Ansel, Good context on permissible use of force in state law.

Lol, what a little twerp Hinds is, perhaps he'd be better off doing what everyone else with no real skills does, get a state job.



He'd have to adjust to not wearing that big ole dented cowboy hat and those sexy driving gloves but he could never be a real cop anyway, he obviously doesn't work and play well with others.

If you have half an hour, this article reminds me of the most awesome thread on the internet, about the Mall Ninja:

http://lonelymachines.org/mall-ninjas/

Obviously just a background check allows these companies to hire complete and utter buffoons and to give them pepper spray on top of that? Wow. How about a common sense test for these idiots.

The better question is what right do I have to defend myself against these rent-a-cops?

"There are almost 11,000 licensed security guards in Washington, and since 2007 not one has been disciplined by the state for excessive force or misconduct on the job".
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2007 to 2013 = 6 years (I'm not counting 2014).
6 years = 2,190 days. In that time there is ONE instance of bad behavior, by one guard, on one day?

Not to excuse the guard in question, for what he may have done, but this story screams "excess media drama". Thank you.

Oh hey, I think I remember this story.

Is this the one where the activist photographer captured a frame that showed "Shirtless White Man" reeling from a punch Raymond Wilson had just landed, and tried to remove it from the gallery he posted, except he left the actual photo on the server, and we found it, and when the photographer realized he was busted he updated the gallery to include the photo, but at the bottom where people would be less likely to notice it?

That was a fun story!

I was at a concert by Al Stewart a few years back. A very drunk "fan" wouldn't stop screaming questions and making various whoops and howls for the first half of the show. When he started up after intermission, a security officer removed him to general applause.

I happened to be in the lobby when the two men showed up. They just kind of stared at one another, each unsure of what to do next. Finally the security guy set the drunk dude in a chair and shook handcuffs in his face...and called the police.

Security firms in this state tend to give their officers carte blanche to stop a whatever when anything goes down. When I was working for a small company, the owner said, without irony, to one of our armed guards "shoot if you think you have to; do what's right by you". It was kinda chilling.

Though I will give the dude credit; the guy he said that to was a black guy, father of two, really decent dude. Hopefully he was saying that as a reflection of the guy's good character instead of just a general sentiment about shooting first and asking questions later.

If that guard is about as "stocky" as Olive Oyl.

That guard is about as "stocky" as Olive Oyl.

I'm curious what happened to this asshole. I vote to turn him loose on the street next time there is a racial profiling riot in Seattle.

Interesting! I had no idea that the two were assaulting each other. The pictures and missing pictures really give a more complete story than "security guard pepper sprays innocent black man."

Since private citizens are on the same legal footing as mall cops, can we legally protect ourselves against mall cops if we haven't committed a crime?

Was it ever determined if the pepper spraying occurred on the mall'so property or not?

@7: Robotslave, as I pointed out to you previously, the image in question was not removed from the page. It was there then, and it's there now.

@17. In general, I would say, avoid, avoid, avoid any conflict. Why? You may not have done anything, but is it worth getting investigated, possibly arrested, court appearances, etc. while you clear yourself? How many witnesses will be around at the end to support your version of events?



Beyond that, a security guard is an agent of the property owner that hired him/her or the company he/she works for. If you are on mall property, they have the right to trespass and remove you at any time, for any reason not prohibited by law (e.g. your skin color, and you would have to prove that in a civil suit). That would involve telling you to leave and escorting you off the property. If you return, they can call the cops and have you arrested for criminal trespass. If you resist and refuse to leave, they have the right to handcuff you. If you still resist, they can physically haul you to the property line by manhandling you, putting you in a car, etc. That is the right of any property owner or their agent. Remember, at a Mall you are standing on someone's private property. You also have the right to use that kind of force on others on your property or in space you rent. In practicality, most people leave when asked, or the cops are called to do the removal of the unwanted person (which takes hours and hours and hours) See RCW 9a.16.020. See also RCW 9A.16.090. Lastly see RCW 9A.16.050. These are relatively short and straightforward laws on the subject. They come up easily when googled.