And, in that statement, people who are actually working toward equality, and not just screeching on a blog, have managed to sound more reasonable than you ever have. Congratulations.
Have fun electing anti-gay Republicants.
Wait, so the same people who blasted the federal case are blasting the feds for trying to upend it? The same people who had previously, in the case of HRC, said "oh, no trannies, none," before saying, "well, okay trannies"?

See, this is what gets me: people screamed loudly about the federal case, but when they get their wish to have it halted, they go apoplectic.

This is really just a play out of the Kennedy book-- court a group (black voters, in K's case), get their vote, back out on promises to protect certain voters (oh, poor southern whites), then the shit hits the fan (oops, bombs and Wallace) and you have to deal, so you have a Senator deliver a bill to you and put your name on it (tee-hee, noone but historians are the wiser) and send it to Congress. Congrats, an asshole becomes a saint!

I wonder if Obama will have someone wiretapped like Kennedy had MLK wiretapped? Ooh, maybe it'll be Dan?

It's shitty, but seriously, after the BS the HRC heaped on starting federal cases, I'm beginning to think that the GLBT "advocacy" groups are leaning over the desk in the Oval Office saying "Psst, just a few more years, alright?"
I didn't vote for the guy. I didn't trust the guy. I thought he'd be worse than Clinton (Hillary, that is).

And goddamit: I was RIGHT!
Obama is very intelligent. He must know he's going to be on the wrong side of history. I wonder if that bothers him.

I kinda wonder if Hillary would be doing any better...
I'm shocked that the notoriously whipped HRC had the cojones to sign off on this, but happy they did.

No, Will; it's time for queer Americans to DEMAND that Democratic candidates FOLLOW through with their promises after taking our money, votes and time. And if they don't want to do that, then we need to withhold our money, votes and time or devote them to third party candidates that have some convictions.

And does the Democratic Party REALLY want to lose our big, fat, gay, loyal voting block/billfords and risk splintering the party, much like what's happening to the Republican Party right now?

The time to put up with, "well, they're the best of two options" is coming to a fucking end.

It's time to march.
@ 3,

Would you care to explain your antipathy towards GLBT organizations?

You know what's most despicable about the Obama DOJ's arguments? They'll work. That's why major gay legal groups have asked people to hold off on federal lawsuits.

And do you seriously think that after all these betrayals that Odubya has a grand plan to help GLBT Americans? This is insane. We have to acknowledge that we're dealing with an administration that's openly hostile to our needs and our community and proceed accordingly.
and enough with the "Hillary wouldn't do this" shit. The Clintons INVENTED THIS FUCKING SHIT. They're the ultimate political machine.
one issues voters - the backbone of america.

how about the fact he's been in office for less than 6 months. he has 4 years. calm the fuck down.
and "a penny saved is a penny earned" and "a stitch in time saves nine!"

any other tired lameass homilies we want to trot out?

By the way Max; 41 years IS a pretty fucking long period of time.
Dan, Can we get a vote to move Obama to enemy's of slog?
Our PRIDE parades all across the country need to be PROTEST parades this year. We need to show Obama exactly how many of us are angry at being lied to and treated like 2nd class citizens.
@12: That is a DAMN good idea.
when I was a Republican, all of the Party apparatchiks and flunkies told me when I raised (personal issue X) "Just wait. It takes time. you don't want those nassssty Democrats in power, do you? Vote for us and we'll make it better...just not now."

It was a lie when they did it to me and it's a lie when the Democrats do it to (issue group X). Don't believe them, guys. Comments 2, 8 and 10 are just Exhibit A: they pretend to care, but really, they just want you to shut up and pull the lever.
All of this makes me want to shriek. And yes, I'd like my donation back too. But then last night my bf and I were watching TV, and caught that Taco Del Mar sneakily, yet blatantly, gives us props in their latest commercial. "Taco Del Mar Shark Attack" on YouTube, about 5 seconds in. (Surfer with the very visible GLSA - Gay & Lesbian Surf Association - sticker on his board). For what it's worth it made me smile. In spite of the disappointment with Big O, it's one more sign that for most of America, gay is becoming a non-issue. A decade ago this commercial would have caused instant outrage.
Yeah let's all calm down while Obama compares us to child molesters and pig fuckers. It's been less than 6 months guys, we should expect him to compare us to child molesters and pig fuckers. That's what needs to be done before he can make any progress with our equality in the next 3 1/2 years.

Fuck everyone who ignores what Obama has done. You're all selfish, closed-minded pieces of shit.
@7: Wow, spoken like a true Politizombie. Politics isn't the answer, it's the problem. Those groups, like the HRC, have frequently thrown groups under the bus (like urging support of a T-less ENDA), and they, in the vast exception of Lambda Legal, have generally done nothing beyond rebuttals to statements. Although at this point it would seem that Lambda Legal is a little less than sad about this, which I can't understand.

And no President, save for FDR, has really ever come out of the gate with a grand plan. They've had to make them up on the fly. Kennedy is a shining example, and true democrats worship him like the salt of the earth, even though he screwed black people over hardcore and even authorized what would ultimately lead to MLK Jr.'s death.

The DOJ has said lots of things, and they haven't always stuck. That's why we have 3 branches.
The calm down, "he's got 4/8 years to make changes" shit is also getting old...NOTHING on this front is going to happen in 2010 because it's the midterm elections; Obama starts running for reelection in 2011. 2012 IS the election year. And there's no guarantee of a second term.

and, as Dan points out, the BO administration is apparently too busy to make POSITIVE change for the queer community, but has PLENTY of time to stab us in the fucking back...that only took about 5 months.
Yeah Original Monique, it really hurt to say it, I've been a staunch wait and see there's a lot on his plate supporter, but I'm pretty damn upset.

Yeah, and let's do that with tons of balloons, glitter, half-naked fat hairy men in bubbly bathtubs, et al, all over the place. Nothing like a glorious circus in the street to be taken as seriously as possible, because that's just. like. them.
Yeah, yeah: I suck, I know. But it seems that mainstream gay orgs are as pissed off about this as I am, as John is. And we've passed the point of the Obama admin doing *nothing* and have arrived at the point of the Obama admin doing active harm. So don't tell me to "wait."

And I agree 100% with what Poe said in comment 17.
I don't wish that McCain/Palin had won, but yes, I do want my contributions to Obama returned as it appears he's just as much a lying say-anything politician as the rest of them.
Sure guys. But come 2012, when the President has done nothing for you, how much do you want to bet you're going to go vote him anyways? Because you'll let your friends and the Democratic Party scare you into doing so. "OOGA BOOGA Republicans!"
When are people going to realize that we need a third big party? I hate republicans and I don't like most of the democrats. There have always been other choices besides the democrats and the republicans! I voted for Ralph Nader and I am proud of it. The only democrat I liked during the primaries was Dennis Kucinich.

I listen to Dan's podcasts and always felt bad when he was telling people to vote for Obama when Obama kept saying that he opposes same-sex marriage. You don't have to vote for the lesser evil.

Anyway, my point is: get informed about the positions of independent or third-party candidates, you may like them.
Listen to #8


I'd also like to add, that any real change comes from the bottom up (not from the top down). Obama is smart and knows that. Things are moving in the direction of gay marriage but they're not there yet.

Remember, the guy represents ALL of America and the majority of this country aren't in support of it now. But they will be.

Chill. The Fuck. Out.
but the original Pride parades WERE political and not just an excuse to watch the make-up melt off the faces of drag queens or to see clapped out old muscle queers on bad homecumming floats or listen to fat, black, female R&B/Disco artists that no one's really ever heard of sing in gay bar beer gardens with $25 admittance fees ...maybe it's time to re-politicize Pride.
This thing from Obama's DOJ infuriates me, even when I separate out what some are calling the "hysterical" reaction. I've tried to digest this and to read lots of interpretations. This didn't have to be so fucking dismissive of LGBT Americans. But it was. And it gives ammo to the anti-gay crusaders. THAT'S what pisses me off to no end.

But whenever the gays get angry the "progressives" always start calling us hysterical. Funny, that.

Whenever I'm told to wait I seriously just want to break something. Fuck waiting. It's not like I'm expecting Obama to fucking fix everything right this god-damned minute. But I sure would appreciate a good word here or there in that bully pulpit kind of way. I'd REALLY appreciate action.

I mean, the hell? I will no longer support the Democratic Party until they start supporting me. And I mean *really* supporting me and not just scaring me with the idea of a Republican-run country. Fuck fear. Gays just survived 8 years of vilification across this nation.


Dear Big Gay Groups;


you filthy animals
Change Takes Time:

More than one recent poll shows that the MAJORITY of Americans are ready to end DADT.

Shut. The Fuck. Up.
you see? #26 won't STOP telling the lies. Recent polls indicate that a vast majority of the nation is in support of repealing DADT. We now have, what, five states with legal gay marriage? All it would take to put this issue over the top and finished for good would be a little leadership, but the spineless apologists for the Administration are poll-driven little pussies who wouldn't dare take a stand about anything without being absolutely sure no one ever opposes it....ever!

The repeal of DOMA wouldn't even be about gay marriage per se. It would be about reengergizing the Full Faith and Credit Clause of the United States Constitution. It would simply require states to recognize other states' legally-valid marriage licenses, kind of like how the states have to recognize your driver's license if you leave Washington.
obama isn't going to give the GOP a stationary target until 2012 is over. if the voice of the nation grows so loud that all he has to do is acquiesce, then you'll get what you want. but he's obviously not going to stick his neck out for this.

so deal with it. amurka is chicago now. politicians fuck over everyone but eventually change happens.

strangeways, i don't know what "41 years" means.
I'd like to add that this isn't just about marriage.

On every issue: DADT; the despicable lack of action on Hate Crimes legislation; ENDA; repealing DOMA; we've had a total failure of the DEMONcratic "leadership." It's been fun watching Nancy and Harry squirm and try to come up with new lies about why nothing can get through Congress, but it's over.

We need to withhold contributions to the Dems--it's the only thing they give a shit about, since they obviously don't care about leading or, you know, governing.

No, don't "wait", demand to be seen, treated, and recognized as fully equal. You are not doormats, and Obama doesn't get to wipe his boots clean on you.
I don't agree with Andrew Sullivan all the time, but I think this gives a glimpse into what some of us homos are thinking:

"[T]o file an actual brief re-stating some of the worst and most denigrating arguments against gay civil equality is just bizarre. They could have argued for a narrow ruling or kept the "reasonable" arguments to a minimum. What they did - without any heads up to any of their gay supporters and allies - is unconscionable. Citing incest precedents? Calling gay couples free-loaders? Arguing that our civil rights are not impinged because we can marry someone of the opposite sex? Who on earth decided that that was a great idea? Marc is right that this will be simply incomprehensible to most gay people. To have unloaded it after refusing to do anything on DADT, after failing to lift the HIV travel ban, after punting on even pure symbolism like hate crimes - well, it's no way to treat those who worked their butts off to elect you, as all the major groups have now said.... I'm baffled by this, I really am. The content of this brief is a massive political error from an administration that is making it impossible for its gay supporters to stay supportive. What's next? A Clintonian political ad boasting of these arguments?"

You and I both know if there were a nationwide referendum on gay marriage tomorrow, it would fail.

If you deny that reality, you are completely out of touch with the voters of this country.

Suck it. The Fuck. Up.
36 - there doesn't *need* to be a nationwide referendum. All it would take would be support from the Democratic leadership and the Administration to repeal DOMA. That's it. It just needs a majority vote from both houses of Congress.

So what's your excuse for the Democrats this time? I'm reminded of the abused girlfriend: "Oh, he promised me he'd stop drinking and hitting me. It was just one time!"

Suuuure it is.
Balt-o-Matt "But whenever the gays get angry the "progressives" always start calling us hysterical. Funny, that."

I know this is off-topic, but, I just have to say that this comment made me think how funny it was that the angry = hysterical thing applies not just to women, but to gays. Not "funny ha ha", but "funny ironic" and "funny how revealing it is in terms of how people view gays."

Anyways, more on topic... Slog should publish the places where we can give feedback on this. The DNC, the White House, etc.
What a bunch of hysterical screaming Mimis on this.

36 is right and nobody on Fuckital Hill can handle it.

Hey Kim miss Holier than thou about everything under the sun, I am just curious: what did you do to offset your carbon footprint from your trip to Seattle just to go to SLOG Happy? Or did you walk?
Max: it's 41 years since Stonewall.

Dumbfuck Change Guy: you need to learn to read. I referred to DADT in my post. DADT is DON'T ASK DON'T TELL. Recent polling has the majority of Americans ready to END it, yet the BO Administration does nothing. DOMA also needs to go bye-bye but you are correct in believeing that the numbers are not there yet, at least in public opinion, for it to be accepted by a public majority.

That doesn't excuse the Administration from stabbing us in the nutsack like the JD did today.
You know, if you just had voted for Grandpa McCain, you'd have gay marriage rights.

In Siberia.
oh and have fun marching - they won't even report your marches on the TV news so you're pretty much wasting your time there.

yeah, nothing wrong with getting upset and insisting on things, but let's just do a scenario - think of what if you upset the race in Virginia - and get an ultra-right House member - how does that help you? He ain't gonna vote your way - ever.
gee, Will, you seem like you have a modicum of intelligence. How, then, did it escape your attention that there are more than two parties in these here United States?

The Democrats have no incentive to help gay folks out because they know that people like you will constantly whisper and fearmonger in their ears: "BETTER THAN THE REPUBLICANS!"
You know what, Poe (and Dan)-- if that's how you feel, great, you are entitled to it. But as long you can't manage to make a constructive contibution to your cause, a lot of people like me (straight, supportive of gay marriage -- I'd vote for it in a hearbeat) will not give a flying fuck about you or your shitty little issue. So fuck you right back you asshole.
Biiiiiig surprise that Obama isn't sticking his neck out for gays when you guys call him and every one else that supports civil unions "bigots."


Talk about the abused girlfriend scenario. "You're a BIGOT for not supporting gay marriage, just civil unions....but wait, NOW I want you to put yourself out on the line for me and you're not. Fuck you! I knew you were a BIGOT anyway!"
25 - You're a fucking idiot voting for Ralph "the ego" Nader.

As for this brief, heads should role. Whoever wrote this should be fired and Obama should issue an apology. As AG Holder said "we are a nation of cowards".... and guess what, he's a fucking hypocrit. Along with his boss.

To cowardly to push a public option for healthcare... to cowardly to stand up for gay rights.... to cowardly to make the stimulus pure government investment, instead giving the Republicans $300billion in tax cuts and not getting a single fucking Republican vote in the House..... Too cowardly to release the torture photos..... To cowardly to investigate Bush administration crimes...

When is this guy going to stop thinking about re-election and start acting like the god damn Commander in Chief.
@17: understand - i'm angry too, i'm on your side, i'm ready to march - but screaming insults at people who still support Obama amidst this bad news isn't going to rally them to the barricades. stick to appealing to their sense of moral outrage rather than taking out your understandable frustrations on them.

no, i'm not saying you shouldn't act out. but keep the anger focused accordingly - otherwise, you'll simply drive the straight moderates further away, who in general avoid extremists of any stripe.

the religious right and their campaign against gays and equal marriage is easy to despise - it's hateful, spiteful, judgmental, irrational. some of the best opposition we can provide focuses on condemning those very aspects - not emulating them.

i recognize that sometimes the complacency of your allies can be as dangerous as the aggressiveness of your enemies - but they're still your allies, and what they need right now is a call to arms, not trash talking.
@45 - oh, was that the reasoning behind the DoJ brief at the court? "Gays CALLED TEH PRESIDENT NAMES!"

No, no it was not. Obama is the one who said the two words "fierce advocate". Gays didn't make him say that.

you keep saying that Obama shouldn't "put himself on the line". What about "simple majority in two houses and a signature" don't you understand? That's all it would take to make DOMA go away. Even less would be required for DADT.

you keep up the apologetics, though. How much does the DNC pay you?

I'm the same as you -- straight, supporter of gay rights -- and I agree with you wholeheartedly. Fine, go ahead and call us pieces of shit. And you'll lose the support of me and the rest of the people's votes who you need to win.
I confess that until very recently, I've been one of those "wait and see, it's only been a few months, he's busy" people. I was hopeful that he was just taking his time about it, being careful, etc. Hopeful that he'd eventually come through on his promises.

But this crosses a line. This isn't just stalling. This is actively opposing gay rights, and in an appallingly inflammatory way. I'm done with Obama, unless he reverses course and fulfills some of his promises.
since DAN isn't linking to wtf he is talking about (again) can someone here link me to these statements from Obama that must have just happened? kthanks
Andy_Squirrel: there aren't remarks by Obama, they are remarks made in a court brief from Obama's Department of Justice.

Aww, you poor thing. All straight and filled with rights, all the priveleges of walking around with your wife/girlfriend without getting ugly looks, without being demeaned by religion left and right, without the President comparing you to a sex offender, or someone enthused with bestiality. A young, fed-up fag is pissed off, has some smoke to blow, and that's just toooo much for you to handle. Yep, I've irrationally pushed the envelope way too far. Since I'm sick and tired of being treated like a sickness, the few (you and #49) who allegedly "support" my sexuality won't support it anymore because of this newfound oppression you have.

Yeah, I'm the one who needs to be the better person. I need to be patient and understanding. I'm the one who needs to back down, go back to the corner where I belong. Sit tight. I need to take this. Act mature, be nice, better yet, I should just go back in the closet.

I think it's funny how you demean my feelings of being compared to a child and/or animal fucker by my President that I voted for by showing me you're upset and/or angered with being told "fuck you". Guess what? Fuck you.
It isn't that change takes TIME, "slow-down-chill-out" assholes, it's that it takes ACTION.

Forgive me for quoting a bumpersticker, but IF YOU'RE NOT PISSED OFF - YOU'RE NOT PAYING ATTENTION

And it's not just this move by Obama's DOJ to continue to uphold what amounts to a modern separate-but-equal policy - Obama's completely abandoned any pretense of progressive ideas and attempting serious, forward-thinking changes.

Waiting is what sheep do.
44 That's all they're accomplishing with these hissy fits, alienating those who support them fully like you and on some things like me. The word allies is not something they'll be able to use anymore in the context of straights supporting their agenda, they wont even be able to use the word tolerance cause people will associate it with un-democratic tactics of intimidation, temper tantrums and now with attacking our President like Mr Savage does when they don't get their way. It's a really poor strategy. They just seem to be so out of touch with the rest of the country that its sad. They wont advance the cause of tolerance for them if they continue down this road. But maybe this is what they're really after.
Good Grief, you're stupid...Dan makes his fucking LIVING flapping his mouth about gay rights (and sex)...I don't always agree with everything that comes out of his mouth, but he walks the walk everytime he uses his voice to state his opinion whether it's on Slog, or in the NYT Op-Ed page or on Bill Maher or Anderson Cooper. And you don't even KNOW Mr Poe so how can you presume what he does, or doesn't do when it comes to making a "contribution to the cause".

What the fuck have you done lately?
All you gays should stop being so ANGRY because your rights are entirely provisional and depend entirely on people like ME, the straight man who will happily renounce my oh-so-generous and COURAGEOUS support for your equality as soon as you say something that sounds like it might be HYSTERICAL or offensive to my straight sensibilities. You've been warned, faggots.
@ 44 and 49,

Fellow het supporter here. Guys, please, we can never understand what this feels like. This is grief, anger, and frustration. It isn't directed at het supporters as individuals. Supporting someone, means exactly that, you support them. You don't withdraw, you share the grief, anger, and frustration. Try not to take it personal. Give them the compassion you would want if the table was turned.
Again, Hillary would have never done this to us.
I'm with Kim.
@46 (steve): Amen.
@58 agreed - i'm never going to withdraw my support for equal rights to gays and lesbians, whatever the climate. yelling? frustration? name calling? it's all good - i can take it, i won't take it personally, i know this sucks, i know you're mad as hell, yell/cry it out... but then let's get back to work.

my worry stems from alienating folks on the fence about the whole thing into a sense of (at best) an annoyed apathy, as they're want to do when the screaming starts.

if we're mad at Obama and the DoJ and the Christian right and all the gay haters, et al, awesome - let's organize, let's march, let's make our voices heard. let's get all the facts, the history, the allegories, the moral imperatives out on the table and show the world that our side is the side of history.

but if we're mad at people because they aren't as mad as we are, well... i'm not sure what we're looking for there, exactly, other than an easy target. they may never feel the associated pain of the oppression, but that doesn't mean they can't agree on its definition, and to recognize that gay rights are human rights.
A question to all the CALM DOWN OR I'M NOT VOTING FOR GAY MARRIAGE kids (44/49): if angry queers posting angry comments on some blog is enough to sway your vote, why are you even supporting gays in the first place?
@ 62 agreed. This is my interpretation of the " mad at people because they aren't as mad as we are". Who of us when in pain, want to be told to calm down and wait, or that we're acting like spoiled brats (as posted by another "supporter")? I'm guessing very few of us would like it. I think that is the reason behind the "fuck you" comments.
Thank you Kim @58.

Alos, Michael Strangeways, you are on top of your game today.
@64 you nailed it. 'fuckers' and 'fuckees', can we all kiss and make up in the morning? we gots work to do...

I'm not sure how many of them are real supporters as opposed to opponents who want to make us feel bad about speaking our minds so we will roll over and play dead.

If you support gay marriage you must realize that there are real lives and rights at stake. If you don't understand why people would be upset about the DOJ's action then, by definition, you must not understand the issue.
Wait a minute - so Obama himself read this brief before it was filed? Or Holder did? Or anyone in the White House did?

C'mon folks. Wake up. This was a pro-forma filing by the DOJ in response to a lawsuit - a lawsuit that ISN'T GOING TO GET US ANYWHERE even if it does move forward. The couple that filed it have NO case. The stuff about DOMA in the DOJ brief was designed to give the judge something else to fall back on in case the standing argument doesn't work.

You can't read too much into this. This isn't a sign the Obama administration doesn't care about gays - it's a sign the Justice Department is lazy!
"The Nader campaign supports full equal rights for gays and lesbians. While civil unions are a step in the right direction under current federal and state law, they do not afford full and equal rights."

- - -

This was here for the world to see last election cycle, yet, the MSM chose not to cover him, or other third-party candidates...since they would deal an obvious blow to the corporate-driven politics Obama is continuing...
Dan, your money means more to you than your vote?
Something like 40% of gay men voted for Sarah Palin. We had the most important election in our lifetimes and nobody can explain why that happened - casting a vote for war, economic destruction, fundamentalist christianity, racism, homophobia and against health care...If all you care about is gay marriage and you're going to vote republican and screw everybody else out of their rights once you get it, then I don't blame Obama for not jumping on a grenade for you. And if Palin got 40% of the vote because other issues are more important than gay marriage, then you got what you voted for. Either way, until you face up to the right-wingers among you, I'm going to focus on the rights of people with cancer to not go bankrupt.
I am also a straight supporter -- have been for most of my 46 years. Blow off as much steam as you need to, but it is still true that we are seeing a sea change like I've never seen in my life, among the public. I'm not saying to wait. I'm just saying, do what you need to do, but try to preserve that momentum. It's better than anything Obama does.

I am deeply disappointed in Obama's gay rights record. But while inarguably, this brief is despicable, reality is that he never saw it, he never read it, no one ever discussed it with him, or if they did, it was in the most general of terms. That's Holder's job. Now, Holder, I can believe this of. He was a judge here in D.C., and before that a prosecutor. My husband and I are lawyers in D.C., and have appeared in front of him. He's an asshole. Now he's U.S. Attorney General Asshole.
Just a note of caution Dan, when the rhetoric against a sitting president becomes to vicious, Secret Service may pay you a little visit. Remember who he is.
@71, "Something like 40% of gay men voted for Sarah Palin."??? No. Exit polls show that McSane garnered 27% of the gay vote.…

Of course, that's beside the point. The point is how far today DOJ memo went in claiming that gays are no more deserving of marriage rights than pedophiles and that the state has a financial interest in denying benefits to those who are legally married. Just try replacing the word "slavery" with "marriage" in this document and you'll see just how odious this argument is.
This thread is probably already dead by now, but, as a long-time lurker, first-time commenter, I have to jump in and slap ya'lls bitches' faces! Dan and most ya'lls sit around complaining about the White House's/DOJ's opinions about teh Gayz and how you want your money back because the lemonade you "bought" is too sour... your tongue is too raw!!!

But seriously, grab your balls, man up, and realize this administration won't do anything for us "gays" unless we change the political reality. If you thought listening to Obama talk about how bad DOMA was back in the Democratic primary eqaulled him overturning it within 6 months of taking office, I have some CDOs to sell you. (And come on, the President only signs or vetoes bills; he doesn't introduce them). Has he passed Immigration Reform already? Or even *talked* about it?

Here's a question for you wailing Siren Savage:

Has he changed any policies that affect African Americans? They voted him into office by over 90%. Surely, on the list of who can be upset or not be upset, they list above teh gayz. So, before you start crying... what has he done for them?

Crickets help put me to sleep; thanks!

He was a politician now, he was a politician in September 2008, he was a politician in January 2008, he was a politician in January 2007, and he was a politician in November 2004.

During the 2008 election, I don't remember you "demanding an answer" from him during *any* of those time periods about these situations. I'm pretty sure, you Dan, didn't get a chance to interview him and instead "interviewed" McCain supporters and made fun of them. And if I remember correctly, on Bill Maher's show you supported Obama uncritically... until he got elected; and then, post-January 20, you realized: "I see a MARKET!!!!"

Good luck... I guess? (Disingenuous comment?... YES!)
@73, there are parameters, very specific. Quit your insipid retarded fearmongering.
Really, is Thelea your real name? What the hell does that mean? I mean really. I'm Mexican-American and my name in Spanish is Marcos. Is Thelea in the same name family as Shaniqua? Just trying to understand.
Bush's fault...
@68. I hear you, but I also think you are pretty naive. I hope you are right--- and if you are, it will be really easy for Pres. Obama to clear things up during his next Saturday YouTube address . He can let America know where he really stands on gay rights. He can tell everyone if he agrees we should be compared to incestors, if he really thinks we are free- loaders for wanting marriage benefits, if he really thinks we aren't being discriminated against b/c we CAN MARRY STRIAGHTS, etc. etc.
And to prove it, he can call on Congress to repeal DOMA, or shit, do a SINGLE FUCKING THING that shows support for queer Americans. He hasn't done a single thing yet, and after today, I'm not holding my breath.
PS. Oh-- and I deleted my Obama '08 iPhone app today. Did I mention that already?
People, people -- marching is cool, but that isn't the way to make the changes. We all need to talk to our friends, family, coworkers and neighbors about equality and equal protection under the law, and why it's so important. And then, we need to work with our elected officials. This might be a great place to let off steam, but we need to gather our arguments, rhetoric and evidence, and present it to our politicians over and over and over again. We need to call, write, email, twitter, fax, whatever. Personal, hand-written letters sent by US Mail mean the most, and they take hardly longer than composing the others. Send a copy to the newspaper while you're at it.

Also, we need to be making appointments to meet with our Senators and Congresscritters when they come home. It's called lobbying, and regular people doing that influences those people more than the paid lobbyists do. Tell your story, and then tell it again. Tell it to everybody, and we WILL change this country. Sitting back and waiting for someone else to do it is the slow way, and I hope that LOTS of us will write, call and lobby.

The Religious Right is doing all this stuff, which is why things are the way they are. Let's beat them at their own game.

Valorie, a PFLAG mom from Black Diamond
The issue for me is not his work to defend the DOMA. Apparently some well-thinking lawyer types think there's justification in that. The issue is the arguments his administration made in the defense. Don't give me this "change takes time," "he's only been in office 5 months" bullshit. There's no excuse for the insults and lies perpetuated in this brief.

And regarding the issue of time, Obama is owned by Wall Street. His time is focused on catering to Wall Street and the investor class, making sure as many trillions of dollars in taxpayer money get transferred to them as possible. You can bet the perverted Wall Street cash-addicts are not fooling themselves with bullshit like "we need to give Obama time." They're extracting maximum benefit from Obama NOW and he is delivering.
@2 - I don't think that the option is between voting for Democrats who do nothing and anti-gay Republicans. Nor is the choice even about supporting third-party candidates. There is another option: Hijack the Republican Party.

The Republican party is shrinking rapidly, has no clear leadership, and is losing viability as a national party everywhere except the Deep South. If all the gays registered as Republicans, started voting in the Republican primaries, started pushing pro-gay candidates in the Republican primaries, and started giving cash to pro-gay Republicans, the gays could hijack this shrinking party in a number of moderate to liberal states. Given that the rich urban homos could donate more money than the poor rural (and toothless) evangelicals, I see this as a viable option.

After all, the Republican party was started by a big homo, and is headed by tons of closet cases. Maybe it's time to send them back to their roots.
This kind of shit is nothing new. The only reason DOMA and DADT even exist is because Bill Clinton signed it into law. Obama -- like Clinton -- is playing politics, kicking the can down the road, because he's too afraid that supporting the geighs will cost him political capital. It's the same story with his draconian moves on government secrecy, warrantless wiretaps, and civil liberties suppression.

I donated to Obama's campaign, hoping he'd be better than this, but my brief moment of optimism has been completely shattered. This latest move by his administration is just the maggot-infested cherry on top of a shit sundae.
Equality is where you find it. Imagine the NY state senate, (now run by the Republicans), going ahead with the offer to put the same-sex marriage bill to a vote next week. Now, imagine the New York Republicans giving just enough YES votes for the bill to pass and be signed into law by Gov. Patterson. Would I, as a gay man, actively support Republicans who pass this legislation in my own state? Damn staight I will. Just as I won't support Dems who won't support equality legislation. Loyalty is earned, not demanded.
@84 - I was just going to mention NY. The calculus has changed. Democrats ignore us at their peril and smart Republicans are starting to figure that out.
It really is disgraceful and hypocritical of the Obama DOJ to have put this argument forward. I am still glad a republican is not president but if Obama wanted to treat us as badly as Bush did why he voice support as he stabs us in the back like this.
It is time for the Supreme Court to do its job. We have three branches of government for precisely this reason. Alexis de Tocequeville predicted that Americans didn't know that even democracy has limits. We are not wasting time because this needs to be resolved asap, but it is slowing our efforts to deal with global warmining, use of fossil fuels. The difference is this could be done with a pen or a keyboard all at once. Mind your own business cyrpto-fascist-christians (i put christians in lower case because the Jesus I grew up with loved people). robert, denver
One final word on this issue. NO, Obama did not personally write this brief. Nor did Eric Holder. But who was the totally stupid fuck in the White House who let this event slide on by without raising a BIG red flag to both of these guys? As in "RED ALERT! RED ALERT!" You'd think that a constiuency of several million voters/donors would warrant somebody's attention before this shit hit the fan. Or do we count for that little?
74 - voting for Republicans isn't going to give you gay marriage - who would have more credibility to put an end to DADT than John McCain? And he won't touch it. And you knew that. But a huge percentage of gay men voted for Palin and McCain anyways. Is it possible gay marriage and DADT and DOMA are not the most important issues out there for a huge percentage of gay people?

Bottom line: I voted for Obama because I wanted a more equitable tax system, health care for me and my children and a foreign policy that involved something other than starting wars. A lot of gay men voted for Palin because they wanted favors for the rich and could care less about health care for kids. If you want me to get really, really worked up about the DOJ memo, then you might want to prove to me that you care about my rights too.
89: Holy shit, what's this rationality crap you're pulling. You just blew my mind.
It's important to realize something: 6 months is already 1/8 of an entire term. 1/8 is significant because it's been 1/8 without significant movement on progressive policies, with mainly war and bailouts for the superrich to show for what they've been doing with their time. Those who still say give him more time are like some Obama zombie army. This is the only mantra they can repeat. Well, repeat after me, change happens when you enact change, not when you talk about how it's coming. Obama is a conservative who got involved in community organizing to learn some good techniques, then strategically rode a wave of popular discontent into the white house, where he is doing very little to help the kinds of people he would have been organizing back in Chicago. He uses whatever works, but he is as much a tool for the capitalist powers as Bush, just a smarter one. He turned "change" into a future tense, where it will always reside, just a little bit further along, just keep going along, as we approach the cliff...
This might be news to Sloggers but outside your little bubble your two pet issues - gay marriage and legalizing pot - are irrelevant to most Americans who are more worried about their jobs, their kids' educations and keeping their homes.

I know that might be hard to fathom while standing on a bar shaking your tickle-tackle at all your mates, but you are not, to be polite, of great interest to most of us.
Folks, here's my suggestion. An area politician to whom I had contributed money voted FOR DOMA. I sent her a letter expressing my dissatisfaction for her vote and demanding an explanation and a refund of my contribution. Every piece of literature she sent to me (including an Xmas card with pix of her MARRIED" children was returned with a request for an explanation of her vote and another request for a return of my contribution. It took a while but I did get a refund of my contribution (but never an explanation of her vote). I suggest that everyone here who contributed to Mr. Obama's campaign begin by WRITING a letter requesting a refund and why!! Money talks, BS walks. DO IT!
90: Not sure I understand your comment. Rationality?
you very funny boy!
shutup you dumb faggot. there are more pressing things to worry about at the moment. Like how to feed my family, and how i can fight a war in Iraq that YOU FUCKING SUPPORTED. Shut your goddman faggot mouth, bitch. Go exploit your son some more and teach some great "values" about infidelity. Savage, you just need to get your fucking jaw broken, bitch.
What's pathetic is Join the Impact Seattle's self-loathing fawning over Patty Murray, a homophobe who voted for DOMA. Queer groups that make excuses for homophobes and think letters are a better substitute than real rights should be regarded as obstacles to our struggle and not leaders.
It's time to call out the right wingers in the lgbt rights movement... You can see their comments on every lgbt thread here. They insist we beg for our rights. They say NEVER is the best time to march. They make excuses for every homophobic politician from Obama on down to Greg Nickles. They never attend a meeting or an action, but post comments on blogs. They talk about "proper procedures" and generally have no understanding of the lgbt rights movement or civil rights movements generally. They will defend Fred Phelps' right to be anywhere, but argue against equal rights supporters being visible. There is a left wing in our movement and a right wing and finally the left wing is waking up.
Maybe Melissa Ethridge should meet with the President, he can tell her he has all her records, and she can come back to the gays and tell us he is OK.
You may not be able to take your vote back, but you can sure as hell make sure he doesn't spend 8 flippin years in the house that George built. It is easy. In 2012 you boot his ass out of office, just like you put him in there.

Come join us at and start voicing your concerns.

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