Podcasts Sep 20, 2011 at 1:00 am


This may be painfully obvious to a 30-year-old, self-aware depressed man, but regular exercise has been proven to help fight depression and, of course, improve body image! I have a friend who is able to overcome his depression through disciplined diet and exercise. It's not easy. In fact, for him it's a struggle, and if he lapses for even a few days, he feels really down. But a healthier lifestyle can combat depression on both a physiological and emotional level. You don't need an expensive gym membership; even a daily jog and a bit of other light exercise can help you shape up and also give you a real sense of accomplishment.
As Dan said, you need to find ways to be at least somewhat content on your own before you can make someone else happy. Perhaps that could start with taking good care of your body, which will in turn take care of your mind.
'Gaydolph Hitler.' Fantastic!
I think I suffered from that same vocal-induced orgasm ailment with that British caller at the end...
Here's the thing. . . I understand that a lot of people who say they're bi when they're scared teenagers are not. We all know this. I think it is OK to say so- IN GENERAL. That might even be helpful. I mean, young people still in a period of discovery may benefit from hearing that it's all right if they figure something else out later.

The problem, as I see it, is this: as a somewhat repressed bi teenager, I was badly treated by the gay community. If I had a dollar for every jerk who told me that someday I'd grow up, stop lying, and quit trying to keep my hetero-privilege, I'd. . . I'm not sure. Pretty sure I could buy a nice winter coat or part of a computer. So I felt that I didn't belong anywhere, and I can assure you that all this attitude did was make me feel terrible. It did NOT encourage me to lesbian identify. (I still don't.)

That sort of behavior is what a lot of us are thinking of when someone expresses doubt about an individual's sexual identity. If someone could express the possibility that you might narrow the field later without being a superior ass, that would be ok. But in my experience and from the notes I've compared, that's not how it goes down.
Disappointed with Dan's comments about older women/younger men scenarios. The caller first said simply that he was sexually interested in older women, then started using the word 'Cougar', seemingly unaware that it is pejorative and offensive to many women. Dan also jumped straight into the stereotypes, claiming that older women who like younger men are 'a phenomenon' associated with ski resorts, and that older women are attracted to a blase attitude in younger men.

Has anyone actually done any research on this, or is this just made-up rubbish that stigmatises and creates confusion around totally normal sexual behaviour?

Maybe - and I don't want to shock anyone here - it's actually totally legitimate for older women to be interested in younger men, and isn't a 'phenomenon'.

While many women who happily claim the 'Cougar' label, it this does not make it any less sexist. We completely normalise Older man/younger woman relationships (or indeed age difference in same-sex relationships), and yet no one questions the stigma attached to older woman/younger man scenarios. Dan, I don't think you helped him much at all except to further myths and sexist views.

I would suggest that the caller simply approach older women as he would any other woman. They'll either be interested, or not. Don't approach it as a fetish or weirdness, and certainly don't call anyone a 'cougar': it's just plain old shitty sexism, reinforcing the idea that 'normal' women choose men with money and status, that is to say, men who are older than them.
@shapeofdolls, I'm from Eastern WA / Northern ID and until Dan mentioned ski resorts I was planning on calling in to suggest he ought to get a job as a ski bum in Sandpoint if he wants to meet attractive older women. So don't knock it, even if some of the other advice was somewhat questionable. It's a good suggestion for the area where the guy lives!
Dan, let me try to explain why we bi's get mad about this.
Every time the topic of bisexuality comes up you feel you have to point out the "Young and Bisexuality identified but really gay". Let me give a example, I know several trans people that when through a time identifying as gay. How would you react if a prominent Trans spokesman brought up the "Trans and identifying as gay" every time homosexuality was brought up?

On another note, please quit bringing up your sexual past with bi men, it comes across like the guys who claim they can't be bigots because they have black friends.
I can't believe I'm only the second person to comment on how adorable the British caller was! What a good friend and mature guy. Kudos to you for getting it right. :)
Hi Dan,
Re episode 257
Audio orgasms
I have an exlover; ok lets be more honest there. He is my first love & who I lost my virginity to nearly 30 years ago.
Anyway we had not had any contact for nearly 25 years and after reconnecting (not physically) I came very close to full squirting orgasm on a phone call with absolute not physical stimulation at all whatsoever. VERY intense, nothing like that had ever happened to me before.
Certain accents will always instantly get me highly aroused. (No he does not have an accent)
I don't find it inconvenient in any way just spontaneous pleasures.
Wonderful podcast! Loved Gaydolf Hitler.

Have a few notes for the disabled dude. I am a fat, hairy person with a propensity for severe (disability-level) depression and anxiety. (I might be able to qualify for government disability; I don't know.) But I don't really think of myself that way when it comes to landing dudes or dudettes. Doing so, I suspect, would prove more romantically crippling than any of my fat, hairy, depressive, anxious, or otherwise potentially alienating qualities.

And guess what? There are people who love chubsters; there are people who love body hair; there are people who love us "neurotic types," etc etc ad nauseam. There are even people who take inspiration from disabled folk who forge on ahead and live life in spite of disability.

I happen to be dating someone who is awesome in just about every way--and also superhot. Though it can be weird when we go to places together and strangers assume we couldn't possibly be dating, presumably because of the difference in looks, it's still freaking fantastic.

But I kind of had to recover a bit from the debilitating hospitalization-level depression before I could be in an emotional and mental place to give my partner a chance.

It sounds from the caller's description of himself that he still hates himself very much--perhaps more than is warranted. (He doesn't seem hateable at all.) So maybe he needs to recover a bit, too?

Just my two cents.
Okay, a few things. First of all, the 20 year old British caller with the comment...oh. my. gawd. You sound hellasexy!

Next, the auditory orgasms; now it's not the sound of certain voices, *but* I seem to be auditory as well, in that I have a hard time reaching orgasm without the sound of a woman having an orgasm, but *only when I masturbate.* Otherwise, my boyfriend does very, very nice things to my bits with his bits :) So I haven't heard of the voices thing, but I do somewhat understand.

Moving on, to the 15 year old non-virgin with the girlfriend in pain, you made a wise decision to listen to the podcast, and you both should definitely follow Dan's advice (especially about going to the gyno); take the time while you are young to really get to know the pleasures that come from more than just sex, and you (as well as any future partners) will *not* regret it.

Finally, Cougar-hunter: enjoy! If you see one you like, catch her eye, smile at her, and if she smiles back, or gives you the eye, buy her a drink or ask to dance (believe me, guys who dance--or at least try--have better luck picking up then the boring guys who play pool all night).

PS @ shapeofdolls, chill out a little. You know what the equivalent guys old enough to be my dad's golf buddies who approach me are called? Silver Foxes. Four of my last five partners have been young men (4-8 years difference), and it was fun while it lasted, but I've worked that particular phase out. I'm not old enough to qualify as a cougar, I've definitely enjoyed my puma-prowling. Nothing wrong with a phase, dear.
People have periods when they are sexually less active. He might be depressed or have a lot of stress. It might get easier. And from my own experience I know that sometimes you want someone so much because they are being distant. When they find their libido, or with the next person who is more active, you might start feeling the way he is feeling now, like someone is pushing you to do something that should come as a natural need. And he might want to be the one "hunting" for once, and not be always under pressure from your advances. Even if you think you are being kind and gentle, you might come off as frustrated and overeager. Young men are often turned off by a very keen partner, because it somehow takes the wonder out of the relationship, they like to be kept guessing. They might know this themselves, but believe me, I have seen this so many times (not just in my own relationships). Maybe let him be for a while and let him come to you. Do something fun without any sexual innuendo. Eat nice food together, make him feel safe when he is not in the mood for sex. He will start trusting you again.
@5 I agree regarding the irony. Hey, you can't be sentimental in science. Self selected samples are a real problem in stats.

And I don't actually blame Dan at all for the fact that bisexuals feel mistreated by their theoretic allies. It's just when he gets close to what some of us have heard before in stronger language, there's a bit of "Oh, no, not you too!?"

I smile knowingly to myself at those younger than I all the time- but they never get wind of it and I would never, EVER tell them they're being deceitful just by being, well, young and going through something I think I recognize. Not everybody's life can be predicted.
Regarding the woman who has "ear-orgasms" Has she talked to her doctor/therapist about the condition known as synastisia? It is where your brain, while interpreting one sense kind of mixes it up with another. A lot of times people with synastisia will be able to see sound in the form of colours, mind you only certain sounds at certain times. Also when working with numbers, sometimes sounds are associated with it, if a cashier types numebrs a lot who has synastisia they might hear a different tone with each number, or see colours for different numbers. People can feel music as well, so it mihgt be she has an audio synastesia that is connected to touch. Something so strong is rare but not impossible.
@Fancy's_Pants "Chill out a little" and "dear" - really? Nice attempt to try and belittle, rather than engage with the substance of my argument, which you actually ended up supporting? 'Silver Fox' is a great example of how the same behaviour in men is labelled with what is clearly a term of endearment. Whereas 'Cougar' is largely used pejoratively, to humiliate and stigmatise both the women who prefer younger men and the men who prefer older women. You've also really well underlined my argument by saying things like "nothing wrong with a phase"... which shows that you think there is actually something wrong with women who are interested in younger men for more than just a "phase" or as you put it, "fun". Having a younger partner is a privilege that only men are allowed - Silver Foxes that is.
@shapeofdolls, sorry if my particular vernacular isn't to your liking, but I still beg to differ. I don't see how only men are allowed to have a younger partner...don't we snicker at older men and their trophies? The media and everyone in North America didn't snicker when Hef's last fiancee ditched him? Like we aren't aware that more often than not, these silver foxes are shallow and insist on trading in their current trophies for newer ones? I think the silver fox is easily as open to being humiliated and stigmatized by some in society as the cougar. Hell, there's a whole genre of viagra jokes out there aimed right at the "endearing" silver foxes.

Besides, older women are now openly claiming this privilege for themselves, and a hell of a lot of them are proud to do it. Hell, some even wear the Cougar badge with pride. So why deny them that? Seriously...why? Because you don't like the term? Then don't use it to describe yourself if ever in that position. But again, chill out and let others who want to claim the term, do so.

Finally, my fault for not clarifying, but when I wrote of nothing wrong with phases, I was referring to my own close-to-cougar situation (as you might understand when you read that the last couple of sentences were about me and my experience); it was a phase because I'm not on the prowl for younger men these days, I'm happily settled into a relationship with one.
British caller: I had to listen to your call twice. Once, to listen to your voice, and the second time to actually try and concentrate on the words.
@Fancy's_Pants You are putting words in my mouth. I'm not denying anyone call themselves a Cougar, what I said is that it's problematic when other people calling an older woman who prefers younger men a Cougar. This is the difference between a particular woman calling herself a slut, and you calling her a slut without regard for whether this is ok for her or not. A lot of women in this situation clearly do mind being called a Cougar; it seems sad that you would advocate that the word be used as a standard, despite widespread objection.

You describe yourself as having been 'on the prowl' for younger men and having seen yourself as a near-Cougar, but this behaviour is by no means the case for all older women who prefer younger men. This is perhaps one reason why women who prefer younger men might not wish to be tarred with the same brush; some, for example, will not be specifically looking for younger men, but generally happen to fall for them. They are not, therefore, 'on the prowl' in any way, shape or form.

Your suggestion that I 'chill out' is a classic derailing technique and highly weakens your argument in the eyes of anyone who appreciates and understands the qualities of rational debate. You can read more about why telling someone to 'chill out' is considered pitiful at Derailing for Dummies.
Audio orgasms:
I can't do it without a little manual stimulation, but I know what she's talking about. No explaining why some voices flip my switch either- seems like the less sexy the person, the better. Short list of favorites:
1) Bob Ross
2) A Chinese lady on YouTube that makes tea and art while talking nonsense.
3) An African-American woman on a local jazz station that has a show called "Traces of Faces and Places."
4) Another YouTuber; this one's Hungarian and demonstrates how to make awful, horrible crafts.
So, anyway. No help about why - I think maybe it's something about a state of instant relaxation that I feel when I hear them talk. I am sure they would be completely skeeved out by the whole thing. Except Bob, for obvious reasons.
Perhaps someone can explain to me why the phone call from Europe was the clearest sounding call on the Savage Podcast... EVER! WTF? Also: Note to the woman who cut her "rambling" short: THANK YOU! I hope this catches on.
Re: the woman who is aroused by voices:
- The general term for cross-wired sensory modes is synesthesia. That would be a starting point for any research or medical consultation.
- It sounds a bit like ASMR. (Google is your friend.)
Re: anal sex-- the caller needs to read Tristan Taormino's "The Ultimate Guide to Anal Sex for Women". The gf needs to read it too. Anal sex can be awesome (should be awesome) and het women especially can be educated and empowered about it. Why dive right into anal penetration, anyway? Take it slow, have fun, explore! Just as Dan says. Tristan's book will give you a lot more detailed advice ;-)
@ UmJammerLammerz (comment 1), Has it occurred to you that it is asking a lot of (some) disabled people to jog or do light exercise? Perhaps the caller is in a wheelchair or on crutches, or has debilitating asthma or other issues that prevent vigorous exercise. Has it occurred to you that depression and anxiety can have a paralyzing effect on a person? Some people with depression cannot get out of bed. While it is true that some amount of physical activity generally leads to better mental and physical health, it sounds to me like treatment for the caller's depression must go beyond just taking a jog.
@15 That's just what I came on here to post. Synesthesia does seem like the most likely cause of the auditory orgasms.
Cougar is pejorative? Since when and says who? I've understood it to be a more flattering term than "silver fox" because it's lacking in the dirty old man element. Yes, there are women who just happen to be with a younger man, but I don't think that's what the cougar "type" is describing. A cougar is a seasoned, independent woman out to have fun and get what she wants. She's unfettered by the traditional romantic Disney narrative of the passive woman and is free to what she wants with whom she wants.
Re bi guys: Do bi guys really exist? If someone says he's bi then he's bi, right? I mean, that seems to be how it works for transgendered people. If a person born a man is certain he's a woman on the inside and chooses to identify as such who am I to argue? Even though there is no objective measure of someone's gender we have to take her for her word on that don't we? Even if there were an objective measure we as supportive, sex-positive people would still have to take her word for it wouldn't we?
I think you should have an ernest British man (or possibly just European if Brits are scarce) finish the show every week.
Re: "cougars": If the caller wants a hook-up as opposed to a longer term dating relationship, he should hang out in hotel bars. There he will find successful, confident (and in some cases, fit and attractive) professional women who are out of town on business, have lower(ed) inhibitions, and a hotel room. Initial confidence can be attractive: sidle up to her at the bar, start a conversation, show genuine interest in whatever career accomplishments she has achieved that would bring her to an out-of-town conference/meeting, compliment her, offer to buy her a drink, keep the convo going and see what happens.
@blukatgrl wow, none of that occurred to me. like, at all. what was I thinking! :b
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"Cougar" and "Silver Fox" offensive??? Better than MILF and DILF, I think. Or "old hotties". Also, a cougar would kick a fox's ass hands down. Sounds like you have problems with your fleeting youth. Have a sense of humor about it, liken it to the word "slut", which can be sexually positive.

I'm straight and I get erotic inklings when I hear intelligent, but soft-spoken women talk. They don't even have to be sexy, but talking science/policy/literature. Nancy Pelosi, call me!
I get the same effect from women with spanish accents. No orgasms, though, interesting problem.

I think hearing women I admire speak makes me feel great, and it trips something sexual in my brain.

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