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800 Maynard Ave S, Suite 200, Seattle, WA 98134
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"You're making me do this!" she cried out to the teacher as she repeatedly disrupted the classroom, not taking responsibility for her own actions. Then she tells the police they'll have to carry her out, and they do just that.
As a world-class bitch myself I can report that at the moment when I do break some camel's back with my last little straw no video verite could capture how guilty I am. But in a truly just world cops would swarm to cuff me every time...
Count me among those who don't see why she was arrested so swiftly (unless those cops were off-camera during the whole thing - I really couldn't hear the people answering her so I don't know if the cops were trying to call her over first). BUT... she was definitely disrupting things. Even if she was right, her behavior was wrong.
We don't know how the altercation developed before the camera came on, so we can't say if the teacher's right to throw the student out was used or abused, but it's pretty clear that if the right exists and is police enforcible, there's nothing legally wrong with what happened.
When the instructor asks you to leave - because the rest of the class feels threatened - or she'll call the campus pd, just get the fuck up and leave. She thought she had the right to argue ad nauseam and "threaten this bitch right here" and didn't think the teacher would call. She had her bluff called, tough shit.
An important distinction frequently forgotten.
Teachers seriously need to grasp the basics of non-violent communication. They are in a position of authority; the onus is on them to prevent shit like this from escalating. If that woman had snapped and hurt another student -- if, because she came across as perfectly manageable to me -- the teacher would have to take the lion's share of the blame, as far as I'm concerned.
The thing that really bugs me about this is that the student kept trying to de-escalate the situation, and the teacher kept arguing with her. Fail, fail, fail.
Watch very closely the moment that she's asked by the police to leave. (3:02) She strikes the police officer.
She shouldn't have been cuffed, she should have been expelled.
As @16 and others note, there is a lot of context missing.
When students threaten me or others in my room (university), security WILL be called because of safety.
Her taunting the cops only strengthened the case for her being the assholle appears to be here.....
Not being able to hear what she is saying, it's hard to speculate whether the instructor was trying her best to deal with the situation to the best of her ability.
Where is she supposed to learn how to handle this situation? Most likely this instructor was a newer TA, who had a one-day workshop training before being put in front of a class. If it's the failure of anyone besides the student, it's the administration who offers so little training to it's instructors, and absolutely none in dealing with disturbed/disruptive students. You don't expect this behavior in a college classroom, and when it happens, it's a rare event.
Yes they do. Those that don't are immature 'tards. She also admitted she threatened someone. Them fighting words.
Here's a non-violent confrontation: GTFO my classroom.
I also can't discount the racial dynamic of the situation. You've got an angry young black woman in confrontation with a white teacher and three white cops. And the black woman sounds really frustrated and defensive -- gee, I wonder why.
Non-violent communication, people. This is why some teachers just never, ever have these problems. I've seen them at work, and I've done it myself -- turned another prof's nightmare student into a pussycat. You just have to care, and know how to communicate. And it's important because here's what's at stake: that young woman's education. The prof could have recognized that the student had a temper, and established a sympathetic relationship with her. This is what helps students grow up and become mature, responsible, caring individuals. Instead, she's been arrested and thrown out of class.
I don't mean to come across like I know all the answers. But really, this girl was not that tough. I stand by what I'm saying -- that arrest didn't have to happen.
Thing is we all know people like this. People who demand to be "respected" but don't know how to earn that respect or even how to offer it to others.
So even if the prof could've handled it better, on the video this woman made poor choices and paid the price.
I've dealt with drunk students, threatening students, aggressive students, rude students. You try to get them out of the room with as little disturbance as possible but you call security if necessary. As an instructor I have a duty to ensure the classroom atmosphere allows everyone to participate.
@18, it's all well and good to say students "should" act responsibly, but we all know they don't, and you have to be prepared for it. And I agree that it's possible that this teacher was a TA or otherwise new... or maybe not. Either way, it's the student who loses out in the end, so the TA has failed to teach her. If it were me on that video, I'd say I'd made a mistake and hope to learn from it.
I'm partly coming down hard on the teacher because I sympathize with the student, and I'm embarrassed for her, and I'm convinced that that is NOT how she wanted the situation to play out. And yeah, I totally agree about the administration being responsible for the training. Even though this kind of thing happens pretty rarely in college or uni, teachers should still be prepared for it, especially if they end up teaching in a school where the students are disadvantaged and tough.
The Center for Non-Violent Communication:
http://www.cnvc.org/en/about-us/new-site
She was behaving like a spoiled child.
Why not? Why would you be scared of guy who "acts shifty and threatening" but not a girl who is using abusive language and openly threatens a peer? It sounds like you have a bias towards the student for one reason or another and cannot view this objectively.
"If it were me on that video, I'd say I'd made a mistake and hope to learn from it."
If you were the student in the video? Or the teacher? I would hardly say the teacher telling an aggressive student who threatened to beat another student's ass to stop and asking her to leave warrants an apology. I think that student was an ass and I just don't understand why people screw around with their education like college is a free for all.
And I highly recommend more people become familiar with non-violent communication. It can work wonders.
"the black woman sounds really frustrated and defensive"
Gee I don't know, maybe cuz maroons like you let her grow up thinking she's entitled to be a rude bitch and blame racism for everything, including your own anti-social behavior.
This is the only quote that matters:
"I threatened this bitch right here"
OUt on your fat ass honey.
"because I sympathize with the student, "
Well maybe she should call you a bitch and threaten you some day.
"I just don't understand why people screw around with their education like college is a free for all."
You know, I don't understand either, but I try to. People are people, and they screw up constantly. This girl screwed up big time, and I hope she gets her shit together and figures it out so she can finish school. I feel compassion for her, just as I felt compassion for the disturbed guy, even though he was unable to feel compassion for anyone. It sucks to see people's lives go down the tubes.
Uh, because this woman has an outrageous sense of entitlement that makes her think she can behave like a street thug in a place of higher learning.
- student admits to threatening another student
- other students are clearing out because they're uncomfortable
- student tells cops that they'll have to drag her out of there and that's exactly what they do
We don't have a clear context for what's happening, but if you're being disruptive and a professor asks you to leave, you'd better do it. Perhaps the teacher totally egged on the student, but the cops acted calmly and professionally based on the information they had.
No. Having a position does not automatically mean you should be respected. All respect has to be earned. Blind obedience does not lead to anything good. You can respect the position itself, and the institution it represents but every individual has to earn their own respect.
There are bad teachers, there are mean teachers, there are petty and vindictive teachers. Just as there are students that are the same.
The instructor should have stopped saying anything and let that student talk herself into self-consciousness first though.
That certainly explains why she refused to leave.
That's how white liberals like their blacks, in a perpetual state of infantilism, devoid of self respect earned through personal responsibility. A permanent state of victimhood that needs help from them, white liberals. How else can their make their sociology degrees from Evergreen State college pay?
There is no harm in being handcuffed. Being handcuffed does not mean you are guilty of anything. Guilt is determined by a court of law. And, if you think your rights are being violated save it for the judge. When dealing with someone with a badge and gun, be respectful, cooperative, and do your best to get through that ordeal. Because if the cop does violate your rights and kills you in the process, you're still dead. So, who cares that your rights were violated? You have to know when to pick your battles and your first goal should be to come out alive from any interaction with the police.
I do agree that the instructor should have stopped engaging the student in conversation. As soon as the instructor contacted campus police, class should have been either cancelled or dismissed for a 15 minute break. Because students tend to become very passionate when discussing grades, questions about a particular grade on an exam or a paper should be handled in private during office hours. Thus, the instructor should not have been engaging the student in a conversation during class about a graded assignment.
The socially conscious among us always say it is the onus of the teacher to be responsible and level headed. It is my strong belief that every time a student successfully tells a teacher " go on with your business and don't mind what I do" that the student looses respect for the teacher (whom they've just got over on and is therefore a fool) and learns to use what I call the Indignant Bitch persona to deal with people who disagree with her.
I don't think she should have been arrested. I think the teacher should have told her to GET THE FUCK OUT OF THIS CLASS RIGHT NOW AND ONLY COME BACK WHEN YOU CAN TREAT ME, THE OTHER STUDENTS AND THIS INSTITUTION WITH BASIC RESPECT.
To summarize Less "I see your point, you didn't threaten me per se..." and more "Fuck You!"
tyranny of authority bitches!
I agree with some that the instructor could have conducted herself a bit better by not engaging in the conversation any longer after campus security has been call. The student should definitely have been removed from the classroom after threatening her peer and presumably other students as well.
Although, despite the students rude comment of "you'll have to drag me out", I think campus police could have done a better job in removing the student. At least from the video, they exchange no words with the student, make no attempt to calm her down, but instead immediately went at her and cuffed her. They could at least have warned her that they were going to cuff her because of her disorderly conduct.
A simple few words from them could have deescalated the "arrest".
Wow, what a sense of entitlement. Sorry bitch, that's not how college works for adults.
And no, keshmeshi, I don't think that's how she wanted the situation to play out. She was cornered at that point, and her pride gave her no choice but to dig her heels in. If the teacher had de-escalated the situation when she had the chance the girl would not have ended up on the floor in handcuffs. But the way that teacher answered was a red flag to me that they had an antagonistic relationship already, and the teacher just kept pushing and pushing, like she wanted to see that girl get physically taken down. I think it would have been better for all if that had been avoided.
Look, I really see no point in continuing to argue about this. If we disagree, we disagree.
Those of us that finished our degrees know that the grades we got on any individual paper or assignment are meaningless. It's not the process of going to class or writing papers that matters: it's the material learned in that process.
jsonline.com/blogs/news/88423427.html
24 is a little old for this type of behavior ne c'est pas?
You mean all the people who suggested she was a victim of racism, right?
The young woman has behavioral issues -- she obviously threatened a classmate, and later threatens the teacher ("that bitch is gonna get bruised," I think she said as they led her out).
These are not issues a university instructor (even an adjunct) should be expected to deal with. And yet the prof. explained to her that she could stop disrupting the class or she would call security. The young woman was belligerent from the beginning to the end and it seems clear that she had been a chronic disruption in class.
Don't blame the teacher when it's obvious from the clip that the student has a history of bullying and disrupting the class. She needs to get help with her behavioral issues, maybe take a semester or two off, and then come back when she understands why she was asked to leave the class, and then forcibly removed from it.
It's not always someone else's fault.
I just hope they gave her the Rodney King treatment when they got her fat ass to the parking lot.
While it's possible that the teacher could have done more to prevent this, it is not the job of a college instructor to babysit adults who cannot behave as such. The credentials required for teaching college courses, in any event, do involve training in professional de-escalation techniques, and therefore it is incumbent upon teachers who feel that a situation has already escalated beyond their control defer to security/law enforcement.
Dammit. I even proofread it before posting, and missed that.
Ride that Heifer!!!
Also, @43, the police do not immediately cuff her, the first guy puts his hands on her to escort her out and she tries to push him away. They did absolutely the right thing.
They shoot them dead at the earliest opportunity.
No Joke.
- "The Ghost of Tom Joad"
They did; as soon as they dragged her fat, threatening, gangsta ass out of there, that class room was safer, quieter and defused.
Mind you, she's probably call you a bitch too Idaho, so maybe she's not a totally useless piece of shit humanity.
I got that from my boss, a wise man.
Frankly, I think patience with that sort of thing just reinforces it as a technique for the abuser getting what he or she wants. What 62 is an awesome tactic in a therapeutic setting. I still say a college course is not therapy, and that kid should have left when the teacher told her to.
The individual, regardless of anything prior, was asked to leave private property and declined. She is now trespassing and the cops arrive. They ask her to leave - she declines and says they will have to carry her out. I can't tell if the previous poster is correct in their assessment that she hit the officer or not but she is clearly resisting. The officers then cuff her with minimal force (a knee on the back of the neck sucks but I didn't see any of the officers actually strike her - which is comparatively surprisingly gentle for most police).
Paying for university does not make it public property. If asked to leave - you leave. After that all actions are her own regardless of how the situation began.
Someone up in here said 24 is a little old for this sort of thing. Shit, I'd say 6 years old is about where I would draw the line with refusing to talk about your behavior (I have a wonderfully pleasant and mild mannered 8 year old btw). For children we can legitimately say "we can't expect her to have a rational conversation, she's only a child" but American society has moved that line up into the 20's now.
Letting kids/adults off on that reasoning only reinforces that yes, you can get your way, if you act like a child, because it makes everyone uncomfortable and people around you will look away, or give in to you because they can't have a rational conversation with you and the alternative argument is too ugly.
I would agree with you if you had prefaced your statement with: "This was not the IDEAL way for the teacher to handle the situation." I wouldn't give this teacher an "A", but I wouldn't "fail" them either. Just because there are some very skilled communicators out there who would have been able to diffuse this situation in a more peaceful way does not make it fair to hold everyone up to this standard.
By the way, if the student had been a white man instead of a black woman, how (if at all) would this effect your opinion of the teacher's handling of the situation (and let's make the teacher a man in this hypothetical, as well)?
White guilt whiner? No, tolerance of others ethnicity's yes. Your views are scary at best.
I can only hope you fall victim to some good ole' hillbilly white crime.
We know your crack pot theory is faulted. A great example is the Chicago public housing system. We now learned that integrating those folks into neighborhoods across the city as opposed to just putting them into high rises across the city nearly cut crime in half.
Good luck with the move.