Why Ron Paul Will Never Win

Inside a Pizza-and-Conspiracy-Fueled Meeting for the Great White Libertarian Hope

Comments

1
Paul's article is spot on in describing Ron Paul/Truther bobbleheads. I work with one of these guys. When I tell my coworker about how Ron Paul's policies would hurt the industry we work in, my coworker becomes upset and asks me a million questions that he pulls out of thin air, that have absolutely no relevance to our jobs. And my coworker is in a financial pickle as it is, so he has more reason than I to vote for his job. Libertarianism would fuck my coworker over very well. Just another example of someone who votes against their self interest. Good article, Paul.
2
Oh man, love this article.

Can't wait for the Paulistas to arrive.
3
great analysis & reporting!
4
Credentials! Credentials! Do you need credentials to valiantly debunk the government's nefarious chicanery, or are only the "sheeple" who don't blame the government for 9/11 obligated to provide them?
5
So, what do we do? Keep voting in the same two corrupt parties? Both parties keep imperialism, colonialism, geo-political meddling in the Middle East and elsewhere around the world. Both parties maintain over 700 bases in 130 countries around the world in order to keep their military industrial complex alive.Both parties are bought off by corporate interest.As a lefty, I'm tired of seeing the same crap over and over,watching Obama maintain Bush era policies. The Obama admin. promised to back off on DEA marijuana arrest, promised to cut back on deportations and has deported more immigrants than Bush, promised to make a mends in foreign policies,promised to support Palestinian statehood which as of tomorrow, the United States will veto just to protect the global interest in the Middle East and keep funding billions of dollars to racist pro-apartheid Israel, promised to back off on the Patriot Act 2, and he didn't follow through on any of it. So, maybe Ron Paul may not be the complete answer, but at least he is willng to address the issues that both parties haven't addressed in over 20 years. You want more info, check out DemocracyNow.org and Nation of Change, just to name a couple of Independent news sites. Peace brothers and sisters, there's just not enough of it.
6
This comments thread should prove to be entertaining.
7
ah...more smarter than thou insight from the stranger. maybe the stranger should get off their faux disenchanted high horse and post something of substance. why are truthers concerned? do they not have some legitimate ideas? yes...some of them are completely insane, and yes libertarians aren't the best of the bunch (understatement cough cough) but this article reeks of pandering and is just an excuse to trash paul, minimize the average persons concerns about the crap the democrats have miserably failed to handle, and subtly keep the status quo in place. weak. the truthers are lost in a sea of disinformation but at least they are trying and they have to guts to say what they believe no matter how fucking insane it sounds.,,they dont need to hide behind a mask of pseudo intellectual judgement which is what you are doing. this type of crap from you guys is just boring as usual. please get a life. other than that, FUN article!
8
@7: "the truthers are lost in a sea of disinformation but at least they are trying and they have to guts to say what they believe no matter how fucking insane it sounds." Where on earth does this idea that trying to do something, anything, is intrinsically better than doing nothing? Where does this idea that believing insane things is better than skepticism come from? Willful ignorance should not be celebrated, nor should the desire to publicly and proudly proclaim that ignorance. Pursuing policies that make things substantially worse than the status quo for more people than they make things better (especially if one of those people for whom things get worse is oneself) is not better than supporting the status quo, no matter how bad the status quo is.

I think Paul's critique is pretty well-thought-out (i.e. plain "intellectual judgement", not "pseudo intellectual judgement"): as he mentions, Progressives think Ron Paul makes sense (some good ideas!) until he starts talking about dismantling all government infrastructure (and, of course, his weird anti-agency, pro-government-biopolitics stance against abortion).
9
There is literally nothing that these people can't turn into a conspiracy. To my great embarrassment, my father is a 9/11 Truther (it makes me *crazy*). The other day he mentioned a YouTube video he found that makes the case that the seismic record for the recent D.C. earthquake more closely resembles that of an explosion. Well! If there's someone speculating about it in a YouTube video, then it must be true. Just like the one he sent me during the swine flu epidemic telling me not to get the vaccine, which was tainted as part of a plan by Baxter International to kill off a huge percentage of the population, thus solving the overpopulation problem. This last video was made by a nun in Spain who inexplicably had the inside scoop on this plan. I really wish I were making this shit up.

The psychology of conspiracy theorists is interesting. My father for instance is actually a pretty intelligent man, but the conspiracy theories make him feel like he's "in the know" and thus superior to the unwashed masses.
10
Dear Paul Constant:

Are you telling us that you believe the government's story of 9/11? And I thought The Stranger was hip, smart and cool!! Maybe all the music and film you promote is garbage too.
11
Dear Paul Constant:

Are you telling us that you believe the government's story of 9/11? And I thought The Stranger was hip, smart and cool!! Maybe all the music and film you promote is stupid garbage too. As a former far left progressive, 10 years after 9/11 my only disappointment with Ron Paul is that he is not a 9/11 truther. Way to make a joke of yourself and the Stranger with this article though.
12
Easy prediction: Biggest Slog commentary EVAH.
13
Let the Paulista Yahooing begin!!

14
...just as long as the U.S. doesn't become a Paulista State!!
15
What @2 said.

However, at least Ron Paul doesn't hate America and old people like Comrade Perry does ...
16
OooOOoo! This should be fun!

::popping popcorn, settling in…::
17
@9: People are really really good at pattern recognition. To a fault. Good pattern recognition skills are essential to survival. Over-active pattern recognition accounts for much of our desire to see god in everything, or a conspiracy in disparate unrelated information.
18
"his arms flying about like a Muppet"

Love it.
19
Bruno.
20
CHEMTRAILS!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
21
Where is that popcorn gif from the LiveJournal days...
22
It would be worth it to do a follow-up article on the psychology of conspiracy theorists. You could almost call it "conspiricism"; it's an affliction worthy of an "ism".

You have somebody who is fairly intelligent but antisocial, and the last thing they want to do is believe what most people believe so they will gravitate towards conspiracy.
23
I'm imagining the C4L members as barnyard animals meeting at a pizza place. That makes mess less sad about their mental illness.
24
Incoming John Bailo idiocy in 5.... 4... 3..
25
Paul, on a purely stylistic tangent, shouldn't you have used the word 'liquefy', not 'liquidate'? Or am I just splitting hairs?
26
Well done, Paul.
27
What @26 said.
28
The Stranger used to be funny. With this article, I'm glad to see the total sarcasm and humor back! Did this first run in the Onion?

I'm a Ron Paul supporter. I don't subscribe to conspiracy theories, therefore I don't believe half the carp that comes out of D.C. Of course, as the author says, I have zero interest in 99% of what comes out of Washington D.C., and there's a simple reason for that. What happens in D.C. can stay in D.C. The politicians there are so grossly out of touch with their constituents that they cannot possibly represent in an appropriate manner.

Ron Paul supports less federal government involvement in the daily lives of Americans, which is good for everyone except the federal government. The federal government is the largest corporation in the world. Do you really want that corporation to be so involved in your life that you are 100% beholden to the out-of-touch, corporate-owned politicians for everything ranging from health, work, taxes and retirement, to sexual preference freedom, marriage rights, and everything in between? If you answered, 'Yes', stick with that 2-party system candidate who promises the world and delivers a rancid peanut.
29
P.S. If even for a second, you thought, 'No,' do a little Ron Paul reading to get some real facts instead of the one-sided satire here.
30
The greatest 9-11 conspiracy theory of all in only 5 minutes!:http://www.corbettreport.com/911-a-consp…

Didn't we do this already a couple weeks back?
31
Why is this not a reality TV show?
32
Lissa, pass the popcorn?
33
"So what kind of person becomes an avid Ron Paul follower? The kind of person who is a 9/11 Truther."

Well said, Paulie and company. By the very same reason neocon swine like Paulie subscribe to those hardcare anti-truthers (and also, I believe Zionists) like Jonathan Kay, fellow with the Foundation in Defense of Democracy, that ultra-neocon blather group which replaced the PNAC crowd (note the similarity in many of the names).

http://www.defenddemocracy.org/about-fdd…

Bill Kristol, Joe Lieberman, Eric Cantor, Gary Bauer, Woolsey, Ledeen, Steve Forbes, Charles Krauthammer, et al., definitely Paul Constant's kind of crowd??

http://www.defenddemocracy.org/about-fdd…

http://www.defenddemocracy.org/about-fdd…

Since it's guilt by association, the typical ploy used by non-reporters, non-writers, and former book clerk hacks who can never make it at anything requiring rigorous thought, this must definitely apply to Paul, Dano and company at the Stranger....Strangest???

No, I would never support Ron Paul, as anyone over the age of 25 who is a libertarian is complete moron. (Should have outgrown it by that age.)

And since I've held the highest security clearances possible, and have experience in military intelligence (sic), global command post ops, and special ops (at least now it comes under that rubric), I and others with similar experience have long since taken issue with the story Paulie believes: the Cheney/Rumsfeld/Bush/Kissinger version.

But for those with a three-digit IQ (unlike Constant's barely two-digit brain), who are capable of independent thought, feel free to peruse the following:

[Vids]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuC_4mGTs…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?
v=WC9KZ2Yy5g4&feature=player_embedded

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pla…

http://soundprint.org:8080/ramgen/docume…

[Articles]

http://www.foreignpolicyjournal.com/2011…

http://www.jstor.org/stable/10.1086/5036…

http://www.zerohedge.com/contributed/%3F…

[SEC]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pla…

34
@32: With pleasure care bear! Perhaps whipping up some cocktails would be in order as well. In light of the topic at hand I'm thinking maybe something Kool-aid based....
35
FYI: Jonathan Kay wrote Among the Truthers, an anti-diatribe against those who question the official Cheney/Rumsfeld/Bush/Kissinger 9/11 story, and associating all those skeptical people with every crazy out there, similary as his pal, neocon Paul Constant does.

Birds of a feather.......
36
Oh look! Here's sgt doom!

::adds salt to popcorn::
37
"In a world under assault by shadowy cabinets of scary foreigners seeking to enslave the masses in concentration camps"

i get it, this Ron Paul article is part of a new Disney graphic novel, complete with WWII metaphors!
38
@11, 911Hipster, , you are sooo on target!

A friend of mine, after Paul Constant was hired by The Stranger (BTW, whoever was responsible for hiring that eff-tard? Did Dan "let's invade Iraq" Savage have anything to do with it????), recalled his unfortunate experience with Constant when Paulie was a super-incompetent at Elliott Bay Book Company.

Constant claimed he was in charge of their SF section and was knowledgeable about and asked if he could help him.

My friend inquired as to when they would be getting the next copy of an Iain Banks' SF novel in, and Constant claimed that Elliott was the first book store to stock it and had been doing so for over one year.

My friend explained that many local book stores had been stocking both Iain Banks' SF and regular fiction for well over 10 years, and that the first to carry him was the UW Book Store.

Similary, Constant knew nothing about the SF category in general, or anything in particular.

Why Constant felt the need to dissemble is anyone's guess, but almost everying else he has commented on has been off-the-wall and slapdash....
39
@36, Lissa, well since Paulie believes in guilt by association, and assuming you subscribe to Paulie's inane and insipid idiocy, no doubt you align yourself with the anti-truthers such as those neocons at FDD?

Is this your and Paulie's best buddy???

http://www.whodidit.org/richardperle_2.j…
40
@39: Oh, sgt, you're such a caution! Carry on, carry on...

::considers splurging and adding real butter to her popcorn...::
41
but, my popcorn is flavored with rich buttery thermite...
42
mmmmmm, thermite.
43
Thanks, Paul. This is going to be one for the clip file, I warrant.
44
Thermite and jet fuel Jiffy Pop...KABOOOM!! Done, but now I need a new kitchen. nomnomnom.
45
Q: What is the difference between a Paultard and a LaRouchie?
That's not the set up for a joke, I'm just wondering if anyone can see any discernible difference between the two.
46
There is no conspiracy theory that cannot be equally well explained by simple human idiocy. Either on the part of the supposed conspirators, or on the part of the conspiracy theorists. At the root of all evils, you will find a twerp.
47
@9 my point is that these people CARE and good for them. I would sooner jump on a bed of nails WHILE receiving a root canal than vote for ron paul but I don't believe every ron paul supporter is insane and believes in chemtrails. People look to Ron because he at least appears to be an independent voice that fights for the little guy. I personally think its a crime he has received the attention he gets while dennis kucinich or any other progressive liberal is tossed to the side. The stranger isn't a dennis fan either, which I bitched about the last time they ran an article about him. imo this article takes the easy cynical road instead of offering actual solutions and making a point to relates to actual people, and thats sad to me. shame on me for thinking they represented the little guy.
48
opps. That was directed @8 and not 9. MWAH.
49
@45

A paultard makes me groan, but a larouchie makes me laaaaaugh
50
OooOOoo I want some thermite!
51
Even Schizophrenics have moments of clarity but I still wouldn't put them in charge of the local nuke power plant.
52
@45: LaRouchies are an actual cult where the members often live together in dorms and LaRouche dictates what sort of music and art and math is acceptable.

Paultards are a mishmash of tech nerds and survivalists and neo-nazis.
53
Well, it's nice that the crazy middle-aged women have a social outlet that doesn't involve a library or Metro. It was lonely for them after the telephone company closed their payment lobbies.
54
Crazy Federal Reserve hating, 9-11 truthing, Ron Paul supporters! They're crazy! And "chemtrails"....oh boy, that's coo coo! Nobody in government could ever come up with something that wild....oh, wait....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXZhyf57Xyc&feature=results_video&playnext=1&list=PLD570EFB6C8843077

55
@54 Well bud, since the existence of anthropogenic global warming is a known fact, then we already have a real world example of unintended geo-engineering. It's clearly a possible thing to do. Unlike your insane 9/11 conspiracies, which, unlike the study of anthropogenic global warming, are utterly unaccepted in the scientific community. But here's some new stuff for ya, seen this one yet? It's a new theory of what brought down the towers, but the weird thing is is all it requires is chemistry, not conspiracy. Have fun hunting for clues of the conspiracy regardless.

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/09/21/di…
56
@55 Yes I have seen that, unfortunately I am one of the few 'truthers' who has never been a big proponent of the 'controlled demolition' angle.

The real story behind 9-11 can't be reduced down to a snappy sentence about nano-thermite, or bombs planted in the buildings. Plus, that line of reasoning misses a critical component for any objective investigation: a suspect, means, and motive.

There's plenty of people (yes, people within the scientific community http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=…) and even people right here on the slog who will argue the minutiae of the physical evidence to death. I think some of it's valid, but most of it is largely irrelevant to holding anyone accountable for the event that has trigger a war which "will not end in our lifetime".

I find things like this vastly more interesting: http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww…

or: http://www.historycommons.org/project.js… (that one might take a while to go through...)

Enough, I'm done. I'm tired of 9-11. It's significance is being vastly overshadowed by the shit storm that we are all currently ankle deep in. A shit storm by the way, that was in-part allowed to happen because too many people have failed to learn the lessons of 9-11, or how truly corrupt elements within our government really are. You can guarantee it's going to get a whole lot worse, I hope you have a kayak.
57
So I googled Hurricane Erin and 9/11. There's a woman named Judy Wood who has a WTC conspiracy theory that involves Tesla coils and "star energy weapons." Her theories are nuts, of course, but she does have a charming smile.
58
And you need to understand that Richard Gage and his theories are not respected at all outside of the Truther community. You can find "a" scientist to support anything, there's hundreds of thousands of scientists in the world and all individual scientists are fallible humans. We do our best to correct for this with the peer review process, and independent duplication and verification of findings. There's a handful of doctors who support homeopathy, astronomers who believe in UFO abductions, zoologists who believe in Big Foot. They're still wrong. A rational person provisionally sides with the consensus the scientific community holds on a given topic, not someone's pet, routinely debunked idea they've been peddling for years. A handful of cranks doesn't legitimize anything.
59
Mmmmmm! Pass the popcorn! Anyone for M&Ms?
60
Only 59 comments? C'mon Paulites/Truthers! You can do better than that! Where is KittenK to chide us for being mean? Where is Anastasia B? What about all of you who respect Mr. Paul for his "sincerity"? I have a pitcher of martinis, and it’s not going to drink itself people!

@59:Would you prefer peanut or plain?
61
Anyone who believes World Trade Center 7 fell because an airplane hit it is certifiably insane. If WTC 7 had remained standing, I wouldn't have an issue.

And before you throw out the old "but a chunk was taken out of a corner of the building"...which is true... But if that was the cause, then the building would have fallen toward that damage rather than straight down. Also, NIST admitted that the building was in free-fall for a few seconds. Now, how does a building achieve free-fall unless every support was gone at the same time?

Until someone can explain why WTC 7 fell the way it did, I will continue to take the official government story of 9/11 with a grain of salt.
62
"someone announces that a local anarchist group wanted to engage the C4L in a debate, which elicits derisive laughter from the assembly. "We don't have time for this," someone sneers."

How embarrassing for C4L Seattle.
63
@56: "The real story behind 9-11 can't be reduced down to a snappy sentence about nano-thermite, or bombs planted in the buildings. Plus, that line of reasoning misses a critical component for any objective investigation: a suspect, means, and motive."

While slightly better, you're still using a Creationist's logic to "prove" your viewpoint.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_of_the_…
64
@58 A rational person should probably be wondering why all those main-line scientists over at NIST classified the data that they used for their model of WTC7′s collapse. Ya think?
http://cryptome.org/nist070709.pdf
65
@63 Wow, well you better not let anyone whose ever tried to prosecuted a crime know that.
66
@60 Lissa: I love BOTH!!! Chocoholics unite!!!!

@61 Joe6Pack: Also, the World Trade Center collapsed because of a weak foundation. The beams holding up all those floors were not sturdily built. My father was an architectural designer and had pointed this out to me.

@64 Spindies: I wonder if it's possible that the NIST scientists kept the World Trade Center data under wraps because they knew of the weak floor plan?
67
@66 NIST's claim is that it would "jeopardize public safety" to let anyone know how their model worked.
68
The only reason the stranger is finally writng a real political hit piece is to discredit Dr. Ron Paul. They are taking the same stance with all the media cronies. Ron Paul has won all his debates according to web polls, only to be minimized through the corporate brain washing media. Seattlites, especially the stranger, claim to be so politically saavy, but do not know anything about the true workings of the federal reserve, real reasons that the US goes to wars, the constitution (our true rights and privlidges),and the true role of government. It is amazing, moreover pathetic, that the anti-war movement has virtually disappeared, now that a democrat is in office. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss!!!
69
9/11 Commissioners admit that they never got to the bottom of 9/11. For example:
• 9/11 Commission co-chair Lee Hamilton says “I don’t believe for a minute we got everything right”, that the Commission was set up to fail, that people should keep asking questions about 9/11, and that the 9/11 debate should continue
• 9/11 Commissioner Bob Kerrey said that “There are ample reasons to suspect that there may be some alternative to what we outlined in our version . . . We didn’t have access . . . .” He also says thatit might take “a permanent 9/11 commission” to end the remaining mysteries of September 11
Indeed, 9/11 Commissioners and other officials say that the true facts were hidden from them, or covered up (you don’t have to get bogged down in reading this section – you can skip ahead to the next, if you like; this is just documenting that the 9/11 Commission report is in no way the last word on 9/11):
• The 9/11 Commission’s co-chairs said that the 9/11 Commissioners knew that military officialsmisrepresented the facts to the Commission, and the Commission considered recommending criminal charges for such false statements (free subscription required)
• 9/11 Commissioner Timothy Roemer said “We were extremely frustrated with the false statements we were getting”
• 9/11 Commissioner Max Cleland resigned from the Commission, stating: “It is a national scandal”;“This investigation is now compromised”; and “One of these days we will have to get the full story because the 9-11 issue is so important to America. But this White House wants to cover it up”
• The Senior Counsel to the 9/11 Commission (John Farmer) – who led the 9/11 staff’s inquiry – recently said “At some level of the government, at some point in time…there was an agreement not to tell the truth about what happened“. He also said “I was shocked at how different the truth was from the way it was described …. The tapes told a radically different story from what had been told to us and the public for two years…. This is not spin. This is not true.” And he said: “It’s almost a culture of concealment, for lack of a better word. There were interviews made at the FAA’s New York center the night of 9/11 and those tapes were destroyed. The CIA tapes of the interrogations were destroyed. The story of 9/11 itself, to put it mildly, was distorted and was completely different from the way things happened”
• A 27-year CIA veteran, who chaired National Intelligence Estimates and personally delivered intelligence briefings to Presidents Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush, their Vice Presidents, Secretaries of State, the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and many other senior government officials, and who has for years been a tireless anti-war advocate and critic of imperial foreign policy (Raymond McGovern) said “I think at simplest terms, there’s a cover-up. The 9/11 Report is a joke”
• A 29-year CIA veteran, former National Intelligence Officer (NIO) and former Director of the CIA’s Office of Regional and Political Analysis (William Bill Christison) said “I now think there is persuasive evidence that the events of September did not unfold as the Bush administration and the 9/11 Commission would have us believe (and see this)
• A number of intelligence officials, including a CIA Operations Officer who co-chaired a CIA multi-agency task force coordinating intelligence efforts among many intelligence and law enforcement agencies (Lynne Larkin) sent a joint letter to Congress expressing their concerns about “serious shortcomings,” “omissions,” and “major flaws” in the 9/11 Commission Report and offering their services for a new investigation (they were ignored)
• A decorated 20-year CIA veteran, who Pulitzer-Prize winning investigative reporter Seymour Hersh called “perhaps the best on-the-ground field officer in the Middle East”, and whose astounding career formed the script for the Academy Award winning motion picture Syriana (Robert Baer) said that“the evidence points at” 9/11 having had aspects of being an inside job
• The Division Chief of the CIA’s Office of Soviet Affairs, who served as Senior Analyst from 1966 – 1990. He also served as Professor of International Security at the National War College from 1986 – 2004 (Melvin Goodman) said “The final [9/11 Commission] report is ultimately a coverup”
• According to the Co-Chair of the Congressional Inquiry into 9/11 and former Head of the Senate Intelligence Committee, Bob Graham, an FBI informant had hosted and rented a room to two hijackers in 2000 and that, when the Inquiry sought to interview the informant, the FBI refused outright, and then hid him in an unknown location, and that a high-level FBI official stated these blocking maneuvers were undertaken under orders from the White House (confirmed here)
• Congressman Ron Paul calls for a new 9/11 investigation and states that “we see the [9/11] investigations that have been done so far as more or less cover-up and no real explanation of what went on”
• Congressman Dennis Kucinich hints that we aren’t being told the truth about 9/11
• Congressman Jason Chafetz says that we need to be vigilant and continue to investigate 9/11

• Senator Lincoln Chaffee endorses a new 9/11 investigation
• Congressman Dan Hamburg doesn’t believe the official version of events
• Congressman and senior member of the House Armed Services Committee, and who served six years as the Chairman of the Military Research and Development Subcommittee Curt Weldon has shown that the U.S. tracked hijackers before 9/11, is open to hearing information about explosives in the Twin Towers, and is open to the possibility that 9something very different from the Bush-Cheney version of events occurred on 9/11

• U.S. General, Commanding General of U.S. European Command and Supreme Allied Commander Europe, decorated with the Bronze Star, Silver Star, and Purple Heart (General Wesley Clark) said“We’ve never finished the investigation of 9/11 and whether the administration actually misused the intelligence information it had. The evidence seems pretty clear to me. I’ve seen that for a long time”
• Former Deputy Secretary for Intelligence and Warning under Nixon, Ford, and Carter (Morton Goulder), former Deputy Director to the White House Task Force on Terrorism (Edward L. Peck), and former US Department of State Foreign Service Officer (J. Michael Springmann), as well as a who’s who of liberals and independents) jointly call for a new investigation into 9/11
• Former Federal Prosecutor, Office of Special Investigations, U.S. Department of Justice under Presidents Jimmy Carter and Ronald Reagan; former U.S. Army Intelligence officer, and currently a widely-sought media commentator on terrorism and intelligence services (John Loftus) says “The information provided by European intelligence services prior to 9/11 was so extensive that it is no longer possible for either the CIA or FBI to assert a defense of incompetence”
• The Group Director on matters of national security in the U.S. Government Accountability Office said that President Bush did not respond to unprecedented warnings of the 9/11 disaster and conducted amassive cover-up instead of accepting responsibility
• Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense under President Ronald Reagan (Col. Ronald D. Ray) said thatthe official story of 9/11 is “the dog that doesn’t hunt”
• Several key employees for the defense department say that the government covered up their testimony about tracking Mohammed Atta before 9/11
• The former director of the FBI (Louis Freeh) says there was a cover up by the 9/11 Commission
High-Level Officials Want to Explain 9/11 … But Are Being Gagged
There are high-level officials who can tell us why 9/11 happened … but they are being ignored or gagged.
As Senator Patrick Leahy said that Congress doesn’t want to know what happened:

The two questions that the congress will not ask . . . is why did 9/11 happen on George Bush’s watch when he had clear warnings that it was going to happen? Why did they allow it to happen?
And the people who can explain what happened are being gagged.
FBI Translator – “The Most Gagged Person” In History
For example, former FBI translator Sibel Edmonds – President of the National Security Whistleblower Coalition – who has been deemed credible by the Department of Justice’s Inspector General, several senators (free subscription required), and a coalition of prominent conservative and liberal groups – has fought for years to testify about what she knows about 9/11, and has repeatedly asked to be subpoenaed (so as to avoid violation of her oath of secrecy as a government employee).
The ACLU described Edmonds as:

The most gagged person in the history of the United States of America.
And famed Pentagon Papers whistleblower Daniel Ellsberg says that Edmonds possesses information “far more explosive than the Pentagon Papers”.
Not a single politicians or prosecutor has been willing to issue a subpoena.
Edmonds also made the following offer:

If anyone of the major networks — ABC, NBC, CBS, CNN, MSNBC, FOX — promise to air the entire segment, without editing, I promise to tell them everything that I know,” about everything mentioned above, she told us.
“I can tell the American public exactly what it is, and what it is that they are covering up,” she continued. “I’m not compromising ongoing investigations,” Edmonds explained, because “they’ve all been shut down since.”
Not a single major network has let Edmonds say what she knows.
Indeed, Ellsberg says that the government has ordered the media not to touch Edmonds:
Ellsberg seemed hardly surprised that today’s American mainstream broadcast media has so far failed to take [former FBI translator and 9/11 whistleblower Sibel] Edmonds up on her offer, despite the blockbuster nature of her allegations.
As Edmonds has also alluded, Ellsberg pointed to the New York Times, who “sat on the NSA spying story for over a year” when they “could have put it out before the 2004 election, which might have changed the outcome.”
“There will be phone calls going out to the media saying ‘don’t even think of touching it, you will be prosecuted for violating national security,’” he told us.
* * *
“I am confident that there is conversation inside the Government as to ‘How do we deal with Sibel?’” contends Ellsberg. “The first line of defense is to ensure that she doesn’t get into the media. I think any outlet that thought of using her materials would go to to the government and they would be told ‘don’t touch this . . . .‘”
Other Whistleblowers Being Silenced
Edmonds also says that she has been contacted by two high-ranking military officers who would like to shed light on 9/11, but – due to their oaths of secrecy – can only do so if subpoenaed. No one in Washington wants to issue a subpoena.
High-Level Military Intelligence Officer: No One In Washington Wants To Know
Similarly, a high-level military intelligence officer says that his unit – tasked with tracking Bin Laden prior to 9/11 – was pulled off the task, and there warnings that the World Trade Center and Pentagon were being targeted were ignored.
Moreover, he says that he has information that can shed light on 9/11, and that he has repeatedly tried to get this information to the Obama administration and Congress, but that no one in the administration or Congress wants to hear about it. As just one example, Nancy Pelosi’s office demanded that he not even email any information which he has about 9/11.
He is still working in military intelligence, and so he can only publicly speak about 9/11 if he is subpoenaed. He is therefore asking that he be subpoenaed … but no one wants to look into it:
There are numerous other whistleblowers with key information about 9/11. But no one in the government or media wants to hear what they know.
9/11 was one of the most important events in American history, as 10 years of war in numerous countries – costing trillions of dollars – and the crackdown on liberties like freedom of speech have all been justified by that one event. And yet the politicians in D.C. and the corporate media don’t want to hear from the people who can explain the gross incompetence (or worse) which occurred on that day.
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@55, OuterCowDung,

Here's a simple exercise (which actually requires mental activity, so it may be a bit beyond you): simply research into the backgrounds of the passengers aboard those four airliners that day, which leads to...

@57, Joe GlibMoron,

You might then learn that among three unique groups and three unique people aboard those airliners, included a physicist with the Naval Surface Weapons Center, Directed Energy Section (sound familiar with what you Googled, dood???) who was familiar with a Strategic Defense Initiative ("Star Wars") intel ploy to mislead the old Sovs by pre-planted pressure charges in a dummy building then overflying with an airborne "explosive laser" which really did no such thing, simply altered the barometric pressure in the building -- with directed energy -- thus setting off the pressure charges.
71
#56, spindles, really nails it with:

It's significance is being vastly overshadowed by the shit storm that we are all currently ankle deep in. A shit storm by the way, that was in-part allowed to happen because too many people have failed to learn the lessons of 9-11, or how truly corrupt elements within our government really are. You can guarantee it's going to get a whole lot worse, I hope you have a kayak.

If you lazy-brained types would bother to examine the financial angles, you might actually begin to understand (albeit only a little given your mentally limited situations) the audit trails involved: money transferred offshore, hedge funds explosion, ultra-leveraging based upon securitized credit deratives based upon hedge fund trillions (from transferred funds, etc.), today resulting in a leveraged bought out America.

Of course, this involves an attention span greater than 15 seconds.

But I'm afraid this is where most of the commenters are at:

http://cryptogon.com/wp-content/uploads/…

72
@65: "Wow, well you better not let anyone whose ever tried to prosecuted a crime know that."

What an asinine statement.

Going with it, Bush and the neocons are, as I believe, horrible people. Plenty of prosecutors attempt to place guilt on horrible people for crimes they did not commit (though they are surely guilty of other crimes.)

You're aggreeing with me here far more than you're countering my statement, you realize. Do I believe they're beyond being capable of this? No. Do I believe that they caused this? No.
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@68: "The only reason the stranger is finally writng a real political hit piece is to discredit Dr. Ron Paul.

...

Ron Paul has won all his debates according to web polls"

Yawn.
74
#68: "Yawn"

Typical responce of the truly ignorant. America is being destroyed from within...Yawn
We are fighting another war...Yawn
Elections are stolen..Yawn

No doubt, your brain is asleep...Yawn
75
Undead Ayn Rand would you like a cocktail?
76
Totally, Lissa! Today's a beery, cheery day!

@74: On the contrary. I loathe Paul *and* will take glee in the eventual isms fling of the corporate media.
77
"isms fling" = dismantling.
78
@75 Lissa: You've still got the martini shaker going? Yeah!!!
You go, girl!!

@56 & @71: You're both chillingly right on!
And now I really do need that drink!
79
@61 - In addition to the structural damage it sustained from the towers falling, WTC7 was also heavily on fire. This fire burned for 7 hours un-fought, as the building's water main had been damaged and the sprinkler system had insufficient pressure. The FDNY encountered similar problems with local water service, and were never able to get an operation going to fight the WTC7 fire. The fire fully engulfed many, many floors of the building over that 7 hours, and is to this date the largest office fire in history. Eventually the building collapsed due to structural damage caused by this fire, along with the debris damage from the towers collapsing.
80
Paul Constant,
You left out that Ron Paul subscribes to the blowback theory. To Senator Paul, fundamentalist Islamic terrorists are real. They're clearly real to you, too: organized fanatical jihadists w/ their sleeper cells etc. You clearly believe the hype, the same hype that keeps Northrup Grumman in business.

In his book “Defending Mohammad”, Mohammad Salameh’s defense attorney Robert E. Precht, recounts a meeting he had with Bill Kunstler during the 1993 WTC bombing trial. Kunstler offers advice while doing some unvarnished truth-telling:

"If you'll pardon me, you guys are being incredibly naive. The system is terribly corrupt. Just look at the FBI, how they leaked evidence and intimidated that witness Moneeb. How can you talk about giving this guy a fair trial? There's no way he's going to get a fair trial, and you're only going to legitimize the result if you don't push the envelope. Crimes are committed in the name of justice by prosecutors and judges all the time. You should argue that the FBI was behind the bombing and that it was a plot to discredit enemies of U.S. policy in the Middle East."

When Pretcht's co-counsel John Byrnes demurs by saying, "We don't see it as a political case..." Kunstler fires back,

"That's your problem. You don't see the case for what it is. It's a political case. You heard the government's opening statement. The stuff about America not being safe anymore, all those Arab terrorists out to get it. That's what they've turned this case into, not the guilt or innocence of your client. You've got to play hardball."

By pushing the envelope/playing hardball, Kunstler was recommending that Pretcht call as a witness the FBI informant Emad Salem. If you recall, Salem recorded phone calls between himself and his handlers that are quite incriminating w/ respect to the charge that the agency was involved in the plot.

btw, you know who’s a big supporter of the holographic, no planes theory of 9/11? Morgan Reynolds. That's right, the former chief economist of the United States Department of Labor during Bush's first term. Talk about poisoning the well...
81
This is interesting how the "liberal" media even believes the official stories the government provides us. Ron Paul questions the mainstream corporate world of which obviously this writer is a slave to. The government has done an excellent job deceiving the masses with their official story of 9/11 and creating outcasts of those of us who do not believe their story. The media has created an equality of "Conspiracy Theorist" with a lunatic ... great job to the entire team of criminals who pulled it off. This is truly a sad society where we are ridiculed for questioning and not believing the government.
82
I call bull****!

I'm not a supporter of Ron Paul, (and there is no chance of him winning) but atleast his policies support his public agenda. Aka, libertarian politician equals libertarian policies. Can you say the same about the "teabaggers"?

My problem here is your complete lack of journalistic sense! You listed one source (The PAC you went to.) and assume those are the only types of Ron Paul supporters in the whole US.

Political action committees aren't a fair representation of support. Because you can have multiple PACs supporting the same candidate for office, but have different viewpoints on different situations.

You list all these things he supports that make him look like a crackpot and don't show where you got those facts. Cite sources! If you don't show where you got the info you're just as bad as those conspiracy bloggers you were ragging on.

You just made fox news look credible!
83
I call bullshit!

I'm not a Ron Paul supporter, (and he'll never win) but atleast his policies reflect his public agenda. I.e. libertarian politician equals libertarian policies and values. Can you say the same of the tea party candidates?

You name one source, from the sounds of it a small PAC, and make the assumption that all Ron Paul supporters in the US are conspiracy nuts. One meeting does not give an accurate demographic. Especially, if it is a PAC.

Cite sources! Multiple sources! Aside from the PAC, you cite no names, dates, bills he's passed, bills he's apposed, etc. Instead, you portray him as a crackpot with no real substance to back it up. If you don't show where you got your info you're no better than those conspiracy theory bloggers you were ranting about! Where's your journalistic integrity?

You made fox news look credible with that article...
84
Had the good sense to make popcorn and a nice pitcher of martooners before sitting down to start reading the comments ... and so glad I did! BTW, Lissa, you get first dibs on the pronto pups in the oven for "undead Ayn Rand."
85
It is very clear that Pres. Obobo will be a one-trick pony. His so called followers are obviously not critical-thinking minded, but rather following a cult of personality character and still under the euphoria of the novelty of the first Black president. Let us see his achievements: the failed economy: federal deficit from 11 to 16 trillion (Bush: 9 to 11, 2 terms), the QE thefts, US credit downgrading, crushing unemployment the wall street thefts; the reneged promises: the failure to close Guantanamo bay and the opening of the far worse Camp Bagram, failure to undo and ironically the expansion of Bush’s policies including the Patriot act; Military: undeclared and illegal wars in Pakistan, Libya, expanding Afghanistan, and turning Iraq into a mercenary war, more than 1000 military bases (up from 700+ from Bush) not including the dozens or ???hundreds new drone bases planned for Africa, and attacking by drone no less than a half-dozen countries; scandals: Soldyne and LightSquared that we know. Before you liberals (“ooh my own flatulence smells so sweet”) attack Ron Paul, research of what he says not of what others say of him and try to understand the issues and not the images and five second sound bites from ass clown republicans, democrats, and media.
86
All building demolitions in major cities require permits that are easily found in the public record of state and or municipal government so there would be a public record of
Silverstein Properties' plan to demolish their own buildings in Albany or NYC hall and since there is no record of this that means 9/11 truthers are delusional and the 9/11 Commission Report is the last word and that Ron Paul can't win. Thank you, Paul Constant, you are a real journalist.
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#86 that is like saying there is no drug trafficing in the US because drug dealers must pay taxes and since they don't pay taxes...no drugs

What a marooooooon!!!!!!!
typical Obamite
88
Wow, I hadn't heard of any of these weather manipulation-related conspiracy theories. The theories that you guys come up with sound more far-fetched and full of holes than the official government version of the story you're trying to debunk.
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@84: Hey, ron-in-PDX--can I join you and Lissa for martooners?
90
Yeah...this guy is right...Ron Paul is the only candidate who is talking about changing what is going on in Washington.

That is just CRAAAAZY! He is the only candidate that would bring all the troops home on day 1 of his presidency! WACKY!!!

He is the only president who wants to change the way we do banking in America. INSANE! IT'S GOING SO WELL!!!

I'm glad The Stranger is here to tell us that only paranoid whack jobs with ponytails and rumpled coats would vote for him.

His ideas are extreme and crazy. Now, let's vote in the establishment's choice of Obama again or Perry and hope for things to finally change. That's not insane at all, of course!
91
The amount of smugness filling this comment thread is sickening. It's almost as though denying theories of conspiracy and collusion is as hip and cool as the typical stranger reader thinks themselves to be. I find it hilarious that you say that "truthers" or "conspiracy theorists" are delusional and seem to think they know better than you, yet you obviously don't see the irony in believing the official stories and using the same methods of dehumanization that the military and politicians have used for ever: marginalize those who don't think like you or that you must go out and kill by assigning them a group name. Charley, skinnies, conspiracy theorists, sheeple, etc. aren't like "us", the ones in the know... Seriously, your hip, cool, "I know what's going on, and it's exactly what the authorities tell me" is not only sad, it's down right depressing.
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@82: "I call bull****!

I'm not a supporter of Ron Paul, (and there is no chance of him winning) but atleast his policies support his public agenda. Aka, libertarian politician equals libertarian policies. Can you say the same about the "teabaggers"?"

"He may be insane/naive/calculating, but at least he's not visibly retarded?"

Er, no cookie for Paul. I appreciate that he's fairly ideologically consistent, but he's a fool in other ways (for example, believing that Bachmann sincerely agrees with him and isn't just giving lip service.)

He would/does cave to any Teabagger who pretends to agree with his ideology. They don't, they're opportunists.
93
The amount of smugness filling this comment thread is sickening. It's almost as though denying theories of conspiracy and collusion is as hip and cool as the typical stranger reader thinks themselves to be. I find it hilarious that you say that "truthers" or "conspiracy theorists" are delusional and seem to think they know better than you, yet you obviously don't see the irony in believing the official stories and using the same methods of dehumanization that the military and politicians have used for ever: marginalize those who don't think like you or that you must go out and kill by assigning them a group name. Charley, skinnies, conspiracy theorists, sheeple, etc. aren't like "us", the ones in the know... Seriously, your hip, cool, "I know what's going on, and it's exactly what the authorities tell me" is not only sad, it's down right depressing
94
I know this is off topic, but why is Rob McKenna leading Jay Inslee in the polls---especially in King County???

Okay, Lissa--I really DO need that drink!
95
@84: Yes snacks! More snacks I say!
Indieoak, you sound like you could use one. Low blood sugar may be why you are so grumpy.
96
I honestly don't know what to believe about 9/11. However, whenever I look at the video of the building falling, I always wonder how clean the decent is. Now, does one become a paranoid schizophrenic for just being curious?
97
What a delicious brew of insanity and nutty fun! I hope that it isn't over. They haven't even gotten to the part where all the peanuts on the flights where changed out for pretzels, and we all know what that means...
98
There's a lot of food and drink being passed around in this thread, and I would like some, please.

@38: Your "friend" is wrong. The bookseller in that Banks anecdote is not me. I know who he's talking about, but it ain't me. That's the only one of your comments I feel like addressing right now.
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@95: Right on, Lissa!! I second that on more snacks!!

@97: Yeah---I want my honey roasted peanuts!!!
100
@85: "President Obobo"? Stay classy.

::passes Lissa the nachos::