News Jun 13, 2012 at 4:00 am

But Would They Be Legal?

Comments

1
The problem with the quote from Washington CeaseFire is that "assault weapon" has no functional definition. It usually ends up with a definition akin Supreme Court Justice Potter Stewart's definition for pornography "I know it when I see it."

There is definitely a problem with firearm violence in Washington and our laws are ludicrously permissive, but the problem is not going to be solved so long as the people pushing for them are so willfully ignorant about firearms.
2
Guns = Death.
3
@2 Guns = Death

Cars (in the hands of a violent assholes, or in the hands of incompetent idiots impaired by inattention or sleep deprivation, etc) = Death.

Unnecessary wars = Death (but as a nation, we're still fairly ambiguous on that one).

In the mean time, in case you have not considered that which has been pointed out x-million times in the past few months; the act of making guns "illegal" has no effect on the existence of guns, and therefore cannot be expected to prevent criminals from committing criminal acts with guns.
4
How about instituting a gun safety program; educate law-abiding citizens so they can defend themselves.

Instruct people on how they can secure their weapons so children and thieves don't get their hands on them and be competent enough to defend themselves if the need ever arises. Banning guns will only make the innocent vulnerable.

I've been shooting since I was 8 years old, my father was a certified safety instructor and a volunteer instructor for Iowa's hunter safety course; I live in the Seattle area now and I keep every firearm I own locked away with one exception - there is a shotgun in the bedroom closet, loaded but without a round in the chamber, I put it there after someone broke into my home while my girlfriend and I were sleeping. Every few months I have my girlfriend practice cycling the rounds and releasing the safety; I also taught her to hide in the closet and point the gun at the bedroom door if someone ever comes into our home again. I don't care if someone steals our things, well I care but not enough to kill someone over it, but I do care about her and want to make sure she is able to keep herself safe.

One thing that Seattle should be able to do is to raise penalties for those who commit crimes with guns. If you point a firearm at someone during a crime or are carrying a gun illegally you should be looking at a minimum of 10 years regardless of whether you pulled the trigger or not.
5
@Texas10R

"...the act of making guns "illegal" has no effect on the existence of guns, and therefore cannot be expected to prevent criminals from committing criminal acts with guns."

Yeah, agreed. People with corrupt intentions, will find a way to do and get what they want. Also, if it isn't a gun, it will be whatever is readily available. You can't take the crime out of the criminal. < lol, I'm laughing at that last statement.
6
It would be interesting to see some concrete proof that knowing where the gun came from - the last owner or the first - has anything whatsoever to do with the actual crime committed. I've never seen even a hint that this tracking has any potential to reduce crime.

Does it matter where an arsonist bought matches? Does the original owner of a car have any responsibility for the fifth owner's actions? Does knowing who bought a steak knife prevent someone from using it to harm another person?

Why are guns different? Hint... they are not. The only thing accomplished is control. It's not about safety or life... it's about control of the population.
7
Search your news feed for Chicago violence. Chicago has some of the most restrictive gun laws in the US, and they are averaging about 45 shootings per weekend. Go ahead, make them illegal, turn law abiding gun owners into criminals unless they get rid of their guns, and make sure that the only people who have them are criminals. See what happens.
8
The Seattle Pigs Defartment is only attempting to get the DoJ's spotlight off their Gestapo-imitatin' arses by - with your (unwitting?) collaboration - screaming about shootings (although at this rate 2012 WON'T come close to breaking the all-time dead-via-shooting number).
9
State preemption laws exist for a reason. You can't legislate away violence with shit like trying to ban guns from parks and creating different laws in different cities and counties just creates a pointlessly complex and arbitrary mishmash of ineffective laws.

Scare quotes about the "gun show loophole" are a joke, criminals will always be able to buy guns from other criminals, regardless of how much you try and restrict law abiding citizens.
10
We can ban guns, but we can't ban insane people. Tragedies like Cafe Racer, the Shannon Harps stabbing, the capitol hill axe murder, and the South Park rape/murder will continue to happen unti we fix the gaps in our social programs and care for the mentally ill.

We can ban guns, but we can't ban poverty and lack of education. Gang bangers are shooting at each other because they haven't gotten a loving upbringing and education from a caring society. They've been ignored and pushed into slums. Whether with guns, beatings, sword decapitations, the violence will continue until we start to value and support families, extend education and after school programs, and provide a proper living wage and health benefits to all people.

As long as we have a society that pushes the poor and mentally ill off into the dark to be ignored, we'll continue to see them lash out through violence - because it's the only thing we on the other side of the fence seem to listen to.

We need to fix the causes, or we'll have to continue the futile battle of bandaging the hemorrhaging wounds.
11
@9 Really? You can walk in, see and buy whatever you want, and no questions asked -- and you think this has no effect on the cost/availability of guns to people who otherwise wouldn't get one?

It's a little late now, but some reasonable and responsible gun ownership is in order. Why not close the loophole, require owners to report sales/thefts, and open avenues for getting guns out of the hands of people who are unstable? (The Cafe Racer shooter's family had tried). Do you really find this unreasonable?

Not that any of this entirely solves the problem, or some roots of the problem, as funnylittlemunki points out. But hey, it's a start. Problems like this take time.
12
@11 Yeah, really. The underlying problem with the "reasonable and responsible gun ownership" (as you put it) conundrum is that according to some/many people, the threshold for "responsible" is higher than others would find reasonable". Let us stipulate that Ian L. Stawicki (of Cafe Racer infamy) definitely should not have been allowed to keep anything more dangerous than a goldfish; what then, would be the MECHANISM and CRITERIA for determining lawful permission to keep firearms for protection against the Stawickis, the gangbangers, the home invaders? A commission of people like you? Throw in a few cops, a few Jean Goddens, and some onerous criteria designed to make gun ownership as intrusive as that of Chicago? An unenviable proposition indeed. (If in doubt, Google: 2012 Chicago homicide.) No matter what you say, you will never overcome the intellectual hurdle inherent of your own philosophical device. The reality remains endurably intact: Disarming nonviolent citizens will never reduce the crime of violent assholes.
13
There is no gun show loophole in Washington state! You cannot walk into a gun show and just buy a gun with cash no questions asked. That is a lie perpetuated by anti-gunners, who like the stranger, twist the facts to their own extreme agenda.

The truth is more gun laws won't help. Take Chicago for example, something like 7 or 8 killed last weekend, and over 35 wounded in gun violence and they have some of the most restrictive gun laws in the nation. In fact someone is killed in Chicago nearly every day by a gun. Seattle is actually pretty safe by comparison.

Stop the lies Stranger, and try some real, unbiased reporting for once.


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