Savage Love Sep 18, 2018 at 4:00 am

Fresh Starts

Joe Newton



Daddy, my husband is into mild/gentle femdom and he gets off on me looking at his porn history and likes. It's a good thing - why the warning?


HAGO, what if you decide NOT to disclose. Where's this thing headed? If you have to keep secrets - denying who you really are - then you're not really in a relationship, are you?


WOW. Bullseye, Dan, to NOPE on self-fulfilling prophecies. "You had shitty sex with your ex, and now..." I'm guilty as charged. It sounds like NOPE is not over her ex. No matter how sexually GGG her new guy is, she may be subconsciously afraid of getting hurt again. I hope all works out well for you and your much better new guy, NOPE.
Okay, Dan, and everyone, here are a few dumb questions (at least, to me): If I am happily asexual after so much shitty het sex back in my 20s and 30s, and am now perfectly content in my 50s to not go looking for it, why does that socially feel so wrong? What is [U.S.] society's hangup with coupling everyone?


Thank you and bless you, Dan, for spot on advice to NOPE. I had to stop reading at the beginning of your response, because the subject matter touched a sensitive nerve. I wonder if that would ever work for me, too? I'm otherwise perfectly okey single.


Auntie griz @4, people want to believe they're normal, so all the coupled-off parents with steady jobs insist that's the only path to a respectable life -- it validates their choices.


How can HAGO be turned on by femdom and yet feel nothing with a stern thought policewoman?


@6 EricaP: And that is why I avoid bars, don't regularly attend any one particular house of religious worship, and, like classic rocker George Thorogood, drink alone.


Daddy @ 1
Saxfanatic @ 7
I find HAGO’s “mild fem dom” as a designated play time every now and then rather than a 24/7. I would very much prefer to submit to someone who deserves my trust, as opposed to a nagging insecure person attempting to control me in a no fun nor trusty manner.

I think Ms. Biz @ 2 may be into the same vibe, only the other way. Interested in your take if you care to share.


@4 Griz: if you're happily asexual, why are you reading a sex advice column?


@10 fubar: I read Savage Love because Dan offers such spot on advice. We quite often agree on a lot of issues. I have had the pleasure of meeting Dan in person. People don't necessarily have to be sexually active to love Dan's column, Dan himself, or the wicked kickin' awesome things he does (I would never have the stomach to attend a Republican National Conference like Dan can). There are also a good number of regular commenters I enjoy keeping in touch with online. One big plus in my opinion: Dan the Man is also feisty, like I am.


Dadddy@1: yeah, I was kinda noticing that as well. "Oh no, my girlfriend is so controlling about my femdom kink :D." What's next, "Help, Dan! My boyfriend keeps punishing me for looking up spanking kink porn - by spanking me when he finds out! Whatever can I do?"


HAGO: Your girlfriend reads Savage Love with you. I think that's already pretty solid evidence that she's less kink-negative than your ex.

DWBAA: Too late - you're already an asshole. What you want is for your ex-boyfriend to not think you're an asshole, which is impossible, given you are one. He's a big boy; just tell him before he hears it from someone else, and give him the opportunity to process it and/or decide he doesn't want to be friends with you. You're doing him a service: he might not have yet learned that dating women in their 20s is nothing but trouble. That's an important lesson and the sooner he learns it, the happier he will be.

Busy @2: "Why the warning"? Dadddy is SL's resident misogynist, now that Hunter is taking a back seat. He can't resist making the woman the bad guy in every situation. A Dominant woman will only control her partner's internet use if that turns him on and he consents to it. If not, she's not a Dominant, she's an abuser. Not surprised Dadddy doesn't know the difference.

Griz @4: Books have been written on the obsession with coupledness!

Sax @7: He didn't "feel nothing"; on the contrary, he stayed in a relationship with her for an unstated length of time. Perhaps Misogynist @1 is onto something after all: it was Ex's dominant personality that attracted HAGO in the first place, but it didn't manifest in ways that he consented to or enjoyed.


@13 BiDanFan: I have been taking great strides to avoid those obsessed with coupledness. I had waaaay too many yentas to fight off half my life ago. I could cite some examples, but I have shared mine at great length in past SL columns. I don't want to be redundant. The good news is that it appears that said yentas have since backed off.


Rather than encouraging the ex to unfollow her, would it really be unthinkable for a 24-year-old woman not to post anything about her love life on social media for a couple of months? I realize Dan brought this up and not LW, but....


Fred @15: Or she could set her filters to exclude him. Asking him to unfollow her would be a clear signal that she's hiding something. (Even a photo of the two together would count as "posting something about her love life.")


@4. Griz. The right way to answer, 'why does that feel wrong socially?' is to ask another question: 'what do I want?'. If you don't want to be sexual, then that's what's right for you; being stronger than society's prejudicial desire for you to shack up with someone can be difficult, yes, but isn't the primary concern.


HAGO is making things unnecessarily difficult for his new partner with his elaborate device of having them read out 'his' letter. He must have a sense of whether she has domme-ish tendencies, by now? If she isn't naturally dominating, but he only likes to be mildly dommed anyway, the question may become 'is she willing to do certain things for me?' e.g. to tie him up, to lock up his cock, to spank him. If he noncoercively suggests these activities, he will get a response. Or ... whatever ... ask her to kiss his toes. Depending on how much she's into it, or how GGG she is, he will decide how serious the relationship is for him and/or how long it's likely to last.

But he shouldn't suppose she's like his last, controlling gf until there's proof to this effect.


@10. fubar. One of the flavors of sex is asexuality--yes? 'A' is a letter under the queer umbrella. (This suggests, to me, the portmanteau's usefulness). The spirit in which the column is written is that no variety of sexual experience is normative--not married heterosexuality, married homosexuality; not promiscuous or sex-starved homosexuality; not bisexuality or voluntarily not having sex.


HAGO hasn’t let us know how he uses the internet to satisfy his kinks. Is it thru porn or other. Does it involve humans in real time interacting. Three months is way too long to disclose mild or otherwise kinks. And to set her up by reading the thread is going to achieve what, if she has a negative response. Is he going to deny his kinks or have another x gf. Always best to be upfront, a few weeks in.


Spot on, LavaGirl


Lava @20: Hmm. Three months is the end of the money-back-guarantee period, and while that certainly means it's not too soon to tell her about his kinks, whether it's too late, IMO, depends on how important those kinks are to him. If any partner of his wasn't into them, would he be satisfied by watching femdom and foot porn? If the kinks are a dealbreaker, then yes, disclose as early as feasible. If they're a take-or-leave, three months seems about right -- particularly since he has the excuse of a kink-shaming, controlling ex for why he didn't speak up sooner.


HAGO ~ perhaps a bit of counseling would be of benefit if you are so traumatized by your ex that you can’t communicate with your current SO. You can’t always have an advice column handy when there is something you need to discuss.

DWBAA~ He’s your EX, you aren’t responsible for taking care of his insecurities. Either he’ll get over your jumping directly onto another guy or he won’t, but if it will make you feel like you’re doing him a favor by being the one to essentially say, “Our relationship was so over way before we broke up that I’ve already moved on to fresh meat” then the sooner the better. I doubt if it will change his opinion of you no matter who he hears it from, but if it was me I’d give you a half point for the belated honesty.


@16 Fan: Yes, there's that — though, as a tactic, it may be more useful for cooling the pivot-to-close-friendship that Dan rightly thinks is ill-advised than for concealing her new relationship. Mutual friends who aren't filtered out may spill to him anyway.

If she really wanted to spare his feelings, she could try a multi-pronged strategy of a) filter adjustment, to help keep her generally off his radar; b) discretion in what she posts, to avoid giving those mutual friends fodder; and c) keeping a low profile as a couple IRL, if only for another month or so.

Granted, it was nearly a decade ago, I was twice the age that she is now, and I wasn't on social media — but I have been in a roughly similar situation. Spending a lot of private time indoors and shutting the rest of the world out, early on, wasn't exactly a burden. The discretion that afforded was just a side benefit.


First, in the eyes of at least someone, isn't EVERYONE "masturbating to the wrong things"?

Now I just want to concur with:

@13 BiDanFan
"Busy @2: "Why the warning"? Dadddy is SL's resident misogynist, now that Hunter is taking a back seat. He can't resist making the woman the bad guy in every situation."

I haven't been here a long time, but this pattern has become sickeningly clear to me already.

"A Dominant woman will only control her partner's internet use if that turns him on and he consents to it. If not, she's not a Dominant, she's an abuser. Not surprised Dadddy doesn't know the difference."

Exactly. Misogyny in anyone is disgusting. Then there's something extra I also find shameful in hating the sex one isn't attracted to.


BiDan@22 ~ If theses kinks really are make-it-or-break-it, I’d say, “You strung me along for THREE MONTHS before telling me this?!” Third date should have been the time to say, “This caused some trouble in my last relationship, so in fairness to you I want to get it out in the open ASAP...” If it is totally “break-it” the extra time won’t make any difference. Best for both of you to find a better match sooner rather than later.


DWBAA: Back away a little bit from your ex; remain cordial but put some more distance between the two of you. You've moved on, and he obviously hasn't. It's going to hurt him to see you with someone else so soon, and hurt more when he realizes that there was no time gap at all. So let him keep some dignity and save a little face. If you can, try not to flaunt your new relationship too publicly, while not trying to pretend you're not in one.

It's often very difficult to abruptly shift the nature of a relationship if there's no time during which to downshift. Your ex is going to feel hurt and probably betrayed; there's no way around it. You have to let him lick his wounds. You can't make this better for him by explaining or justifying or pretending that something which is clearly going on isn't going on. He'll figure out the timeline soon enough. That is when he'll really feel the pain of the breakup, and I think you are just going to have to live with the knowledge that you won't be seen as the good guy* by some people. He will be mad at you. For a while, he may not like you. I know this is hard, because you still like and care about him and you also sound like you want to be approved of and liked. You want to be a good guy.* But he will get on with his life, and down the road, you two may be able to be friends again. Or if not friends, not people who hate each other.

*"good guy"= a non-gendered expression.


DWBAA is a 24 year old who has been in an ltr with a man ten years older than her. I wonder how long the long term was? In any case, now they are meeting up once a week and she feels she must manage his feelings? He's a grown ass man and not your boyfriend. His feelings are his own responsibility. She should not have to refrain from using social media or lie about who she is dating- if he can't handle knowing that she's dating someone else, then he can choose not to look at it and not to go out with her once a week. She should tell him kindly and spare him the details until the sore spot is gone. If he can't handle hearing it, then he is not ready for her friendship. And that's fine. BDF, why is DWBAA an asshole?

As for the kink disclosure, I think three months is an acceptable amount of time. Obviously there might be variations- like if they'd been moving really fast and making committments to each other, he should've disclosed earlier, but they don't say anything like that. And it doesn't sound like indulging in his kink during that three month period has done anything that would affect her (not like he's lying about something that could expose her to STDs.) I'd think that someone might want to divulge earlier just to spare themselves and others the invested time if the kink is a deal breaker, but 3 months isn't that long.

As to the misogyny conversation, I'm a little curious about it. It sounds like the LW's ex was not a dom- if she's kink shaming him to the point that she is controlling his computer use, etc, then it sounds like she was not willing to indulge in the kink at all. There's no indication that she was also a dom. These things seem totally unrelated. Which leads me to wonder if the LW should in fact be looking for a dom. Is his kink just watching this in porn (could that even be considered a kink?) or is he actually looking for someone who will be a dom in real life? Because if it's the former, then revealing it to his girlfriend should be a good filter to see if she's a decent person. Anyone who is going to be weirdly controlling about what you watch online needs to be dumped right away. If it's the later, then it's a bigger ask. Is he asking her to either be his dom or to be ok with him seeking a dom? Even a decent person who is not a kink shamer might have trouble with that. I'm unclear what he's seeking here.


@4 Griz: thanks... I'm glad you're here :)


Whoops... make that @11


@4 auntie griz: have you seen The Lobster? If you haven't, you should see it. I won't say any more. :)

@25 curious2: "First, in the eyes of at least someone, isn't EVERYONE 'masturbating to the wrong things'?"
(You're welcome.)


It may be that this thing was over for DWBAA some time ago, and she's ready for a new connection, but as a rule of thumb, it's not always the best idea to jump from one LTR into another "relationship". YMMV of course, but it wouldn't hurt to take a break and have a little solo time... especially at the tender age of 24.


Curious @25: Dadddy is also highly contemptuous where women dominating men are concerned. This concept upsets the "natural" order of his world, where women submit to men both in and out of the bedroom. Glad he's clarified his point downthread (@33) -- shame that same point couldn't have been made without the misogyny.

Donny @26: Yes, if these are in fact "make or break kinks," I agree with you. It's not clear from the letter whether this is the case, however. If these are kinks he mainly enjoys in his own private time, immediate disclosure is not necessary. At any rate, he can't go back in time, so "disclose sooner" is kind of useless advice for HAGO's current plight.


Again, what I don't get is the point about not being able to tell the difference between a good dom and someone who is just a controlling asshole. The exwife was obviously in the second category and it's not in the least confusing as there's no indication she was ever a dom- in fact the kink shaming suggests she was completely unwilling to be his dom at all or even accept that he has this kink. So she's not a bad dom or a dom who is also an asshole. She's just an asshole, plain and simple.


A follow up on my own comment @ 9
Subs should try just as hard to earn a dom’s trust, in terms of communication, boundaries, and the like.
There are also ways to hint your preferences while applying it to real life situations.

“Don’t worry dear, i will gladly do the dishes.”

“Oh, that amazing goal you scored earlier tonight, dribbling from half field through all the other team’s players. I’m so proud to be your lover. May i give you a relaxing foot rub?”


Ah, Daddy that makes more sense. If you are saying that a guy who is vulnerable and likes to be bossed around might have bad judgement in looking for a dom, that's understandable. His ex was not a dom- she was a controlling kink shamer. So my unqualified opinion would be that he might actually have more luck if he actually seeks a dom- she would be less likely to be a kink shamer and (I'd guess?) more likely to be able to compartmentalize her domination to the situations that he wants rather than just generally push him around?

Which is why I'm confused about this letter. Is he saying his kink is just to WATCH dom porn? Or is he actually interested in his current girlfriend being his dom in the sack? Because if it's the second, that's a bigger ask than the first, and surely he'd have some idea if she's interested or not based on the sex he's been having with her for the last three months.


@17 Harriet_by_the_Bulrushes: I know what I want: continued asexual singleness. I'm basically trying to protect what I already have. Nothing's broken. What's there to "fix"?
@29 & @30 fubar: Thank you. It's good to be here.
@31 Ghost of Sea Otter: So you're saying that if I don't land a man right fucking now, I should be turned into an animal? Okay----I'll gladly become a feline----preferably one of the big cats. I'll go down in history as the first musical lioness driving a classic Volkswagen. I really don't like Hugh Grant all that much.


@41: Dan and everyone: Please bear with Griz. At the risk of sounding like a drama queen, I'll offer the long and short: My pursuit of sustainable employment musically in the film and TV industry has been a steep uphill climb. A selfish, chauvinistic blood relative of mine, successful in the industry for half his life is proving once again just how shamefully unsupportive he truly is.


Griz, I don't come here to read about your personal issues.


@4: In summary, I believe the answer to my above posted questions, for me, is that after trying repeatedly in search of forming healthy, loving LTRs only to get hurt, abused, and disappointed, why should I be made to keep going after what clearly hasn't worked (read: the unrequited mismatch of Lucy and Schroeder in Peanuts)---and maybe work on myself, instead?


@43: Then you don't have to read 'em.


Back to Dan and this week's Savage Love: Fresh Starts.


@43: By the way, Miss Grossly Overpriced Private School, Dan's Savage Love letters and column are open to comments here. Mine, yours, or anyone else's. I'll quote Dan Savage: Don't like it? Don't read it. Have better advice? Write your own column.


In three months one’s whole life could be shared, as people open up to each other. And kinks, being important aspects of a person’s sexuality, need to be disclosed early. What’s the point of getting attached and after three months this is starting to happen, if it’s going to fizzle because one of them hid significant information that the other one is not ok with.
You seem to be a one trick pony Dadddy,
‘the woman did it.’ Boring.


@41 "So you're saying that if I don't land a man right fucking now, I should be turned into an animal?"

Uh...No, I'm not saying that at all. Have you seen the movie? In case you haven't, it's meant to be a dystopian horror/satire, not a prescription for how society should be run. As someone who's never found a partner and who resents societal pressure to stop being single ASAP, I related to it.


@49 Ghost of Sea Otter
That's a wonderfully positive take on The Lobster that makes me retroactively like it more. Personally I thought it was interesting but lousy; I've never understood why people love it, I found most of it unbearable. For me (as they say) 'it seemed like a long way to go' to satirize "societal pressure to stop being single ASAP".


Emma @37: I understand the point Dadddy was trying to make: This woman was dominEERing, not dominANT. HAGO and folks like him shouldn't confuse the two.

Emma @40: I don't understand what HAGO wants -- other than to not be kink-shamed -- either. Does he just want to be accepted, or does he want her to participate?
As I said upthread, if she's an SL fan there's a very high probability that he can just open a conversation with "so do you have any kinks?" and expect a positive conversation. It's a shame his ex damaged him to the point that he's afraid to just ask.

Griz @41: I too read the Lobster recommendation as the opposite of the way you interpreted it. Did you see the film? It is a biting satire on the pressures we face to find a "match." You'll come out of it laughing and glad you're single. I prescribe some deep breaths and a glass of red, red wine, stat -- sounds like you're having a really crappy day. Hugs!


Yes, obviously his last gf was not happy with his kinks. Did he also disclose them after she became attached, a sort of last minute add on.


@49 Ghost of Sea Otter: Okay. To be fair, I really haven't seen The Lobster. A dystopian horror satire? Is it anything like the late Leslie Neilson horror spoof, Dracula: Dead and Loving it ? Forgive me for being on the defensive. It sounds like you and I have much in common in our struggles with "societal pressure to stop being single ASAP". Sometimes I do wonder what it would be like to be a lioness, panther, or a cheetah.


If the gf reads SL, it means she’s read about all the different activities people get up to. Meaning she’s educated and tolerant. It can’t be assumed she’s ok with any or all of these activities in her partners.


performed by her partners.. not in.


@51 BiDanFan: Thanks so much for the virtual hugs---I needed that, and do plan on having some more red,red wine again, tonight, plus a long hot bath and a movie, keeping The Lobster, as Ghost of Sea Otter recommends. I won't go further here in this week's SL--I'll email you in more detail what is going on. It's probably a good thing that Griz and her Love Bug are going out of town soon for a few days.


Congrats in advance to this week's Lucky @69 winner!


@BiDanFan: Apologies in advance for my lengthy email to you. A lot at once is going on.
Thanks so much for the virtual hugs. Sending some with positrons, and VW beeps right back.


Lava @52: Good point. How, and when, did she find out about his kinks? Disclosing early would enable him to avoid controlling, kink-negative people. An excellent argument for being up front.

Hunter @57: "Had your morning rape today?"
Need I say more?
Not to mention your insistence that you know why women wear the clothes they wear and why they cut their hair short, more so than the multiple women offering their personal experiences. That's called mansplaining, by the way.
"Misogynist" isn't a slur, it's a description of one's behaviour. If you don't want to be called a misogynist, try not being disrespectful towards women.
(I quite like the way Dadddy is, belatedly, bending over backwards to avoid being thought of as a misogynist. Perhaps it's a persona that his female subs like, and he didn't realise it would go over like a lead balloon among women who aren't turned on by dominant male swagger. Dadddy, if this truly is an epiphany on your part, please do keep it up. We could use fewer genital wars in this forum.)


@41. Griz. There's nothing to fix. Your only problem is society's prejudice against aces--a problem shared, sadly, with others of a minority sexuality.


To my mind, the correct response to a person saying, 'I'm [x]' is 'yes', i.e. it's not to say, 'you're not x; you have a pathology in even thinking you might be x'. (Examples of 'x' could be 'a bottom', 'asexual', 'kinky'). On occasion, perhaps rare, there may be times when there's another question, 'what does it mean that you're x?'. 'What do you want?' can be a misleading (or leading) question, too, in that it can often seem convenient to a so-called 'deviant', someone of minority sexuality, to be like the majority (as we might suppose). Needless to say, I wasn't asking the question in this leading way.


@51. Bi. My impression was that HAGO would like his partner to participate, but after his last experience simply of being shamed, it may be in his mind too much for him to hope for. But maybe not? Fingers crossed for HAGO exploring getting mildly dommed!

@60. I dislike the whole comrades-in-genitals thing on here. To be clear, I approve of both a specifically womanist comrades-in-genitals opposition to Brett Kavanaugh, maybe just among cis women, and a universalist comrades-in-natural-right opposition, also--but on a message-boards, having broadly the same genitals (there's a spectrum, after all) would seem to me insufficient basis for supposing one thinks the same thing as another commentator, or that one forms a political constituency with them.


Lava@55 ~ I like "in" her partners better...


Must be disappointing for those women. Guess they just have to keep on lookin’.


Oh, what? You mean I wouldn’t stand a chance. My heart is breaking.
You’re a classic Dadddy.


CMD Wannabe @9, I'm finally responding to your comment. Yes, the sexual submission for my husband is strictly a bedroom play activity. It's in no way a 24/7 or lifestyle for us.

I should add, he very slowly and gently revealed just how submissive he is over a long time and I don't think he could even have articulated his desires when we started going out together 24 years ago (I was his first girlfriend and we've always been monogamous). So I find discussions about when to disclose hilarious - it was about 15 years in our case!

He uses Tumblr and I can see when he's on it (he only uses Tumblr for porn) and what he follows and likes. Sometimes it's pretty challenging for me because I'm much more vanilla but it gives me an opportunity to process it and think about how to incorporate this stuff without talking, and then go ahead and do that (maybe that sounds unhealthy but even after all this time we find it hard to talk about sex when it's not happening!). The most recent example would be me writing all over him ("slut" etc I'm sure you get the idea) before pegging him, which was actually huge fun. It's a pretty joyful thing. And very mild too, we're such amateurs.


BiDanFan: Thank you so much for your kind, supportive email. I'm ready to come back as a lioness or cheetah. GRRRL power! :)


@69 Ha ha! Who'da thunk?


In all fairness, another lucky commenter deserves this week's HUnsky Award.


@61 Harriet_by_the_Bulrushes: It's nice to know I'm an Ace at something.


Ms.Biz @ 68
I always got a good vibe from your writing. I think it’s great how your relationship keep growing, that you and hubby are capable to communicate on different levels and have such “mild, amateur” fun some others could only dream of.


@64: Funny. Someone who can't spell Daddy "correcting" a British spelling. Some folks can't accept an olive branch. Moving on.

Busy @68: Thanks for sharing your story. Glad you and your husband were able to grow kinkily together.

Griz @69: Congrats on the magic number, perhaps your luck has taken a turn! :)


@73. Griz. And why should you not be ace--that is, absolutely top-notch--at your musical scoring? :) Well done on your lucky number!

@68. busy_quilting. Very hot! Did you use paint?


time to dump this dude's column. It's so trite now.


Just checked your short trolling history. Apparently “not really” is your favorite comment regardless of the subject, and should probably apply to your own post.
In any case, you are welcome to start an advice column on your own. “Else Hate” is likely to be an appropriate name.
In the meantime continue to take advantage of those lefty librals who let you stay on this site in the name of inclusiveness and transparency.

Admittedly I love playing Simon Wiesenthal on occasion.


NOPE- " Is it OK to give myself permission to give up on partner-based climaxing?"
Why does she seem to rule out masturbating in front of him forever here? Does she not trust him? Not trust herself.. She might.. Fart?

HAGO - You say you've been dating this girl for 3 months but also that she's your girlfriend. When you agree to be non casual sexual partners, you should have an idea of how that will work... She needs to know if you want something undisclosed to be happy with your sex life. You should expect her to be reasonable about your private sex habits. If that is your only concern, please open up about your last partners bad behavior, to reassure yourself that you aren't wasting your time on another bad match.

Dwbaa- You would likely have no problem telling other friends about your new beau. He's not like your other friends. He's your ex. Y'all might be able to be friends, if you can stay in touch and stop missing the romance. You can't make him want to be friends, if it will happen it will take time. Would you want him to tell you if he were dating? Do you think he might need time or space to move on, you can talk to him about that.. If you think he's truly over you and feeling single.. I'd tell him I started dating a great guy, treat him like a friend, and see if he acts like a friend.

Men and women can show an inability to empathize with one another. Dadddy and Griz can overreact and get vulgar about it. Lava and sb50 allow for some gendered disrespect but are generally fair. I think BDF and Ricardo are really fair and don't seem to subscribe to many gender roles, maybe from rejecting heteronormativity?

I think most people fall in the middle camp. The first camp seems traumatized. The last camp is soothing to read.

I'm glad I didn't piss you off last week nocute. Best.


Sorry you don’t like my take on things Philo. To call it gender disrespect means what exactly.
We are not a bunch of school kids asking for comments in the yr book.


@75 BiDanFan: Many thanks. Things are looking up, and it's Friday to boot.
@76 Harriet_by_the_Bulrushes: Thank you, too. The field I am in is an extremely tough nut to crack--film and TV composition. But I have had some signs of interest in my latest work, and that's encouraging. My toughest obstacle is male chauvinism.
@77 orafice: Don't let the door hit you or aisforanna @43 in the butt on the way out.


@79 WTF, Philophile? You're not my mom. Me, vulgar? You ain't seen nothing yet, sugarlips---you've never even met me! I'll tell ya, though, I do get feisty when my back is up.


@79: How could I be pissed off, Phil, at someone who is trying to be nice to me? Even if I don't think someone's advice is going to work for me, I am grateful for the efforts to be helpful.
You and I don't always agree on behavior, but you have a good heart.


Hi Lava, I didn't mean to offend. I put myself in the middle camp too. I don't.. Think.. I come across as traumatized.. And I'm still trying hard not to apply my own ideas of men and women incorrectly to individuals etc. From the two of you I noticed that you seem to find cheating more forgivable if men do it, and verbal excoriation more forgivable from women.. Not that you came across as condoning it so much as excusing it.. And my impressions are not fact. Just.. anyone who talks about what "men" and "women" like is devaluing individual men and women. I probably find BDF and Ricardo soothing because they inspire me. But I like reading all the interaction here.. That's why I do it so much.

No Griz I'm not your mother and yes I've seen you a lot more vulgar! I'm sorry if I offended you!

And thanks nocute. I do try.


You don’t offend me Philo. Your opinion re my comments is not a great concern of mine.


It seems childish to create camps. If you have issue Philo with comments, say so at the time.


@84 Philophile: You didn't offend or piss me off, either. I only become vulgar when I'm really mad (and yes, I have at times over-reacted,spewing wildly) and / or offended. But usually that has to do with male chauvinists. This is among man reasons I am so happily single.


@84 Philophile: I am also premenopausal and started another cycle, which may explain my feistiness. I apologize to you, Ghost of Sea Otter and others, with the exceptions of @43 and @77 for being snippy this week.
@88: Oh, Jesus, there I go again with typos---and I haven't consumed any alcohol yet!
Make that: "This is among many reasons I am so happily single." Although, while I think about it, it actually kind of fits my situation better. Let's roll with it! Man reasons are why I'm so happily single! Griz thinks another movie night laden with red, red wine is in order.


I'm wondering if maybe Mr Amazing Moves is being a little too insistent about whatever mind-blowing thing he is doing with his tongue etc. Sometimes that leads to overstimulation, resulting in a hard plateau. The way to get around it is to back off a little every so often -- or to adopt a lighter touch.


Early congrats to this week's Lucky HUnsky Award (@100) winner!

In honor of bestselling novelist Stephen King, who just turned 71 today, I will be watching film adaptations of two of King's books, Carrie, and The Shining tonight. To prolong the occasion, I'm switching to comedy tomorrow, in honor of comedian / actor Bill Murray, who turned 68 today.


@31 Ghost of Sea Otter (and others making the suggestion): I apologize for being snippy earlier (see @89). I actually visited Everyday Music to see if they had The Lobster. It's not on the store shelves, but I could probably special order a DVD copy of it. BiDanFan says it's really funny in a dark way. I may want to still play conscientious objector and come back as a lioness or cheetah.


Harriet_by_the_bulrushes, thanks - no it wasn't paint it was lip pencil (an unloved one) but it went blunt really fast and I had to sharpen it again. Which was a bit of a pain. But paint sounds even less convenient!


Thank you for your kind words, Philo! Means a lot, particularly as you and I bumped heads in the past.


Someone really should organize a convention for the Savage Love Comments regulars.


@95 Hunter78: It might be worth noting that "misogynist" doesn't actually have to mean "hating women". The word covers other attitudes too.


Dadddy.. You are hearing an original angle.. You've made mistakes. You call the women on the thread unintelligent and neg, you conflate dominance with "primitive masculine signifiers" although your ideas about gender are personal and subjective.. And you drew ire because you DIDN'T say

Careful you don't go looking for dominance and end up with another asshole. Sometimes they can be hard to tell apart.

Or at least follow up about how you are into dominance but make sure you are not an asshole by (having highly developed communication around consent) (expertise detecting enthusiasm).

That way it wouldn't look like misogyny at all.

I think you are right that if you find yourself staying with a jerk, you might be a doormat, and vice versa. I don't think that only applies to bdsm gone bad though. I think everyone who gets lonely wants to feel well cared for. Some people have trouble asserting their own needs and go silent and some have trouble taking care of their own needs and get controlling.

Lava86, no thank you!
No need to apologize to me Griz! All I really wanted to say is that some men have been really hurt by relationships too that's why they sound crazy sometimes. I think you're great!
Yes BDF I don't dislike people because an attempt at communication failed! I can always improve!
Hun I'm sorry you don't consider the present rape culture dangerous enough for women. That's really your problem though, we're going to keep fighting jokers who act like enthusiasm or at least consent are optional.. because rape is so rarely prosecuted successfully, or because mostly women have to deal with it, or whatever other reason leads crappy guys to joke about what they can get from women sexually. It's harder for women to sexually assault an unaroused guy, so the crappy women just joke about money we can get etc. We're not really the better gender there's no such thing; better depends on the goal.


It's funny how misandry is never called out.


@92: Ha, no worries. I can see how you might have misunderstood. Hope you enjoy the movie.


@96 fubar: I think that's a great idea, but are you sure you want to meet a nut like me face to face in person? We'd need to establish a good meeting location that's doable for everyone interested in participating, though. Remember, LavaGirl is in Australia.
@98 Philophile: Thanks, Philo. I think you're pretty great, too. and
@99 Philophile: Misandry. I'm going to have to think about that one and get back to you.
@100 Ghost of Sea Otter: I'm going to stop by Everyday Music today and see if I can special order a DVD copy of The Lobster. Many thanks, and congratulations on scoring the well-deserved HUnsky Award for this week's SL: Fresh Starts!! May good fortune to shine upon you.


@100 Ghost of Sea Otter: An update: I inquired at Everyday Music, today, about special-ordering a DVD copy of The Lobster. They only have Blu-Ray editions available, sadly. The guy said to check back--maybe I could get a used DVD copy later. Should I just be a conscientious objector and become a lioness or cheetah?


@96: Plus, BiDanFan is in the UK. Not everyone is in the States.


@103 Griz: It sounds like the best compromise is Toronto, Canada which, purely coincidentally and very conveniently, is where I'm located :)


@104 fubar: DonnyKlicious is in Minnesota, and sb53 is in Ohio, so we have some Midwesterners among us. No chance of enticing anyone to come to Seattle?


@105 ~ "...enticing anyone to come to Seattle?..." Hopping the Empire Builder for a train ride through the Rockies is on my to-do list.


Hunter @95: "Counter-arguments are gladly accepted."

Bwahahahaha! Woman after woman offered up other reasons why she or other women she knows cut their hair and you refused to believe any of them. You literally scoffed at my example of "babies pulling at it" although that is the exact reason my mother cut her hair in her 30s, keeping it short and permed until her 50s when she decided to grow it out -- and it was thick and healthy. Nope, you were convinced that all the reasons offered were bullshit designed to deny the truth of your theory that women's hair thins or splits irreparably around age 40.

As Philo said @97: a misogynist is not just someone who hates women, it's someone who belittles and disrespects them, as you've done time and time again.

Fubar @104: Canada sounds great. Don't make me go to the US. Would the Seattleites trek north to Vancouver?

Griz @102: You can rent movies on YouTube these days. At least you can here in the UK, any Americans want to confirm?


Ms. Biz- Lipstick works even better.
Ever checked out this site?
Mostly femdom in the context of a committed het couple, from the mild to the not so.
Seems to be based on personal experiences, probably mixed with fantasies, and assumingly written by more than one person.
I found some of the literature to be quite inspiring.
“my husband my maid: tales of men as maids and the women they serve:
It's every woman's dream to have their very own maid at their beck and call, taking care of the chores as well as waiting on them hand and foot. The ladies in these stories are no exception, but rather than hiring help, they've trained their husbands to do the housework! Whether they wear frilly French maid's uniforms or just an apron while they work, these men have learnt how to wash, cook and clean as expected of a maid - all so their wives don't have to!”

SL commenters convention- I pitched the idea in the past and some told me they would rather maintain their anonymity after what they shared here about their private lives. I still think it will be fun, using one’s screen name only, though now I’m afraid some angry trolls will come and shoot us.
In any case, Seattle is the only destination for such gathering.

Hunter’s obsession with women’s hair- I think this was the first time he showed real passion about any of the issues discussed in here.


@106 DonnyKlicious: I could just as easily hop an Amtrak Cascades down to Seattle from Bellingham, and meet you and everyone interested at the King Street Station.
@107 BiDanFan: I know about YouTube--some of my own composed work is on it. Netflix is also available for renting movies. The guy at Everyday Music also recommended I try a place called Film is Truth, here locally to find a DVD copy of The Lobster.
@108 CMD: So you've suggested this before? Cool! And Seattle it is, then? Yaay! Would sometime next month work for you and everyone interested? I would hate to think that trolling idiots like Joey Gibson and his goon squad were still publicly malingering about, though, just to cause trouble.


How about a big shing dig in New Zealand.. great country with an amazing PM. You guys would love it. Peace away from mad brexit and crazy trump.


@111 LavaGirl: I'd love it--!!--New Zealand is one of many places I'd love to visit internationally. I'm presently job searching right now, though, and would have to save up to travel abroad. At least my passport, enhanced WA State driver's license, birth certificate, photo ID., etc. are up to date.
Yes--peace away from Mein Trumpfy would indeed, be wonderful. I am comforted to live on the opposite coast away in an infinitely saner Washington.
Going off topic, Lava, but I have one question: Did you ever get a successful download of my mp3 audio recordings of my latest orchestral work?

    Please wait...

    Comments are closed.

    Commenting on this item is available only to members of the site. You can sign in here or create an account here.

    Add a comment

    By posting this comment, you are agreeing to our Terms of Use.