During the past year, the amount of time for the weather segment has progressively dropped, and increasingly they run out of time in the first hour and push me to the second, so that listeners are uncertain when I will talk.

I find this bit from Cliff Mass's blog a much simpler explanation for why he's trying to burn KUOW to the ground.

I don't think Cliff is trying to burn KUOW to the ground - just hold them accountable for a bad decision. I am a listener and financial supporter of KUOW, and I'm completely on Cliff's side.

And what he points out in the quote, @1, isn't wrong: it has annoyed the crap outta me on many occasions that Cliff gets pushed into the second hour of Weekday (which I'm consistently unable to listen to due to work), I end up missing him for the week.

Cliff is a great meteorologist, and a valuable local voice. If something is important enough that he wants to talk about it, I want to hear him say it.

I don't think Cliff has said all of KUOW is wrong. He points out his conflict with a couple of people and how he didn't have this issue for a very long time.

"They said I was essentially part of KUOW news since I was a regular, and thus they had to present both sides."

Well, KUOW can't have it both ways. Over at Publicola, Guy Nelson, the station director, says Cliff is a "guest." Is he a guest or a regular, make up your mind.

I almost never heard Cliff talk off topic and so this seems weird to me. I can't believe it was that big an issue for KUOW. That their Friday pundits got basic facts wrong is no big surprise and that Cliff works for and is on an admission committee for UW seems pertinent to him making a comment.

KUOW, except for reporter Phyllis Fletcher, consistently gets education stories wrong. I don't know why but it's vexing to hear the Friday pundits go on about a story (like the Ingraham principal firing) and have basic facts wrong.

I"m still boycotting KUOW. Either listeners get to have some input or they don't need the money.

Professor Mass,
This will sound harsh, but I have no empathy for you. I recognize that you volunteered your time, but the reality is you deviated on more than one occasion from doing the job they asked you to do--the thing you are an expert on--the weather. The bottom line is you broke the rules, even after they warned you. Anyway, you have a huge following. Quit whining, get off your high horse, and get your own show. Problem solved.

The fact is we have dozens of politicized media outlets. We subsidize "Public Radio" so that it can be above that. When KUOW serves itself, it does not serve the public. I could not name 3 programs on KUOW, but I could easily listen to an educated insider such as Cliff Mass give his opinions on various topics in higher education. As for "breaking the rules," rules followers are putzes. I bet you work an hourly job, #4 . Guys like Mass rise above that, people such as yourselves follow orders. I know who I'd rather get information from. And I question your one premise, that he's not an expert on higher education. He's a multi-decade member of higher education, and he has intimate knowledge of the subjects he's commenting on. I agree he deserves his own show, probably outside the KUOW cocoon. This recent episode is reminding me why I hardly ever listen to public radio.

It seems a little strange that a weather expert would complain when asked to restrict his opining to the things he's an expert on.

Although I can't stand Steve Scher and never listen to his show, I don't think he was out of line to ask you to report on the weather and not whatever else you felt like talking about. Also, Steve Scher's show IS his show. It's not the public's. That's a ridiculous statement. If it were the public's show, I might actually listen to it.

Cliff Mass' weather segments have been a highlight of my Fridays for the past nine years. That said, I don't think it was unfair for Scher and the Weekday producers to stick to their guns. For Mass to expect to parlay his 5-minute weather segment into punditry, regardless of his tenure, delusional. In his statement on the matter, Scher wrote that he would be happy to bring Mass on to discuss other issues, just not during the weather segment. I love Mass' work both in academics and on his blog, but I think he's the one in the wrong.

The point is not that Cliff was a volunteer, nor is it that he strayed off topic. The point is that lots of other guests stray off topic when they're on the show and they haven't had their segments cut at all. (Rick Steves, Joni Balter, et al, to name a few.) This is PUBLIC radio, and plenty of people other than UW, contribute to its funding and as such, should take their concerns seriously. That's why so many people are upset.

TL;DR http://cliffmasstldr.blogspot.com/2011/0…

If you'd like to see Cliff back on the air, please sign this petition: http://www.petitionbuzz.com/petitions/cl…

What exactly is Steve Scher's expertise? Talking?

@12-Steve Scher has a PhD in windbaggery, with a minor emphasis on talking over and misinterpreting his guests' important points.

I just listened again to the April 22 show from 11am. The biggest problem with Steve Sher's argument about Cliff Mass being "only" a weatherman for the show and that there needs to be an opposing viewpoint that must be scheduled for any other topics Cliff wants to discuss, is that the opposing viewpoint was in the studio at the time! Joni Balter wrote the article that Cliff was refuting and she was on the air at the same time. Opposing viewpoint: Check

Hold on a second, @6 and others: Are you saying a professor at UW isn't informed about education issues? What exactly qualifies as an "expert" if not an actual teacher?

And anyway, 99% of what he discussed on Scher's show was weather-related, and even when he got into educational issues, it was still nearly always tangentially related to climatology...it's not like he went off about how incoming students had no poetry skills or couldn't speak French.

KUOW is attempting to portray this as a simple hiring/firing issue, and not about suppressing opinions inconvenient to a well-placed few.

The fact is, Scher claims his show is about controversial topics, and both sides of the issue need to be presented. Cliff had largely capitulated to his request that he confine his comments to the weather, rather than the controversial topic of education that he is well-qualified to comment on. Hrm. Then when Scher didn't have anyone else to argue the opposite side of the Seattle Times article, Cliff felt compelled to speak up. So he got canned.

Scher is the worst kind of hypocrite. He exercised what he felt to be his right to terminate Cliff, a well-respected local figure. (Don't mess with our weathermen, Steve.) He should just be prepared to deal with the fallout: a bunch of well-informed Seattlites (Ross Reynolds assertion that we haven't read Scher's vile letters and Cliff's blog is silly; most of us wouldn't be upset if we hadn't) who see what he's doing and are willing to withdraw their support to KUOW over an issue that ought to be something actively discussed and covered on Public Radio.

Maybe Steve would be more comfortable working at a Fox News type situation. I would certainly be more comfortable.

If you just want Cliff back, go here:
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Put-Cliff…
They have over 1900 fans at this point, and could well outstrip KUOW's Weekday at the pace they are going. They've already left The Conversation in the dust.

If you want Scher and Sewall gone, go here:
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Tell-KUOW…

Cliff doesn't endorse the second page or have any involvement with it. I run it with a friend. Like Scher, we are exercising our right to do what we want regarding things we feel fall under our purview. I'm doing it in a way that is not offensive or braying. I keep a civil tongue because I know that's how you win an argument.

It's a rude thing to ask for someone's termination, especially in this kind of economy. But in addition to the events of the last week, Scher is just plain lousy at his job. That alone ought to get him the sack, regardless of what happened with Cliff.

If Scher were doing his job, he would have invited Mass to participate in the discussion about UW admissions, and would routinely invite him to participate in any discussion about math and science education.

The Stranger should have Cliff Mass as a regular contributor. I would totally read a bi-weekly "Cliff Mass says whatever he wants" column.

@7: KUOW has a community broadcast license, you dipshit. The airwaves are a public good. KUOW is using our airwaves, and they are most definitely accountable to us.

To your readers,

In case you're interested, KUOW's decision on Cliff Mass comes from management and station policy. Steve Scher's action was simply in compliance with those.

The decision to end Cliff's segment is completely in line with standard practices both here at KUOW and in public radio in general.

That practice is to book guests and contributors to speak on specific agreed-upon topics. If they don't want to confine themselves to the agreed-upon topics, we won't book them.

In fact, all traditional media have editorial rules to determine who gets to speak and what they can speak about. Enforcing those limits and agreements is not censorship. It’s done for a higher purpose - to keep the programming focused, fair and balanced.

KUOW’s editorial rules differentiate between those who may give opinions on our airwaves and those who may not. Hosts and reporters are not allowed to take sides on issues. Guests are allowed to opine freely and be rigorously challenged by the host and listeners.

In his Friday weather segment, Cliff Mass had the distinctive role of contributor. As such, he functions journalistically, as we do – remaining informative and objective. He can speak about science, but he’s not free to digress into any topic he feels like, especially policy issues that may be controversial or polarizing.

Critics point to Rick Steves as a contradiction to this policy, but there is a difference. Rick has appeared as a guest on KUOW about once a year for the past five years. As such, he can freely discuss many topics, including legalizing marijuana.

Cliff has also appeared as a guest on KUOW (most recently 12/09) – again, guest, not contributor – and in those interviews he’s had the same opportunity.

Cliff is a passionate advocate for certain causes such as math education and coastal radar. As worthy as those causes may be, we believe our listeners want us to thoroughly examine them by providing differing viewpoints and opinions, not just comments tossed about randomly.

We’ve talked to Cliff many times about his differing roles and expectations. Unfortunately we were not able to come to an agreement that would allow him to continue.

It’s true that certain practices have changed at KUOW over the years. Some types of comments and discussions that were once permitted are no longer so. That’s simply an evolution of our editorial practices as station management continuously re-evaluates what we do. We strive to produce solid radio journalism and refrain from providing an unchecked platform for any individuals or interest groups.

And let me state unequivocally that this decision is not political in any sense. No one is being censored, no outside pressure came from the UW or anyone else. We value listener input and will continue to explore ways to work with Cliff that meet our mutual needs and desires. We wish him well in his future endeavors.

Sincerely,
Guy Nelson
KUOW News Director

Guy Nelson--

Bullship. Stop treating your listeners like idiots. We are not.

Guy Nelson--

You had a reporter talking about the UW admissions policy for an hour with no balanced alternative to her opinions. Then someone who was actually involved in the UW admissions process and had spoken to the Dean of Admissions was available to relay first-hand knowledge and perspective. That person was Cliff Mass. Any credible journalist would find themselves lucky to have such an articulate person to "balance" the opinions of your first guest.

Your response to this situation is Bullshit. Stop treating your listeners like idiots and stop backing the unprofessional actions of your host who ended a 15-year relationship with a snarky email. "See you at the gym" has now become a snarky way to end something. Well, a lot of your listeners are saying, "See you at the gym, KUOW--our money is going elsewhere."

Much as I generally respect you Guy, I think you're off on this one. Others have pointed out Joni was on for almost an hour.

Your letter sounds like corporate weasel speak - I don't think it's going to win many converts.

Start calling Joni Balter a regular cuz gawd knows she gets enough airtime on KUOW, can her ass for one-sided axe grinding, and we'll call it even.

Also, fire Scher on the general principle that anybody who interacts with the public for a living, thinks it's a good idea to fire somebody by e-mail, signs off with "see you at the gym" and publishes it unedited - must be stupid or a sleaze ball HR disaster-in-waiting.

Since Rick Steeves has had a weekly travel show on KUOW for at least several years Mr. Nelson's statement above, I'm sorry there just isn't any other way to put it, is wrong. Doesn't the KUOW News Director even know what is on KUOW? Besides, this is really an extraneous point.
How long has Prof. Mass taught? As a full professor, an apparent expert in his field, in which mathematics is a major component, his experience on the state of math. education is more than "mere opinion". In a few decades, less if we are lucky, the results of the changes in math education will show us who is correct. Meanwhile, I for one, want, and expect, public radio to air divergent information. Even if it "steps on the toes" of other "powers that be". Esp. if it steps on the "toes of powers that be"! It is abundantly clear that Prof. Mass is speaking for himself when mentioning math education. Only someone not paying attention would think otherwise.
As some would say, KUOW "man up" and do the right thing!

Since Rick Steeves has had a weekly travel show on KUOW for at least several years Mr. Nelson's statement above, I'm sorry there just isn't any other way to put it, is wrong. Doesn't the KUOW News Director even know what is on KUOW? Besides, this is really an extraneous point.
How long has Prof. Mass taught? As a full professor, an apparent expert in his field, in which mathematics is a major component, his experience on the state of math. education is more than "mere opinion". In a few decades, less if we are lucky, the results of the changes in math education will show us who is correct. Meanwhile, I for one, want, and expect, public radio to air divergent information. Even if it "steps on the toes" of other "powers that be". Esp. if it steps on the "toes of powers that be"! It is abundantly clear that Prof. Mass is speaking for himself when mentioning math education. Only someone not paying attention would think otherwise.
As some would say, KUOW "man up" and do the right thing!

Why are the Mass supporters so , well Ayn Randian? Just sayin'...

I learned many years ago that if you have to fire someone, the bigger failure is yours. In this case, KUOW could have taped his spots and edited them to make sure he was on topic, if they were so worried. But they chose to do nothing: they obviously didn't care enough about his contributions to keep him on the air. That's the decision KUOW's management (loosely defined) needs to own.

Cliff Mass will be fine. KUOW doesn't care. We, the listeners, are the only ones who miss out. I hope the KUOW board understands when volunteers or donors ask about this next time they're expected to fund this trainwreck.

I'm pretty sure the "guy nelson" commenter is not Guy Nelson.

There are only two instances of this comment, one on blatherwatch and now here. None through official channels.

So, @19 is a big fake.

Being an expert in a science that involves mathematical modeling does not actually make you an expert on k-12 mathematics pedagogy. Ask anyone who's had to suffer through grad school under a hotshot advisor: being a successful researcher in your field IN NO WAY implies being able to teach it to others (or to be able to prescribe the methods by which to teach the ten-years-aforehand prerequisites of your field, as Mass presumes to do.) And I've never seen any evidence that Cliff Mass has credentials regarding pedagogy.

I do think that he should go on KUOW for an hour against someone who actually knows shit about pedagogy, though, that would be useful.

@32 I'm a tad suspicious, too. I would hope KUOW would respond officially via the Stranger staff, rather than diving in the dangerous waters of The Comments.

Side note - "We wish him well in his endeavors" is mealy-mouthed HR talk for canning someone. Always sounds snarky and disingenuous.

The real problem is UW vested interests putting pressure on KUOW, combined with some prima donna ossification within the KUOW institution.

Oh come on. Guy Nelson's remarks about contributors remaining on-focus make perfect sense. You can't have a show where every guest or contributor feels free to opine on whatever bothers him that day. Well, you can, but it wouldn't be a very good show.

Cliff Mass was not invited on KUOW to talk about feline homeopathy, deep-vein thrombosis, or math education. He was invited to talk about the weather. When he decided unilaterally that he could say fuck-all to KUOW, he was canned. Appropriately so. And I like Cliff Mass.

Cliff has (for good reason) built a following around here. Great for him - I'm one of those followers. But I'm disappointed in his reaction to this decision by KUOW. Move on, they have every right to cut him off. I don't even care what the reason is.

Assuming Cliff is half the personality and influencer he thinks he is, he'll just move on to a bigger and better forum. Any other action on his part comes across to me as an egocentric power play - with a kind of desperate and pathetic aspect.

Cliff Mass is painting himself as the world's biggest martyr. So he got canned. Boo hoo. It happens all the time in the real world, Prof. Mass. And most of us survive and move on instead of creating Facebook campaigns.

How Mass thinks that listeners want to hear about math and UW admissions practices during his five-minute WEATHER segment is beyond delusional. I enjoyed listening to his WEATHER segments as much as anyone, but if he wants to use it as a soapbox to talk about math or music or methadone centers, well, I'd want KUOW to find another talking weather-head to replace him.

People who don't believe that #19 is really Guy Nelson? Geez, get a clue - Contact KUOW and see for yourselves that yes, that is he.

And for everyone calling for Joni Balter's head: Have you not noticed that during the Friday news wrap-up segment, your beloved Stranger's Eli Sanders is also sharing a microphone w/ Ms. Balter? Off with his head, too!

Finally, shame on The Stranger: The cover of this week's issue promises "Cliff Mass vs. KUOW," but all we get inside is a one-sided regurgitation of Mr. Mass's blog screed. If you really wanted to offer a "Him vs. Them" feature, you would have brought in Steve Scher or Guy Nelson or Katy Sewall for a Point-Counterpoint with Mr. Mass.

Scher is out of line. Fine, Dr. Mass pounds the pulpit on occasion. But. Steve is so used to having a script of questions handed to him by the governor & mayor when they are on and Steve does his stuttering Eddie Haskall suck-up routine with people of "power" I think he's playing the big brother & slapping down Cliff because he can.

KUOW is out of line in so many ways it is time to us this as an opportunity to clean house. We pay all wages through the "U-dub". They work for us. Steve makes near 90K a year...

BY the way, why are employees of KUOW considered essential state employees & not being forced mandatory time off??

In many, many ways Steve Scher has jumped the shark. Did you catch his time with the mayor at the time of the murder of the Indian carver? Steve claims he a journalist, he should have nailed the mayor but really he could care less, his near 90K a year is more important than truth..

Dr. Mass if you would have pushed legalizing pot like Rick steves does on a regular basis, you would have been: "ok".

I like Cliff's contributions on KUOW, but he is being a big crybaby and it is very unattractive. I doubt he has the support of his colleagues at UW. Cliff should do himself a favor and listen to those who have told him to back off--they are his friends.

People did warn him, but he has a messiah complex.

This was Cliff's final warning on the air:

http://www.kuow.org/mp3high/mp3/WeekdayB… Scher warns him.

@ 37: Yes, they have the right to cut him off. It just seems like they let the minute letter of the law get in the way of the larger picture: were the lapses really so great that it meant purging one of the most interesting and beloved of contributors? Really? I guess they feel clean, knowing they are following their rules, but from the listener's perspective, they just chose to dump a huge asset. All of their legalese can not make up for it.

#33
K-12 experts on pedagogy are getting things wrong, and that is the issue. If your goal is to give people good math education and after 12 years of math education people in your charge clearly know less than their counterparts from other states and countries, your methods are not working.

You are more likely to succeed as an educator if you follow methods that have been proven successful elsewhere rather than coming up with things like "discovery math".

Discovery math versus math books used in Singapore? Hmmmm, I wonder which ones would serve better for my kids. I really want my kids to know and appreciate math.

I have two daughters in elementary school. They very clearly do not benefit from working in groups nor do they seem to discover much of math when at school.

Their teachers are wonderful people, but they have to follow the Seattle public schools curriculum.

I got seriously alarmed when, come fifth grade, my older daughter still did not understand how to use the equal sign. I began paying closer attention, and sure enough, my third grader is clueless when it comes to the equal sign. For God's sake. The equal sign.

Luckily, I have enough time and passion for math and now I tutor my kids. They are not as dumb as I was afraid. They simply receive bizarre instructions.

#43, #38
Cliff Mass is not painting himself as a martyr, he is not a cry baby. He cares about things that you probably give a damn about and thus you do not understand what is the big deal.

@38: as a total side note, Ms. Balter takes up a LOT of that hour's airtime. She jumps in as if she is the appointed default speaker, and then talks over and interrupts the other guests. It is, frequently and tediously, her forum.

If keeping programming focused and on track is a priority for KUOW, Jesus Christ, then why is Steve Scher on the air at all? The guy has as much focus as a fart; he's a walking non-sequitor.

@33: As an undergraduate advisor and as someone involved in the admission process, it sounds like Mr. Mass is a well positioned front line witness to the failures of the touchy-feely hokum presented by "discovery math" and other failed education approaches.

An article about the Mass/KUOW riff written BY Mass. That is SO Mass. Was I the only one who noticed the constant pitches for his book or where he would be giving a lecture and signing his book. Give me a break. This is a Mass tantrum about losing free public face time to promote Mass Inc.

An article about the Mass/KUOW riff by Mass. That is SO Mass. Was I the only person who got sick of the shameless self promotion of his book, where he would be talking and signing etc.? Give me as break. This is more about Mass losing precious (and free) on air promotion of Mass Inc. He is free to do or say anything he wants to all of you who clamor...via pod cast.

Science and education are inextricably linked. Science is about education, about learning how the Universe works. And about sharing that knowledge and process with others to improve the world.

Steve Scher and KUOW staff, if you invite any good scientist onto your show, Weekday on KUOW, even if they are there to talk about the weather, the discussion will inevitably lead back to education. Why do scientists take the time to write books and articles, to publish their research, to go on TV and radio shows? To educate, and to promote the cause of education itself.

KUOW agreed to this when they first added Cliff Mass to the segment. From Cliff Mass's blog:

"My involvement with KUOW began in the mid 90s when I was contacted by them to replace the previous weather person, Art Rangno. I told them that I was not interested in just giving the forecast, but wanted to do scientific outreach, trying to follow (in a modest way) the footsteps of one of my mentors, Carl Sagan, who convinced me that scientists had to communicate directly with the public. I offered KUOW a hybrid: a weather forecast/weather 101 combination and that was accepted."

I wholeheartedly endorse the efforts Cliff Mass has done to speak out in this issue, both on KUOW and in a court of law. Thank you, Mr. Mass for standing up and putting your reputation, career and your personal finances on the line.

On a personal note, my wife and I withdrew our kids from public schools in a large part because of this horrible Discovering Math curriculum. We enrolled them in Catholic schools (even though we are athiest/agnostic!) because they are way better at teaching math and science. The public schools in this country are an abysmal failure and it is the duty of any good scientist or educator to speak out on this issue. I feel that Cliff Mass had an excellent way of portraying the relevance of this issue to the large community of people who were drawn to his weekend weather forecast out of interest to the topic. It is not off topic, it is the heart of the topic. If I wanted a brainless weather report with no educational substance I would go to commercial radio or TV.

Steve, please consider the precedent that this sets for your talk show. You are one of the torch bearers for the public voice in broadcasting in a time when the government Is making that form of communication increasingly difficult.

I will no longer support KUOW with my own personal financial contributions as I have done in the past unless this issue is sufficiently addressed.

@46 Sorry, but Cliff Mass is handling this matter in a very undignified manner and he richly deserves the scorn he is receiving for it.

@13, etc. In listening to Steve Scher's show I learn the thoughts of those who come to town to speak at Town Hall, Benaroya Hall, McCall Hall, Kane Hall, Elliott Bay Books, Third Place Books, etc. Those folks usually thank Steve for a thoughtful interview and they never dismiss him as a windbag.

I've enjoyed Cliff's KUOW segment for years, including his concerns about math and science education. Jeff Hansen of KUOW replied to my email that they expect commentators to stay within their allotted field; maybe this can change with sufficient community comment. I enjoy Steve Scher, but perhaps he's grown stale over the decades... time for a new Weekday host?

My main issue with Cliff Mass's firing is that as a listener I want Cliff Mass and his comments on the weather (and whatever). What I don't want is Steve Scher, who is incompetent. Having Mr. Scher do the firing was just salt on my wounds.

@56- When you tell a volunteer they can't volunteer anymore, "firing" is a reasonable word.

You're handling this in a pretty classy way, Cliff. Kudos.

I hope Dr. Mass develops his own radio show, gets picked up by a different station, or begins a regular podcast. Getting canned is a frustrating experience, to say the least, but it sounds from all accounts that Weekday just wasn't the right gig for him anymore, for several reasons. Time to grieve and move on. Too bad he felt it necessary to burn bridges with a station he'd been a part of for so many good years.

I also hope the Weekday staff take the feedback they've received from listeners because of the firing, and apply it to improving the show, which somehow manages to get more boring with each passing year. They clearly need to balance the interviews of authors pushing their books with local/civic issues for the sake of reporting on local/civic issues. You know, a news-based call-in show. Like it was 8 years ago when I started listening.

Now HERE's a weatherman I would have enjoyed listening to!
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/lo…

@52 How the hell is Catholic school better at teaching math and SCIENCE?! There's no room for science in creationism.

yeah they have a right to let him go just like I have a right to not give them money when they come begging.

Cliff Mass being warned on the air, something you won't find on his blog

http://www.kuow.org/mp3high/mp3/WeekdayB…

I think the UW policy is horrible. We all know what it's about...money. Who pays taxes so that the UW can accept students from Washington State at a lower rate? Washington State taxpayers. If Cliff is so worried about folks getting a good education, why can't he support students with lower Math SATs going to the UW? Math IS important but so is education that is available to everyone who wants it and especially those who live in Washington State and who have been paying taxes here. Higher SAT scores also come from those folks who have parents who are able to send them to special SAT courses that also are not cheap. I like Cliff Mass. I think KUOW should keep him but I don't think it's right to defend his pro-math, anti washington state taxpayer student stance when he is wrong. Most people who major in math will never use that skill when they graduate. We need students who are involved in community building and the labor movement. See... every one has an opinion...

I gave up on KUOW about 6 months ago when I just got tired of hearing TWO canned episodes of "Marketplace Morning Report" during my morning get-going routine instead of 20 more minutes of actual NPR. (Ooo! What's today going to be: "It Don't Mean a Thing If It Ain't Got That Swing"?..."We're In The Money"?..."Stormy Weather"?...WHO CARES?!?!)

I gave money to KUOW. I'm Done. My money went to KPLU this year! Pledge drive was WAY shorter, better programming, and none of this bullshit!

@67: This "bullshit" is the result of KUOW broadcasting local news programs with local voices. KPLU does none of that. And all the more reason why KUOW and Steve Scher should let a valued local voice like Cliff Mass speak his mind.

I like Cliff Mass. He is worth listening to. Steve Scher is not worth listening to it turns out. I urge all of the "members" to ask for their money back. I just donated $100. and I definitely am not going to do that again. Not unless they offer Cliff an apology.

I second the comment from Valkyrie: "If Scher were doing his job, he would have invited Mass to participate in the discussion about UW admissions, and would routinely invite him to participate in any discussion about math and science education."

Scher's mumbling, often indifferent interviewing style is tolerable only because the guests are interesting and usually very articulate. Cliff's weather reports have always been engaging, enlightening and useful. If Scher & his producer had offered Cliff another way to share his views & knowledge on education, this fracas could have been avoided.

I second the comment from Valkyrie: "If Scher were doing his job, he would have invited Mass to participate in the discussion about UW admissions, and would routinely invite him to participate in any discussion about math and science education."

Scher's mumbling, often indifferent interviewing style is tolerable only because his guests are interesting. Cliff's weather reports have always been engaging, enlightening and useful. If Scher & his producer had offered Cliff another way to share his views & knowledge on education, this fracas could have been avoided. Lousy management, guys.

As a long term KUOW listener & supporter, I find it tragic that KUOW chose to make a mountain out of a mole hill over this issue.

It is particularly tragic because Steve Scher is one of the most interesting & least formulaic interviewers & conversationalists in American public radio. Steve's effectiveness & charm is due to his ability & willingness to follow bright, curious & interesting people's thought processes wherever they sometimes meander. It's an essential part of the art of conversation, as is his skillful ability to then gently rein in his errant guest & turn the conversation back to the main topic. Had he quietly continued doing with Cliff what he repeatedly did and does so well with many of his other guests & contributors, we listeners would never have cared or known any different.

Do yourselves and your listeners a favor. Acknowledge your mistake, and invite Cliff back to his rightful place on your program.

Thanks for letting Cliff Mass have his say - and I hope he becomes a regular feature in your pages. Since moving to Seattle in 1994 I have found the Stranger to be the ONLY source for reliable news, especially on community affairs and politics.

many many things are connected to education. it seems like a leap of logic to say that he should get to talk about education on his weather show. sounds like prof went gradually expanding his job description and finally came up against a wall.

and booh hoo, mr. tenured professor. you got fired from your radio (volunteer) job. chin up, at least you have a job, and you can say almost any tangential thing you want in the name of academic freedom and no one can ever fire you for it.

but i can't stand Scher either. agreed on that one.

Please - keep up the fight against Discovery math!!

My daughter's second grade teacher came from the UW's math education program and was a staunch proponent of Discovery Math. My daughter learned absolutely nothing from her. Couldn't even fucking add. What a waste.

Math education programs must constantly churn out new fads in order to justify their existence. They're mission in life is to "fix" things regardless of whether they are broken.

We already know how to teach math and have for decades. There's no mystery to it. Given the UW budget crisis, they would do well to make huge cuts in the math education department.

Hey @27 @44 & @64 Farley Mowhat:You're either Steve Scher himself or one of his rubes, enough with the sock-puppetry, shit is stupid and pointless, not unlike this comment.

this is just another example of the death throes of old media. and good riddance. we don't need you any more.

and to all those people who say cliff has no right to talk about other topics (very occassionally btw/) on his bit.. what kind of tyrants are you? this guy volunteers his services on a weekly basis for 15 years & he gets fired for occassionally talking about related topics that he has experience w/? what kind of a relationship is that? where's the give & take? where's the respect for this individual who you & your show have a relationship w/? it's nowhere, because old media is a piece of shit.

KUOW is just a cozy club for journalists:

Joni ("Eastside") Balter is allowed to spout off every week on Weekday on any topic - usually unencumbered by any knowledge - purely because someone annointed her a "journalist" (whatever that means).

If Frank Blethen with his great largesse, decided to start paying Cliff Mass would that somehow give Cliff, like Balter, the right to speak freely on KUOW ?!

What got Cliff fired was an attempt to correct bias and misinformation from the Seattle Times, that was discussed in the review segment on Weekday.

To have Cliff Mass subsequently speak on Weekday without giving him the right to respond makes him appear - by his forced silence - to be assenting to these inaccurate claims about the UW! Anyone following the program would likely think, "Oh, that info about UW must be correct, otherwise Mass would have said something...."

I know this kind of editorial practice is quite common in [Iranian] Public Radio!

It seems most of these comments have been written by Cliff Mass under various noms du plume.

noms de plume

with @4 100%. stopped reading the comments at that point.

Steve Scher sounds like a lightweight radio putz. Belongs on "Morning Drive" in some mid-tier midwest city. Cliff Mass is a successful, published, productive professor at U-W. I know who I would want to hear, and I know what lameo putz belongs out of a job.