Savage Love Jun 4, 2019 at 4:00 pm

Baby Soft

JOE NEWTON

Comments

119

Dadddy @109: "@ciods: The appeal for me is that a woman has offered her beautiful sexy face for me to come on." "Offered" seems to have been the wrong choice of word if you've asked.

121

"the expression of gratitude for not getting it in her eyes."

I'm quite kinky and yet I find this disturbing:

"My partner didn't non-consensually harm me! Let me express my gratitude!"

Do you think it's healthy to feel grateful one's partner was careful not to cause one harm during sex? Maybe in knife-throwing sex games, but otherwise, hmm.

122

I think I should clarify here that I am also not happy to go down on a woman who's having her period, nor would I be keen to position my face in the direct line of fire of a squirter. So there's no sexism to my don't-want-goo-on-my-face attitude.

By "gratitude" I think you, Dadddy, may mean relief. I continue to prefer to be grateful my partner didn't come in my eyes because he didn't come anywhere near my face.

124

Winkyface emoticon, Dadddy. ;) It's one of the few punctuation options we have left around here.

125

@68. Dadddy. Are AB/DLs very heavily straight men? The fetish would seem to be to involve giving up the kind of control that is more usually culturally associated with masculinity than femininity.

/break/
My experience with women is a sliver of that of many commenters, but I've had requests to be pissed on (from the very sex-positive women I know) and never as yet a request to be come over. The second could be an act more women do in relationships?

126

Harriet @125: The data I posted disagree; the longer term a relationship, the lower the preference for facials.

127

@82. Bi. In gay sex, often the top 'can't get there' during PIA with a condom. One option is for the condom to come off and for him to get a choice of receptacles and targets for emission. (There are many other options ;) ). When the top does finally come, in the mouth, over the face, anywhere, speaking personally I would say it's with a sense of delight, relief and achievement for both.

128

@92. ciods. Well, I can frame a conjecture, but it's not entirely serious--it would be shot down in flames as tendentious. The longer a relationship goes on--the theory goes--the more a woman expects to be impregnated by her partner. Non-condom sex going anywhere but her vag is exasperating--something her partner is doing for his benefit. The theory isn't entirely serious ... although I would think that the women for whom sex is hot partly because it's procreative would be under-represented on here.

Ah--I see Bi @100 has already offered this--as well as a variation on 'coming outside' being a relief for inability, which may be more vexatious or anxiogenic in the straight context than the gay.

129

Harriet @127: You could leave the word "gay" out and substitute the words "PIV" for "PIA" and "man" for "top" and your post would still be accurate. The only difference, as discussed in prior SL columns, is that gay men seem to view face as a valid option at far higher rates than straight/bi women, which is logical: There is no gendered baggage. A gay man can reciprocate a facial with his own, thereby re-establishing parity among the two partners. A woman cannot; she is perpetually in the receptacle role, which many view as demeaning. Certainly, women experience delight and relief when a partner who's taken a while manages to come. That still doesn't mean that all locations are created equal, as the poll data I linked show.

130

@126. Bi. I'm slowly catching up with you. SL is an absolutely excellent resort in being dip-in-and-out-able in my no-longer-senior work training new hires--who must not be bawled out for learning at their own pace! Like in life.

131

@129. Bi. I agree that there's no gendered baggage, in the sense that a man creaming over another guy's face doesn't have the overtones of 'demeaning' (either fantasy-'hot!' demeaning or actually intrusive and demeaning) it can have in the OS set-up. I'm not sure this is because there's always a premiss of reciprocity in gay settings. Often (almost always?) in my hookups, the roles of top and bottom, servicer and serviced, were established quickly, even if implicitly; and in these situations, being facialed is the part of the bottom. I would have come before--usually--or would come after in a less theatrically dominant way.

132

@122. Bi. Goo is good is goofy, I say. Sex is no place for circumspection.

133

Harriet @132: There's no 'spection in any direction if you get spooge in your eye! ;)

135

@82 1, I'm only talking about facials, and I'm directly saying that my belief is that men and women like them equally, once social barriers are removed. You don't have anything to add to that point.

And so... you're saying that orgasm gap is a myth? That most women are getting off before their male partners? Holy pretzel, you must be doing some INCREDIBLY advanced yoga to twist yourself into that position.

@92 we're programmed to want children - even if, intellectually, we don't want them. Women within a stable relationship likely have that instinct kicked into overdrive (I think this is behind the idea that men don't like using condoms, even if they dont want kids, our instincts appear invisible to us), so I wouldn't be surprised that coming inside someone would become more desired. (again, it's an instinct, not exactly a choice)

@94 Who cares if it comes from Porn? So does squirting - it came from porn, was considered mythological for like 20 years, and now it's celebrated and you can go to seminars to learn how to do it.

@102 Women will tease you for anything out of the ordinary. I'm not circumsized, which apparently everyone needs to talk about. I'd figure at my age, everyone I'm with has had enough dick to know that circumcision doesn't make a huge difference as to the motion in the ocean.
I believe I 'magically' find submissive women who are turned on be me telling them what to do and doing what pleases me (as I've noted before, I suspect this is because I'm both tall and relatively quiet, which gives me a "mysterious" vibe that has no basis in actual reality, but affects who is attracted to me). I have not been with a lot of women that I'd call "cum fetishists", but I've been with many women that like the idea of "being marked" in various ways - bruises on the butt from spanking or a facial (both, really) or wearing clothes that I give as gifts. I think it makes them feel especially desired, and perhaps as if my human nature has been turned off and I'm animalistic id (they also feel like "I did this to him, I must be excellent at sex" which seems fairly universal). FWIW, I suspect my enjoyment of facials comes from the same place - I interpret it as "they must especially desire me to allow this", and I like feeling desired.
W/R/T tits, heck no. I'm a nipple suckling fan but I am 100% not an eat-my-own cum fan. Coming on a girls tits is like coming on my Cheerios.

@129 why is the receptacle role demeaning in regards to sex? Socially, I can see it, but most sex is just two people in a room with no one else to judge. That would seem to indicate that PIV, probably the single most enjoyable activity known to humans as regarded by like, 90% of the population, is inherently demeaning? This is very close to "all sex is rape" theology.

136

Sporty @135: I'll add that it makes no sense to think that the person having the orgasm doesn't enjoy it more than the person not having the orgasm, for any given value of orgasm.

And no, I am not saying the orgasm gap, which I myself cited, is a myth. I am saying that women come two-thirds of the time, and sex is almost always finished when the man comes, so once more applying logic, most women are having orgasms before their male partners do. No yoga involved there.

And speaking of twisted logic, there is zero expectation that a man will lick the cum off my tits after he deposits it there. Are you licking your ladies' faces? Really??

I won't rise to the trolling involved in your final paragraph. I'll simply point you to your own statement that the attraction of coming on a woman's face is that she "must especially desire you," because otherwise she wouldn't do this unpleasant thing, right? Which shows that you indeed think of it as something that is inherently not pleasant for her. And I have said far more than I ever wanted to say on this tangent, good thing tomorrow is Wednesday.

137

Okay, I will rise to the trolling. I did not say a "receptacle role" is "inherently demeaning." I said "many view" it as demeaning; 26 percent, to be precise, from the same data I posted earlier. That's 26 percent of both genders, by the way. Which means your math is quite a bit off when you reckon 100% of women would be fine with this, which was my only point from the very beginning.

138

@135, programmed to want children, who by? Nature plants those seeds, before men do.
Facials do not involve ejulate, quit it with the euphemism. I’ve had facials, and beautiful creams are used.
Why do men want to ejulate on the face in the first place? What do they get out of it. Not that I care, It is a demeaning behaviour to me.

139

Oh is that the reason, it shows she desires you, greatly, because she’s prepared to have you squirt over her face. Right.

140

Lava @138, they've explained it. They want us to prove we really like them by letting them do this gross thing. And sorry but "facial" in a sexual context means cum on the face, just as "cum" means, well, you know. :)

142

It’s not a facial unless someone is rubbing the come into the face.. that’s what a facial is. Must words be bastardised.
I’m with you Fan, though knowing Dan and his cheeky sense of humour he’ll be giving us a face squirt letter any day now.

143

Fuck off hunter. You life must be so boring if stalking me gives you a trip. Grow the fuck up

144

Sorry hunter, life you know. You’re a good example of the shit ways of some men we women so often complain about. A woman rejects and the punishment is ongoing. Leave me the fuck alone. Ok.

145

Sporty if I say that a man almost always puts on his jock strap before he puts on his shorts, it does not logically follow that he wears a jock strap more often or even as often as he wears shorts. It simply means that in situations in which both appear, the jock strap almost always goes first.

And yes, we are all the common denominators in our own experiences- you attract certain kinds of women, you filter out certain kinds of women, there is no magic needed.

Ciods, thanks but again I'd assume at some point I'm just supposed to sit there and stare up at the dick right? Or am I supposed to be doing whatever I'm doing and then the guy tells me a second before the cum happens at which time I get my face in place at the ready? It's fine if people like this. It's not for me- I would just find it really stupid and awkward feeling.

The fact that porn popularizes things in general is not bad. I am disturbed by how many of the things popularized in porn focus on women doing things that are unpleasant or even painful to them but are pleasant for the man, and I'm disturbed by how much porn is about punishment or degradation. I don't think facials fall into any of these categories though. I do think there is a slight degradation element- sometimes but not always as others have illuminated- but again, as I said, that's not really why I don't care for them. The question about objectification (being a receptacle) is obvious- you can't build a firewall between things that happen in society and things that happen in the bedroom. Your question makes it sound like sexual attraction and sexual feelings can somehow be controlled with LOGIC - if something makes you feel a certain way then it just does, regardless of if it happens during sex or during private moments or out in public, etc. In fact for some people, it can feel even worse in private. So "why is the receptacle role demeaning in regards to sex?" is the wrong question to start with. No one is saying it is objectively demeaning. And if someone does find it demeaning, then no amount of logic is going to change their minds.

I don't give a fuck about the cum/come split- cum is a slang word anyway, seems pointless to complain about improper usage of slang words.

146

BTW in my post above, Ciods, just that paragraph was in response to you- the rest to the general thread above. Sorry I didn't put a break or indicate that.

148

@138 um, living things have an urge to procreate. Living things that don't have that urge do not survive pay a single generation. You think ancient humans, without language or writing and not even stone tool making skills thought "wow, life is hard. It's be easier if this person over here had a baby, diminishing her ability to footage or hunt for like a decade"?

We want kids like we want our heart to beat. Do they not teach evolution in your neck of the woods?

149

@136

because otherwise she wouldn't do this unpleasant thing, right?

You're reliable as a clock.

You might not understand this, but when you like someone a lot, it feels good to spend time, effort, and money on giving a good gift.

150

EmmaLiz @145: To be fair, "magically" was cheekiness on my part.

Sporty @135: Not sure why you think it's illogical to think that women usually come first during hetero sex. Both you and Dadddy have said that's how it usually happens during sex with you. Sorry dudes, but that's typical, you're not special.

And yes, Sporty @149, I am reliable. Don't ever claim that I contradict myself.
Feels good to spend time, effort, and money on giving a good gift? Sure it does. But if your partner wanted you to lick your cum off her tits, you wouldn't. Either we all have a right to hard limits or we don't. Looks like yours isn't too different from mine, is it? So is cum gross or isn't it? (Rhetorical question of course. It's in the eye of the beholder-- and hopefully it's in no one's eye.)

151

Listen here buster @148 it’s bush here not woods.
why can’t you use people’s names, not just their no? Too intimate for you is it.
I was saying that. You used the word programmed, and I thought you meant socially. Funny choice of word, it is usually associated with computers. We are not programmed. We have drives and instincts. And yes, there can be a strong drive to recreate, for some.

152

Come is not gross Fan, it’s a very special fluid. Just keep it off my face via a direct hit.

153

Lava @152: It's Sporty who thinks cum is gross. He wouldn't lick it off his partner's tits. Not even to show her how much he desires her. (I'm just being cheeky now. Sporty tends to have that effect on me.)

155

"I think you attack @Sportlandia and me because you find the idea of good dick threatening."

gross

156

I have a much stronger drive for recreation than procreation.

When women cum, they usually cum before the man. But that doesn't mean women always cum. Also I think it's great if both Sporty and Daddy (or any man really) have a pretty consistent experiences of their partners having orgasms, but I think it's also clear that for many women, the 'dick quality' really doesn't matter all that much- sometimes it's just our own bodies. I can orgasm with a door knob if need be. Other women here explain that it's rare to orgasm even with very pleasurable sex from attentive partners. Generally speaking, I think women need to learn how their bodies work (with the help of male partners or not) and everyone needs to focus more on the pleasure in the moments (mutual) and less on trying to achieve an end goal.

If it's a problem that men have their egos/masculine identities wrapped up in their sexual achievements, then you can't simultaneously act like it's their fault if their female partners don't cum or like it's nothing special if they do. What matters is attentiveness- in whatever form that takes with different people. Also orgasms are important, but focusing on them distracts from everything else. If I were only interested in orgasms, I could just get myself off with my vibrator- sex is more than that.

157

" I think it's also clear that for many women, the 'dick quality' really doesn't matter all that much"

Oops need to clarify here- I mean it doesn't matter that much to whether or not the woman has an orgasm (since some women's bodies really just work how they work and they either are or aren't going to orgasm by some method or another regardless). It obviously matters quite a bit to the overall sexual experience- pleasure is more than just orgasm, and yes, a good lover makes a world of difference to that.

158

Bi, when you lap up your own squirt, call me. But no, you think that's gross ergo you think vaginas are gross ie you are a misogynist. Wow that was easy, now I know what is like to think like you!

If my partner wanted me to lick my own jizz of her tits I'd almost certainly decline. If she was driven wild by it? I'd consider it. Doing something that drives for partner crazy is sexy even if the act itself doesn't do anything for you. But hey - I'm not cumming on anyone's face who says no, so I don't know where you're going with this.

159

Dadddy @154: Hahahaha. No, I find the idea of good dick wonderful, and know how fortunate I am to be getting it on a regular basis. I've had lots more dick than you've had, I think it's fair to say, and the majority of men I've been with have been keen to give me an orgasm or several. Perhaps I'm just weeding out (most of) the lousy shags, as Sporty weeds out the women who'd balk at a facial.

Sporty @158: Ring ring! I happily snog my partners right after they've gone down on me, which amounts to the same thing. You may know what it's like to troll me but you obviously have no idea what it's like to think like me.

Where I'm going, the only place I've ever been going, is to call you out on your not-so-humble bragging that had nothing to do with the letter at hand. "I'm not cumming on anyone's face who says no" -- so you now admit that -not- 100% of women say yes to this? Then my point is, FINALLY, made.

160

Chiming in late: I'm fine with coming on my face. Not many people have asked to make it a regular thing. It was particularly fun with one person who really liked it and was thrilled that I was up for it, and he made cleanup afterwards enjoyable too.
I won't keep my eyes open. If you get it in my eye then you lose face privileges, so be careful. Avoid getting it in my hair if I'm not already planning to shower after.
I don't find it degrading. If you want to play it as a whole degrading thing I might agree or I might not. Asking on a first date is fine, although I'd be put off if it was a degradation thing so early. (I'm not into degradation and wouldn't be initiating something like that myself.)
Least favorite place to come: inside my mouth.


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