>"if not squick-free, activity"

Really, Dan? Coming from a butt-fucker*? How is pegging any squickier than other kinds of anal intercourse, or other kinds of intercourse in general?

In, out, repeating as needed until liquids are produced. Isn't that the basic procedure for what makes most people happy in bed?

*using the butt-fucker-postive sense of the word.

I am reminded of George Clooney in Burn After Reading.

I salute you, OMFG - you're living the dream!

But on the engineering/plumbing required:

1) (no pump): he'd need to insert catheter in the woman's urethra, and run the tubing down the center of the dildo. Challenges that would quickly emerge include the catheter dislodging during vigorous movements, kinking the tubing thereby blocking flow, and having enough pressure from the ejaculation to make it through the tubing and past the sphincter - from what I've seen, girl ejaculate doesn't squirt as high (i.e. isn't at as high a pressure) as boy ejaculate.

2) (pumped somehow): either a catheter or some funnel apparatus to catch the fluid and then a separate pump to squirt it through the dildo. That pump could be external and electro-mechanical. I'd suggest a automotive window-washer-fluid pump as having the right flow rate, modest pressure, and running on 12 volts (safety first!). More elegant could be a piston or bellows pump within the dildo operated by the repeated compressions of the dildo and run through a check valve to create flow from the catheter/funnel into his anus.

3) But what about this is turning him on? The gender-bending aspects of not only getting fucked but also being ejaculated into? Could that itch be scratched more simply with a turkey baster? If she sops up her ejaculate, fills and lubes up the turkey blaster, and then does the deed, the solution is in the kitchen gadgets aisle of the supermarket and costs only $6.

there is the risk of having an ass-baby, but you'll be ok if you're on the pill

Don't catheters go to the bladder? Might bypass the Skene's glands.

But more importantly, catheterizing is one of the less pleasant things known to man. I really doubt the 'vigorous movements' would be the first challenges. Unless he happens to be getting pegged by a hardcore masochist with a medical fetish, and he's qualified to catheterize her (not trivial, can damage a person that way) ... uh... no.

Maybe you were just looking at it from an engineering perspective, in which case see above re: where ejaculate gets into the woman's urethra from. But from every other perspective, a resounding NO.

Am I the only one who read DAVIDinKENAI's detailed reply #4 in Sheldon Cooper's voice?

That's meant as a compliment, David :)

@1 I imagine it's pretty squicky to a gay dude.

@5: Your "ass baby" made me laugh.

New science suggests it's mostly urine, not that there is anything wrong with a little water sports.

Come in ny ass, and tell me that you love mee...
I'll come in your ass and tell you I love youuu....

@7: on the mark. Total nerd / geek / maker. Hence my Macgyver avatar. I could into the fit-testing of it on her, but I'd leave the full field trails to the LW.

@6: you're probably right - I saw urethra and thought "there's already a device for that" but, yeah, if catheters need to lodge in the bladder, then I've imagined a solution for a different sort of "water sports". Also, I totally agree - he'd need a hyper-GGG partner to pursue this.

@8: I wondered about that. But wouldn't this be as unsquicky as sex with a woman could be for a gay guy? Dan writes about cunnilingus, etc, all the time. This would have no visuals and no vag. The mere thought of girl juices flowing? Stare at the pillow and think of Terry.

@10 The study Dan cites only had 2 participants, but that one only had 7. 5 studies, at least, have found no urine markers, and present markers that indicate prostate analogues, while one found both urine and prostate-like markers, and then this recent one. Meanwhile, of course, actual women who actually ejaculate, and their partners of whatever gender who smell, taste and otherwise interact with it, report that it isn't urine, but hey, those are just anecdotes. A LOT of anecdotes. It's possible some women pee a little when they orgasm (orgasmic incontinence or something, Dr. Drew called it?), but it's pretty clear most female ejaculators are experiencing something different.

I am an anecdote, and it's not urine.

I am also an anecdote, and if the bladder is empty, it's not urine. But if the bladder has anything in it at all, urine will come out at the same time, so...mostly urine. Women don't have the valve men do that shuts off the bladder at orgasm.

@13 Do you have references for those studies (not to be confrontational but out of my curiosity).

@14 If you read the study, it is rather interesting: They had the women empty their bladder prior to sexual stimulation, and that prior to orgasm the bladder filled (they took ultrasounds), and subsequently emptied with the squirting event. The author mentions potentially studying whether sexual stimulation causes increased urine production in certain individuals.

The bigger concern in my mind is matter of back-flow. Female ejaculate going into LW's ass probably poses a minimal risk, true. The contents of LW's ass moving in the other direction? Much more of a concern.

Jesus Christ. Sometimes you don't know what you want until someone else asks for it.

@4, what if you used some sort of squeeze-bulb in the vagina to create the pump action, powered by either deliberate or involuntary orgasmic contractions? How dope would that be? I don't know if it's feasible, though. Testing would be required.

@17, @4 mentioned a check-valve, which is a pretty simple little piece of hardware that would solve that problem.

Oh, yeah, and OMFG? You're a true American hero and I hope this worked out for you, but come on, man, it's been four years! Why isn't this on the market yet?

@4 "Perfection is the enemy of the good." You don't need to save every last drop. As long as something comes out the end, it's a win. Also, you're pumping away with the thrusting itself, so who needs electricity? Why not incorporate two little manual pumps into the device that work from the thrusting? (Would this be what they call a 2-stage pump?) The first stage is a low-vacuum pump just to keep some kind of suction cup over the external urinary opening. It would have to have a pressure regulator/relief so as not to damage anything. (That'd be a terrible place to get a blood blister!) The second would squirt out under positive pressure any fluid that shows up in the vacuum pump. Each pump has valves to move the fluid in the right direction, so that answers @17's concerns.

When the pegger ejaculates, some will squirt into the vacuum pump and some will probably overwhelm the suction cup and squirt around it, but on the next couple of thrusts, whatever got into the device will be pumped out the end.

Now HERE'S a problem... How the heck would you clean this thing? You'd need some sort of device to wash it out or it'd be a bacteria farm.

Oh, dear... I'm a nerd...

I agree that the idea of channeling the stuff is a non-standard. There's no pressure involved to keep it moving.

And as for the rest of the discussion, kind of glad I'm not an anecdote.

@15 I'm lazy: I counted papers in the literature review section of this paper, which is several years old, so there might be more.

@21 I gather it varies hugely on whether it's all it's cracked up to be. For me it almost always is ejaculation instead of orgasm; I have to do it voluntarily, it 'uses up' the orgasm potential and gets me to the 'afterglow' calm without the climax pleasure. But it's rare, and it's voluntary, so I go there sometimes when I sense I can, because it's interesting for me, and hot for my partner. (And in certain situations because my dom orders it.) Other women seem to find it actively pleasurable or enhancing to orgasm?

22

Oh, I don't mean the act itself is undesirable. I just can do without the discussion about whether I'm peeing on myself during sex.

I do think it's really interesting to note that as much as doctors claim to know, there is liquid that comes out of women that they can't identify

@5 FTW. Everybody else: thanks for playing. Your certificates of participation are in the mail.

@24. Fair enough question.
Though I'd rather if I squirted, that it was some nice fancy sex juice, not piss.
Cause piss , as we know, goes in the toilet- usually.

Babies, blood, sex juice and dripping sperm Star@23, isn't that enough?

I'm an anecdote, and it doesn't feel like I'm peeing, it doesn't smell or taste like urine, and afterwards, I often still have a very full bladder.

Although sometimes I wonder. And then I think who cares?! It feels fucking awesome, and every man I've ever been with who's experienced it is over the moon.

@28 Same here on every count (but feeling awesome, generally). Of course I don't produce these giant prodigious amounts like some ladies do (and they put pictures up of the bedspread in these discussions, so I do have some basis for comparison) so maybe we aren't representative?

@24 Loads of people aren't into watersports and don't find the idea of pee (or the smell, et c.) sexy at all, so there's an emotional investment, for sure. Like you're trying to make something sexy about them and make it gross. I have a little bit of that, although I'm more in agreement with nocutename (since it doesn't have any of the gross attributes of urine, and it's sexy to my partners, enhhh).

I might also suggest that it's because historically, medical science hasn't been great at listening to women's experiences, especially sexually. Like, 'do women have orgasms'? There are still people claiming there's no G-spot, when the sex toy industry mass produces things that seem to zero in on the damn thing beautifully in a majority of users. It is frustrating to be constantly told that our experiences of our bodies and sex are not valid, and instead pointed at the 'authority' of a bunch of shitty pop-science articles overinterpreting often questionable science with contradictory results. That's probably where a lot of the anger comes in.

Dudes -- there are multiple kinds of ejaculate. Take it from someone who knows, that is to say someone who has discovered at least 3 so far. And they come from different places. It's going to be a difficult subject to study. Stimulation from the g, the a, and the u slots leads to different kinds of come -- for me, anyway. Different viscosities and different tastes.

@Cat in Fez: I actually do produce prodigious amounts (I didn't use to, but I've been getting more prolific with age), and for those of us who do (or those who sleep with us and want to do so in a dry bed, this is pretty helpful. The quantity is why I sometimes wonder if it is urine, but again, neither I nor any of my partners seem to care that much.

@31 I've read the raves, but so far it hasn't been a big enough problem to go after, since I very rarely make much of a spot -- so expensive for something that isn't much of a problem! Yet -- good to know it might get more extreme as I age.

Generally: Another complicating factor, in terms of the full bladder thing, is probably that full bladders often distend the G-spot and make that kind of orgasm more likely.

I think it's very unfair of the advertizing team to let dope adds be placed here.
For those of us having to pay top $s, and risk police raids at 3am, on a Sunday morning- it's quite cruel.

@24 Cat in a Fez mostly sums it up but I also think it's because people are quite familiar with what urine smells like and that doesn't match the experience of female ejaculate.

@1/@8: Pretty sure that was a tongue-in-cheek.

@31: Wow, what happened to "grab an old towel"? Am I still doing it the teenage way? (Not an anecdote, to my knowledge. But I have no idea how I would actually know.)

DAVID, all this time I thought your avatar was a pic of Dennis Quaid! I prefer knowing who it really is.

@36; I thought it was Luke Skywalker..

Squicky, really? Are we back to the dropped can of ham? We know you aren't into chicks, Dan, no need to keep making the point.

I had no idea who DAVIDinKENAI's avatar is. Thanks!

BiDanFan, an old towel isn't enough. I have gone through two towels, the comforter, the sheets, and into the mattress before. You don't want a repeat of that!

As a past partner of an anecdote (who self-identified as a squirter): Whatever it is (and in this case it wasn't hugely voluminous), the "asparagus pee" smell carried over from dinner into the ejaculate.

"Don't worry. Be happy." That's what towels are for - enjoying the sensations sure beats worrying about the sheets.

24

I think it's pretty obvious why people would rather believe that they are not involuntarily squirting urine during sex.

Would you still swallow if you found out semen was pee?

Or, you know, maybe you're not into that anyway. But you get the picture. We're socialized to see pee as dirty, and while it's not really unusual for that message to fail to connect, those of us who got it in full force tend to keep pee in the non-sex part of the brain.

(but, of course, pee isn't *actually* dirty so it really doesn't matter except in our poor indoctrinated little skulls).

Dear God, I am SO vanilla.

42

Me too, but it's fun to read about how not vanilla other people are.

Do a lot of women have orgasms while pegging?

As another "anecdote", I recommend the Liberator Fascinator Throe to protect the bedding while providing a large play space. It washes easily, feels good against skin, and lets us concentrate on fun without worrying about soaking the sheets or the furniture

Semen is pee though. Or at least it contains an amount of pee because it's in the same plumbing system. LIke most sex, if you think about it much it's squicky. The answer is not to deny the evidence in front of you, the answer is to accept the evidence and then not worry about it.

Back in the day, drinking one's own piss was a thing. Can't remember why now. Wasn't a part of the counter culture I really took on.

@44 I 100% agree. That throe is the best hundred bucks I've ever spent.

You guys know what sex is for, right? That's it- to make babies.
And as we know, after babies come squeezing down that passage, there's blood and stuff so messy, so it all fits really.
A world of liquid and messy stuff, that's what sex is and what comes from it.
Obviously God the creator wasn't too fussed with etiquette.

And gay sex, still liquid and messy stuff.

And yet, women still worry that they'll poop during childbirth. Because despite the fact that as a new mom they are going to be basically buried in poop for the foreseeable future, and that babies are sometimes born covered in it (that's a bad thing, though), pooping in bed seems way worse than having half a dozen total strangers stare at your vagina and wait for something to come out of it.

So just face it. People are weird.

And doctors used to taste pee for diagnostic purposes.

And if you think they are weird about pee, try telling an office full of grown men that those bottles in the refrigerator are filled with breast milk.

There's a a squick factor I've never understood. They *drink* milk from a cow, but when it comes from a person they don't even want it offgassing on their lunch.

Hey, there are too many creepy dudes who feel the constant need to remind everyone around them loudly that they are INDEED into women and to make sure everyone know how much of a boner each women within eyesight gives them. It's ok to balance that out with a guy who isn't.

@ wave_collapse #10
It seems that Dan long ago made up his mind what "female ejaculation" consists of, and any scientific evidence to the contrary be damned.
(I come to that conclusion based on his repeating these columns without any edits or footnotes)
I started pointing him in the right scientific direction way back in Feb of 2012 (quoted below)

What I can't figure out is WHY.
I can see why some straight males and females might buy into the notion that a female orgasm you can SEE (putting aside that most women will tell you "ejaculation" & orgasm are two separate entities quite often) is somehow a more sought after orgasm...since perhaps in their minds this makes females more equal to males?
But a gay man literally has no skin the the game.
What gives?

@ Cat in fez # 13 (care to link to those other 5 studies you mentioned?)
Never mind, I see that per your comment @ #22 that you HAVEN'T read the other papers.
I HAVE read most of them, and the problem with at least some of them is that they simply restate results from other past studies.
Repeating "bad" science do not make it true, no matter how many times you quote/reference it!

@ Neur0mancer #24 Thank you, thank you, thank you!
I've often wondered how folks with even a rudimentrary knowledge of female anatomy are convincing themselves there's some magical reservoir for this stuff!
And why they get so pissed (pun intended) when you try to point out there just isn't one and the bladder is the only option!

"From Feb 15, 2012
http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/Savag…

Pinky1352 commented on Savage Love.
Dan,
You said:
"You're not getting peed on. (Science says: female ejaculate ≠ urine.) But don't take my word for it, TW: Ask your girlfriend to piss on you sometime, and see if you can't tell the difference."

Can you point me to some actual science that PROVES your statement? From my own research, the only arguments that I've been able to find say that it can't possibly be urine because creatinine & urea levels are very low, and in some cases there are traces of PSA.

Extremely dilute urine will also have low levels of creatinine and urea. There was an interesting article, "Magnetic resonance imaging of male and female genitals during coitus and female sexual arousal" (BMJ British Medical Journal (1999)
Volume: 319, Issue: 7225, Publisher: British Medical Journal, Pages: 1596-1600), that shows just how rapidly the female bladder fills during and directly after intercourse and orgasm. Very cool MRI pics if you're into the science of it!
Link to article here:
http://www.bmj.com/content/319/7225/1596…

In short, rapidly filling bladder=dilute urine.

As for the +PSA, women also have prostate tissue (and yes, there have even been cases of female prostate cancers). This prostate tissue has ducts that lead into the urethra, same as in males.

Now the question becomes how we are defining female ejaculate? Are we referring to the smaller amounts of whitish fluid that women produce, some in more copious anounts than others (which originates in the female prostate), or as this particular writer is suggesting, the type of "squirting" that is so popular in porn now?

IMHO, dilute urine still=urine, even if it also contains another substance.
If you have a glass of coke and add some rum, and ice cubes that you wait for to melt, does that negate the fact that there's coke in that glass?
So "female ejaculation" probably equals dilute urine plus some prostate fluid.

MY hypothesis is that this is an evolutionary defense mechanism against UTIs. Having a way to create the urge to "rinse out" the urethra after intercourse (or even via stimulation DURING) should do a world of good in preventing disease. Add in what at least one scientist at Mt Sinai proposed to study, "Does female ejaculation serve an antimicrobial purpose" (http://www.medical-hypotheses.com/articl…), and I think we're onto something here.

This is from a woman who had never seen nor heard of it (yes, I lived a cloistered life ) before age 49 and taught herself how to do it, in part for the science of it. I'm still trying to get my hands on some methylene blue. I want to "come" in color.
Don't I sound like a fun lay??

The point of it is, I have no problem with folks liking this if that's their cup of tea, but please lets just call it for what it is!
(But if we actually did that, the porn industry might just lose some folks that are into this genre but not water sports, and we can't have that now can we?)

I'll let you know when/if I ever finish my full article on it ;) "

Pinky, that rocked my socks!

My husband I have landed on, "Whatever it is, it's nice to have it on the menu."

Yes Pinky, let's us know when you write an article. And thanks for your info.

"I am thinking about modifying a toy in a way that might enable her to squirt up my ass."
LOL! Men, I swear. They are so full of creativity. Ah men. Can't live with them, can't shoot them...so...just fuck 'em deep in the ass and pressure wash their insides with your natural juices :)

@45:Oh noooo. I really didn't want to think about that.
I'm fine about my own ejaculate containing dilute pee though; but at least nobody is expected to swallow that... Yes, people are very inconsistent.

@54 I did warn that I was lazy. Thanks for the better lit review and a clearer sense of the difference between ejaculation and squirting. That may explain some stuff about my experiences!

On your more psychological point, I think I've been less lazy: see my posts above about why people get invested and angry.

I for one would be happy if porn got away from so much squirting. That would be a lovely side effect of increased knowledge!

I actually remember this exact same question getting the exact same answer maybe five years ago in your column, just as a heads-up.

@60 That is because this is a reprint of that question from maybe five years ago.

@61 I can't believe I didn't see that before, I just thought it was deja vu. My apologies! I'll be sure to read more carefully next time. Sorry!