Blogs Aug 2, 2011 at 3:12 pm

Comments

1
/popcorn
2
It's incredible to think that social customs are different in different countries.
3
I HAVE RECEIVED A SHITTY TIP FROM CHARLES MUDEDE!!! HE DRANK RED WINE AND READ A BOOK WHILE HIS DAUGHTER COLORED!!!!!!!!!!!!! THERE WERE NO COMPLAINTS WITH MY SERVICE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SHE LEFT A MARKER THERE THAT I LAUGHED ABOUT BECAUSE IT SUCKS AS A KID TO NOT HAVE A FULL SET. IT WAS A SUNDAY AFTERNOON.
4
Waiters and waitresses also get paid in WA - at least $8.67 an hour - similar to what other (untipped) workers in the service industry make.

I'm not arguing against tipping - I really do believe that direct compensation for good service creates a better service environment. I just think that people whose pro-tipping argument is "but their [b]livelihoods!!!![/b]" In WA are silly, considering how many other people there are that make the same wage and never get tips.
5
I worked in a restaurant for a couple of years, in a neighborhood that's 50% white -50% black, and this happened super-rarely, thank God.

But there was a consistent category of poor tippers: old women coming out to lunch (no matter the skin color). Man, those were some terrible tips.
6
In spain the servers give shit service. Also France. The servers are usually white.
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Old women are the poorest of the poor in this country: an alarming percent of 'em live on Social Security benefits alone, and reduced benefits, at that.
8
Yes, Judy, except this was a "fancy" French restaurant that did not target the category you mention.
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Why didn't they ask any white people? Seems kinda racist.
10
@7, baloney. The poorest of the poor by far are children, and their young mothers. While there are poor old women, old women on average are quite well-off compared to the rest of the population. A substantial number of them are widows with inheritances. Some of the richest people in America are old widows. And old people have many special programs to supplement their incomes, from social security to Medicare to senior discounts everywhere.
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Servers do in fact get tips in Spain, but as with most European countries, the expected amount is much smaller than in the US.
12
$8.67 by itself is starvation wages. Waiters and Waitresses do a tough job--dealing with tempermental and sometimes very shitty people and deserve a really good tip to supplement their meager wages (and possible existence) when they do a good job for the crap they put up with.
13
In the US most African-Americans tip better than the skinflint rich do.

But tips in the EU are a lot lower than here, because wages are higher.
14
You know Fnarf once again it would be awesome if you could back up your sweeping "THIS IS THE WAY IT IS!!!" statements with a couple of reasonable cites.

Not that I don't think what you say in this instance is unlikely. It's just that... well... it's fucking annoying you stomping around this place like the King of Slog posting in nearly every thread these declarative supreme edicts with out one shred of... well, anything... to back up your condescending certainty.
15
Pink people don't tip either; specifically, Mr. Pink:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gLV4OxzDK…
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@14 -- Fnarf is way off the rails on this one.

I could give specifics, and I am tempted, but a simple "and so there!" will suffice.
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@14 i hear ya
Fnarf almost always reminds me of that internet meme from a few years back:
Arguing on the internet is like trying to win the Special Olympics.

on topic, i usually tip 10-20%. As far as caring about others tipping practices? like the Hank Williams song - 'Mind Your Own Business'
18
"Women Have Lower Income in Retirement than Men -- And Thus Higher Poverty. In 1997, median income for elderly unmarried women (widowed, divorced, separated, and never married) was $11,161, compared with $14,769 for elderly unmarried men and $29,278 for elderly married couples. Thus, the poverty rate for elderly women was higher than that of men: in 1997, the poverty rate of elderly women was 13.1 percent, compared to 7.0 percent among men. Among unmarried elderly women, the poverty rate was significantly higher -- about 19 percent."
http://www.ssa.gov/history/reports/women…

Note the above figures were collected before the Bush Recession/Depression.

Although of course, if that was an upscale French restaurant, that's another matter.

My experience: rich people are the worst tippers. Working people and the middle class, tipped better.

19
I thought the guy in the video wearing the blue shirt pretty much summed this issue up from just about every angle worth exploring. Then there was 18 more comments. Er... 19. Shit.
20
There is a "hierarchy" of places most bar and restaurant people want to work. Waiting on gay males is at the top. Waiting on poor people in general is at the bottom. Working at clubs, you want a gay club first, a white on after that and a black club would indeed be the last club you would want to work. In general the tips at the gay club are highest and those at the black club lowest. That is not to say that all gay people tip and all black people do not, but on average it does work out as I stated.

There are exceptions. At a middle of the road restaurant, the last people you want are any group of ladies meeting and splitting checks, although sometimes you can be surprised. A friend bar tended an EW&F concert not too long ago, and made a killing serving on black ladies. There is always anecdotal stories. If n=1, it does not make a trend.

Personally I tip 20% rounded up. It is easy to figure and I like being nice to my servers. I can also afford it, so I share. You have to piss me off real bad to get a bad tip. If I do not order much and camp at your table, I compensate you. Guys, if you are on a date and want to impress somebody? Tip appropriately, be polite, say thanks, and do not make a mess. Men and women you are taking out will notice this!
21
As for all those "wealthy" widows out there:

"Elderly unmarried women -- including widows -- get 51 percent of their total income from Social Security. Unmarried elderly men get 39 percent, while elderly married couples get 36 percent of their income from Social Security. For 25 percent of unmarried women, Social Security is their only source of income, compared to 9 percent of married couples and 20 percent of unmarried men. Without Social Security benefits, the elderly poverty rate among women would have been 52.2 percent and among widows would have been 60.6 percent.

•Women Face Greater Economic Challenges in Retirement. First, women tend to live longer: a woman who is 65 years old today can expect to live to 85, while a 65 year old man can expect to live to 81. Second, women have lower lifetime earnings than men do. And third, women reach retirement with smaller pensions and other assets than men do."

And keep in mind that 14 years later, the women and men retiring are less likely to have pensions, and their 401Ks or investments -- if they had any -- have been bottomed out by the recession/depression, as prices rose.

22
That place is 2 stops from my house. I'm going in there Pink and Proud, and I ain't tipping shit! Problem solved. Power to the Pink!
23
No one in their right mind would be a server for MINIMUM WAGE. If you regularly give anything less than 15% the only reason your server is putting up with your CHEAP ass is cos someone compensates to make serving you worthwhile. I've been a server for many years and I've never noticed a huge difference in the tips from people of different races. The worst tippers are the people who don't understand how hard it is to make all those strangers feel comfortable and happy no matter what.
24
I am a server...my tip percent is calculated by the company based on my sales amount, regardless of what I actualy made. The tips are then taxed and taken out of my pay check. The amount takes no concideration of the 40% I have to tip out to the host, cooks and dishwashers. I have to work atleast 8 hour days (crazybusy days) to make decent money. And the end of a pay period 80 + hours my paychecks average $200 to $300. This is in seattle at min wadge. I work long hours running non stop dealing with multiple personalities. Carring a smile and possitive demenor is no easy trick. My lively hood relys on tips, and I appreciate every one. However if I am tipped under 15% or not at all I am literally paying (in taxes) to have served a customer.
25
@12: I agree that they have a tough job - but the same can be said for lots of people who work for minimum wage.

As I said, I'm not arguing against tipping - I find that it improves service greatly. I'm saying that lots of people do hard work for minimum wage, and it's silly to single out waitstaff as the group we're most worried about making a living.
26
Thank you @14
27
black men ski.
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@24 I'm confused, are you saying that you average $2.50-$3.25 an hour in wages?
29
Slow traffic day at The Stranger:

Schmader: Hey Charles! The traffic is crawling at Slog...it's your turn to post something about tipping...that'll goose the numbers.

Mudede: Shit.
30
@25 Completely agreed. Quite honestly, who does NOT deal with multiple personalities, sometimes negative, at their job? I know I do and there is no opportunity to make tips. In fact, I would be fired as an educator if I took tips. I'm not saying that we shouldn't tip waitstaff, but the argument/whine "we make minimum wage and have to serve grumpy people" could be used by a lot of people. So should we just tip everyone that has a hard job and makes a low wage?
31
I use to have to work "gospel" brunches...and they were the worst tippers ever. I had a lovely little old lady come up to me and say "Roger (my name is not Roger), you were the best waiter we've ever had!"...and she then handed me a dollar. I couldn't help but wonder how much she tipped the worst waiter she ever had.

Having said that, I don't think it was a race issue. People in groups always tip less. That holds true regardless of the makeup of the group.
32
I used to live on minimum wage in Seattle and yeah, it was tough. Guess what? I found a better-paying job!

Tips are for good service and when I get it, I tip 25% or more. Bad service gets nothing. Tips are a BONUS and not guaranteed. The person who said waitresses should get tipped for putting up with bad customers is way off. Anyone in a customer-facing position has bad interactions. Should we start tipping the reps at Comcast and Verizon Wireless? Hell, no.

Ridiculous.
33
Do they take tips at McDonalds?
34
More often than not, black people are horrible tippers. When I worked in D.C. with a majority black staff (I myself am half black), no one wanted to wait on black people. When the Congressional Black Caucus convened it was a nightmare. They were rude and excessively needy on top of being bad tippers.

But you know who tips worse? Europeans.

And to those who feel that you've no obligation to leave any tip--you're absolutely right. Nevertheless you would do well to remember that 1) the tip you leave is redistributed to all of the front of the house support staff of the restaurant (and occasionally the back of the house). Barring exceptionally generous patrons, your server can expect to keep anywhere from 10-13 percent of his sales, assuming a 20 percent tip average. 2) Tips are assumed in the tax code such that governments will audit a restaurant if its servers consistently report tips below 10 percent of their sales.

That said if you are angry with your server, but are satisfied with the service of the support staff, leave 7-10 percent, or directly tip the support staff.
35
You might be interested to know that Fnarf received his Ph. D. in gratuities from the Universidad Salamanca in 1134.
36
@7 Speaking as someone who will be an old woman herself soon enough, that sucks, if it is true (I'm not going to address the arguments on whether it is or not). That doesn't change the fact that if you can't afford to tip, you can't afford to eat out.

To everybody else, yes, the tipping system is screwed up. No, nobody's going to change it anytime soon. In the meantime, tip fucking properly (that's 15-20%) and shut up. Don't be a douche.
37
Tipping is rare in Australia. We have strong unions who get good wages for workers usually. There is just no tradition of it here.
38
You ever lived in Europe Charles? What'd you think of the service?

When I lived in Germany it was horrible. B/c they 'get paid' this meant that the restaraunt had only a few servers and each one had a section of 10 to 15 tables. And b/c tips are a very small part of their wages (the German word for a tip is Trinkgeld, Drink Money) they have no incentive to work hard for the customer. Now, yes the culture is different there, it's a lot more slow paced, but then again THAT'S OVER THERE. Here, in America, which I presume you are bringing this up as some kind of critique the way servers here are compensated, that is not how we do things. People would be walking out left and right.

Also, servers here do 'get paid.' I usually took home between a hundred to a hundred fifty CASH a night when I waited tables. Then again I was good at it.

And yes, on the whole Blacks, Rednecks, Old People and Canadians are shitty tippers.
39
@38,

Huh. I'd like to think that if the tipping system were done away with, in favor of proper hourly compensation, that restaurant owners would choose to fire shitty waiters.

And the tipping system hardly guarantees good service, especially in low-rent establishments where a 20 percent tip on a $20 bill isn't worth the effort.
40
@38 I've lived (briefly) and traveled in Europe, and never had a problem with the service. I actually find it refreshing to relax at the table instead of constantly having somebody breathing down my neck every two minutes, with the pieces of flair and the "Can I start you off with an appetizer? Is that all you're ordering? How about another drink? Save room for dessert? Another drink? A blowjob? Are you sure? Still working on that? Can I get you anything else? Another drink? Are your sure?" It's exhausting.

But some people aren't happy unless the server makes up for everything else in their sad, pathetic lives by acting as a personal slave for the evening.
41
@39. What's to stop a restaurant from firing a shitty server now? And no it is no guarantee, but it's a pretty big incentive. Also the low cost (to restaurants) for servers means that more can be hired, meaning less tables, and more time per table.
42
@40, while the slow pace and lack of attention may be nice while on vacation, actually living there it gets old fast. And again, that's not how our restaurant culture works here, except at certain specialty and high end places.
43
@42 I generally make enough time for meals, whether I'm eating out or at home, that "slow" (i.e. European style, aka human-paced) service is not going to ruin my day.

I have no idea what you mean about "our restaurant culture". I do associate fawning, frantic, sucky-uppy service with lower-end restaurants. At the better places I expect servers to have dignity--not to be snotty, but then I've really never encountered the mythical, snotty server.
44
Would you consider the majority of restaurants to be 'European style' (the fact that you call it European and not Americans shows that it IS different) or 'low end'?

And yes, reread my post, I agree that in high end places in the US, the pace is slower and while the server is supposed to attentive, there is more a focus on being unobtrusive. This is different from in Europe where they are just slow.

Please wait...

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