he might have had a affair - not very conclusive) But then... when Auntie said that - even if she was sincere.. I'm going out on a limb and assume she didn't mean that elsewhere to be in her nieces vagina. Silly me. Its bad when the crap hits the fan... but when the crap hit the family fan... yikes. It can be ugly, and not Ugly Betty ugly - we are talking straight up, no chaser Gary Busey ugly. You don't want that... nobody wants that.

Maybe I'm just getting too old and allergic to drama - but experience has taught me that trouble/disappointment or drama loves to follow in the wake of some fantasies becoming reality, and role-play jumping the fence and becoming real play.
What nobody's comment here seems to understand is that she's actually attracted to the guy because he is her uncle. It's the taboo itself that is the turn on. She's going to do it anyway because she just wants to give into this concept. Shit will, of course, fly. She probably desires that, also. I'd pay to see the movie, done by Woody Allen, of course.

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