Can we presume the bike didn't have a light?

I wonder if this was the same bike that nearly took me out while I was crossing the street last night. 30mph down a hill, all black and grey, no light. I looked both ways but didn't see him at all. Not the smartest gear choices.

I was driving up 12th Ave near Seattle U at late dusk and nearly pasted a cyclist dressed in dark, riding fast, no light. The fucker was invisible. He went completely apeshit. The is a small minority of real bad riders out there, and they make life harder for the majority of good riders (like me). Kind of same problem with the cops, no?

Here's the problem with this: "Motorists are, for the most part, keeping an eye out for other cars, not moving man-babies on two wheels." Not the 'man-baby' (whatever the hell that means) part, but the idea that drivers only need to be looking for cars. There are a lot of other things on the road (think motorcycles, kids, pedestrians if you don't like cyclists) that you NEED to be looking for. If you can't deal with that reality or are not willing to accept the responsibility you have as you steer several tons of metal around, maybe you should reconsider whether YOU belong on the road.

I'm a conscientious driver who respects bicyclists. But is some asshole on a bike chooses to behave like an hole on a bike, and decides to impact my car, well *his problem*. I have a dash cam, great insurance, and a job that allows me to pay for a lawyer. You? ENJOY BEING A PARAPLEGIC.

yep, yep..lots of bicycling man-babies in this town these days. You can tell by the pegged-cuffed pants that stop mid-calf like a "Lil Rascal" set. So sad that they think that passes for "fashion"...so sad....

I'd like to hear the bicyclist's side of this snark fest. If he actually spat at the driver that's reprehensible, but given the contradictions and exaggerations here I'm left wondering if he actually did. You don't see cyclists because you aren't looking for them, and don't expect them. Get used to seeing us, we're going to be there. As for myself, I never assume that I am seen, no matter what I am wearing or how many lights I festoon myself and my bike with. As a driver, I have also had difficulty seeing cyclists from time to time- against a bright, sunny, cluttered background for example. I also see cyclists doing things that are truly cringe-worthy. Riding around at night or on a dark day with dark clothing and no lights GUARANTEES that you will not be seen. Don't be afraid to take the lane. It's safer than riding in the door zone, even though that is where SDOT usually wants to put you. If you're doing 30 MPH as Anonymous suggests (while also claiming not to have seen you), then you won't be impeding traffic. The middle of the lane is where drivers are most likely to be looking. They aren't looking for you zipping along immediately adjacent to a line of parked cars, or suddenly appearing in front of them in a crosswalk. If that's where you are, make eye contact with the driver. Do not assume that they see you, not ever.

@ 8.
Cyclists are just like motorists, because they're the same "man babies" (or whatever the female equivalent is) just riding on 4 wheels instead of 2 and with a lot more mass. I've seen a lot of "the rules aren't meant for me" attitude from motorists, and at just about the same rate. Motorists ignore different rules, but are twice as deadly when they do it. Speeding. Lane changing without signaling. Running stop signs. Failing to yield. Cell phone talking or texting while driving. You know, the usual crap. There's nothing unique about cyclists, other than the rules we choose to ignore. The whole "me first screw you" attitude is getting really tiresome. How about a little courtesy and common sense?

@9: Yes, the are buttheads in all modes of transport. But cyclists are often self-cast as automatic victims because they're more vulnerable. The backlash is recognition that being more vulnerable doesn't make one less at fault.

I had a cyclist co-worker, great guy, but he did frequently tell stories of confrontation with drivers, and seemed to enjoy telling those stories.

When I drive my car I am always trying to remain cognizant of how much space is between me and the car ahead of me, because I need to leave enough so I could stop if they were to slam on the brakes. When I bike to work going down steep hills I never go as fast as my bike will allow for the same reason - I may need to stop on very short notice. But unlike my car, my bike has no seat belt so I can only slow down as fast as my bike will allow me without flipping over the handlebars.
So if what the driver is describing - biking fast down a steep hill during the rain, the biker was behaving recklessly even if he had been decked out with enough lights for a Christmas tree.

@4: a man-baby is a man that behaves like a baby.

you're welcome.

@9 @7, don't be a dumbass. We all know that cyclists can share the roads. We also know that cyclists are less protected than cars. But cars are required to use headlights, where as this supposed moron was wearing dark clothing on a dark day. I would think you'd even tell a pedestrian would know to wear something bright. But i guess common sense isn't common these days.

I did have a cyclist run into my car once. It was actually quite funny since he blew through a stop sign (I guess thats one law cyclists won't obey) and ended up with a couple of broken bones after denting my door. I don't think he appreciated me asking if he had insurance.

I'm a full-time bicyclist, and even *I* believe that bicyclists are pretty much totally responsible for whether a car-driver sees you or not. And I always, 100% of the time, presume "not," unless I have evidence to the contrary. It's just science. In the dark, in the fog, against the sun, or most other times, you are pretty much invisible. You subtend a very narrow visual angle, compared to cars, and you are moving too slowly to be noticed for your speed (compared to cars). Having said that, cars that don't stop at stop signs, don't signal their intentions, or keep their brights on, just because I'm a bike, get a nice talking-to.

You can almost feel the rage of Seattle's bicyclists as you carefully pass by them giving them an abundance of room, but still it's never enough.

30 miles an hour translates to about 44 feet per second, so it wouldn't be an exaggeration for a bicyclist moving that fast to cover a good half city block in roughly 3 seconds; meaning they could easily move into a driver's path even if they'd already just looked in that direction. Add to that: inclement weather, dark clothing, and a very narrow visual profile (especially when lacking lights) and it's is well within the realm of probability for even the most conscientious driver to miss spotting them amidst all the other visual clutter they're attempting to pay attention to at the same time.

That said, while it's easy for both sides to throw blame around like so much New Years confetti, the simple truth - and the one that should ALWAYS be at the forefront of every cyclist's riding strategy - is that regardless who may be at-fault in any given collision between a car and a bicycle, the cyclist is almost, as in 99.9% of the time, going to come out on the short end of things. No amount of self-delusional entitlement OR justifiable outrage is going to prevent you from getting royally fucked.

tl;dr- I almost killed a guy with my car and I am upset he got mad at me for it.

Bud, whatever this one guy today was wearing, you just admitted you're mostly looking out for cars, not bikes. Every day you're on the road, you're an unsafe driver. Please fix that before you actually are involved in a death.

@19:

Statistically, there ARE more cars on the road than bicycles. Bicyclists suffer roughly 22,000 injuries per year in this country, of which only about 11% involve automobiles. By comparison, the number of injuries caused by automobiles averages more than 5,000,000 per year. In 2014 cyclists suffered a total of 113 fatalities, whereas nearly 19,000 people died in automobile accidents in the first six months of 2015. So, it really makes sense that automobile drivers would be mostly looking out for other cars, because they're far more deadly, especially to other motorists.

Too bad more cyclists don't feel the same way...

@20- You say all that like it's relevant or meaningful. It isn't. Congratulations on throwing some random statistics into a post and then scolding a minority. It sure makes you look bright.

@21:

Perhaps it's not relevant or meaningful to YOU, but for those who actually pay attention to what happens in the real world, it's quite relevant and meaningful. If you want to dispute these facts and what they tell us about the immensely greater likelihood of a driver being hit by or hitting another automobile versus hitting or being hit by a bicycle, please, by all means, be my guest.

I was at a stop light around 6 or 7:00pm in November (overcast, near night) when a biker pulled up ahead of me. He was on a black bike with no reflectors or light, dressed all in matte shades of black (except white socks) and had a black pizza box warmer bag. I called it Death Wish Biking.

I say the same about black and grey cars who forget to turn on their lights at night in the city.

I knew this one would be good. Same old arguments, but good none the less.

Anyone who spits at me will be spitting Chiclets.

Yeah, lots of tough guys like you pontificate that kind of macho violent crap. Usually in web forums, thankfully not in real life.