Comments

1
You know what else is "creeping" here? This columnist's casual conflation of adult gay male relationships with pedophilia. Bad Amy. Bad.
2
Some parents can't stop thinking of their college age sons as "boys". If these guys can scam some nice gifts from a starry-eyed neighbor, then great. They most likely know tons more of what's going on than the parents! And if the parents "called the police" on behalf of these strapping young men as Amy suggests, what will the police say? Again, the stereotype has been excoriated at @1 and I agree.
3
Amy is known for giving very bad advice, but her "call the cops" in this case is her worst yet.
4
The older neighbor WAS asking the sons not to talk to their parents about his gifts and attention giving, which suggests to me that he was definitely aware of their disapproval. But I agree, with the addition that the parents should remind their sons that it can be cruel and immature to knowing toy with someone hoping for sex.
5
Coincidentally, I just finished Marc Fisher's article on systematic abuse of students at Horace Mann High School in New York, which mainly involved people between nine and 19.

One can't help but think of Dead Poets Society when reading it.
6
So what would your advice be if these were two girls in their late teens? Would you still be so confident that this was all on the up-and-up?

Whatever age the kids are, the guy is acting in a predatory manner towards them. It's hardly a stretch to say that this could get ugly if it isn't shut down quickly.
7
#4

No Shit, the neighbor is aware of the parents' disapproval. He was told By the Parents that they did not Approve of the Gifts.

His being secretive is probably just a "Hey, here's some cigars! Don't tell your parents how bad-ass I am", because there is quite possibly nothing more to this than a 50-something year old bachelor with no kids, a well-rounded income, and an uncle-like feeling towards the two guys next door that he saw be raised from childhood.
8
On the other hand, there are a lot of predator warning signs in the LW's description - overly generous gifts, violating parental boundaries, social fixation on younger people rather than the neighbor's peers. Given the ages of the boys in question, it would not surprise me at all if the neighbor was involved in sexual relationships with them BEFORE they left for college and feels freer to pursue things (more dinner & movie dates!) now that the kids are out of the house.
9
Back in my day, we called being 19/20 and taking gifts from older men who wanted to fuck you, 'being 19 or 20.'

10
Amy is advising the parents to call the cops and tell them what, exactly? That an adult might be trying to have sex with other adults? They'll probably drop everything and head right over.
11
If it is about sex, rather than uncleyness, then the whole "you, your brother, both at once, whichever" aspect is pretty creepy.

And while I hold with treating 18 as adult, 18-20 is a fairly naive, forming your boundaries time that sets off alarms if someone in their 50s looks on it as "Yay now they're legal, just barely, but still so delightfully malleable!"
13
Also, age when a December-June romance started is important. 55/24 doesn't bother me, but 50-21, starting at 45-16, does. If it is sex, and he started with oh so generous older person interested in you stuff when they were in high school, a far higher level of creepiness.

And of course it could be that he's just lonely and trying to make surrogate family from neighbors, or the parents are kinda nutty and he's just a guy trying to give the kids a sane shelter. And variations, and how to address each is different.
14
Gee, I wonder why the older guy might not want the parents involved in his attempts to have sex with their son. Certainly it's not their attitude, which has been so far level-headed and reasonable, and of course it's any of their business.

Yes, the parents should call the cops and press charges. All the charges.
15
I gotta object to the idea that we live "in the age of Jerry Sandusky." Certain terrible things are as they have always been—and should be brought to light—but should hardly be allowed to define the times.
16
I notice there are still no comments over at the Denver Post. Someone should probably let Amy know she fucked up hard.
17
@6, the advice doesn't change if one or both of the young adults are girls. You figure that people that age are sexually active, and you try to make sure they have access to birth control and enough resources to not need gifts from an older creep. But mostly you stay out of their business, because nothing makes an older creep look more attractive than parents treating you like a child and ordering you not to see him.
18
Actually, "grooming" in general is the manipulation of one person by another, often but not always for sexual reasons. Amy did not use the word incorrectly. Dictionary.com gives the definition as "to win the confidence of (a victim) in order to a commit sexual assault on him or her." I first heard the term "grooming" when I read about a secondary virginity program that included tips on how teenaged girls could avoid being manipulated into having sex when it was not in their best interests to do so.

The neighbor just seemed creepy and lonely to me. It didn't immediately occur to me that he might want a romance with the boys (especially since there are two of them and they are brothers).
19
@16: Huh? There are comments there. And nobody agrees with Amy.
20
Does the guy seem kind of creepy? Yes. Is he doing anything illegal? No. End of story.
21
There's an air of gay panic to that response - "Gay neighbor giving your kids gifts!? CALL THE COPS!!!" I read the letter twice and there isn't any mention of the neighbor's orientation, so she's making a jump in assuming he wants to doink their kids (who are legal adults capable of making that decision for themselves). Sounds to me like he's just a lonely dude - gay or straight - that likes having people around.
22
@19 - Huh. I can't seem to see them. Must be something blocked on this computer. Thanks for the heads up.
23
To listen to some people, you'd think the age of legal majority was 34. 19-20? OMG PEDO. The fuck?
26
Everyone involved here is an adult. Even if the 50 year old neighbor were to say "I'll give you expensive gifts every week for the rest of my life if you blow me just once" it would still be a proposition between adults and none of the LW's business. Your "boys" can decide for themselves what company they keep.
27

By the definition of Hero Project, every 3rd grade teacher is a pedosexual.
28
Even if the creepy vibe were correct, and mom was right in thinking that this guy does not have her sons' best interests at heart, flipping out over it is not the way to go. "I get a creepy feeling from that old man - keep your heads up, guys, OK?" I have young adult kids of my own, and they'd laugh at me a bit if I said something like that, but they'd also be a little wary, and, really, once your kids are adults, that's about all you can ask for.
29
When a middle-age casual business acquaintance flirted with me at a church function, my 21yo self had the following talk with my mother:

Mom: You know he's queer...?
GMA: Yeah, I know.
End of conversation.
30
How Amy ever got a column is beyond me; I've seen better advice from random commenters than from her.

32
I see this idiocy all the time.

Somehow the word pedophile got from "sexual interest in PREPUBESCENT CHILDREN", meaning up to 12-13 years old to any age disparity.

I have a feeling this idiocy is specific to dumb ignorant Americans.
33
The column linked to infuriates me. I was a kid (A KID, as in powerless and helpless and with no choice and no voice) who was victimized by a Jerry Sandusky. To conflate a grown man who is MAYBE interested in other grown men with my experience makes me furious. It doesn't blow the potential attempt at an adult seducing other adults out of proportion; it entirely MINIMIZES what happens to real children who are really victimized. I bet Sandusky's actual victims would like to slap the moron columnist around. I certainly would. Jesus Christ, what the bloody fucking hell is wrong with people?
34
I don't think the guy is creepy; the mother is.

My brother and I always had older adult friends.
My father told us early on about child abuse and that family and friends pose the greatest danger. But he also understood that children and teenagers can profit from non-sexual relationship with other adults than the one's in their family. And once we were of college-age, my parents didn't intervene with our friendships at all.

I think one part is the fear of child abuse. But there seems to quite some pressure in the US to have only friends of your own peer-group.
35
Just to cover all the bases, Panic Mom could ask the kids of the guy ever did anything dubious before their 18th birthdays. If so, she'd have a case. Otherwise, unless he's locking her sons up against their will... The fact that she doesn't mention any such suspicions indicates that either she's too ignorant to know the laws, or she's got nothing.

That such a stupid response should come from Ms. Amy "I believe porn harms all parties, m'kay?" Dinglebat is hardly a surprise.
36
@19/16 - it's clearly showing 0 comments to me too. I suspect there's a region or other filter to explain the difference there. A pity, i'm curious what her fans have to say about that police drivel.
37
Even if the neighbor totally wants to bang the brothers, so what? That doesn't make him a Jerry Sandusky-like pedo. A pedo is someone who is attracted to prepubescent kids. These "boys" are the same age as half the porn stars we watch. Sure, they're still relatively young and naive, but they are nevertheless adults. Legally able to consent, or not, to sex as they please.

I'm roughly the same age as the neighbor, and I will totally own that I lust after college aged guys on occasion. I'm pretty sure that doesn't make me anything like Jerry Sandusky.

Amy, you are a moron.
38
If your under 18, your protected by the law. If you're over 65 you're protected by nature. Everything in between is FAIR GAME! Cary Grant said that. Actually he said 21 and was referring to women, so this creepy old dude should make shure these guys are gay!!
39
All these posts on SLOG are all very well and good, but the person who really needs to read them is Amy herself. Contact her at askamy@tribune.com
I did.
40
@39: Good point. I did as well.
41
I agree - I was pretty floored when Amy pulled "pedophile" out of her a$$ about 19 and 20 year old young men.
42
Well caught, Mr Savage.

By the way, Ms Prudie is at it again. It was not enough for her to suggest that disabled women would be only too grateful to get a man of microscopic endowment. She has moved on to a male LW wringing out his insides in agony because he can't force himself to date his wonderful but unattractive women friends and like it, and who wanted to know what to tell them when they complained about not getting any dates, suggesting that he should match his wonderful but unattractive friends with men who can't "outkick their coverage". She did borrow that phrase from an earlier seeker, but the sentiment is still just as vile.
43
I went right to the "don't tell your folks" part. Then I read the "We used to be friends, but his gifts [given in front of us] were too generous and we told him to stop." I think these parents are trying to prevent their little boys (WHO LIVE AT COLLEGE!) from making friends with someone who used to be a friend. There is something they are not telling Amy and it sounds like they discovered he is not a Republican.
44
@14 charges for what? Guy may be a creep but he's not doing anything illegal. Having an honest talk about how the parents don't feel he's on the up-and-up will do more good then potentially destroying someone's life in an attempt to control other adults.
45
Amy printed a letter today from a reader calling her out on this one. She sort of admitted she overreacted, but invoked her own kids of that age, who are "legal adults but not yet adults, really", in her words.

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