Eleven Writers on the First Week of a New Era

Welcome Back to the United States of America

Comments

1
Dan Savage declares,

“Prop 8 was bankrolled by the Mormon Church . . . “

If a lie is repeated often enough, does it become the truth?

Here are some inconvenient facts:

1. The name is “The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.” There is no "Mormon Church."
http://www.newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/…

2. The Church of Jesus Christ, as an institution, donated only about two thousand dollars to cover travel expenses of its leaders to coalition meetings. Any other funding by Mormons for Propostion 8 came directly from individual Mormons, from their after-tax savings, in exercise of their right of free speech.
http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=4648552

3. The California Teachers Association, as an institution, gave $1.25 million to "No on 8" from the compulsory dues of its members. Where is his outrage for this undemocratic action?

4. Although a web site run by a dissident Mormon purported to “out” individual Mormon donors, its agenda provides good reasons not to trust its information. Moreover, disclosure of religious association is a matter of constitutional protection and a privilege held by the member against disclosure. (Church of Hakeem v. Superior Court, CA, 1980).
http://hedgehogcentral.blogspot.com/2008…

Imagine the uproar if a web site “outed” individual donors to any political cause as “Jews!” Anti-Mormonism is every bit as despicable as anti-Semitism.

5. The “Yes on 8” coalition itself estimates that only about 40% of its support came from Mormons.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cg…

6. "No on 8" raised $38.4 million, with $12.0 million (31.2%) coming from out of state.
"Yes on 8" raised $36.1 million, with $10.7 million (29.6%) coming from out of state.
So "No" raised $2.3 million more than "Yes," and "No” raised $1.3 million more than "Yes" from out of state.
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-mon…

So even if individual Mormons “bankrolled” about 40% of the funding of Prop. 8, most of them must, of necessity, were residents of California.

California is about 2% Mormon. Astonishing that the magical power they had over the other 50% of Californians who voted with them!

Fact-checking the rest of Savage's rant is left as an exercise to the alert reader.

Mr. Savage, if you can't be truthful, at least be consistent. Be sure to also boycott Blacks.

hthalljr'gmail'com
2
Another good thing to keep in mind in the "Painfully Ironic!" section of the Mormon's beliefs is this little nugget:

While the Church did, indeed, have its little tax-prompted epiphany in 1978 vis a vis institutional racism, they still believe that Black's bear the "Mark of Cain," BUT! If you are Black, and you are baptized Mormon and wear the special underwear and go on your mission and whatnot ... when you die and go to heaven ... guess what? As reward for being a good Mormon ... YOU TURN WHITE! AHHH HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!!

Yeah. They don't really publicize that belief too much.

Maybe you should help them out with that, Dan.

3
The MORMON CHURCH went to the unprecedented length, unlike any other religious group, to fight proposition 8. They had a letter read out-loud, in EVERY mormon church, beseeching their followers to donate as much as possible to the Yes on Prop 8 movement. One family even gave their entire 40,000 dollar life savings to the cause.

The mormon church is guilty my friends.

Ironic coming from a group that celebrated polygamy, isn't it?

John from LA
4
Dan Savage is full of lies.

1. The Mormon Church did not bankroll Prop 8. They only spent $2K as a reimbursement for travel expenses.
2. The tax exempt threat, if there was one, had nothing to do with the 1978 revelation.
3. Why do straight African Americans have bigotry to get past? Is it just because they disagree with you?
4. Perhaps African Americans realize more than you do that families need a Mother and a Father and that both are important to a child.

Do you really think Utah will miss you?
5
Also, the African-American community must share much of the blame. I live in a predominately black neighborhood in Los Angeles, and the following comes from a flyer I regularly received:

(Big Picture of Barak Obama)
"I'm not in favor of gay marriage." -Harball, April 2008

And then beneath this, a longer quote from Obama:

"...marriage is the union between a man and a woman. Now, for me as a Christian, it's also a sacred union. God's in the mix."

Shame on Obama. Did you hear that?
I guess God's not in the mix for gay people.

This is why I didn't vote for Obama.

You can see the flyer for yourself by Googling: Flyer, Yes on Prop 8.
6
If you vote republican or democrat, you are fucking delusional. They are bought and sold. Libertarian will be the future, if we have one, for this country.
7
From #1

"California is about 2% Mormon."

"The “Yes on 8” coalition itself estimates that only about 40% of its support came from Mormons."

Mmm, great refuting of Dan's point there. Only 40%?!
8
Send your old Obama shirts to people in other countries. I am sending mine to friends I made while in Ghana.
9
Here's a scary fact about Mormons that you could use to turn mainstream America against them - according Jon Krakauer's book "Under the Banner of Heaven", at their current rate of conversion and expansion, by 2050, the US government will be INOPERABLE without the cooperation of the Mormon church. For some inexplicable reason, their conversion rates are extremely high. Also, their practice of having lots of kids is exponentially growing their numbers. And, the FLDS churches where they still practice polygamy multiply those reproductive numbers by however many "spiritual wives" they have. Since polygamous marriages aren't legally recognized, those children are considered to be outside of wedlock and the mothers receive welfare money on EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THOSE KIDS. That money is given back to the church to make it that much richer and more formidable a force in American politics.
10
THe problem with what the LDS church did is that a letter from church leaders was read outloud 'from the pulpit' saying that LDS members should donate to support Prop 8... it was not an individual decision for each church, rather a directive from SLC...
THAT is what is pissing us off... not that individuals who happen to be LDS donated, as many other people did, but that the CHURCH directed people to support Prop8..
you do not get to piss off the gays by inserting religions into politics, it will end poorly for you
11
I respect the can-do pioneer spirit and rich history of the LDS church. But it sickens me to see them dole out small-minded hatred of the same type the early Saints experienced as they were driven West by similar bigots. Pot, meet Kettle.
12
Screw this Prop 8 talk. Lets talk about how after the election, it is definitely NOT weird to wear your Obama shirt. If anything, I think it's hella cool that after spending 4 years of watching punk kids ram around in their NOT MY PRESIDENT shirts I can wear a shirt and go "Yo, this guy is so awesome, I'm gonna wear him on my t-shirt even though its not an election year. Schwing!"

If one dude can wear a shirt showing off a band I've never heard of, another can wear a shirt showing off that they like to shop at the Gap, and another can show off the way they like the color blue, why I can't I show off a shirt with a dude who kicks major ass? Lets all hold hands!

Obama! T-shirts! Fun!
13
also they believe that bullshit about golden tablets.
14
You know, Linday, one of the first things I thought after BHO won was "wow, I've never worn a t-shirt promoting a sitting President before." And you know what? I probably will wear it sometimes, and I don't think that's creepy.

Also, for your bio section: Sarah Vowell has two "l"s.
15
The Mormons want to run Mitt Romney as a pres in 2012 so they need to up the popularity of Mormons among the evangalicals.

The Mormons are playing a typical playground game. If you are the weak outcast getting picked on, you just need to find a more unpopular kid to beat up, and you become more popular.

Mormon weddings are illegal too. Who is sticking up for the Mormons? I know theyre crazy aholes. But still they should be allowed to have crazy group marrages. I draw the line at the child molestation thing. But if they want to enter libertine orgy gang bang weddings, its their life. its not like theyre stoning rape victims in stadiums. yet.
16
You are assuming that Savage is a reporter. That always throws people.
17
I'm am sorry, but this is pretty sick.
18
If we say that marriage should be a "holy union" that is related to the bible and can only constitute a man and woman, then we need to make marriage illegal for everyone - our very constitution is based on the separation of church and state. Civil unions only should then be recognized by the state. If you want to get married, go to the church and have a ceremonial marriage. As it is, gay people do not have the same rights as straight people do, because they are not allowed to marry. We can't visit each other in the hospital in some states, we don't have the tax breaks that married people do, and we would be unable to inherit our partner's belongings if it is not specified in a will - all because we cannot be officially recognized as partners in the same way that straight people can be.

I believe that some people think that homosexuality is all about sex. It is not. I am in love with my partner and have been for the past five years. We share a house, a car, and just about every spare moment we have together. We are a team, and we would be incomplete without the other. Any straight person in a happy relationship would probably be able to describe their relationship in exactly the same way. Not recognizing that our love is just as great, just as powerful, and just as worthy as anyone else's makes us second class citizens. The idea that someone can say that they are "not anti-gay just pro-marriage" (read Frank Schubert's (chief strategist for Prop-8) commentary in the NY Times Article "Mormons Tipped Scale in Ban on Gay Marriage")is completely incompatible with the truth. There is no way that you can simultaneously feel fine stripping someone's rights from them, while in the same breath say that you believe that they are equal. These things are not compatible. It is baffling that some people cannot learn from civil rights history and realize many of the same flawed and bigoted ideas are still in circulation about gay rights today. I am signing my full name to this -
19
Sorry, but this life long liberal democrat isn't buying into the lies being put out there, by those in the extremist end of the gay movement, any more. The racism, the disrespect for the civil rights, especially the right to think, and decide for ones self, the sanctity of one's right to vote and contribute to candidates and the issues of ones choosing, without threats or intimidation. What the gay movement has revealed is that it is given to FASCISM!

They have shown hatred and intolerance, evidence that they are corrupted, and do not respect the rights of others.

Womyn2me starts pointing fingers at a religion, where was her concern when her "no on prop 8" friends were taking a quarter million dollars from PG&E, the same corporation that has poisoned innocent Californians, when they contaminated groundwater with the carcinogen chromium 6? If you saw the movie Erin Brockovitch, you should be familiar with what happened, the company shown in the film was PG&E, the same corporation that ripped off the ratepayers of California.

The leaders of "no on prop 8" took the quarter million dollar bribe, and refused to support a proposition that would have ended PG&E's monopoloy status in San Francisco.

The same leaders of "no on prop 8" are Log Cabin republicans, the same ones who voted for politicians who would give them bigger tax breaks.. I wonder why gays and lesbians didn't protest against those same Log Cabin republicans who didn't care about policies that hurt less affluent gays and lesbians, or less affluent citizens of any kind.

But what else should we expect from those who demand that religious liberties be violated and that civil rights should only apply to the elites of the gay community?

Of course, the gay community has been refusing to address the disgusting fact that there is terrible racism in it, especially among it's elites. The vile racist epithets, the threats and violence, bringing back the blacklist.. sorry, but I now realize that the negative stereotypes of gays that I fought against, have more than a kernal of truth to them. Good, kind, stable human beings do not act the way the gay community have. They have lost my respect, for them to regain it, they're going to have to work hard undoing the wrongs they have done, and that means kicking the racist/fascist scum in the gay community to the curb, and apologizing for not doing it sooner.

Womyn2me, and the rest of her fellow fascists can try and spin it all they want, I will boycott any and all celebrities, performers, entertainment industry, magazine, corporation that supports the racist, fascist gay community, and refuses to take a loud, principled stand against their racist and fascistic tendencies, I demand a purge of racist and fascist gays and lesbians.

BTW, Utah, don't give in to the fasists who seek to violate your rights and freedoms. I now plan to take my family to ski in your state during our two week long January break.

20

before you know it obama will be running for president again. don't lose track of that t-shirt.
21
"4. Perhaps African Americans realize more than you do that families need a Mother and a Father and that both are important to a child."

Should we put a proposition to ban single parents on the table next time?
22
Lindy West says it's weird to wear your Obama teeshirt. I sleep in mine. Is that ok?