Comments

1
Bonesteel is the coolest last name ever.
2
Sad to say, but I've seen this kinda thing coming for a while.

People round here -- young female people primarily -- have gotten really, really lazy about (late-night, drunken) personal safety and the need to travel in pairs for you, and each other's, protection. I'm amazed how many pretty lil' thinks I see stumble out of the bar and into darkened streets without a clue about what could happen.

Has it really been that long since Mia_Zapata???
3
@2: Has it really been that long since slutwalk? Don't blame the victim.
4
Where in the hell does it say the victim was drunk or stumbling, Timrrr? How's about you just stfu?
5
I believe you mean the suspect tripped over a "guy-wire". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guy-wire
6
Wow, it only two two posts to blame the victim. Awesome. I've got a vagina and, barring an invasive gender reassignment surgery, it ain't going anywhere. It's other people's responsibility to not go attacking it.

Kudos to the guys who came to the woman's rescue. Good on them!
7
@2: Some people don't want to live in a constant state of terror. Calculated risk is not "lazy", and carries the implication that they're being reckless by doing so.
8
gah, @2 is wrong and coming off as really creepy imo.
9
@8: Sounds like some weird Walter Mitty / white knight protection fantasy at best, or otherwise regressive.

"I'm only protecting you from the world, honey!"
10
People... that officer's name is "Bonesteel". Book 'em.
11
@2 If I felt like I needed to be escorted every time I left the house I would move to Saudi Arabia.

I'm glad to live in a city with the same people who intervened in this situation, and sad to know that a lot of people wouldn't have.
12
@All:
According to the woman's statement, half an hour before the 2:00 a.m. bar push-out on Saturday, she left a bar on East Roy Street and headed east toward home.

I didn't say she was stumbling. I didn't say she was drunk. I didn't say anything about her being at fault. You're projecting all that crap.

Listen, I put drunk girls in taxi cabs at 2:00am for a living. This isn't some armchair philosophy from an old man that's never partied. It's a bit of advice based on years of working in the bar/club industry and seeing what drunk people do and how they act in/around/after leaving bars. For 20 years.

But if you want to think that appealing to all women to be mindful and protect one another after a friend of mine was raped and killed in a similar situation a generation -- and it would seem, mental light years -- ago makes me a hater, then you can go STFU yourself, idoits!

(Or... maybe read up on the what's a whys of Home Alive before you open your self-righteous lil' pie hole, please.)

If you love one another, protect one another:
Friends don't let friends leave the bar alone.
13
Ha! I was there outside to see my friends pursue the perp. He didn't trip over the utility pole guide wire so much as he was clotheslined by it rather. Dazed, he was promptly tacked and restrained until the cops arrived. Classy guy.
14
@12: "Be mindful" != "young female people primarily -- have gotten really, really lazy"

It's a value judgment, and yes, BLAMES THE VICTIM.

Be conscious about your language, which is speaking different intentions than you may yourself hold.
15
Creepy crime. Maybe, if it is demonstrated that one cannot responsibly handle one's genitals, they should be confiscated for the sake of others.
16
While this story is totally scary, I gotta say I feel great about the men who stepped in to help her. It is awesome that they acted and they may have saved her life. Go boys!
17
"bar push-out" what are you, from fucking England?

*claps hands together* KILL THIS INTERN AND BRING ME A FRESH ONE!
18
remember girls, be mindful and don't get raped. 'cause if you do it is prolly just your fault anyhow and all that.
19
Also, OFFICER BONESTEEL.

He just shows up, and shit is automatically handled. He carries a flip top notebook that he takes out just to write 'handled' in it. That's his report.

He types that shit up every night before he goes home to his beautiful wife, four adopted children and his shelter rescued pets.

He only drinks straight American bourbon.

No ice.

20
#2 isn't blaming the victim. He/she makes the valid point that women need to be extra careful and not take shortcuts through dark secluded alleys all alone.

It's the same logic reason parents of young children should never let there little ones out of their direct sight on nature hikes; you never know what wild animals could be lurking out of site, waiting to pounce.
21
The opening of CSI Miami happens every time Bonesteel opens a door.
22
What the fuck ever 20. I'm sure he tells men to never walk alone for fear of being mugged, because only "lazy" men get mugged.

Oh, she shouldn't have been drunk!
Oh, she shouldn't have been alone!

Folksy non-solutions aren't helpful when they're offered patronizingly.
23
@20 Yes, likening adult women to young children who need to be protected from their own choices is totally not insulting there.

I've been raped and I know a lot of women who have been raped. Yes, these "dark alley at 2 AM" rapes happen, but the majority are more like "hanging out with a cute guy who's got a degree in English lit and we're chatting about indie comics and oh shit he's choking me and pulling out his dick." Living your life in fear of the black swan event of the dark alley stranger assault is all fine and good, but it doesn't protect you from the far more likely dangers and it puts all the onus on the potential victim. It took me a long time to be able to live my life without being completely crippled by fear. Would I walk down a dark alley alone at night? No, the fear remains too strong, but I'm not going to judge anyone who's lucky enough to not be the walking wounded.
24
I'm surprised (and a little dissapointed) that the guys that came to the rescue didn't put a boot to his ribs and/or face a few times while they were waiting for the cops.

I'm sure officer BONESTEEL would have approved.
25
I love these hero guys. in addition to doing the right thing by responding, there's this: "hey, do you guys know eachother?"

that's an enlightened position. 'well, it doesn't look right, but just in case this is a happy couple with a weird taste for alleyway bushes, I better ask...'
26
@18:
It's not your fault. It is your friends -- the ones that let you walk home alone -- 's fault. (You might note creepy creeper wasn't following groups of people down the street with his fly down, just women alone.)

It's always tempting to project ourselves into the staring role in any story. But try putting yourself in a supporting role for a change: Imagine for a second you'd been one of the people the almost-victim had been hanging with earlier.

How do you think you'd feel the next day, when you found out what had happened to your BFF after you'd let her leave the bar on her own that night?
27
this sort of doorguy-machismo is really common, but they're contributing to rape culture with their tongue-clucking about how girls "should have known better".

fuck off with your creepy white-knighting. recommend it at the time and when someone's trashed, but don't shake your head and look down on those who got followed be a predator and don't call them names, creep. it's very easy to go through life 6foot something 250lbs, and not have to require a "minder" wherever you go at night for all of your life. it comes off as controlling, not positive
28
@26: "It's not your fault. It is your friends -- the ones that let you walk home alone -- 's"

or, just putting it out there, you know it could be say, the rapists fault and umm not anyone else that didn't willfully violate another human being?
29
@28 Yes. The rapist is at fault. Rape doesn't just "happen" to people who made the wrong choice. It is a violent act that one person--THE RAPIST--willfully sought out to commit. People might feel guilty over something bad happening to a friend, but that doesn't mean it's their responsibility to treat their women friends like rape-bait every time they leave the house.
30
#2 isn't blaming the victim. I grew up in Cold War Europe where kidnapping was a very real possibility. My parents taught us to be alert, to be observant and to be mindful of potential problems and solutions. I didn't grow up feeling paranoid, I grew up assessing risks, and knowing that if something did happen to me, we'd talked about what to do. It was never stated that I might not make it home, though that was certainly true. We were taught to think.

#2 is right. People are getting complacent. Maybe we're burnt out on terror. Maybe the younger generation is so used to hover-parents solving all of life's problems and sheltering their kids from anything unpleasant that the idea that someone should be responsible for their own well being is foreign. Rape isn't the only thing that happens in alleys. Cutting alone through a narrow, dark space is a bad tactical decision whether you have a penis or a vagina. You could be mugged, raped, there could be a loose dog, you could trip over something and have trouble calling for help, there could be people behind a dumpster doing consensual things you'd still rather not see.

There is no way to eliminate risk. Bad things happen, and yes, more sexual assaults are perpetrated by someone the victim knows than complete strangers. But you don't have to live in constant fear OR not be a dumbass. You lock your car. You wear seatbelts. You lock your doors. You wash your hands after using the restroom. You don't go hiking covered in doughnuts and beer. You don't drive the wrong way on streets, stick forks into electrical sockets, approach dogs you don't know, swim in rip tides or any number of other things that have a bad risk/reward ratio. When you get in your car and lock your door, are you thinking in detail about car-jackings? When you fasten your seatbelt are you thinking in gruesome detail about what happens to flesh in car crashes? NO, you just do the freaking thing because it's what you do to reduce harm.

There's no reason fear has to enter your mind when you look down a dark alley and say, "eh, I'll stick to the sidewalk." Is that going to prevent all rape ever? Of course not. Is that even going to prevent *that* rape? You know, if someone wants to harm me enough, they'll do it, or at least try. People are dicks sometimes, whether or not they have one. Rape happens because rapists rape. Muggings happen because people steal wallets. Car accidents happen because physics works. That doesn't mean I can't hedge my bets a little and make them work for it.
31
#2 isn't blaming the victim. I grew up in Cold War Europe where kidnapping was a very real possibility. My parents taught us to be alert, to be observant and to be mindful of potential problems and solutions. I didn't grow up feeling paranoid, I grew up assessing risks, and knowing that if something did happen to me, we'd talked about what to do. It was never stated that I might not make it home, though that was certainly true. We were taught to think.

#2 is right. People are getting complacent. Maybe we're burnt out on terror. Maybe the younger generation is so used to hover-parents solving all of life's problems and sheltering their kids from anything unpleasant that the idea that someone should be responsible for their own well being is foreign. Rape isn't the only thing that happens in alleys. Cutting alone through a narrow, dark space is a bad tactical decision whether you have a penis or a vagina. You could be mugged, raped, there could be a loose dog, you could trip over something and have trouble calling for help, there could be people behind a dumpster doing consensual things you'd still rather not see.

There is no way to eliminate risk. Bad things happen, and yes, more sexual assaults are perpetrated by someone the victim knows than complete strangers. But you don't have to live in constant fear OR not be a dumbass. You lock your car. You wear seatbelts. You lock your doors. You wash your hands after using the restroom. You don't go hiking covered in doughnuts and beer. You don't drive the wrong way on streets, stick forks into electrical sockets, approach dogs you don't know, swim in rip tides or any number of other things that have a bad risk/reward ratio. When you get in your car and lock your door, are you thinking in detail about car-jackings? When you fasten your seatbelt are you thinking in gruesome detail about what happens to flesh in car crashes? NO, you just do the freaking thing because it's what you do to reduce harm.

There's no reason fear has to enter your mind when you look down a dark alley and say, "eh, I'll stick to the sidewalk." Is that going to prevent all rape ever? Of course not. Is that even going to prevent *that* rape? You know, if someone wants to harm me enough, they'll do it, or at least try. People are dicks sometimes, whether or not they have one. Rape happens because rapists rape. Muggings happen because people steal wallets. Car accidents happen because physics works. That doesn't mean I can't hedge my bets a little and make them work for it.
32
"#2 is right. People are getting complacent."

yep, that's why rapes happen
33
Replace"raped" with mugged and killed an replace "woman" with "man" and no one here would be attacking @26. @26 isn't attacking the victim, he's just pointing out we live in an imperfect world that contains some real scum, and we should watch out for ourselves and friends.

Glad to hear that those guys helped the woman out, kudos to them and my heart goes out to the woman, no one should ever have that happen tonthem
34
"Maybe the younger generation is so used to hover-parents solving all of life's problems and sheltering their kids from anything unpleasant"

RAPES ARE NOT INCREASING SO MUCH AS PEOPLE ARE UNAFRAID TO REPORT THEM
35
@33: "Replace"raped" with mugged and killed an replace "woman" with "man" and no one here would be attacking @26"

Wrong, this was already brought up.
36
BONESTEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEL.
37
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qm85rMYKS…

WHOOOOOOO ARE YOU?

Officer Bonesteel.
38
There's a hell of a lot of black-and-white thinking going on in this thread. In general, black-and-white thinking isn't very helpful.

@30 and @31 is right enough to post it twice.
39
Bonesteel RAWKS!
40
Bonesteel is truly the greatest name for a cop ever in history. If his first name isn't Max, it should be.
41
@38: Let me get this straight, it's the LEAST polarizing to blame the woman who gets raped for walking home alone, not the most?
42
@41
Bonesteel.
43
I wonder, does Officer Bonesteel have a badass eyepatch like File:General_Charles_H_Bonesteel.jpg">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Genera… General Bonesteel?
44
@41 That is not anywhere near how I interpreted @30. My point is that the following two statements can be true at the same time:

a) The victim of a crime is not at fault, the perpetrator is.

and

b) Crimes happen in cities and there are things you can do to improve your safety.
45
Bah. HTML fail.
46
44: "b) Crimes happen in cities and there are things you can do to improve your safety."

that is well and good, but I do find it pretty condescending for some to insinuate that women are not keenly aware about the potentiality of rape or somehow blind to its consequences;
like the effects of domestic violence or restrictions on reproductive health, It is pretty much assured that women know about it earlier and in a deeper way than many men ever can.
47
You know what sucks about the "You're Blaming The Victim!" brigade? They make it incredibly difficult to disseminate solid, common sense advice. People like timrrr try to remind folks to be careful and to think about your situation and your surroundings, and others jump down his throat claiming he's "blaming the victim". The ONLY thing this accomplishes is to make well-meaning people with good advice to share think twice about speaking up.

For that reason only, Fuck You, 'Victim-Blaming' Criers.
48
(@45, the HTML parser thingy chokes on the colon in Wikipedia image URLs. The easy and quick workaround is to get a shortened URL at bit.ly and use that on Slog.)
49
#46, I find it pretty condescending to put all women into the same bucket, whatever that may be. Some women are aware of their surroundings. Some women are unaware they're pregnant until they give birth. Some women take personal responsibility for their experiences, some women believe that other people can make them feel a certain way and assume that other people know what they mean without having to say it.
*You* may be keenly aware of the potentiality of rape. *I* may be keenly aware of the potentiality of harm in many forms and read "The Art of War" for fun. *Some* women are f*cking idiots who deliberately put themselves in harms way so that other people will rescue them or feel sorry for them. (I am not, in any way, talking about the woman in the story at this time, anyone who feels I am is wrong and can shut up) I have known women who do this, who fall apart so other people will put them together.

"Women" are not any one thing. We are individuals who have different thoughts, different motives and different ways of dealing with the world. For you to assume everyone of any group shares your views, knowledge and motivations is hubris of the least constructive kind. Don't lump me in with you, I don't know you, I may not agree with you and you don't get to tell me what I think, feel or should.
50
@44 Sorry you feel condescended to; I agree that women in general know more about all those things, but that doesn't mean a discussion can't happen.
51
Common sense advice is obvious by its very nature. Dispense it, but don't expect anyone to think you're amazingly wise and insightful, especially when the advice comes with a passive-aggressive dig at women who don't act as if every walk home is a rape in progress.
52
#30 - Who was doing all the kidnapping in "Cold War Europe"? The Russians?? The North Koreans?? WTF are you talking about?
53
@49 & 50: good on you, but both of your framing of the discussion in those terms does little to recognize the on the ground realities about gender related violence, i find that your arguments actually move that discussion backwards into a safe space for them to perpetuate again and again.
54
#52, You're right. Kidnapping wasn't the primary threat, bombings were. We were stationed at a NATO base and there were explosives found in my elementary school several times. We took different tour buses to school from our houses in the surrounding area so we wouldn't be obvious targets.
Kidnapping was explained as a threat to us and something we covered because of the unpleasantness in the Emerald isle and the smaller local political organizations for whom American children could have been useful bargaining chips. It was enough of an issue that the military thought to mention it so I trust they knew what they were talking about.

But we're deviating into red herring territory.
55
Here is the truth.

We should live in a world where women can walk home nude, nude, at two AM, where they could pass out spread eagle in the street. AND NOTHING WOULD HAPPEN other than maybe a trip to the ER or a night in the drunk tank.

We can't live in this world because men can't keep their dick in their pants or because someone is a power tripping freak that gets off on making someone else feel helpless outside of a consenting BDSM relationship.

Blame the rape culture, not the rape victim.
56
Goddamit this stupid comment servce ate my comment. Oh well, tl;dr, let me summarize:

1. This happened only blocks from where I live. I walk home from work after dark, as I don't own a car. So it's just a *smidge* personal.

2. The bitchfest above about women's agency and victim-blaming is nice and all, but stfu. You're missing most of the point here running around reliving your women's studies class.

3. The point being, any guy who's rubbing himself and trying to rape girls in public isn't just a Bad Man (tm). He's MENTALLY ILL for fuck's sake. I doubt you could convict him in a court of law.

4. Somebody let this man wander free without his meds. They are responsible for this near-tragedy.

5. I have seen obviously mentally ill people wandering around this Lower Queen Anne area since at least late last year, when I moved to this neighborhood. Horrifying as this is, it really was only a matter of time.

6. We don't prevent this by arguing about women's agency or ability to stagger drunk out of bars to demonstrate their American! Freedom! We prevent this by mercifully putting people this ill in places where they can't hurt themselves or others. If their families can't afford it, the government needs to do it.

7. Bring back the institutions now, or bring them back over the bodies of those who will die to protect whatever the hell we were protecting when we got rid of them in the first place. They should have been reformed, not abolished.

I am just this side of starting a campaign about this. FFS.
57
I find @56 to be mostly spot on. eom
58
56 is generally correct. Reagan hated mental institutions because he belonged in one. So he helped ensure they had their funding cut.
59
#54. Red herring or not, I think you're full of shit. I grew up on european military bases as well and never heard of any bombs being planted in elementary schools. Who exactly would stand to gain from that kind of pr if a bomb blew up a bunch of kids? But hey, if it makes you feel like you've lived a dangerous life, y'know, feel free to believe it.
60
Good for those who got involved. Better for society to get this perv off the streets.

He's not mentally unstable, he's a perv and a danger, that's it.
61
Also: BONESTEEL.
62
I feel very sad for the victim. My heart goes out to her.

Many thanks to the two brave guys who intervened and nailed the dude.

Let's all use the Buddy System, shall we?
Stay safe.
63
@56: "You're missing most of the point here running around reliving your women's studies class."

Thanks, I hadn't realized life is a womens' studies class.
64
@59: They were in danger like Hillary Clinton had to run away from snipers.

DANGER EVERYWHERE.

@60: "He's not mentally unstable, he's a perv and a danger, that's it."

Are you ever not full of crap? He's all three. Mental illness isn't all puppies and ASD.
65
@60
"He's not mentally unstable, he's a perv and a danger, that's it."


Ummm, I'm willing to wager that anybody who whips their dick out in public, tugging on it while pursuing their would be victim has more than just a couple of screws loose.
67
To all the men who sympathise with @2 who said

"People round here -- young female people primarily -- have gotten really, really lazy about (late-night, drunken) personal safety and the need to travel in pairs for you, and each other's, protection. I'm amazed how many pretty lil' thinks I see stumble out of the bar and into darkened streets without a clue about what could happen."

Don't think we don't know the logic of your argument. But that's no excuse for being ignorant and then defending your ignorance on the whole long and sordid history of victim blaming. please read up on it.

And in the mean time, imagine this. Imagine 99% of rapes happened to men. (man on man). And imagine that this had been the case for millenia. And imagine that going for a walk at 2:00 am you'd see very few men walking alone, but in pairs, if at all, and that there were about 5 times as many women walking the streets as men, and many of them alone.

And now imagine that you one day say "fuck it" and take a risk walking alone, because you're sick of living in a world where the women walk freely and men can't and then on that night that you say "fuck it" and you get raped. And then imagine it gets posted by an intern on slog. and then imagine the second comment (after the "isn't bonesteel an awesome name" comment, is about how men are getting lazy and thoughtless and this is why you got raped.

Imagine this was your life.

Because I think if it was the men who got raped 99% of the time, men would probably organise vigelante style and go after those rapists one by one without mercy, and not let the entire male population be terrorised by the rapists. (and yes, raping one group of people is a form of terrorism. Terrorism is something which causes one group to live in fear, after a small sample of that group have been attacked. It instills fear. That's its aim and its achievement.

68
@56 "You're missing most of the point here running around reliving your women's studies class."
point taken.

But as for all rapists being mentally ill, I beg to differ. What about brain damage, combined with ignorance, combined with a bad upbringing, combined with drugs and alcohol, combined with the lowest things this culture has to offer. I suspect that's behind rapes like this.

Check out the face of this rapist in Australia:

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/studen…
69
We don't know if the alleged rapist is mentally ill. We don't know if he was coked to the gills, has a TBI, was tripping balls, was drunk, or any combination of the above. We don't know if he was stone cold sober, mentally capable, and reasonably healthy. Speculation about the above is a little pointless now.

There's also a fallacy in the argument made elsewhere about comparing a car wreck to a rape. One is an accident; one is a purposeful assault.
70
Stating that women should buddy up when walking home from the bar at 2am and avoid taking shortcuts down alleyways isn't blaming the vicitim, it's common sense. We live in a world where rape and murder and other violent crimes exist, unfortunately. Buddying up and sticking to main streets won't prevent most rapes from ever happening, but we need to make some effort to protect ourselves.

@2 -- Calling a woman lazy after she's been attacked and nearly raped in an alleyway, or accusing all women of being lazy, doesn't help. It hurts. We need to look at her case and learn from it, yes. We don't need to name call.
71
There's an awful lot of college age kvetching going on here, and all of it bullshit. Every word of it.

What matters here, is BONESTEEL.

72
I hope the victim is OK and feeling better and getting help, if she wants it. This was not her fault. I walk and ride my bike at night by myself—it could have just as easily been me—and years ago I was attacked by two men as I walked 15 feet from the cab to the front door of my apartment (the cab driver pulled away as soon as I shut the door).

It would be wonderful if we lived in a world where women and men could walk anywhere they want and not get jumped, robbed, raped, attacked, etc, but we don't and never will. This shit has been going on for millennia. The fact is that women are more at risk in this world than men are: We are usually less skilled at defending ourselves and weaker. This isn't victim blaming; it's just reality. This is why Home Alive was the most awesome organization ever. It understood that women need to learn to fight back, because some men are never, ever going to stop hurting us. It's not victim blaming; it's common sense.

There are many, many things we do every day to avoid being victims. We shut our windows, lock our homes, cars and bikes (and if you don't, and you get robbed, many people would not sympathize with you). Some people learn self defense; others carry weapons, etc. For better or worse, in the world we live in, we can't simply live and not be bothered. So learn defense; take precautions; walk in groups; be prepared.
73
People angry at #2 are seriously fucking retarded and have taken their college-learned identity politics way too far. You people need to chill out and understand good advice when it's given. Fucking self-serious, over-sensitive morons.
74
I'm glad for all these men letting us know know what is best for women when we go out drinking. Next time I want to go out alone, I'll stay inside so I don't get raped in the bushes. Because if none of my friends are available to walk me the three blocks to my house, I know it would be my fault if I went home at two am like every other single fucking bar patron in the city, and along the way some deranged fuck raped me. Thanks for the advice fellows!

By the way, what articles about rape to you post advice to guys about how they shouldn't engage in sexual assaults against us? If you want to call us lazy and offer your sage advice to grown women about how they need a buddy system every fucking time they venture outdoors after dark, surely you have some equivalent advice to menfolk who are roaming the streets stroking their dick, right? Or is that behavior just par for the course in this world, whereas women living their lives not bothering these assholes is cause for a whole host of tips about how to best work around it?
75
75: You have issues that go far deeper than what anyone on this forum can possibly address. Do you honestly believe men go around encouraging their buddies to go stroke their dicks and sexually assault people? As a human being with a modicum of intelligence I will freely give women advice. At 2 am I'm sure as fuck not going to allow a female friend of mine to walk down a dark alley alone. I'm sorry that offends your feminism, but it's fucking common sense. Stop being such a pedantic idiot.
76
And what if there weren't people there to intervene? Then what? Was it condescending to help her? She's obviously the victim and shouldn't be blamed for the actions of some sexual predator, but she would have been safer with friends. And it's not sexist to say that.
77
Let's be intelligent here, not anti-male. @2 may not have stated his case with sensitivity, but the gist is this: Be careful, use common sense, watch out for yourselves and your friends. This is not victim blaming; this is smart. The world is cruel and unjust; that's a fact of life and it is never going to change. Focus on solutions, not on nitpicking someone's poor choice of words.
78
A MASSIVE THANK YOU!!! To the heroes in this story! You are truly heroic!

My heart goes out to the victim. If you read this, I want you to know that you are not alone in this world. People can help you, and to this extent, I urge you not to underestimate the potentially crippling power of this horrific event and find someone professional to talk to. The sooner the better. I hate thinking of you carrying around this horrible weight for years and years. You have been through a significant ordeal, which is putting it lightly. I strongly encourage you to seek therapy. My prayers will be with you. I wish you good luck.
79
@77,

Seattle is one of the safest cities in the country. Walking home alone in a very safe neighborhood (I've lived and/or worked in the Queen Anne area for nearly eight years) at night is an acceptable risk. The victim in this case had her wits about her to identify a threat, run away from it, and fight back, so she wasn't staggering home drunk like the condescending asshole @2 implied.

@2,

Go fuck yourself.
80
@77, I'm not anti-male. But words are most of what we have, and I think we should be careful with them. The first post here rightly acknowledged the inherent awesomeness of Officer Bonesteel's surname. We did not then get a comment about how pervy jerks shouldn't go around assaulting women, or an Atta Boy for the fine gents who caught and held him. No, we got someone saying that women shouldn't do things that men are allowed to do.

Rape is a cultural artifact. It is not biological; it is not genetic. It is not true that men in all cultures commit rape. We can change culture. It is no longer *as* acceptable to commit domestic violence; it is no longer *as* acceptable to drive while intoxicated. These things do still happen, but how our culture views it has changed. We can do the same with rape, if we have the will.
81
@ 80: ::Heart::
82
@77: As with everything in life, it's not what you say, but how you say it.

Advice is fine, victim-shaming is not. If you can't see the difference between the two, you should probably stop being "helpful" until you can suss it out.
83
If one thing watching hours of COPS while fucked up at night for years taught me - the guy out in the street without a shirt is probably guilty.

Ahem. Seriously. In all seriousness, I have a couple things I want to point out here -

1) - There is no excuse, no justification, no blame to be placed on a victim EVER in the case of rape. No tongue-clucking or finger-pointing is ever justified in the case of rape, or any other heinous human rights abuse. No rape victim ever "lets it happen" or "puts herself in a bad situation." Even thinking this way is leads us down the wrong path.

2) - That being said, it's not bad advice for people to be on guard at night but it's not as though women walking down the street "need an escort." I feel that #2 meant well but came across in a condescending, bro-ish way. Which of course, diluted the message.

3) - Rather than rehash the after-school-special messages here (we're all adults here) I'd like to focus on something else in this story. I'm pretty sure we can agree that society has a collective responsibility to help prevent them from occurring. Instead of focusing on "what the potential victim can do to protect herself", we really need to make it clear that we all have some measure of collective responsibility as part of society to keep these sorts of things from happening.
Male, female, it doesn't matter, keep your eyes open. Not just for your own safety but look out for the other person walking down the street at night. I've been a victim of random street crime in this town and have a permanent injury as a result, and the one witness I saw didn't do so much as offer me a fucking towel to mop up the blood. Kudos to the two guys who intervened rather than just "minding their own business." As a society, we can help make our streets safer by looking out for each others' well-being. Oh, yeah, and don't be a rapist. I guess I should bring that up too. But if you're reading this, chances are you already figured out that part.

4) Bonesteel will be the name of a cop on the edge in my upcoming, unproduced noir thriller.
84
Also, Bonesteel.
85
WOHOO! +5 FAITH IN HUMANITY! [/level up music]
86
As a male, I will do my part to stop rape by NOT FUCKING RAPING PEOPLE and I expect all of my friends of any gender to NOT FUCKING RAPE PEOPLE as well. Oh, and Bonesteel.
87
if women have to wear "less sexy clothing" as people are encouraging, perhaps we should just pre-emptively arrest all men who wear cargo shorts
88
People here who think rape is some sort of human condition that has always been here need to go read Christopher Ryan's Sex At Dawn.
89
Rape isn't about the sex, people who think it's somehow the woman's fault, it's about power tripping, ego, abuse. Anyone who is capable of rape is just evil, they are willing to destroy another person's trust in others just to feel powerful ... which is abuse in it's most basic form. Rationalize it all you want, rapists are not hormonally driven or even driven by instincts, they are drive by a lust for power. The mixing of the two is pretty much just a societal coincidence, by sexualizing everything the lines get blurred. Not society's fault though, again, the rapist is the problem.
90
Kitten Koder, please go re-read my post at 80.
91
@90 So .... we agree. Then my post wasn't toward you, was it? ;)
92
Actually, not quite. While the rapist is in charge of his actions, he is also shaped by the culture around him. Stating that a person is evil is simplistic and reductive. It implies that he would be evil in any society, at any point in history. This is not true.

Our culture (and others throughout history) teaches us to desire power, and that if we do not have power over others, this is a bad thing. It teaches that especially well to men. Other cultures don't do this. There are societies in which rape is unknown, or known as something that happens out *there*, not here.

I agree with you in that victim-blaming is not acceptable. But where the impulse to rape comes from is kinda complex; simply saying 'evil' doesn't get us very far.

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