New Chop Suey Owners Face Pressure to Change Venue Name

Comments

The claimed etymology of the term 'chop suey' is really not known, google it, so Andy's argument surrounding that is misleading at best.

I'm not saying his grievances are unsubstantiated, just that the story surrounding the Miners is probably no more than urban legend.

robroc on February 17, 2015 at 12:01 PM

That story sounded fakeroo the minute I read it. I don't know what chop suey is out west, but here on the east coast it's some sort of concoction with roast beef and mashed potatoes.

Barmy Fotheringay-Phipps on February 17, 2015 at 12:04 PM

In a tribute to The Stranger's loving support of Chop Suey, and to keep alive the spirit of journalism ethics violations, I think "Bailee Martin" or "Keenan Bowen" would be a good name. Or "Sweep Your Past Firmly Under The Rug" or "Rehire A Loser."

dnt trust me on February 17, 2015 at 12:16 PM

It is one of many unsubstantiated stories:

http://www.snopes.com/food/origins/chops…

jack chandelier on February 17, 2015 at 12:21 PM

I was hoping the new owners would rebrand the venue, as I always thought it was unnecessarily right on the line of being offensive - but are they really facing pressure? Panda's efforts don't seem to have picked up much steam. The community response seems to have been, overwhelmingly, "chill out/who cares/I have no problem with it so there is no problem", which is pretty disappointing.

genevieve on February 17, 2015 at 12:25 PM

That story reeks of bullshit.

But, this form of "racism" is pretty damn innocuous, considering this is a city that still has Dress Like a Mexican pub crawl.

Chop Suey's decor never had the tone of cartoonish caricature. *shrug*

TheMisanthrope on February 17, 2015 at 12:27 PM

@2 In New York City, it used to be fairly indistinguishable from the Chinese-American takeout version of Chicken Chow Mein, although maybe with a slightly different mix of onions, celery and bean sprouts, and without the accompanying bag of crispy fried noodles. I stopped eating that stuff many years ago when I discovered actual Chinese restaurants featuring regional cuisines and better ingredients.

When it comes to decor and names, I'm having trouble setting aside the romantic relationship Americans have with oriental imagery in order to find it underpinned by animus. I can understand how having your culture misunderstood and misrepresented can be irritating, but I don't think it's being done out of hatred or prejudice. To most Americans, and certainly to many East Coast Jewish Americans, Chinese restaurants were their first taste of something exotic in their lives. Can't we cut a little slack for residual mid-20th century cultural infatuation?

At worst, it's a fond nostalgia for exposure to something seemingly exotic.

Brooklyn Reader on February 17, 2015 at 12:31 PM

The story isn't true.

Amanda on February 17, 2015 at 12:33 PM

They should change the name to "Biscuits and Gravy" written in stagecoach font

dustyvinegar on February 17, 2015 at 12:42 PM

What if the club was renamed "Mango Curry", and it was filled with statues of Ganesh? Are there "racial implications" with that one too? I'm honestly curious.

droctopu5 on February 17, 2015 at 12:53 PM

If the new owners, in updating the decor, are harking back to the location's auto history, why not just rename it "The Chop"? As in, chop shop. Or something auto related. Seems an easyish fix.

Anne18 on February 17, 2015 at 12:56 PM

As someone of English-Irish descent, I am partially offended by the Georgian Room at the Olympic Hotel!!!!

Catalina Vel-DuRay on February 17, 2015 at 12:57 PM

Is Olive Garden owned by Italians??? If not, why not??

cocktailer on February 17, 2015 at 12:58 PM

@14 Well, Chop Suey doesn't actually serve Chinese food, so that's like comparing... oh, I see what you did there.

droctopu5 on February 17, 2015 at 1:00 PM

dear new owners: welcome to seattle. i'm sorry, this is what it's like here.

Max Solomon on February 17, 2015 at 1:04 PM

It's difficult to jump on the Panda Express here.

cliche on February 17, 2015 at 1:06 PM

So what's the story behind the name anyway? Was was it ever named Chop Suey?

Gordon Werner on February 17, 2015 at 1:10 PM

Dear Asians: we don't know the true origin of the term Chop Suey, but we can assure you that your story is wrong and therefore you should not be offended by having your cultural heritage appropriated and ridiculed as superficial decor for a rock venue. You can trust our long years of oppression, from having a sports team called the Fighting Irish to having a hotel ballroom called the Georgian Room to having a restaurant called the Olive Garden, which are exactly as bad as the Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882 or the Japanese Internment of the 1940s. So when we trivialize your feelings in favor of our own cheap sentimentality over a music club's inessential features, it's for your own good. Best Wishes, White People.

AmericasFavoriteWhiteGuy on February 17, 2015 at 1:12 PM

They should change the name to the Ching Chong Ping Pang Disco Pagoda.

brenan6 on February 17, 2015 at 1:14 PM

So Asian kitsch is super offensive ( even though its the color black and red, and cheap "oriental" trinkets from china ) But any of the dozen or so Anglo owned Mexican theme bars on the hill are totally cool why?

meanie on February 17, 2015 at 1:26 PM

The Georgian Room is a restaurant, NOT a Restaurant!!!

Catalina Vel-DuRay on February 17, 2015 at 1:39 PM

Oops, that should be The Georgian Room is a RESTAURANT not a BALLROOM! I was blinded by my outrage.

Catalina Vel-DuRay on February 17, 2015 at 1:46 PM

I can't imagine the oppression you must be experiencing. When will someone help the white people?

AmericasFavoriteWhiteGuy on February 17, 2015 at 1:47 PM

All white people with Japanese/Chinese influenced tattoos must have them immediately removed with a cheese grater.

jwr on February 17, 2015 at 1:49 PM

Offended by Chop Suey? I don't want to live on this planet anymore.

seatownr on February 17, 2015 at 1:50 PM

Oops, that should read "The Georgian Room is a Restaurant, NOT a Ballroom". My outrage at having British oppression of the Irish ignored made me lose my composure.

Catalina Vel-DuRay on February 17, 2015 at 1:53 PM

William Hopper has a painting titled "Chop Suey". The scene is a Chinese restaurant though the decor doesn't look particularly Asian. The word Suey is very prominent in the center of the painting. Perhaps it should be painted over so as not to be offensive to Mr. Panda.

bertha on February 17, 2015 at 2:08 PM

The name Chop Suey has always been lame, just because it is. The cultural appropriation aspect doesn't help either. Just go back to The Breakroom, an unimaginative but not-sucky historic name.

Neumos was ARO.space was Moe's; only one of those names sucks.

El Corazon was Graceland was the Off Ramp; only one of those names sucks.

Now seems like an ideal time, even if it sorta looks like the new ownership has decided to stick with Chop Suey, I say do it, because the name sucks, and it's more right than wrong.

matt on February 17, 2015 at 2:08 PM

Someone named Andy Panda complaining about trading on Asian kitsch makes me giggle.

Banna on February 17, 2015 at 2:36 PM

I really like the idea @12 and would change the last three letters so it's The Chop Shop - just because I like saying it: Chop Shop, Chop Shop, Chop Shop, Chop Shop - just can't STOP!

But would keep the same decor, also just because.....

Jaymz on February 17, 2015 at 2:50 PM

Local White Man Honestly Doesn't Understand What All The Fuss Is About

yelahneb on February 17, 2015 at 3:18 PM

I don't know if the details of the story relayed by Mr. Panda is true.

I just know that for a city that has no problem dwelling on the injustice and pain caused by losing a sports team, they sure do seem blind – and even hostile – to concerns raised by people who feel pain caused by other historic injustices (that are associated with actual human rights abuses).

politickling on February 17, 2015 at 3:20 PM

@18 ask Linda Derschang

robroc on February 17, 2015 at 3:36 PM

As an Italian (100% Italian, not Italian-American) if I were to follow this logic, do you know how many "Italian" places I would want to be re-decored and renamed? Let's focus on important matters.

labrava on February 17, 2015 at 3:38 PM

The "Management Team" of Einstein's Bagels doesn't, at least by their names, sound Jewish. The business uses fake Yiddish, e.g., schmeer. Sic, Einstein's is offensive to Jews? We demand that Einstein's change it's name to Smith's.

Algernon on February 17, 2015 at 3:40 PM

Just another white person here, focusing on this matter just to tell you to focus on more important matters. You're welcome!

AmericasFavoriteWhiteGuy on February 17, 2015 at 3:48 PM

I always thought the decor was an obvious and broad parody of offensive kitsch, which somehow made it better/OK.

Regardless, I love that crazy dragon.

Josh Bis on February 17, 2015 at 3:57 PM

As a proud German-American, this post has empowered me to speak out on the evils of Der Wienerschnitzel. Raus Der Wienerschnitzel! Raus!!!

Gern Blanston on February 17, 2015 at 4:11 PM

@40 the gigantic black-light-induced dragon mural makes any experience there utterly magical.

I do love that this story pairs nicely with the I, Anonymous also featured at the same venue.

Beetlecat on February 17, 2015 at 4:25 PM

As a White American, I'm going to help trivialize the feelings of someone with a completely different cultural heritage by pointing out that I just now started being offended about affronts to my race that I never noticed before! I mean, Bryan Cranston's character in Breaking Bad was way more offensive than Mickey Rooney's character in Breakfast at Tiffany's. At least Capote had the decency to not make the latter character's last name "Yellow", amiright?!?!

AmericasFavoriteWhiteGuy on February 17, 2015 at 4:33 PM

I'm going to wear my feather headdress to the grand opening, who's with me?

AmericasFavoriteWhiteGuy on February 17, 2015 at 4:37 PM

Would this be an issue if the "fake Chinese decor" in Chop Suey turned out to be made in China?

Yeah, the ridiculous facts (and maybe-facts) here are enough to humorously question any hurt feelings. The venue isn't using a racial slur or personifying anything here. It's a Chinese themed music club. Why not a little cultural pride instead?

cliche on February 17, 2015 at 5:01 PM

Geez, y'all. His request was made awfully diplomatically and the sentiment...well...is exactly as true as it feels to him an other Asian Seattlites. If folks are avoiding the place because it mocks their identities that should be a concern to the business owners. There are some cultures that have been more recently subjected to malicious caricature on the west coast than others, Chinese being quite at the top
Of that list, and the polite request to put that history behind us seems worthwhile.

efp on February 17, 2015 at 5:42 PM

There have been a couple threads on Facebook lately about this and the majority of the people crying out for a name change seem to be non-Asian Millennials with too much time on their hands.

So, the name and decor are borderline racist and offensive?

This must make 99% of the Asian restaurants in the world self-hating for using cutesy poo "Ye Olde Asian Font" and hanging up Chinese lanterns and dragon art.

Time to tear down the I.D.!!!!!!!

michael strangeways on February 17, 2015 at 5:57 PM

Oh, piffle! Just rename it Wing Tip Shoo and get on with it.

spokevin on February 17, 2015 at 6:08 PM

So 48 comments and no one has mentioned it... Does this person realize that the place was owned by the owners of a club called K's dream... in japan?

If a local native tribe wanted to call their high school football team the redskins, it wouldn't be the same issue at all. I feel like this is the same kind of thing.

I expected their argument to be "now that white people own it they shouldn't do that"... but that's not really what they're saying. Did they even realize what the deal was before? what?

Thinkythought on February 17, 2015 at 6:15 PM

I really hope one day that people realize that when they attempt to push the P.C button on non issues that WE THE PEOPLE will not even hear their voice. This is a classic non issue. Long live Chop Suey!

blackheat on February 17, 2015 at 6:57 PM

@49 I don't care about the name, but I don't think Japanese and Chinese is interchangeable in this context.

The CHZA on February 17, 2015 at 7:11 PM

As a gay man, I am offended that the Cuff is straight owned and promotes a stereotypical image of homosexuals as leather clad macho men.

Catalina Vel-DuRay on February 17, 2015 at 7:15 PM

Does Panda have the same outrage for all the "Chinese" restaurants that serve chop suey? Surely if that origin store is true it must be extremely more offensive for white people to order chop suey, as they are continuing the offense of those miners. Where is the boycott of actual chop suey!

j2patter on February 17, 2015 at 7:56 PM

Kitsch is so lacist.

SAW on February 17, 2015 at 7:58 PM

Also, the Seattle music community had this conversation over a decade ago when Chop Suey first opened.

The following is just the first LTE I foundfrom that time. I am sure there are more out there.
http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/lette…

It was tedious then. It's tedious now.

James Machine on February 17, 2015 at 8:25 PM

Chop Suey, the name, the silly font, the paper lanterns, it all seems like pretty obvious satire, poking fun at a dated and tacky stereotype. It's only offensive to those too dense to get the joke.

evolume on February 17, 2015 at 8:44 PM

Let's call it Rhino Horn Loves Tiger Penis

wilbur@work on February 17, 2015 at 10:04 PM

This gets the "Who Gives a Shit Award" for the day. Ugh. Seattle. Stop creating racism. It's the name of a Chinese dish. Big deal. The old owners were Asian. Maybe they liked chop suey. No, that's too easy. We all have to be uneducated bleeding hearts instead. Would it be racist if I moved to Asia and opened a bar called "Hamburgers"? No. Because no one gives a shit because it isn't a fucking issue. Douche.

DaddyGitBox on February 18, 2015 at 12:21 AM

They should change their name to General Tso's. But if that is too un PC then how about Biscuits and Gravy.

crumley on February 18, 2015 at 7:32 AM

@49 it was originally owned and named by Wade Weigel (of the cha cha) and Linda Derschang (of everything)

robroc on February 18, 2015 at 8:03 AM

You know, Dave Segal, this whole story here is completely bogus; I admit you really did have me going when I first saw it yesterday. The story appeared as a headliner yesterday and today it comes under the MUSIC/NIGHTLIFE heading. Promoting a performance is one thing but it stoops pretty low to exploit the issue of racism to do it. It's a little early in the year for an April fool's joke.

bertha on February 18, 2015 at 8:10 AM

"As a Chinese person, seeing fake Chinese decor in a club that is not owned by Chinese people makes my heart sink. No one should have to see their own race caricatured..."

Such utter bullshit! Stop being so fucking hyper sensitive that you find a slight in everything. Take a look at you average Mexican, Greek, Italian or French restaurant, Brazilian steak house, teriyaki joint, or Irish, Scottish or English pub or German beer hall and cry about race caricature.

I assume you find Bastille, Poquitos, Macleod's and Rheinhaus to be equally offensive?

Or is it just paper lanterns that trigger you?

You_Gotta_Be_Kidding_Me on February 18, 2015 at 10:41 AM

I shudder to think how offended AndyPanda must be by the 5th Avenue Theater...

You_Gotta_Be_Kidding_Me on February 18, 2015 at 10:54 AM

Perhaps Andy Panda should change HIS racist name...

JimmyFlame on February 18, 2015 at 12:46 PM

@ Everybody - Yes, the story he used is apparently an urban legend. Yes, there are a lot of other, more important (to you) things that you'd rather have him focus on. Yes, his stage name is based for whatever reason (satire?) on an asian stereotype. Yes, the club was owned by a Japanese company. (maybe that is worse?) Yes there are restaurants/businesses that are themed around ethnicities that used to be oppressed in the US that are currently lumped in with white people and no one cares. The point is that there is a long history of oppression, and that history isn't that long ago and there are still a lot of people with racist attitudes toward Chinese and asian folks in general, and this person is bothered by seeing a cheap parody of his ethnicity and history used as a theme for a music venue. That's all. I'm sure it isn't the only thing he does, or cares about. And white folks can't understand this experience, because we have never had it. Right? Cool?

LBrady on February 18, 2015 at 1:06 PM

naming a club or night is half the fun of starting something or taking over a new venture. i have no idea why the new owners would be eager to continue to brand something that they themselves didn't create. as mentioned many times before, anyone with a small sense of history can tell you what a space used to be called. pressure on the new owners to change the name (real or not) seems beside the point.

frankly, it seems lazy to not rebrand this place. it's not that hard to give it a fresh coat of paint, to throw up some new fixtures, and design it to whatever focus you choose. as long as you've got folks like jodi booking, the quality of shows will be solid, and i may be wrong here, but it's not like a bunch of recently-initiated nightclub goers would be like "oh i go to ALL the shows at chop suey but they changed the name and now i don't know what it is anymore and i won't go see a band that i like there because who knows what i'm getting into?".

i saw plenty of shows at the breakroom. i've seen plenty of shows at chop suey. it's all about the right acts in the right size room. new owners: i don't think you'll lose a whole lot of regulars because you rebranded. chop as a concept is whatevs, i don't love it or hate it, the most important thing to me is the that the show is right.

just don't do anything stupid like those fools did Ia few years back) when they tried to rename the current neumos space as "paradise garage". did they really think they could get away with that?

deepconcentration on February 18, 2015 at 3:07 PM

Great letter Andy Panda. Listen up fellow priveleged white people and have some respect for other cultures and races.

Jordan VV on February 19, 2015 at 12:54 PM

I thought this was a joke when I heard about and I'm still not sure after reading this article. I hope it's not the poutrage that it would be if it's genuine.

pUnqfUrs on February 19, 2015 at 1:51 PM

Says the guy named Andy "Panda" - sheesh.

kylembelltown on February 20, 2015 at 1:05 PM

Everyone who is saying this is no big deal is white, most def.

kittenalarm on February 20, 2015 at 2:20 PM

ITT: Whitesplaining

J. Burns on February 20, 2015 at 2:25 PM

Racial phonus bolongus

bertha on February 22, 2015 at 12:53 PM

New Chop Suey Owners Face Pressure to Change Venue Name

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