Columns Jul 24, 2013 at 4:00 am

Head Fake

Comments

103
@99, 101:

@93 was directed at me with a lot of unexplained hostility and situational myopia. The next time someone famous hurts your feelings, sit on your hands and say "Fuck their ethnicity/sexuality/gender/political affiliations!" Because that'll show...people who have nothing to do with the subject of your hissy fit. Irrational, and deeply petty.
105
@104 - Nobody is 'entitled' to ANYthing from ANYbody. Check your privilege, jackass.
107
@105: So, my wife isn't "entitled" to be treated decently by me? I can unilaterally withhold my share of anything that is normally supplied within a marriage: food, clothing, money, shelter, a healthy emotional relationship, communication, affection, sex? And she should just accept that, because "[n]obody is entitled to ANYthing from ANYbody"?

Moron.

Look, you may be personally allergic to the word "entitled," but all those things -- including oral sex -- fall within the range of "reasonable and customary." If you have as little clue as to what are reasonable expectations within the context of a human relationship as is indicated by your inane statement @105, you shouldn't be in one. With ANYbody, at ANY time.
108
@104, 106:

Dan said oral comes standard, not oral or death! A partner can make up for a dearth of one aspect of sex by making up for it in another; or the partner could accept whatever "lack" there is as a price of admission. She barely gave him head at the start of their marriage, so it seems silly to have expected that not to wane along with standard intercourse in general. She has kept up PIV sex at quite a high frequency (4 to 10 times a month), so his complaint (and his serial infidelity) seems highly unfounded.

P.S.

BJS never said whether he was giving his wife oral. What he claims is lopsided could be quid pro quo.
109
@105: Just for grins, let's take your premise as valid, and run with it. If we accept as true your assertion that "Nobody is entitled to ANYthing from ANYbody" then the Letter Writer's wife isn't "entitled" to monogamy from him, either.

I suspect you might be a little surprised and chagrined to realize that you just argued for Letter Writer's freedom to go get BJs wherever and whenever and from whomever he wants, and that his wife's opinion on the matter means fuck all.
110
@108: I think it's up to the person making the request to decide whether or not the thing being offered as an alternative represents an acceptable substitution. In this case, apparently BJs are non-substitutable.

When he says 4 to 10 times a month, I expect that the actual value is in the middle, with 4 and 10 being the extremes. Say 7 times a month, which is a little under twice a week. (Exactly twice a week would be at minimum 8 times a month [in Feb] and 9 times a month in other months.) While I would definitely call that adequate, I don't think I would call it "quite a high frequency."

Nor would I necessarily consider it a defacto fair substitute merely on the grounds of its frequency. What if the desired activity was, say, being spanked? So his wife fucks him 10 times a month but never, ever spanks him. How is that supposed to satisfy his desire to be spanked? Even if it is 10 times a month?

Whether he is giving _her_ oral is a factor in considering a fair quid pro quo only if she wants oral. Otherwise, he is giving her something she doesn't care about (or worse, is forcing something on her that she doesn't want) and then claiming that as a credit in his column. That particular calculation is too much to speculate on here. If she wants oral and isn't getting any, then she is the one who needs to write in to Dan about that.
111
Seriously, a blowjob takes like fifteen or twenty minutes. Maybe thirty depending on the man in question or if you like to take your time. Why would you get into a LTR, literally build your life around it (marriage, kids & etc) if you can't be counted on to provide the same amount of time it takes to watch a single television program into an important aspect of your relationship at least twice or three times a week? The only thing to be taken from LW1's letter besides the fake he's an asshole is that if a partner asks you for something it's probably fucking important to them which means it should be equally important to you.
112
@111 I meant fact not fake. That and my blow job time estimates might be off, but I stand behind my original message.
And furthermore, when did the health of a monogamous relationship come down to some kind of weird sex math. If someone's dissatisfied with the amount or quality of sex happening in a relationship I seriously doubt pointing out that what their getting is "acceptable" according to generalized standards really helps. LW1's wife's sexual standards might be perfect for someone else, but they're falling short of her husband's; which to be honest is the only other opinion on her sex life that counts since she chose to merge it with his.
113
"Whether he is giving _her_ oral is a factor in considering a fair quid pro quo only if she wants oral."

Thank you!

I always get irked by the assumption that all women want oral, especially comments criticizing men who don't do it for their partners. Seriously.
114
@108: So getting laid twice a week after 15 years of marriage and children is fair grounds to seek out and receive anonymous blowjobs from dudes on Craigslist simply because he's not getting head?
@112: Who's to say dissatisfaction isn't in it for her as well? Maybe she has little to no desire to have any kind of sex, and the twice-a-week frequency is not her preference at all. Shouldn't he have some sensitivity to her baseline? He too chose to merge his sex life with hers. Compromise, not mutual utter acquiescence, makes a relationship work. Well, the mutual acceptance of compromise by both parties does- otherwise you just get poorly rationalized betrayal.
115
Does she consent to any oral at all - licking his penis, sucking him but not to ejaculation? There is a broad spectrum of oral sex and we don't have the entire story.
116
@114 If she really has no desire for sex than you have to question the sanity of trying to maintain a monogamous sexual relationship, let alone the fairness of entering one in the first place. Compromise is great, but it isn't always realistic. Sometimes you have to go right or left. Maybe one wants another child, but the other thinks their family is large enough. One wants a sedan, the other wants an SUV. And etc.

I love to think compromising on EVERYTHING is possible, but it's just not. If something's important to your partner, but not to you then why would you fight about it when there's already so many critical choices you need to navigate together?

On the flip side, if your partner can't provide something or demands something in your relationship and you're entering the relationship knowing this than it should fall under "Price Of Admission".

If LW1's wife said "I HATE giving bjs, is this a problem?" while they were dating and he lied, saying "Not really." than he's an idiot and a cheater. The impression I get is she provided them but never said one thing or another about them. Which gave LW1 the impression she was cool with it occasionally, if not really that into it. He was satisfied enough with this arrangement to marry her. Now that understanding is gone and what you have in it's place is one partner ignoring the other's needs and the other putting his wife's health at risk.

Of course every couple is different. One might be more assertive, have a demanding job they enjoy, a medical condition or etc. This usually means that their partners have to make certain sacrifices or at least put in extra effort for their relationships.
117
DAMMIT, i used than instead of then. Damn you beer! But seriously, I hate fighting. I'd rather just be the bitch in a relationship and save the arguing for the few things I actually give a shit about. Unfortunately though, sometimes the other person's choice of words will set me off and I go into a blood rage. Once a friend saw me laughing at a South Park calendar and said "I'm glad you don't work around kids!". I knew she was calling me immature, but in my head I was already going off; "You don't think I'm good enough to be around children?! Fuck you, you self-righteous bitch! Etc." So you can see that as much as I like to talk and think about relationship in a logical straight-forward manner, I'm still struggling to put what I learn here and elsewhere in practice.
118
@116: My point was the sex they do have may not be ideal for her either, but it's possible the currency frequency (pretty high for 15 years in with kids) was to assuage the dearth of blowjobs. Regardless, the LW never did his due diligence. He never asked his wife for an uptick in BJ frequency OR if she would mind him getting NSA anonymous head from other people. Some might say no one would really ask the latter question, but to my mind if you're that hard up asking would be less difficult (and less risky) than setting all that up.
119
^ current, not currency. Not even drunk, no excuse.
121
Hunter78, lovely to see you not trolling.

(If you were indead trolling, please forgive my naïveté).
122
@117 "I'm still struggling to put what I learn here and elsewhere in practice."

Likewise...
123
@Really Now: I do agree pointing out he is getting an acceptable amount of sex compared to others doesn't help either of them, but it was meant to illustrate the EXTREME solution. He's married, with children. He could lose everything, and all anyone would remember is he got blown by dudes on craigslist. EXTREME solution. I think most husbands in the same situation, would leave or cheat with a woman who did give bjs, or talk to her, or offer her bribes or SOMETHING before this step. But I could be wrong. And your friend has no sense of humor. South Park is funny.


124
@120: BJS never said he requested more oral sex from his wife. If he had and she had flatly refused, maybe I would understand his extracurricular activities. And I'm not tearing down what Dan said at all- he said oral comes standard, however for some no or low-incidence oral is the price of admission and is either accepted or rejected at the onset. The LW mentioned a barely-there interest in oral on his wife's part at the beginning of their marriage, so it's not as if the lack of enthusiasm was a development.

Regardless, I hardly think the LW's wife has earned her husband's reckless and frequent infidelity.
125
@118 I agree that if he just went straight to craigslist's list without even saying anything about the missing bjs than he's an incredible nuke level douche. As for substituting PIV for bjs or anything else; it might fly occasionally, but even as a woman I have serious doubts any man would let that go on indefinitely.

I did read somewhere recently that men have trouble asking for things in relationships. Has anyone experienced that?
126
@123 Yeah, I agree LW1 went for the oddest, costliest solution to his problem. How a father and husband decides to get unprotected bjs from craigslist dudes is a decision process I wouldn't want to retrace.

"He could lose everything, and all anyone would remember is he got blown by dudes on craigslist."

Dear God, can you imagine the eulogy at his funeral?
127
#79: differences in sexual interest doesn't necessarily mean differences in total overall sex drive, it's also that for various reasons women are more likely to be sexually interested in a long-term partner than a casual one. Different patterns, even with similar levels.
128
@127 My sexual interest in any partner has always sharply diminished after 12 to 18 months at most. That's hardly long term.

I'm a woman. Am I that unusual ?
129
Newsflash from that breeder purgatory known as marriage: "Plain Old Vanilla Sex 4 to 10 Times a Month." A MONTH!!!

Enjoy the babies. Sounds like making them is a real chore.
130
WIFE, if you feel more empowered with your man than you do without, if he fulfills you ways beyond sex, if you really really can't live without him, then you'd do well to listen to Dan's advice.

A sexless marriage will heap mounds of stress on you which will only serve to be more painful with children. Savage Love once advised me to open my sexless marriage. His negotiation language is five-star amazing. It's been three years now and while the arrangement works for us (we're very compatible partners who deal with the fatigue of fifteen years together and several children) there are definite moments when I feel sad about our sexual differences. Our differences are permanent. All these years later, I still wonder if sacrificing passion with my life-mate is worth it. The good news is that we have an amazing family to show for it.

Another thing to consider is that even if you two come to an agreement, daily life doesn't offer all that much support for alternative relationships. People are crazy-judgemental (stating the obvious here) and although our society is slooooowly growing more tolerant, we're far from in the clear. For me, keeping our "open" marriage in the closet weighs heavy on my mind.
131
Griz-watch for today: Officially 49 years younger looking,
about to go pick up and scarf some "guilt free" gluten-and-sugar-free chocolate cake from my local co-op, worshipping my ruling planet (the Sun!), and out for fun in the summertime!!!
WOO-HOOOOOOO!!!! My birthday wish came true: I now have a "Thelma Dickinson" tummy!!!!!!!
132
...and "Erin Brockovich" boobs---YIKES!
133
Happy Belated Birthday, Aunt Griz! Enjoy the shit out of that cake!
134
@36 "Crap in large volumes does not make up for lack of quality?" I donno...pizza's kinda like sex: even when it's bad it's still kinda good.

Except rape pizza. That pizza just sucks all around.
135
@Auntie Griz..Happy happy Birthday.
136
@133 lolorhone and @135 tito: Thank you so much!! I really am enjoying the shit out of this cake!!
I'm still having a blast!! One humbling little lesson learned however:
Upon losing 35+ lbs. (down to 157), I forgot that I (gulp!) can't hold as much alcohol as I used to be able to chug last year! EEK! I may have been photographed as NY Pizza and Martini Bar's DOTW!! Luckily, I didn't get sick, but I was definitely out of it until I had some dinner and plenty more ice water down my throat!
Moral of the story: No more than 2 glasses of cabernet sauvignon at dinner for me anymore!
137
@99. Agree entirely. LW1 is having sex (some months) every three days - with a couple of kids and after 15 years of marriage that is a lot more sex than most couples manage. The issue isn't a wife who won't put out, because she's putting out. The issue is what he wants.

Is HE GGG? He never says that he is, now or when they first married. He doesn't say a single thing about satisfying his wife sexually. He chose to marry someone who he felt wasn't as GGG as his ideal - well, he made his bed and now he has to lie in it. It isn't his wife's fault that he made a deal he doesn't like now, it's his responsibility to address a situation in a mature and respectful way. And that doesn't include putting her health at risk by getting BJs from random dudes.
138
BlowJob Secrets: I think what you are doing is AWESOME! You found a way to satisfy your sexdrive, without cheating on your wife and that is wonderful.
I love my husband, and love our life together but I have no interest in sleeping with him (or anyone) and no interest in giving him bjs, so this seems like the perfect solution. I would LOVE it if he had a guy giving him regular blowjobs!! Hell I'd even pay for it!! I will suggest this to him :) :)
139
BlowJob Secrets: I think what you are doing is AWESOME!

You found a way to satisfy your sexdrive, without cheating on your wife and that is wonderful.

I love my husband, and love our life together but I have no interest in sleeping with him (or anyone) and no interest in giving him bjs, so this seems like the perfect solution. I would LOVE it if he had a guy giving him regular blowjobs!! Hell I'd even pay for it!! I will suggest this to him :) :)
140
@139: "BlowJob Secrets: I think what you are doing is AWESOME!

You found a way to satisfy your sexdrive, without cheating on your wife"

Did you even fucking read the letter?

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