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800 Maynard Ave S, Suite 200, Seattle, WA 98134
800 Maynard Ave S, Suite 200, Seattle, WA 98134
I'm at a bar, one pint down. I say go for it! If you're 50, your kids aren't little anymore.
Just don't bitch when you get rejected or caught.
When my dad was 50, I was 5. The better indicator of age of the kids is the length of the marriage.
(That's my excuse & it works very well :D )
Of course, I'm the type who tells her husband that she finds someone "crush" worthy. And, I listen when he tells me he has seen or met someone "crush" worthy. Maybe, we are at peace that being happy, committed, and married does not equal either blinders or sudden demise of our sexual beings. But, what do I know, except that guitars are lovely to play, whisky is lovely to sip, and Huckabee said something dishonest, in my opinion, again.
Maybe, the LW could unlease some of that "crush" desire on his wife? It would sound good to me, anyway.
That isn't true, of course. Lots of people don't like to make eye contact for all sorts of reasons, including cultures that consider it rude to make extended eye contact. But enough people have been taught that one ought to make and keep eye contact that it might be nothing more than that, and she might be seriously creeped out by you viewing it in a sexual manner.
I guess it's sunglasses or no eye contact from now on. Gross.
Exquisite tension just doesn't get its due and it's hard to come by, too.
Dude, this happens! Crushes happens and crushes are awesome! Heck, I wish I had someone to massively crush on right now for some inspiration.
I lust after girls every day. I work downtown, there are a lot of young women in tight little business suits, and not a day goes by that I don't imagine fucking one of them. That's lust.
I would never actually fuck one of these girls. I just picture my girlfriend's face after she found out: the hurt, the betrayal, the complete shattering of what she thought was our happy life. I would rather chop my own leg off than do that to her. That's love.
Really. The odds are a million to one he's never crossed her mind. She probably looks at people when she speaks to them because it's polite, and/or he's selectively ignoring all the times she looks away.
Does he really think he's that much different than every other 50-year-old who has unsuccessfully tried to hit on someone two+ decades his junior?!
URoEC? WTF? My rule is that if they stare into your eyes long enough to say "let's fuck", they are probably sexually into you. Otherwise, who knows and who cares.
You got a perfect life, don't muck it up.
Spot on advice, Dan. Don't drink yourself out of it.
I can't wait until people start calling Dan "Gramps"
Otherwise, the advice is spot on.
That said, if he's been married to his wife for 25 years, she's probably had enough experience with his idiocy to forgive him.
Unless there is unmistakable evidence of intent-- I'm talking hand on your thigh, "why don't you come over," etc.-- then you should stay the fuck away from kids more than two decades your junior.
1) Young people may just be socially freer in general, so what qualified as "totally flirting" in your day might be just "talking" now.
2) Young people might be totally not monitoring their own behavior about signals AT ALL because you're so totally not on their radar as a prospective partner (and yeah, as far as we're concerned, people old enough to be our parents are considered, for our purposes, functionally asexual) that it would never occur to them to be mindful of inadvertent "signals."
Exactly. This is a truly pathetic situation. @18, the 50-something dude dropping Viagra hints to the 20-something chick had me wincing. Are you kidding me??
What is it about you sad, middle-aged, paunchy dudes that actually think you have a shot with attractive younger women? You think we secretly fantasize about stroking your graying man boobs, as you talk about your kids & your mortgage payments?? *barf* Let it go, old man, let it go. Save yourself the embarrassment.
And although this has nothing to do with the LW's predicament (heh), I had a bit of an epiphany in Vancouver, which might be applicable to any other middle aged female sloggers out there who love the fun of flirting, but not the consequences, and apologies if I'm the last person on Earth to figure this out: Gay bar. Spend the whole night dancing with gorgeous young men who tell you they love your hair and your jacket, think your boobs are "fun", but confine the make-out sessions to the other cute boys. Total ego-boosting evening with no guilt whatsoever. Sigh.
If the only time you see her is "in mixed company, with other mutual friends and family," then you aren't friends. You're acquaintances, and you've mentally elevated your interactions to "friendship" because you want to get into her pants.
Think about the people who are your actual friends. I bet you call them on the phone from time to time, hang out, meet for lunch or dinner, maybe plan vacations together, etc. Do you have that level of interaction with this young women? Nope.
Now think about the other people you only see in mixed company. There are lots and lots of them, and I bet the overwhelming majority are not your "friends." They're just people you may like and interact with from time to time.
So why is the 25-year-old the one shining exception?
While I know he's probably an exception rather than a rule, I'm just gonna throw Alan Rickman's name out there.
@32: Sorry, sister, but you do not speak for all women. As someone who's spent some time in academia, I know more than a few 20-something women who have fucked their middle-aged professors, and one who ended up marrying him. Anyway, this guy isn't even her professor.
BTW, if you are making goo goo eyes at men just to be nice, you should probably stop. None of my female friends (who aren't interested in me) do that.
It's exceptions like you that make the rest of us have to put up with dirty old men hitting on us. And your existence also puts false hopes into the hearts (*ahem* let's be honest, the *cocks*) of saggy-balled grandpas everywhere.
Attention: MAJORITY of old dudes, the thought of fucking you makes MOST of us want to wretch out our intestines. Don't flatter yourselves. Go fuck your saggy wives & leave us alone.
Or she might be totally fucking with you just because she can.
I think I should try again. But maybe I need to find the old person gay bar; all the young people puking on old folks has me kinda depressed. Saggy wives indeed :-(
The point of my little anecdote was that it is really fucking disturbing when people you see as essentially asexual and harmless suddenly express a desire to fuck you. Hot cougars come off as neither asexual nor harmless.
This bar had a nice age-range, from 20s to 40s, I'd say. Danced my ancient, saggy, 46 year old ass off, I even managed a few without my walker, and my orthopedic Fluevogs had a good grip on the floor...the best part was being able to keep my dentures in all night--SeaBond rocks!
NEVER underestimate the predilection of young, hot women to entertain themselves by mindfucking older men.
Anyone who isn't constantly gazing at their belly button knows that no-one escapes time. The beauty that lasts a lifetime is internal, it does not lie within the human body's biggest organ. I personally find that time can make people more beautiful, because it can make us more humble and more compassionate. I also think that fine lines can reveal if you are a joyful person with the ability to laugh at yourself and life. We earn the face we have in the autumn of our lives as my 90 something grandmother would tell you. We also earn the perception that others have of us through our actions. Integrity and compassion are far more beautiful attributes than a flawless complexion or perfectly pert tits or rounded bundas. In my opinion a great beauty isn't born, she (or he) is made over the course of their life. And, your transparency, EricaP shows you to be lovely, in my opinion.
Cheers!
I'll bet you (I'm assuming you're male?) have a number of friends--just friends--that you expect consider you an interesting & worthwhile person, and you enjoy that. Now, think about existing where roughly half of the population acts like their basically incapable of holding you in that esteem, because in their calculation you're "interesting & worthwhile insofar as you might potentially be fuckable." It's kinda limiting.
Completely wasted on the youth.
Completely.
I cannot say that enough.
Every single straight or bisexual man that they know well, with the possible exception of family members, has masturbated while thinking of you. Also, lots of men you don't know well.
Even if you are homely, even if you are missing a limb, the guy will one day ponder "I wonder what she does in bed... does the artificial limb come off? does the wall-eye stare off into space while she has an orgasm?"
Just ponder how many times a man you know has ejaculated into his hand while thinking of you, and try to estimate how many total gallons of semen have been squirted in your honor.
The old guy is no more creepy than the rest of them.
Get over it, and get over yourself. You're both a person and a sex object, and being one does not diminish the other.
We did know each other, so it wasn't as horrifying as it could have been. And on top of that, I actually did have a torrid fling with a man in his 50's sometime before that. With a man who looked his age, even, and wasn't rich (since that's the usual assumption) but hey, we sparked for some reason. It happens, clearly. This other guy, well, worried me a bit with the one-sided outpouring of love. I probably would've gone on a date if he'd just asked me out. (Those were the days!)
FWIW, I'm a middle-aged guy who goes out dancing quite a bit. I don't hit on anyone - I'm married, and I'm kind of shy. Yet younger women hit on me (very hard in a few instances) all the time, more so even than when I was in my 20s. And I'm not surprised - I actually have way more going for me at this age - emotionally, intellectually, financially, and sexually - than back when I was the insecure fool that basically every 25 year old boy is. Too bad for them I'm not available.
Our parents all had sex. Most of us don't ever want to think about it. And if someone tried to make us think about it, we'd be within our rights to tell them to knock it the fuck off.
It's the same with masturbatory fantasies. You don't have a right to force other people to become participants in your sex games, even if those games are single-player.
Brains, integrity, and compassion is always an irresistible combination, in my opinion.
Best wishes to you and your's.
Thank you.
Those who aren't are the exception rather than the rule, and yes, can be VERY hot. But take your average 50 year old, odds are, no. Not fuckable. Not anyone you would even want to think about fucking, or wanting to fuck you.
And I have been asked out by 2 such men at my job, one because I''m cute and had to be in an office with this person to go over his accounts, the other because I was just chatting since there was no one else to chat with while I waited for my boss to finish a meeting and he did some phone stuff. The first-then and now--gave off creepy vibes, so I refuse to be alone with this person. The other couldn't take a fucking "No, not interested" and proceeded to ask me out twice the following day.
Sure, some cute young thing might be one of those interested in fucking older guys (or any potential money an older guy might have), and you'll never know unless you ask, but for God's Sake, have some respect! A woman isn't a fuck object first. Second, maybe third, sure. But she's a person first. And no means "Seriously, I do not want to date, touch, or fuck you, or even interact with you without at least 5 witnesses in the same room".
ACCEPT IT!
Screw the haters, you three are the sexiest ladies on SLOG. Good god, what I would do to get in bed with the three of you, in whatever combination (assuming our relationships were all open, of course). You amaze me. The fact that women like you exist assures me the universe is good.
On the one hand I'm a moderately attractive 23 year old woman who has had a LOT of "nasty old men" (and nasty young men too) hit on me. I hate it! Because I see the spark in their eye and I know they're thinking about sexual scenarios with me in them and it gives me major heebie jeebies.
On the other hand, I look at hot guys all the time and occasionally imagine them naked and/or in bed with me.
Plus I know I'm going to be old one day (at least, I prefer that to the alternative) and I imagine I'll still look at hot 20-somethings and think, "Oh, hot guy."
But still, much older men (or women) need to expect that pretty young things won't accept (or appreciate) their advances. I refuse to date anyone 30 or over at this point in my life because I want someone who's going through the same (graduate school) things that I am.
I was going to point that out myself, but was trying to stay balanced on my soapbox.
Though it was nice to realize I'm not picky, I just have standards.
I can't help thinking that all of the folks saying "getting hit on ain't no big deal" are men who have never experienced just how inappropriate this can be. When I was 16, my best friend's mom came on to me in a big way. This woman had known me since I was 8. It's very unsettling when you have to be around someone you previously felt "safe" with, and whom you know is picturing you in a variety of scenarios. Among other things, you have to be on your guard all the time, and make sure you're never in a room alone with them.
I imagine that girls who are even moderately attractive have to put up with this kind of shit on a regular basis.
Well, you get hit on twice at work, you tend to be VERY careful around all male clients, watching your behavior, trying to avoid anything akin to flirtation, even with the clients who have never shown the slightest inkling of interest.
Trying to be professionally polite and friendly without doing anything that could possibly be interpreted as flirtation is nearly impossible, and very stressful, no matter how seriously your boss takes employee safety.
If you want an easy way out, I think I scare people away by whipping out my DS and playing Pokemon. It's worth a shot.
Old people, you will be looking at youth and thinking dirty thoughts, but try your damnedest to not get caught. Whatever you do, don't ask them out. If they're interested, let them ask you out.
Young people, accept that your youth and beauty are attractive to people, even and especially old people. If old people are fairly discreet in their glances, and don't actually hit on you, please don't "hate it" and get "major heebie jeebies" if you occasionally catch them looking. If you're out of high school, you're old enough to accept that most people think about sex a lot. Even your parents.
It's has the URoEC changed and the answer is yes. On June 8, 2010 one URoEC was worth 1.19 DoLLaRUS but now it's worth 1.37 DoLLaRUS.
Or, you could keep your dick in your pants and continue to enjoy the great marriage and loving family you have right now.
If you ask me, your friend who asked how long you've been fucking the younger woman was probably just trying to pay you a sleazy, jokey compliment. And you're acting like that plus some eye contact somehow equals an invitation from her? You may be in your 50s but please grow up! The eye contact rules don't exist, they sound like something my friends and I would have made up when we were 13 so that we could convince ourselves all the cute boys had crushes on us.
And even if she is genuinely being flirty with you - how do you know why? News flash, sometimes we young women flirt with older men because to us you're "safe" to flirt with. If you're happily married maybe she figures each of you are getting a little something out of your little connection... she gets to flirt with someone who she figures won't take it seriously enough to press the issue or get too emotionally involved, and you get some reassurance that you still got it goin' on, and some sexual energy to take home to wifey.
Why ruin a good thing by making it all complicated? Just sayin'.
Dude is in trouble.
Assume young women who stare at you this way are just teasing you. Guilty until proven innocent. She doesn't want sex with this guy. There are lots of these women around. LW is having a mid-life crisis so he's finding it hard to deal with this particular crush who is clearly flirting with him.
Oh, and young ladies? I'm 47, BMI 17.4, I look 35, my balls are not saggy, and I have absolutely no interest in fucking you. You must be at least 40 years old to go on this ride.
I'm surprised that people just assume that younger = hotter for everyone. I'm 39 and wouldn't go near anyone under 30. Not enough experience or character to be interesting.
At one point, I had to excuse myself for a nature call. Leaving the private dining room and crossing the main dining room, I saw an attractive man in his early thirties following me with his eyes. "He must be interested in me," I thought, my ego swelling. Then I realized that, because I was wearing a tuxedo, he probably thought I was one of the waiters, and the only interest he had in me was that he was interested in me filling his water glass.
Moral: Some men in their fifties are genuinely hot. But even when they are, people in their 20's and 30's usually want somebody their own age.
Having said that. This letter reminded me of two particular men in their mid-50s from my dance community, both of whom I regularly see trying to pick up every 20-ish woman in the room. One, who's never been married or had children, dubs himself a "life coach" who offers very pricey seminars on "finding your soul mate." He will not be seen dancing with anyone over 25 or any woman with more than 15 extra pounds on her (this is 4 years experience dancing 1 to 3 times per week in the same room with him).
The other dude approaches young women in the dance community with this speech about wanting a "real" "spiritual" connection. Just yesterday, I kid you not, some female dancers were complaining about being grinded up on by perfect strangers on a dance floor, and he chimed in to request that we, to use his words, have a "dialogue" so that we "can all get our needs met." His "need" was that it was just too hard to resist watching a hot woman dance.
So, it seems to me that a distinction should be made between a genuine mutual attraction between two specific individuals and an entitled middle-aged man who "trolls" for young women. I've seen the latter, and they are indeed creepy. And, in the case of the ones I've described here, laughably self-deluded about their own motives.
Other than leaving out that option, GREAT RESPONSE, DAN.
She is your coworker. Repeat: She. Is. Your. Coworker. If that doesn't get through your skull, let me try again:
SHE IS YOUR COWORKER. DO NOT GET YOUR PUSSY WHERE YOU GET YOUR PAYCHECK.
Do you want to be the target of office gossip? Or the reason everybody feels vaguely uncomfortable when you walk in? Want to mess with somebody's professional reputation--like yours? Want to saddle a sweet young thing with the reputation of the office bicycle, which you can do even if you never see her with her clothes off?
Say you make a pass at her, and she complains to her (your) supervisor. Do you like this woman enough to lose your job over her?
No? Then KEEP YOUR DICK IN YOUR PANTS. That is all.
That was amazing.
1. She's 25.
2. He's been married for over 25 years.
Is this young lady a friend of his eldest child? For gods sake, stay away.
When I dated someone young enough to be my son (entirely unexpectedly) who'd had almost no experience, my instinctive reaction was long-term-glad for him when he had an outside encounter. It was a little surprising at the time, but it seemed important for him to develop a sense of how and why to guard his heart. And here we see what happens to people who never learn.
Did anyone else feel that Iris Murdoch must have written this book? It seems like a cross between *The Sacred and Profane Love Machine* and *The Black Prince*. A course of reading Dame Iris might be just the cure - or then again it could be the cause.
It's almost astounding how easy it was to go from, "So, for fun, I would do it, too," to, "...holds an attraction for me like no other woman ever has." Perhaps the answer would have been to have been following the example of Ms Kim and telling his wife about the eye contact all along. But it's a bit late for that now.
It didn't really strike me at first, but the really bizarre part of the letter is what he decides to ask. His inner life is in turmoil and he doesn't ask either for permission to stray or for tips on How to Remain Faithful, but about Eye Contact. The present isn't enough; he's preparing for the future.
There must be a compassionate answer, but I'll just tell him, before he does anything else, to tell his wife. Maybe if the marriage can be preserved she'll laugh so hard he'll wake up.
If only 20-something women had the self-confidence of 50-something men. We could take on the world. 50-something men have a special brand of self-delusion a la Charlie Sheen. Shalalalala - you may well be the exception, but I've heard dozens of men refer to themselves as looking much younger than their age - 12 years, really? - and be totally and completely wrong. Just as I'm sure you've heard women say they're just a smidge overweight - and a smidge turns out to be 50 pounds.
There are many reasons a woman could be attracted to an older man, and Seandr nailed the major one - disinterest in US. Nothing gets a slightly crazy female going better than being ignored or dismissed. There's also money and power - especially if it's power over her or her circle, like a professor, who combines power with intellect (usually) which is also attractive. The point is that most younger women who want older men aren't into ALL older men or even most. Just the ones who are in specific positions that appeal to the security seeking side of us, or, and it's rare, the devastatingly handsome, witty older man. The problem is that they all think that one rare exception is them.
It *does* suck to get hit on inappropriately, but I wouldn't reserve it to old guys. Anyone who doesn't take no for an answer, doesn't realize your total lack of interest, or leers at you is gross. I'm annoyed by them too, but I do appreciate that in 20 years time I may be missing the days when I got hollered at on the street several times a week. The point is: older isn't creepy when it's not trying to ooze it's lust all over you.
Not only will that happen, but should you decide to have kids, you will find those gazes directed at your daughter (or if you are hanging out in Vancouver's West End, your son...) Gravity is a cruel master ;)
Thank you for the smile. You made me feel lovely.
I'll happily drink whisky with you anytime. It is the elixer of youth.
Uisge Beatha: Scots Gaelic for aqua vitae, 'water of life', from the first part of which the word 'whisky' derives.
Cheers!
It makes me laugh when the young display such distaste for their elders. As if by some miracle they will escape our fate. I'll be 48 next Wednesday, and personally, almost every man I've ever dated has been younger, some, such as my current primary beau, significantly so. I have no idea why that is, but for the most part men my own age rarely hit on me. And I can count on one hand the number of times I've been hollered at on the street in my entire life. That just never happens to me. Even from construction workers, so it's not like I'm super hot or anything. I guess I'm here to mess up the curve or something.