Savage Love

Crossed Dressers

Comments

1
My condolences to DRESSED. I hope he can start over over with a more cross-dressing friendly partner.
Dan, BLESS YOU for pointing out to EGADS the chilling CDCP statistic about the number of women murdered every year (a whopping 55%!) by their husbands, boyfriends, or exes. 16 years, three months, two weeks, and three days ago, I could have become part of that statistic if I hadn't managed to get away, seek help, and be blessed with the necessary resources to start over and renew my life.
Good grief, Charlie Brown! Is Griz first?
2
Thank you, Dan, for showing all comments past @99 from last week, too.
My computer has been playing cyber-head games with me, lately. Even
after my recent birthday celebration, alcohol was not a factor this time.
3
Third time's the charm: Kudos for another great graphic, Joe. Good one! I keep thinking of Tim Curry in fishnets with Love That Red lipstick and his leather bomber jacket.
Okay, now it's someone else's turn to comment.
4
I have nothing to add, I just don't want you to feel alone in the comments. :)
5
@4 What a nice post. :-)
6
Dan's response to EGADS is kind of a non-sequitur, but I realize it needed to be said. (And his point is well-taken, context aside). I do think Dan is excessively optimistic in his last paragraph, however.
7
EGADS: you aren't allowed to bitch about women having more latitude in this particular issue. But you are totally allowed to bitch about the women who were a bitch to you about indulging in it yourself. Mean, sarcastic, shitty partners are a phenomenon at the scale of the individual, not the demographic, and you don't have to pretend that it was acceptable for any woman to shame you over your sexuality. The ones who were bitches about it, you are well rid of.
8
"She was beyond pissed. She says I had a hall pass for sex but not cross-dressing. "

You should laugh in her face for that one. That's like saying you had a hall pass to fuck the masseuse but not to get a massage from her.

Evidently the one part of her health that didn't "recover" when she went back East was her IQ. She is a blithering idiot -- on top of being an uncaring lover and a control freak -- and that particular bit of outrage on her part deserves zero respect.

I agree with Dan: If she purports to divorce you over the cross-dressing but not the sex, you can bet that the reason she places less weight on the sex is that she's been indulging in it herself, which probably explains the presence of Ex-husband on the trip to pack her things. She was on the way out anyway, and the cross dressing is a convenient -- though jaw-droppingly stupid -- lever to pull to make it all your fault that she is leaving you.
9
EGADS: keep in mind that for women to do things that are everyday for people in 2017, like wear trousers, have paying jobs, cut their hair shorter than their ears, and have the legal right to their own property, women had to put in a huge amount of HARD WORK for generations. I know a woman of my mother's generation (former work colleague of my mother) who showed up at a car dealership with her own wages, in cash, from her job as a nurse. The dealership would not sell her a car without signed permission from her father...this, for a woman who had been living independently off her own earnings for most of a decade! That's in living memory. Also in living memory, but much more recent, is all the blowback Ellen DeGeneres got for (a) being a lesbian and (b) daring to wear her hair short. That was only 20-ish years ago...I rent out a room in my house to a person who is too young to remember any of that. I was in high school. I remember at the time wondering what the fuss was about, but also, wondering why people got so angry about somebody who wanted to do something as utterly harmless as cut their hair.

Now, because of women like Ellen daring to be publicly gender non-conforming (and wanting a puppy, and having short hair, and being gay, and all that), women like me can wear our hair short without having beer bottles thrown at us (has happened to me) or being cursed at for being dykes (also has happened to me, boring straight lady) for daring to cut our hair shorter than our ears when we live in places like Tampa, Miami, Houston, and LA where it's beastly fucking hot a large portion of the year. BEASTLY hot.

It's the same reason that only now, in the 20 teens, it's more common to meet "Will"-esque gay men, who are not stereotypically flaming visibly loud queers...they're just gay, Jim Parsons with his nice husband gay, football player drafted for the NFL getting a celebratory kiss from his nice swimmer boyfriend gay...who are doing their normal thing being gay and having Taco Tuesday like all the rest of us: it's the sissy bois, the queens, the nonconformists, and all of that busting their asses and getting their asses busted in some cases so that people like you and me live in a nicer place. The ones who did the hard work of coming out of the closet first made it so that people like you can start coming out of the closet now.

You don't get to hate on women as a whole because they have things THEY WORKED FOR OVER GENERATIONS and still are working for (lesbians not being gay-bashed for shaving their heads, not just short hair but buzz cuts). You don't get to hate on women as a whole for doing things that literally women were called evil for (wearing pants, getting educations, having jobs) because you wish you could do such things as easily as they do. You can hate on the small-minded assholes who would shame you for something harmless, fun, and delightful (because who doesn't like nice shoes? honestly). You can hate on individual assholes who treat you like crap, not because they are women but because they are ASSHOLES.

And, now it's your turn to get to work. You are the first of a new group of people who would like to be treated decently, thank you very much, but it's not going to be easy getting there. You're going to have to learn to roll with the knocks, to come up with ways to deal with the poison air of group dynamics, and yes, fuck the patriarchy and all that (after all, you are running into gender stereotyping, and fuck that noise). Saddle up. It's hard and it's hard to not be fucking angry all the time, but it's also worth it.

Also, FWIW, there are plenty of women out there who would very much like to find a nice man wearing makeup and heels and a dress...look at the crowds that turn up for Eddie Izzard. Like anyone who is a Boutique Item, though, you'll have to work harder to find the right "buyer," because you're not made for mass marketing and neither are they.
10
EGADS: Agree with 9; also, how important is it to you that what you're doing is an active turn-on for your partner? Of course you don't want to be with someone who mocks you for it. But is it "my partner must think this is super-sexy" or "I want A, B, C and D out of a partner, and they have to at least accept and not mock"? The latter might give you more options.

I had an ex-boyfriend who occasionally cross-dressed around our dorm (yes, long time ago!). It didn't really do anything for me, but he wasn't doing it for me. He felt brave and happy, so sure, why not, I didn't see why I should have any problem with it. The relationship didn't last, but the cross-dressing had nothing to do with that. I just checked out his legs shown off by the short skirt and thought, high heels? gah, better him than me. ;)
11
@10, good point about "OMG MUST HAVE" versus, "That's nice, but not necessary" or "Doesn't do much for me one way or the other but hey, have fun!"

You don't have to be a wine connoisseur to enjoy a nice glass over dinner.
12
@4 SophieX: I don't feel alone, but thank you. Asexual, yes, but not alone. :)
@5 TheOnlyThingsBlueInTexasAreMyBalls (and politics): "@4: What a nice comment." Meaning...? My comment re EGADS was more in line with Dan's response that EGADS should feel lucky in one sense that his exes, however bitchy, aren't likely out to murder him.
13
Congrats to Dan for printing those letters to begin with, let alone for supportive, insightful, and practical advice.

The times they are a changin'. Nonbinary did not exist until 10 years or so and it took me many secretive years to figure out what's going on and how to "classify" myself and find like minded others.
From what I gather all three lw's are younger than myself and while still certainly facing challenges are already out there to some degree and likely to find their path. I hope.
Good news on my side too: came out to my nephew few days ago, apparently a non-issue.

14
It's been a while since this has come up in the column, but worth addressing again: "You have permission as long as I don't know about it" is functionally indistinguishable from "You don't have permission."

It is a bullshit, bad-faith offer, because as soon as they find out, no matter how accidentally, they are invariably as outraged as if you had fucked around without permission in the first place. It's giving permission without actually giving permission. When someone offers that, you should not take it up at face value, because it will blow up in your face, and you _will_ be the designated bad guy when it does.
15
OFO: Why not just change your name (legally or just on Facebook) and your Facebook pronoun to they, and not make a big announcement, or filter your dad out of the Big Announcement post? If your dad asks, just tell him you prefer this name, or you don't want your employers to be able to find you on Facebook, etc.
Also, what does wanting children or not have to do with your gender identity?

EGADS: I think Dan was a bit too hard on you. If these women really are saying they don't want you wearing stockings and heels because that's "theirs," unless you really are wearing their makeup and heels, I agree that they're being unfair. Clothes are clothes and anyone should feel they can wear whatever makes them happy. Also, Dan, who says EGADS was never stalked by an ex? I've known men who have been stalked, and possibly the worst bit was that their complaints weren't taken seriously because of the genders involved.

I agree that you should keep looking. A bi, cross-dressing man sounds ideal to me! Get thee onto OKCupid and make a profile that discloses your interests and let the accepting women come to you.
16
EGADS-- Try losing the entitled attitude that it's unfair when women aren't attracted to you, and see if that helps. Consider that even "average" women don't owe you their attraction and attention in the first place. Drop the bit about being an outcast as though you were facing job and housing discrimination when all that's happening is that you're not getting the dates you want. It's hard for me to feel much sympathy for someone who feels bitter because his interpretation of "I don't want to go out with you" is "she hurt me." How do you get over feeling bitter and envy? I dunno, maybe a gratitude journal?
17
@6: Oh, I don't think he's too optimistic at all. I'm 40, male, and bisexual, live in a small city in the Midwest, and got divorced a few years ago. I was pleasantly surprised to discover how many women I dated (mostly through OkCupid; a few times through Tinder or FetLife) who were not just OK with it but openly interested in being with a bi guy and doing stuff like pegging and playing dress-up. There are plenty of kinky girls out there. (But yeah, EGADS: A lot of them will be turned off if you're complaining about how many more "privileges" women have, so cut that shit out.)
18
Allow me to drive my point home. It's one thing for a gay man to complain about job discrimination, marriage inequality, and fear for his life and safety if he should come out in some circles. It's quite another for that gay man to complain that it's not fair that straight men have a relatively large pool of straight women who might want to marry and have sex with them while there's a much smaller pool of gay men who might be interested in him. It's not fair that slim healthy conventionally attractive people have an easier time than short dumpy handicapped ones, but that doesn't mean that it's somehow the fault of the people who aren't attracted to you.
19
EGADS, there's a guy in the science fiction community who always wears dresses and heels, but he's definitely NOT trying to pass, because he also has a full, bushy beard. Women LOVE him! Women flirt with him constantly. I think he's so successful partly because he's both charming and beautiful but also for two other reasons:

1. He mostly hangs out in the science fiction community, which tends to be a bit more open-minded than the mainstream, and which often celebrates and prizes those among us who are visibly different from the mainstream. If you like SF at all, try going to a convention.

2. His girlfriends are mainly bisexual women. Straight women think he's not man enough for them, and lesbians think he's not woman enough for them, but bisexual women think it's fun and interesting that he straddles the gender line. So seek out bi women.
20
Fichu @16/@18: You're absolutely right, and I missed the real problem: this guy is being a whiny baby. So, the "average woman" isn't into cross-dressing men? Boo hoo. Find a woman who's not average. You are not, in fact, entitled to be desired by the majority of women despite having niche preferences and characteristics. Many people have characteristics that cause the majority of their preferred-gender prospects to "bolt" -- but they disclose those things early, take it in stride, and move on to the next candidate instead of whingeing. A bi cross-dresser sounds great to me; a bi cross-dresser with an anti-feminist chip on his shoulder wouldn't make it to date two.
21
CMD @13: Congrats on coming out to a family member! *waves pompoms*
22
Oh my, EGADS, so much drama!
Let's read it again:
"I'm a 25-year-old man who is mostly interested in women but I like to mess around with men sometimes. I also love wearing high heels and makeup—not to "pass," but just because I love it. Most women seem to be instantly turned off by these two things. I usually do very well with women, but they bolt when I tell them, and some have been quite hurtful. My family is very understanding about the high heels and my sexuality—even my father—but the average woman doesn't seem to like it when I do something that they deem "theirs." Which is so unfair. Women can do anything they please—wear pants if they like, have same-sex experiences—but I must submit or face the life of an outcast. Any advice on how to deal with this while also dealing with the bitterness and envy I feel?"

Yes, a lot of women aren't turned on by men crossdressing; but many are, and even more probably don't get turned on but don't mind and are happy to indulge their boyfriend or husband occasionally (all the time might be a different story).

So some women have said hurtful things. That's not nice or fair and they aren't women you want to associate with.
But "the average woman doesn't seem to like it when I do something that they deem "theirs."" Hmm. Why does the lw assume that a woman who isn't turned on by a cross-dressing man is upset because he's appropriated something they deem "theirs?" Have multiple women said this to him in so many words?

I'm not especially attracted to men in women's clothes, but I've also never had a boyfriend who cross-dressed (at least that I knew about--certainly no one ever wanted to incorporate it into our sex life.) I probably wouldn't seek out a cross-dressing man, but if I liked someone and we had been dating for a while, I would be happy to try out that aspect of him. I would never rule out the possibility of finding it very attractive. I also wouldn't rule out the possibility that I'd try it and say, "yeah, does nothing for me; we can incorporate it every once in a while, but I don't want it to be the main component of our sex life." In any event, that is a far cry from being upset that something I thought of as "mine" had been appropriated.

EGADS, no one owes you attraction to you or your kink or fetish. Not being attracted isn't the same thing as discriminating against you or being mean to you.
And seriously: "I must submit [ to binary gender normative behavior] or face the life of an outcast."??!! Pass the smelling salts--the fainting couch is over here. Dramatic and self-indulgent much?

As far as feeling bitterness and envy: well, you can feel whatever you like. But bitterness is not an attractive quality. You're bitter because at the ripe old age of 25, you have found that not every woman you want to have sex with is turned on by your cross-dressing, yet they can wear pants if they like? Dude. Calm down.
23
EGADS, in addition to the great points already made, needs to realise that while women (in his country) can wear pants and have sex with women, it doesn't mean everyone will like them for it. Women can't wander up to any other woman and demand sex, and plenty of women still face descrimination for their sexual orientation. Women still regularly face judgement and descrimination from people who feel they're not behaving or dressing in a suitably feminine manner - and that judgement often goes far beyond whether people are willing to date a woman or not. Women do not get some free instant-acceptance pass. A lot of us just refuse to conform despite facing negativity.

Rather than seeing this as a male vs. female thing I would encourage EGADS to be angry at the societal norms at play - we are *all* impacted by damaging gender stereotypes. The ways in which men and women are impacted tend to differ, so can take time to understand. Take a good long look at the ways you buy into harmful ideas yourself - Dan and several commentors have already pointed out some areas to think about - and then find other nonconformists.
24
OFO: I do think there's value to realizing when part of your life really isn't somebody else's business. There are a lot of things my parents don't know about my life, simply because they've never been germane enough to come up.

Some of your issues won't go away with a simple coming out statement. (Ask openly gay people in long term relationships, many will still have stories of their parents regularly hinting about grandkids.) Others, it might be worth letting your relationship with your dad keep doing its own thing while exploring your fuller self with a different circle. You shouldn't have to hide or lie, but simply not saying something is an option.

EGADS: I'm going to call horseshit on the idea that all women collectively deserve credit for the hard work of women who had to put their own skin on the line. Anyone who says otherwise is free to praise the bravery of Betsy DeVoss.

Instead, the takeaway should be simple. Many women are shitty. People who date men (straight women, bi women, gay men, bi men) will quickly point out that many men are shitty too. Shittiness is a common human trait. You can angst about it, or you can get to work learning how to spot the non-shitty people.
25
To add to what Corylea @19 said - if EGADS is interested in anime, video games, or pop culture at all, there are always tons of guys who crossplay (i.e. cosplay as an opposite sex character) at those conventions too. Comic-con has gotten so mainstream now that it's more like Pop Culture Media-con, so if you want to attend a con without feeling like a poseur, your local Comic-con is a safe bet. Crossplay in anime and video game conventions have been widely accepted for decades too.

Another option - go to a midnight screening of Rocky Horror Picture Show. A friend who was a RHPS virgin went to one a few years ago and his wife made sure he dressed in full make-up, heels, bustier, and fishnet stockings. I can't imagine it would be difficult to find ladies who are into that kind of thing at a RHPS screening.
26
DRESSED, I agree with Dan that what happened with your wife sounds like a setup or at best, her latching onto the first convenient excuse to cast herself as the victim when she wants out of the relationship. When someon offers a hall pass with a DADT clause, that person is also signing up to make it easy to maintain the DADT. Making a 2,000 mile trip and showing up at your house unannounced is the opposite of making it DADT workable.
27
DRESSED: Time to bounce. It seems like you're less out now than you were when you met your wife. Maybe this is bold but "Cross-dress when you aren't around" doesn't seem like an unreasonable request after 2 years of being someone's sole caregiver. That's Dump territory on her own, but flying back home without notifying you, with her ex-husband? That whiffs of active contempt. Time to Eternally Sunshine your Spotless Mind, holmes.

Side note: the other week I was called out for suggesting that developing young women were aware of and experimented with their "newfound" sexuality; but look how easily one Mr. Savage slips into thinking that DRESSED "wanted to be caught".

EGADS: feel free to disregard everything Dan said, he's completely wrong about basically everything. Intangible privileges don't excuse material repression - by Dan's reasoning, even Matthew Sheppard shouldn't be able to complain from the grave since someone else's stack of privileges was lesser than his. But yes, it has been observed before, while i think women in general are more accepting of gay men than straight men are, that stops when it comes to a relationships: 100% straight purity demand is the norm, not the exception.
28
Thank you so much for your excellent comment, @9. It's something I sorely needed to hear today, and helps soothe my angry soul.
29
Slinky @9, agree with Kasatka@28, good post.
A little perplexing too, as I've just decided over the last couple of days to get my hair cut short. At the barber's my son goes to, and get a buzz cut. Does that mean I'm turning lesbian. That association has never occurred to me. I lived on a Buddhist community and all the nuns and monks had shaved heads. True though, in my life time the immense transformation of women's lives, from well in place Patriarchy of the fifties to now. This guy needs to chill, you win some, you loose some.
30
That's lose some. Loose is what this man should be.
31
ChiTodd @24: there's a difference between being responsible for and having benefitted from. Women between the ages of 25-40 benefitted greatly from the women's lib movement in the 1960s that our mothers and grandmothers participated in, and they in turn benefitted from the suffrage movements that their mothers and grandmothers participated in. On top of that, not all women my mother's age participated in women's lib stuff, but they certainly benefitted. Betsy DeVos was never a participant (even being charitable, she's too young) but she certainly benefitted.

Same with the gay men who are more like Will than like Jack...the ones who could hide in the closet did, but they benefitted from the ones responsible for pushing gay rights into mainstream consciousness. Rock Hudson and Tab Hunter could hide and they had mainscreen careers, while up until the late 80s Divine was doing cult films only. Flash forward about 30 years and Drag Race is a thing. Because RuPaul was being a fabulous queen back in the 90s and 00s and being a hell of a businessperson at the same time, now we get to see drag on mainstream TV as the performance art that it is.

32
Sportlandia @27 Dan said that gay men can complain about housing and employment discrimination as well as violence. Actual issues, not just minor annoyances like the fact that it is socially acceptable for women to wear pants but not for men to wear dresses. I'm pretty sure if Matthew Shepard was going to complain from his grave, it would be that this guy has the nerve to whine about something so petty when there are serious problems still facing many gay and trans people, as well as people who cross dress that go way beyond "it isn't fair."
33
Dear EGADS:

My wife of 13 years finished railing my ass into unconsciousness earlier today. She couldn't be happier (I mean really, "kid in a candy store" doesn't even come close) being married to a bi guy who she can fuck with a strap-on like that. And bi-guy threesomes? Well, that's practically how we met.

You'd better believe that there are other women out there like her. And the best part is that no matter how many frogs you have to kiss, IT IS SO FUCKING WORTH IT!!

My advice is come out early and often when you're dating. My wife actually tried to *scare me away* with the crazy shit we're into. When you find the lady that's best for you, that instant reaction of "ew! No!" will instead be "Ooh! Where do I sign up?" and the best thing you can do is take joy in trying to scare off the normals. They're boring anyway.
34
Being able to dress like men is no great achievement anyway. A pair of Levi's and a tshirt.
EGADS, I don't know why the west has evolved to where men have such dreary parameters for their clothes, unless you're a musician. Men in other cultures love to dress up and wear colours on their faces. It became functional for men to go bland, suits/ ha capitalism.
See yourself as at the vanguard, along with many others like our own CMD, who are throwing caution to the wind, and enjoying expressing their X side. The bi part I'm confused by. You must be seeking your gfs in very vanilla places. Fetlife is the place to find like minded people for everything you can imagine.
If you keep resenting women and feel envious, no one will find you attractive. Sensible women don't resent men for the Patriarchy, where would the fun be in that.
35
Those men who still actively work to perpetuate the patriarchy, trump, Pence etc, no point in resenting them. Changing attitudes, again, needs clear focus, and feelings of resentment get in the way. There is a big resurgence of fifties Patriarchy going on. But I digress.
36
Sportlandia @27: And among men, preferring medium-to-large boobs is the norm, yet my AA's and I have never been too short of male attention, because there are PLENTY of exceptions. The same applies to EGADS, he just has to look for them, and not take other people's preferences personally. I bet he has some of his own preferences and would get bent out of shape if told he was obligated to date Republicans or women he didn't find attractive.

Lava @34: Oh, I don't know. I fucking LOVE that I can wear trousers all the time instead of constrictive and impractical female garments like girdles, stockings, and bullet bras. Those have their place in playtime but would be horrible to have to live in for eighteen hours every day.
37
Slinky @ 9
I was too teary-eyed to acknowledge your post earlier. Yes, respect should be earned, not demanded.

BDF @ 21 this "waving pompoms" reminds me someone commenting about his experience growing up: "I wanted to date a cheerleader and also BE one."

Lava @ 29
I'm sure you look fabulous with a buzz cut.

Slinky @ 31
Thanks for touching on the entertainment industry. Divine should have certainly earn some mainstream roles, though may have landed one inadvertently as John Waters defined "Hairspray" as his "accidental family film."
The film that terrified me while still very secretive in my early 20's was Brian di Palma's "Dressed to Kill." Labeled as an "erotic thriller" it featured a psychologists who wants to be a woman, and when a woman wants to have sex with him he freaks out and kills her.
Watch out folks, trans women of any shade are psychotic murderers! (Ironically Hollywood was praised for its feminist take since the cis woman was a sexually frustrated one in her 40's, played by Angie Dickenson, despite the fact that back then, 1980, married women in movies and tv shows who had sex outside their marriage often ended up paying with their lives.)

My take on drag is not that much better. I suspect this was an acceptable outlet over the years and was accepted as such by society. To some people this is all they know about trans womanhood. Some young feminists consider drag race as nothing but a derogatory "black face" show.
That said, I never watched a live show myself, though this is about to change soon.
38
I am not sure that DRESSED is imminently about to get divorced. This could just be his metaphor for 'my wife is really angry; she is hurt and outraged I violated the hall pass'. But then if they haven't broken up, why did she go away and why has her ex-husband reappeared on the scene? It sounds to me as if she's partly confecting her anger as a justification for leaving DRESSED.

If the question is whether he implicitly broke the terms of their agreement, then 'no', he didn’t. And I think he can do much better anyway. I don't know how far he wants to incorporate the cross-dressing into his ordinary domestic and erotic life with his main partner. Some older straight men who cross-dress do so as an outlet and want to maintain a degree of secrecy, of its being to some point isolated or segregated from their workaday existence. Is DRESSED like this? Is his cross-dressing specifically sexualized? (Mine isn't; my going about en femme is no more likely, is actually slightly less likely, to lead to sex than my wearing an average business suit). But if DRESSED wants a partner with whom his kink or inclination is more part of their sex lives, he can have it easily. He needn't be afraid of it; he deserves it; life can be richer and more exciting and better.
39
Just re-read OFO's letter. They're 22 and their father is already "on their back about kids"?? Oy vey!
40
LW1, DRESSED: I feel like there's a chapter missing in your letter. Why did you stay put while your wife moved home for better medical care? Was ex-hubby already (or still) in the picture when she moved? Without that additional information, I tend to agree with Dan and others that your wife appears to have been to be looking to uncover a violation of your "hall pass" arrangement when she flew back unannounced with her ex. You did nothing wrong by combining your true passion for dressing up with your sexual encounters, and if this episode is typical of the kind of fights your wife likes to instigate ("What I said is not entirely what I meant, and now I'm very angry about it, and it's all your fault!") then I really think you'll be happier in the long run without her.

LW2, OFO: I am also non-binary (I prefer to say androgynous), and I can guarantee that any short-term grief you get from your father will be vastly outweighed by the sheer comfort of living an authentic life - and the longer you're out, the easier it gets. Start looking for a better job or a second job, so you can fully support yourself and not have to depend on Dad; that will also do wonders for your self-esteem. But I'm constantly amazed that more people, especially younger people, don't realize that it takes two people to keep a fight going. You say, "Dad, I'd like you to call me [Preferred Name] from now on," he screams at you, you calmly say "Well, I guess we'll talk some more after you cool down." And then LEAVE until he's calm again. Repeat as necessary until you have him well-trained. And why would you want to come out to Dad but not to Mom...? She's going to find out somehow, even if she doesn't use Facebook, and she'll take it much better if you can be honest and tell her in person.

LW3, EGADS: I'll join the chorus of others saying that you are far more likely to attract the woman of your dreams (along with the occasional man) if you lose that giant chip on your shoulder. You are not being personally harmed by women who love other women and wear men's clothes, and I'll bet that the women who have dumped you were more put off by your whining than by your appropriation of "their" wardrobe.
41
Joining the chorus to say that the bi women of okcupid and similar are more likely to be into a guy who's into make-up and other traditionally feminine attributes than "straight purity" (eww makes me think of those blue rings and father-daughter proms). Key words: glam rock, Placebo, drag race. But yeah you'll need to get over the bitterness first.
42
@29 LavaGirl: I'm with CMD---I'll bet you'll look tres chic hot with a buzz cut.
@37 CMD (re @9 slinky's well written post--and @9: Kudos, slinky!): "Yes, respect should be earned, not demanded." BRAVO! I'd love for you to tell my three older siblings the same thing.
Agreed with @22 nocutename and @40 Capricornious: EGADS does sound like quite the whining drama queen. I'm curious as to how he'd react to my oldest sister.
43
I understand the need for hall-pass ground rules, but I'm a little hung up on the "can't be someone I work with"— I implying they don't work together. At first, I figured she was uncomfortable with the intimacy implied in that situation, but by the end of the letter it felt micro-managey, almost a trap.
44
CMD @37 --

Getting a bit off the main topic, but I was being very careful (plus it's my actual opinion) that drag is performance art and the modern manifestation of The Fool...the court jester, who was the only person who could speak truth to the king and not have his head cut off, because he was supposed to be absurd, don't you know? Watching good drag is like watching a combination of the nominally powerful imitating the nominally powerless (men imitating women) to make fun of things that deserve mocking, an opportunity to make fun of anything under the sun, and people having fun being as outrageous as they can. Good drag isn't necessarily NICE, it's not necessarily something that makes you feel comfortable, and it's not necessarily just Whitney Houston songs or pretty boys dressed as pretty girls.

IOW, there's a reason that Divine is still a legend nearly 30 years after her death, while people barely remember Glenn Milstead. He did have his breakthrough into the mainstream on a season with Married with Children, and was signed as a full member of the cast but died before shooting could begin.

As for the modern manifestation of The Fool, Dame Edna Everage wouldn't have been Dame Edna (and taken the piss out of the British royal family) if not for being a drag queen, and Tannie Evita Bezuidenhout (aka Pieter-Dirk Uys' drag creation) is one of the only major apartheid-era activists who was not censored or jailed, in large part because Tannie Evita took refuge in audacity and ridiculousness that would never be tolerated from a straight cis woman (or a trans woman, for that matter). And 25 years after apartheid ended, schoolkids in South Africa will listen to Tannie Evita talk to them about HIV prevention, safer sex, PrEP, and dealing with family members with AIDS with far more attention than they'd ever provide to "just" another well-meaning white lady. (Watch this: https://www.pri.org/stories/2013-12-13/m…)

If you want to cut your teeth on a drag show and they're in town, go see the Ballet Trockadero de Monte Carlo. On the one hand, they viciously parody ballet as an art form with everything from dying swans to mopping the floors to eating an apple on stage....and then they play their characters completely straight with the original choreography of the Mariinsky in 1893.
45
Okay, maybe I am a douche for bringing this up, but if DRESSED's marriage is deteriorating from his role as sole caretaker, and his wife sets him up for for a divorce that she files, isn't she somewhat doing him a favor? He gets away from someone who at the very least, doesn't appreciate the time and energy, both physical and emotional, that it takes to take care of a sick person, and he isn't that jerk that dumped his wife while she was sick. If a marriage is going to end, this sounds like a win-win to me.
46
gromm @ 33
Don't get me wrong, I'm glad pegging works so well for you and your wife.
Just want to point out that not all male-borns who are into cross dressing are necessarily into pegging, are bi, "submissive sissies" and so on.

Play/sexual preferences may vary and shift, just like all other segments of population.
47
@42 re @37 CMD: One clarification (particularly for those new to the Savage Love comment threads. Interesting that @4 and @5 seem to have exited the thread): I'm not asking you to speak to my previous-decade-older siblings on my behalf. I'm just confident that they would actually listen to you than to their "kid" sister.
48
I have nothing more to add, but am instead getting caught up on reading the threads.
49
Dougsf @43: "Can't be someone I work with" sounds like a reasonable rule for anyone to have. Perhaps not the most obvious rule for a third party to impose -- and you're right, given the "sex is okay but not cross-dressing, I want to be able to dictate what you can and can't wear" attitude, might just be an arbitrary "I want to see if you'll obey" measure -- but generally good practice. Perhaps all his co-workers know he's married, and that would raise the Potential Drama Quotient. Or perhaps she's experienced actual drama in shitting-where-one-eats situations in the past. Or LW is a workaholic and the only people he sees socially are workmates, meaning the spirit of the rule was "randos off the internet only."

CMD @46: You are correct. These preferences are often, but not always, linked.
50
What is his question? Whatever it is, he needs to end this horror asap. She sounds like a bitch and why is she travelling around with her ex husband. Deflecting from what she's really on about, pointing the finger at him.
LW, are you awake here, or have you just slid onto the floor, doormat like. This woman, your wife, is a really rude and selfish woman. One hall pass after tending her for three years; glad to see you got to have fun and have sex. Start divorce proceedings, and make sure she's not trying to hang it on you. Her ex husband, eh. Interesting.
Then be who you are, and have your lingerie and dresses and heels and makeup all around your house. Life is too short to spend it with mean spirited people. Fuck 'em.
51
Lava @50: Yes. She "didn't want to know about it," she just wanted to dictate who it was with, what he was allowed to wear during, and how many times they could do it, all while knowing nothing about it. DTCFA (dump the control freak already).
52
slinky @ 44
Rest assured, no bad feelings. I think much of the negative image I have re drag is in my head, and am working on it.
The one time I saw something resembling drag was last year at the Seattle opera production of Hensel and Gretel. The witch was a grotesque character played by a man, and apparently this portrayal also angered some cis women.

My birthday is coming up soon and I've already teamed up with a friend's wife who's into drag shows to choose one for a group I'll be dragging- ha ha- to see it and have a drink and a talk afterwards. I'll be em femme, though nothing like Divine in Female Trouble. (The opening sequence is one of my all time favorites.)

Thanks for the historic perspective, much appreciated.
If you reside in Savageville area you're welcome to join us.
53
@36 are your tits battery powered? I ain't never heard of AAs. But boobs are more like penises than you think: it's not the size that matters, it's the swag you carry them with.
54
@52 CMD wannabe (re my @47): Sorry. After a reread, my comment still didn't come out quite right. I am going with your "respect is earned not demanded" analogy. My sibs and at least half of my elders I was supposed to faithfully respect throughout my life never offered the same in return. Often they were guilty of doing just the opposite----unfairly demanding my undivided attention, obedience and free availability 24/7 unreciprocated as if I was more of a possession than a blood family member. By doing so, they have lost my respect, and their ability to contact me is limited to email.
This is off topic, but I emailed you an update on what is going on in my life (but didn't want to post it all here in Savage Love).
Happy Birthday! Please let me know if you're headed in my neck of the woods. Poetry night?
55
@36 BiDanFan: I envy your bra size. If you ever want to trade, please let me know.
56
@17 Fair enough, and thank you for sharing.
57
@14
It is a bullshit, bad-faith offer, because as soon as they find out, no matter how accidentally, they are invariably as outraged as if you had fucked around without permission in the first place.

I think the good-faith version of this rule is "you have permission, and I'd rather not know about it" (the unspoken or spoken implication being that permission=waiving the right to have a hairy cow about it if you do somehow find out).
58
I'm getting no responses in the comment threads or emails from those among commenters that I have shared my email address with lately. Dan, have I pissed you or any commenters here on Savage Love off? If so, my sincerest heartfelt apologies.
59
Sporty @53: https://www.littlewomen.com/aa-bras
Now you know. An AA is smaller than an A, and therefore impossible to buy other than via specialist retailers. I'm only a handful for those who have petite hands.

Griz @55: You don't envy this bra size. We both envy the B's and the C's. I'm happy to take a cup size of your excess, deal? :)

Ghost @57: Agreed. Avast @14 sounds like he's speaking from (unfortunate) experience... but that's not everyone's experience. The Underwoods in House of Cards appear to have a workable DADT relationship, because they neither parade their other lovers in front of each other, nor punish each other when they stumble over less-than-perfectly-hidden tracks. I've known real-life couples with similar arrangements. One went from a tentative DADT to fully open, going-on-vacation-with-both-my-partners poly. But the tendency of the truth to out is why I 100% prefer a "full disclosure" agreement. I'm fine with a partner having other partners, but I don't want to be surprised by it.
60
CMD @37: Back in high school I had zero chance of either becoming a cheerleader or dating one, either. :)
61
BDF @ 60
Our entire adult life is nothing but a make up for our high school losses and traumas.

I will get the proper attire next time, pompoms and all, as well as the right size batteries for sportie.
62
yeah, the first guy's wife is an insufferable, ungrateful, controlling bitch looking to put all the blame on him. sorry you had to waste 3+ years on that. one can only hope he learns A LOT from this.
63
For OFO, regarding Facebook: Create a new profile, properly non-gendered, and start migrating your cool friends over there. Set the privacy very high to increase the time until your bigoted father notices.

It won't last forever, and eventually slip-ups will out you, but (1) you'll have had 6 months or 2 years of being authentic in one more arena of your life, (2) that experience may motivate you to move out and be more independent, (3) you'll have a easy-to-reach support group under that true FB profile the next time it hits the fan.
64
@59 BiDanFan: I guess my inferiority complex is showing again. My mother, sisters, aunts, and grandmothers were all petite to 5'6 with narrow frames and smaller breasts than mine, never hesitating to call me fat (I'm a C cup, now, and was a D when I truly was seriously overweight. Maybe I need a better fitting bra). It's just so !@#$ing depressing seeing the two sagging globs that represent my chest, and they're not even the same matching size! I have never had attractive boobs and, after having learned a harsh lesson in life about LTRs, am done dating or stupidly marrying them.
65
Griz @64: Perhaps they called you fat because they secretly envied your curves? I know I sure envied my younger sister who "developed" before I did.
And then a few years later, she developed bulimia in an attempt to get herself down to my weight.
Sibling rivalry and unrealistic beauty expectations are a toxic combination.
66
Lot's of great comments. Yes, I filed two days after she left. Especially when ex-husband called me to dictate terms of the divorce. You see, they found my burner phone used to make contact and pictures (just dressed up nothing sexual). So yes we are separated.

Did I know the ex? Yes they have always been on good terms. Thought we were friends. Fool me

Why didn't I move too? Her health care costs have been over $1M a year but I only paid $7500 a year because of my platinum health insurance. If I left my job to be with her, then what insurance would she get? I took her all over the country to see experts and all covered 100%. You don't throw that away.

I have been having fun exploring this new experience and I am glad that I did. Met many people and it's been a blast

No regrets.
67
@65 BiDanFan: "Sibling rivalry and unrealistic beauty expectations are a toxic combination."
They sure are, and add to that another bizarre twist recently, within my remaining family by blood, DNA, same beloved parents (however their hangups and insecurities; I have plenty of my own as well) and family name only: my oldest sister, still unable to fire up her little war wagon and come up "to visit" (more like her coming to snoop into my current life, invade my living space, and fuck up my life by reorganizing my daily routine to suit her selfish, disorganized agenda) and older sister have emailed me, asking what's wrong ('Do you think I'm a bad person?' and related soap opera tripe). After fifty years of their harping, nagging, bossy, cruelly selfish, manipulative over-dramatized, micro-managing bullshit I would think they'd have a clue, or their grown children would bring them up to speed. Nope--they're just as delusional as ever, and my brother is equally out of touch by claiming that [my] participating in these imposed upon, unwanted "visits" is---wait for it----"what [our] Mom and Dad would want". Yeah, well, it isn't what I want---or need (this from the Town Hero who shows up only once every 365 days at his convenience to red carpet treatment, and like I'm supposed be dusted off after being unpacked out of a cardboard box in a closet for the occasion, instantly sprung to giddy, rosy cheeked Norman Rockwellian life--until it's time for my brother to get in his rental car, drive back to the airport and off again in a cloud of pixie dust to Never-Neverland)! If I'm suddenly considered selfish and ungrateful, I have learned it over time and exhaustive wear from three pros born a decade ahead of me.
I call bullshit on all three of them. My brother just wants to keep everything status quo, however unhealthy and unfair in which I'm supposed to be everyone's keeper, come obediently running when anyone snaps his or her fingers, and just LOVE being a doormat. My brother can't be bothered from his L.A. cocoon 1,200 miles away when not freely roaming the planet. I have accepted them as they are; that's a big part as to why I remain distant from them. CMD nailed it: "respect is to be earned, not demanded."
My sisters, brother, and all those like them from my past have lost all my respect. There's no love, either. Anything forced on someone can't be considered love, especially if it only benefits the users, abusers, and manipulators.
My three sibs have each other. They can stay locked in the 1950s together as three little peas in a pod. That part works for me----I can honestly say that my beloved little VW and I are unavailable to them, then. Neither of us existed six decades ago.
My father, before joining my mother coming up on seven years ago, advised me to live my life, chase my dreams and have as few regrets as possible. My choice to leave behind my sibs and those who have wronged / hurt me is mine. I have no regrets about this, and no desire to regress--or look back any further. It's time for me to move on, and with them fully out of my life.
They're on Call Block for good reason.
68
@65 BiDanFan (and everyone else): Okay--I'm off my soapbox now, but I think you get the point.
69
@59 I've been with women with "zero" breasts. I'm surprised that you get specialty bras at all and don't just wear camis? Perhaps it's a generational thing? I suspect the Kate Upton's of the world will "always" be envied for their bodies, but I feel like we're in an era where breast size is at it's least relevant as an element of attractiveness. I dunno, maybe it's a grass-is-greener scenario.
70
@69 Sportlandia: Congrats on scoring the big number! I wanted someone else other than I to have this week's honor.
71
@69: That would make sense to me for those of us with really small breasts to just opt to simply go braless (lucky you, for never having to needlessly suffer the agony of underwires!). You can get away with it, and wear cute little camisoles and / or tank tops.

72
@67 (re @65) BiDanFan: One last dumb question (at least, to me it feels like it): What to do if one is perfectly ready to cut ties with unloving, unsupportive blood relatives, getting therapy, and moving on----but any one or more of them stubbornly refuses to let YOU, the shamelessly abused for far too long, go? All three of my siblings are on Call Block, and their only connections with me are through email (but no longer Facebook) and the standard USPS.
74
Sportlandia @69 (congrats!)/Griz @71: It's a sad omission that there is no comparable feminine word in the English language for "emasculate," because that's exactly the effect telling a small-busted woman "you don't even need a bra" has.

Your tits don't even qualify as tits! You want a garment that at least gives them their best possible presentation, just like every other woman from slightly larger to incomprehensibly larger takes for granted? Tough shit. Just wear camis. No opportunity for you to make the most of your curves. Any garment made for women and fitted in the chest is gonna gap and there's nothing you can do about it. You don't "need" to wear a bra (never mind that your nipples get cold or show through your tops, or that gravity still exists), so why should anyone cater for you? You fail the pencil test; are you even allowed to call yourself a woman? You're a sorry excuse for one. No bra for you. Go back to the playground.

Perhaps I don't HAVE to wear a bra. But perhaps I WANT to. Shouldn't that be an option? (I'm glad Little Women think so.) At my size, "oh this uncomfortable bra" is not a thing. "This shirt/dress won't fit right unless I'm wearing a bra" is. Griz, doesn't a good bra improve your confidence? You'd deprive me of that experience?

For the record, it's not Kate Upton whose figure (and probable back problems) I envy. It's Emma Watson.
75
Griz @72: Sounds like you've done most everything you can. Just stand firm, don't reply to the e-mails or snail mails (better, delete or shred them unopened), and don't let her make you feel guilty. That last one will be easier said than done, so keep up with the therapy, and also have a good friend on standby when you just need to vent! Good luck!
76
@66.GA. I think your life will change for the better.

Your soon-to-ex and her ex find your cross-dressing disgusting. They lose hold of their reason confronted with it--even when retaining a claim on your health insurance would clearly be advantageous to her. The chasm between 'people like us' (cross-dressers, the genderqueer, trans people) and 'people like them' is probably unbridgeable. You may still care strongly that your wife recovers from her illness and feel a responsibility towards her; but her righteous and (I'd guess) kneejerk attitude may mean you've done all you can.
77
@74 BiDanFan: No, no, no--I never said that, nor would I!! I am truly sorry if my comment hurt or offended you in any way. If you want a bra and would feel more comfortable in one, by all means acquire what you want and desire. I only meant that because you have smaller breasts than my shoulder-to-shoulder boulders, you could get away with going braless if you wanted to, with nuthin' underneath and nobody would make nearly the big stink they would if I went braless. Believe me, I'd get weird looks if I dared (read this week's I, Anon about the guy at Greenlake for publicly displaying his highly noticeable "banana hammock" in comparison). There must be some really cute bras your size--seriously, what about Victoria's Secret or Bali? I could wear those only in my wildest dreams. Good luck sexy-bra shopping. I'll bet you'll find something hot.
78
@73 marilynsue: My irony is that a lot of the good older relatives (i.e.: my beloved parents among others) are gone, and mostly all the jerks, controlling bitches, and assholes are largely the ones who are left. I like your steely mantra idea, though. Now how to apply it?
@74 BiDanFan: At least you probably (hopefully!) don't have big boob-related back problems like I do, if that's any comfort, and
@75 BiDanFan: Thank you, too, for the much appreciated pep talk.
re my @71: You really are lucky not to have to worry about underwire bras. I consider underwires what Matt Groening would list in his book, Fashion is Hell. My mother stubbornly swore that I needed them for support (like she unyieldingly believed I needed braces with full head gear) until I showed her the scrapes and cut marks along side my breasts when the underwires kept going wildly out of shape and poking me constantly. They never fit right.
By the way, there ARE sexy bras for smaller breasted women. Remember Kate Jackson, Farrah Fawcett, Jaclyn Smith, and Cheryl Ladd in Charlie's Angels? Girl power!
79
Bi @74: Just for the record, last time I checked there were just as many papers correlating bra-wearing with drooping breasts as there were correlating it with preventing it. Gravity is still pulling whether something's holding them up or not.

I go without bras about half the time. I do enjoy sometimes wearing pretty bras to feel sexy, and I completely understand how you would want that option.

On the other hand--and this isn't directed at you, BDF, but just society in general--I also sometimes resent the fact that I'm expected to wear something that is uncomfortable just so the men around me aren't distracted by the possible sight of a nipple through a shirt. *sigh*
80
@79 ciods: The laws of gravity. *sigh* I can corroborate. I have asked my gynecologist about having breast reduction surgery done. In addition to the procedure altering my body and being invasive as well as cost prohibitive, she says it's a waste of money and time, and that mine would just sag again. I think I need to return to Lane Bryant for a new fitting soon. and
@74 BiDanFan (re @79 ciods): I also sometimes resent (not either of you, personally, though) that I'm expected to wear something big and bulky like a girdle to make my upper half behave itself in public (thankfully, I no longer have to endure underwire bras, anymore).
81
Griz @74: As the therapists would say, use "I" statements.
Good: "I hate bras and I wish I didn't have to wear them."
Bad: "You don't need a bra."

No one would make a stink if I went braless because I'd have no observable boobs. Just pointy nipples where my boobs should be.

Victoria's Secret bras start at B (Emma Watson's cup size). Most major department stores start at A. I, too, can only shop in physical stores in my wildest dreams. Before the internet, bra shopping was an ordeal of trawling the malls in mostly-futile search of A-cup demi bras that ran small. (On the plus side, it seems that the cheaper the retailer, the more likely they did run small enough for me. I guess they were saving money on material.)

All of Charlie's Angels had boobs. Remember Keira Knightley? That's roughly what I'm sporting. The first ever celebrity whose bust looked anything like mine was Kate Moss; she did wonders for my self-esteem. Though not for my ease in clothes shopping.
http://images.gawker.com/lkbnu5kysxfemfe…

Sporty may be right about it being generational. If I were two decades younger, I might just embrace my "failure to become a woman" and identify as non-binary, and be pleased that unlike my NB peers, I could have a unisex figure without binding.

As I've got older -- and had ample proof that lack of boobs doesn't mean no one will ever want to sleep with me -- I do see the advantages of smaller boobs versus large ones. But I've never wanted large ones! Fucking hell, a B cup would be sufficient. To just outgrow the training bra, jeez.

Griz @78: Surely back problems are justification for breast reduction surgery? Get a second opinion!

Ciods @79: Re gravity, I only meant its effects when one is, for instance, going up a flight of stairs.
82
BDF, aunt Zelda, maybe also Hariett, GA, and wanna bees out there- just sharing some of my experiences as a life long lingerie enthusiast in case it helps (me: male born, no hormones nor operations, breast forms ranging from 36A to 38D US size):
Plenty small size bras can be found in stores catering for Asian women. In PNW that also means some mainstream department stores because of tourism, but also ordinary stores owned by immigrants. The Vietnsmese-owned pharmacy in my hood has a huge selection in the back for some reason, same goes to some Asian grocery stores.

Poking underwires, especially in under arm area, is a common problem for all bra wearers regardless of whatever. I often trim them by poking a small hole at that end which is invisible when done on the inside part of the bra by using small and sharp scissors (those on the multi tool Swiss Army knife work best for me.)
Push the wire out and cut an inch or two with a wire cutter, then file the sharp edges (Swiss Army to the rescue once again) and reinsert the wire all the way in.
For my larger-size forms I've found Wacoal and Soma bras to be the most comfortable. They also have some very comfortable and supportive wire-free ones.

Breast forms- after some trials and errors I found a small family business in California which I consider to make very realistic ones as well as best value for my money.

In order to achieve a "no bra" and a fairly "natural" look I use bralettes- Nordstrom has some good ones- and after marking the nipple area cut a small hole just above it and pull the stretchy fabric around the form to allow movement and nipple visibility while making sure they don't fall on the ground.

More details for those interested: cmd78014 at yeah who.
Just be aware that it will take me a week or more to get back to you due to travel plans.
83
Fan, haven't you heard of padded bras? They seem to be what's most on offer when I venture to look. I need a new bra but the size had rubbed off on this one and I have no idea of my size, it changing since menopause, and there you are Fan knowing Emma Watson's size, impressive. So one day I wear my sports bra and take my bra in to the local BigW and like some looney try to measure the straps and cups and I gave up. Guess it's a trip to a dept store and get some breast measurement help, again.
84
CMD @82/Lava @83 by coincidence: I was excited to go to Japan a few years back, and figured I would get in some bra shopping, as the average Japanese woman is much closer in build to myself. Much to my dismay, I discovered that Japan is a nation of false advertisers. There were bras available in shops in my size, but every one of them was ultra padded, with extra booster inserts. Why do they call it a Wonderbra? Because when I take it off, you Wonder where my boobs went. I do not want someone's reaction upon getting me naked to be disappointment. Yes, Lava, I've heard of padded bras. Have short women heard of high heels? And yes, they do seem to be most of what's on offer for the small sizes, which isn't terribly useful if all you want to do is make the best presentation of what you do have, not pretend you have cup sizes you don't. (And even so, you purchase them in your own size, not a size larger. They're bigger on the outside, not on the inside like a Tardis!) Sometimes, for instance when one wants a strapless bra, it's the only choice, and I do have to say mine is useful in making things fit properly. But I'd rather pull someone who knows my tits are tiny and is okay with it, than pretend I can offer a nice handful, only to vanish when the clothes come off.

One thing about being bisexual: I'm a pretty good estimator of other women's bra sizes. Google confirmed Ms Watson's as 32B. (One nice effect of this tangent, it was a wonderful excuse to google "Emma Watson's breasts." I'll be in my bunk...)
85
GA @66, thanks for writing in and giving us "the rest of the story," as Paul Harvey used to say. It's too bad that your dedication and long-term care for your sick wife was reciprocated with faithlessness and fault-finding, and divorce is never an easy thing even when it's absolutely the right way to go - but I do think you'll be happier in the long run, and you seem to be taking the right attitude. You didn't ask for this change, but I think you're prepared to handle it. In fact, I think you will start to thrive and grow again as a person, now that you are living in a healthier environment. Good luck!
86
BDF
I'm aware of the padded bra phenomenon in Japan and most other places in Asia, though there are some exceptions.
Couple lingerie blogs I've dealt with in the past also address the issue, as well as body image of all kinds, and may have some suggestions for you:
thelingerieaddict.com which runs to this day, as well as the lingerielesbian.com which ceased to exist couple of years ago but retained its past posts.
Both women who own them are on the small size and have lots of insight.
If you give me your size, my guess is 34AA, I'll put my big nose to a good use and sniff around for a good cause.

On a somewhat related issue- I wonder why women, especially the smart and feminist ones, insist on referring to their breasts as boobs and tits.
87
The second site I referred you to should be thelingerielesbian.com

88
Look on the bright side Fan, your breasts will never sag, or develop heat rash underneath. Seeing nipples is not a problem always, so going free is an option. Not so for the holders of bigger, gravity responding, banging around, breasts.
So many pluses.
89
CMDwannabe @86 -- why fuss about how we refer to our body parts? When talking to a doctor or other formal situations I would refer to my breasts, vagina/vulva, navel, buttocks, etc. But when speaking casually with my close friends I'd talk about my tits, my pussy, my belly button, my butt. What difference does it make?
90
CMD @86: You are a very good guesser. And honestly, it's partly as Erica says, informal language, and partly for word variety. Using the word "breasts" 18 times in a single post about breasts would make even me get bored of breasts.

Lava @88: If I hadn't learned to appreciate the pluses, I'd be typing from behind a pair of silicone spheres. :)
91
EP, BDF
I was under the impression that some women are not comfortable when the b and t words are used by men, but maybe it's easier for women to say it in this context.
I might casually refer to my breast forms as "silicone spheres" from now on.
Still proud of my big nose regardless.
92
CMD @91: It's all about tone and context. A man shouting "Nice tits!" from a car is a very different thing from a woman saying "I wish I had bigger/smaller tits." And a very different thing from one's own male lover saying "I just love your tits." I guess it's like black people calling each other "my nigga" and Dan describing himself as a faggot. The owner of the breasts can call them anything she likes.
93
@81 BiDanFan: I really think you meant Sportslandia's comment (@69) here: "You don't need a bra".
I have cute tank tops (but not camisoles), but would rather not have to wear a bra as big as the one I require. I believe I said [to you], "you're lucky not to have to suffer from underwires." Believe me, Bi, I don't think you would want to have something scraping, poking and actually cutting into you. Especially when someone (in this case, my mother) insisted that you "needed" them when they proved cruelly uncomfortable and binding. Please reread my comment @77, and @88 LavaGirl's spot on comment as well. I agree with LavaGirl: Bi, you really are extremely lucky NOT to have anything sagging from your chest. Savor your plusses.
94
@81 BiDanFan: Also, please read LavaGirl's excellent suggestion in @83. Have you tried using padded bras?
95
@91 CMD: Can I join your big nose club? I'm proud to be one of few in my family to sport the original.
96
Thank-you, Mr Savage, for the a-romanticism of your response to 'OFO'. It would be good if we all could live 'more authentic lives', but it were unrealistic to think that this can, here and now, be without cost, and as such that cost might be too great for the greater happiness or reduced pain attendant to the degree of authenticity gained.