Savage Love

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FISTS let me be the first to suggest, some people better live alone than with a roommate, even if it means smaller apt. or longer commute (you, or your roommate, or both).


@1 delta35: Congrats for making first post! Savor the glory. :)
Agreed, too, on your comment to FISTS.


FISTS left out the only relevant detail, which is, how many bathrooms???


I live in NYC with two roommates and one bathroom. (Getting my own place this fall, thank goodness.) One of my roommates takes 45-minute showers every night. Drives me up a wall. I know we all have things that make us happy or are part of our daily routine. But when you have roommates, ideally you're limiting your bathroom use to no more than 30 minutes at a time. I've often come home after a much delayed ride on the subway and had to wait about 40 minutes to pee.

Which is all to say, the fisting wouldn't be my issue. My issue is any roommate who has someone over every night after commandeering the bathroom for an hour. Would drive me nuts even if the visitors were friends and not strangers.


Roommate’s habits may seem excessive: daily activity that takes plenty of time to prepare and execute, hooking up with strangers to perform a an act that could be potentially damaging if not done the right way, possibly some dietary restrictions, avoiding other activities that life may offer after work hours. And yet it’s his decision in regards to the compulsiveness nature of his actions.
A friend might offer going out for a drink every now and then, a bike ride, or a show, initiating both hosting mutual friends for a holiday dinner or watching a movie or a game on TV.
Fisting 101 was not the question, though still educating and reassuring for those interested.

Penis-free Potentially Pegging Perplexed Partner should not feel perplexed or ashamed for not having one herself.
And by now she should have been made aware by the local authorities that there are also some strapons out there that also offer pleasure for peggers.

Looks like hubby is already appreciating her accommodation as it is, and may even increase it if and when she does indeed strap it on.
She should not feel obligated though, and just like last week’s case should be able to bring up the question, “What’s in it for me?”
Is there something SHE wants? Is hubby willing to accommodate HER desires?


As a veteran pegger, the harness does NOT cover one's vulva. The dildo sits against the mons and the straps go between the legs, leaving access to one's labia, clit and vagina. How would wearing a strap-on "change your body"? Wearing a bra or pants does not change your body. Nothing you wear changes your body, it's right there the whole time. Maybe PFD could try thinking about how great it is that she can be both the woman her husband desires and the man he desires. Practically, she is enjoying holding a dildo; why not try holding it against her mons to see how that feels? Then it's only one more small step to wearing a harness. She could also try a Feeldoe or other double-ended dildo, or a butterfly vibrator that stimulates her while she is pegging him. A thigh harness is a good idea too. She can also watch some pegging porn or check out Bend Over Boyfriend. Try fantasising that you are him and he is you and you have reversed your sexual roles, if that appeals.


BiDan beat me to it, PFD...


@2 thanks Griz. Hopefully I can get extra credit for working the word "first" into a sentence in the first response?

@4 I would think an emergency jar/urinal in your bedroom (or jar+female urinal "funnel" if you have a vulva) would be a necessary evil. Unless you have one of those many NYC apartments where you don't even have a bedroom to yourself.

When will mainstream democrats wake up and get that "the free market" will never provide affordable housing for the masses, even those earning in the top 10%? Marx and Engels got it almost 150yrs ago. In NYC you need 40x monthly income to rent an apartment. That means you can be in the 5% of income and not be able to afford a studio shoebox without a roommate. Other "blue" cities are as bad, SFO, SEA... maybe more appropriate for a comment on a Mudede blog than on a Savage blog...


Some nutrients are absorbed through the intestines, and I worry that having an enema EVERY DAY could lead to nutritional deficiencies. Dan, can your experts address this?


@8 Heck of a topic to bring up in post #2.

I think you're simplifying things a bit. A truly free market would provide affordable housing for the masses. There would always be a financial incentive to creating housing for people willing to pay. The issue would be the quality of that housing - the affordable would be more slummy. The quality of housing would reflect what you have to pay.

What we can't have in a free market is quality affordable housing. The rise of building codes and health codes means that we're providing a quality filter to housing. This adds cost and takes us out of a free market (little in the US actually is or would be a good free market incidentally, no matter what Republicans wish). We have less affordable housing because there's a fixed cost of each housing unit due to quality standards - this prices things out of low income ranges. That's why the solution is for the same government that applies health and building codes to provide financial incentives and legal mandates for affordable housing.

The real issue is that most people agree on the need for housing and building codes. Those codes have gotten more and more complicated over the years, adding costs to construction (and I'd argue that we have gone too far on them, anyone who has redone a house knows that much of the code feels arbitrary and excessive). At the same time, many of these same people are resistant to government programs about affordable housing. We stick to free market-ish solutions like incentives to builders instead of strict quotas and government programs to build non-high-rise affordable housing without time limits for affordable rent. That's not a Republican thing either - Democrats are often just as wary about bringing affordable housing into their neighborhoods. People's beliefs often fade when they perceive danger to their own wealth and family.

Its of course way more complicated than that.


Full disclosure -- I'm a Libertarian.

That said, the issue isn't the cost of housing, the issue is that none of us has gotten a REAL raise in decades. Housing costs have gone up and up, and we're still making the same $$$.
My daughter just started her first professional job making a salary that's maybe 25% higher than I made 35 years ago. It's CRAZY. I don't want to hear about $15/hr, I want to know how someone is going to fix tax codes to make corporations cough over some cash.

Back to housing. The issue you're describing is largely confined to Manhattan, Seattle and San Francisco, and mostly due to the supply of actual LAND. You're seeing more and more corporations realize that they're going to have create additional hubs (Google, Amazon, etc.), as well as be more flexible with where people live v. "office".


LW2 (PFD), I promise you won't be transforming your body, which is perfect exactly as it is. The strap-on is just a removable appendage (although, in time, you might like to think of it as more). For me, it was like my superhero's cape -- still me, just with extra powers. If you're already enjoying anal play (yay!), I can strongly recommend pegging. The closeness and the air of dominance can be (were for me) massive turn-ons, and the feel of a bit of heft against your mons -- as BiDanFan @6 so asutuely points out -- really pleasurable. Go mad. I'm rooting for you.


Dadddy @13, what again are the alternatives to the massive eye rolls or arguments your posts always seem to provoke? Seriously, no one could possibly be stupid enough to think I meant that putting on a strap-on would literally turn her into a man. If I have to spell it out for you, it will allow her to role play being a man. Which she may or may not enjoy, hence the word "maybe."

You seem very threatened by anyone suggesting sex a different way than the one you like. I wonder why that is?


About strap-ons: I have very limited experience receiving one and no experience giving one, but I found it remarkably similar to the real thing. Since it was given by a man who was accustomed to fucking but now has ED, the motion may have been more realistic than it would be coming from a woman.

I have always wondered about the motivation for the strap-on top. A man with a hard cock is compelled to continue fucking by the sensations he receives. Part of enjoying bottoming is knowing that the top is compelled. I would think that a strap-on that is designed to give a top woman pleasure would be a good idea. She would be pegging the man not just because he wanted it, but because it feels good to her.


NotYourMom @4. Forty five minute showers! Obviously not on tank water in that place. I panic if anyone is in there for more than four minutes. Just had to buy water, Aus $205 for 12,000 litres.


"My husband of nearly 20 years came out to me as bisexual about two months ago. He assured me he has no intention of looking outside our marriage for other sex partners."

Life is long. You have a solid bond together. I would encourage you both to keep an open mind about non-monogamy.

My husband told me about his interest in men after we had already agreed to open the marriage. So it's not your situation. And yet.

You read Dan, so you probably know about being monogamish. Maybe that would work for you, where you bring in a bisexual male guest star, who connects sexually with both of you.

There are many options, and there's no rush. I would just add reading & thinking about ethical non-monogamy to the reading and thinking you're doing about anal play.


Also seconding CMDwannabe @5 when he encourages PFD to think about whether there is something SHE wants in bed.


6 Some harnesses do cover the vulva. As to assuming the male wants her to be "the man he desires," that's very simplistic and binary-rigid and can be off the mark. There's a whole range of gray in there, with gradations of kink, genderfuck, roleplay, etc. But it is easy if emotionally vulnerable, feeling insecure or just not thinking creatively, for that gender assumption to lead to feeling she's not what he wants. Not at all necessarily true: very possible he just wants to be fucked, by his love partner, regardless gender. More communication and receptivity (no pun intended) would help, on both sides.

15 There are lots of strapon apparati and accessories on the market that do indeed give plenty of direct and indirect stimulus to the strap wearer for their enjoyment.


PFD said “I don't understand why this feels so different and difficult.” Maybe it’s this: When she’s using a dildo in her hand she’s using an implement like any other - e.g. a garden trowel or a toilet plunger. But wearing a strap on is playing the role of someone she isn’t and doesn’t desire to be, which is male. And as an imitation male, she may fear not measuring up to hubby’s longing for the real thing. So, yeah, of course it feels different and more difficult.


“My roommate is a very attractive guy who doesn't think he's attractive at all. I've talked to him a few times about whether he's being sexually compulsive . . . .”

FISTS seems to be making a huge logical leap in his thinking. One wonders why.

Lost in his letter and @Dan’s response is the fact that FISTS used to be the lover of his roommate, but now has to watch a parade of strangers fuck the man whom he finds very sexually attractive. I wonder whether FISTS’ concern is motivated by his close proximity to a man he used to fuck, but cannot now, yet for whom he is still sexually attracted.


[He mentioned that he'd like me to peg him using a strap-on. I mean, of course he would, right?]

"Of course he would"? Why "of course"? There are all kinds of ways to be bisexual. A plurality of bi men with whom I interacted when I was socially active were total tops with all their partners, and about half of that plurality wanted only one-way service. I'm surprised Ms Fan didn't pick up on that; it seems a bit reductionist, though LW can plead unfamiliarity for the time being.

Ms Erica - Thank you for raising another point in the OS/SS divide in that your suggestion could not apply to a BG or BL couple as it can to a BS one (although LW didn't specify, the letter certainly invited that inference). I'm curious; what would you have said to a female writer of essentially the same letter with a bisexual wife?


I was thinking like @20 rockyboy and @21 Whirled without end. The discomfort of wearing vs holding the dildo might be that it makes her feel like she is just a stand-in for a guy rather than it being her using a tool. She should try to realize that the info about her husband being bi is still really new to her and if she is feeling insecure that is completely reasonable. She should acknowledge any insecurity to herself and if she needs reassuring let her husband know.

It also might help to remind herself this was just info her husband was sharing about what type of person he can be attracted to. Like if she told him she can be attracted to short guys when he thought she was only ever into tall guys. It's not like he wants "one guy one girl" and is trying to make her a stand-in for what he wishes he could have. He just gave her more info about who he has the capability to be attracted to. That disclosure opened up their lines of communication around sex which led to him being able to tell her one of the acts he would like to do - with her.


I think it's the gender swap feel that the LW isn't into. Feeling like an inferior inadequate copy, a halfway measure, on the way to what? I think most of us would find it fun in the abstract to wear a cock, it's this specific situation that's upsetting her.
We're also all familiar w dildos/vibes used on ourselves, it's easy to understand the appeal. Being pegged adds another element, it's that other element that's upsetting her. The idea of the pretend man.
Maybe just wear the thing around by yourself until it's not upsetting you? In a non-sexual context? Just to defang it? Maybe get something decidedly non-dickish looking? A little silly?


Mr. Venn @24 - I would give the same advice to a female writer married to a gold-star lesbian who had just turned out to be bisexual.

"Life is long. You have a solid bond together. I would encourage you both to keep an open mind about non-monogamy."

It's true that the threesome idea wouldn't work the same way. Maybe swapping with a straight couple where the wife is bi?


I second the advice to try different things with the dildo first before worrying about it on: a variety of sexual positions while it's in your hand and then his hand, holding it against your hip or thigh or mons pubis, attached to the floor or wall if it has a strong suction cup, taking turns holding still while the other person is in charge of motion, etc.


Dadddy @19: Ahahahaha! No, I didn't misstate my point, but thanks for the laugh. You can admit you've misread something without losing YOUR shit. Like you did with the man on the weekly roundup who suggested reading erotica as a means for inexperienced young guys to educate themselves about what women like in bed. This was a great idea, but since you hadn't thought of it, somehow it too was a threat to your masculinity and you reacted angrily to that as well. Other people can be good lovers without that destroying your whole self-esteem, you know.

I think my point is, her fear is "I can't be what he wants," but she could try looking at it the other way -- with the strap-on, she CAN be what he wants, and what he wants is sometimes to fuck and sometimes to be fucked. If her fear is that once he's experienced this he won't want to fuck her, won't want her female body, her fears are unfounded. Bi includes attracted to women! Also, newly out, he may be looking to tick a box -- this may or may not become part of their regular sex life. He should respect her wanting to take her time.

Venn @24: Great catch on the "of course." Not all queer men like receiving anal; not all men who like receiving anal are queer; not all men who like a dildo in the ass want to be fucked. Perhaps PFD should uncouple his wanting to experience pegging from his sexual orientation, then she could get past these feelings of inadequacy that are stopping her from taking this step. Another suggestion, as Ms No @26 says, might be to use a less realistic dildo, if "hey! I have a toy!" is less threatening to her than "hey! I have a 'dick'!" (Easier for you to understand with quotation marks, Dadddy?)


Re FISTS: I would be concerned about anyone I cared about doing anything to the point of neglecting other areas of their lives, whether it be fisting, work (if it wasn't necessary), computer games, exercise, whatever. Like @ 9 coryleah cleaning out every day sounds unhealthy to me. Perhaps do some research about how often is healthy. My approach would be to first come from the angle of someone who cares. Perhaps suggest roommate think about what he wants to get out of these interactions and suggest he might cut down on them so he can lead a more balanced life. Everything in moderation.

If roommate chooses not to do these things, since that is his choice, then I would come at it as a roommate. As far as all the strangers maybe have roommate sometimes go to other guys' places or get a hotel. The hotel and eating a specialized diet would both help with the bathroom issue. If the only concern about the shower is the bill, then maybe figure out how much the water bill has gone up since roommate started these daily cleanings and have him pay the difference.


@22 (SublimeA)
Ding-Ding-Ding. We have a winner. In my hurry to read the column, I'd skipped right over the FWB part. Then I remembered a high school class during which my friends and I presented psychological coping mechanisms. I was in charge of rationalization and sour grapes. LW tries to pretend that it was a mutual decision not to continue to have sex when the roommate moved in - but I believe he's trying to save face, even in front of virtual "Strangers".

He "did" want and hope to have easy access to hookups, but the new roommie turned him down. So he rationalizes and pulls out the concern card. Too many randos (365! really!), fisting only, with the bathroom hogging on top! Um ... FISTS, why are YOU home 365 nights a year? Don't YOU have any friends or sexual partners? And how did you know about the previous year's exclusive fisting activities when you didn't have him as a roommate?

Anyway, if FISTS wants to enjoy equitable access to all of his apartment's amenities, he must state that up front when offering space to a prospective roommate. House rules, as it were. FISTS says his roommate exhibits low self-esteem, but his isn't any better if he won't stand up for his own enjoyment in what was originally his private space! Time to ask the roommie to leave and seek a new one under fewer false pretences. There's a nuanced DMZ between living like strangers with no consideration for one another and behaving like BFFs or insta-FBs.


Joe, you are a cheeky and subversive artist.


I actually see Dadddy's point. He can be both a troll and shitty sometimes and still have a point, they are not mutually exclusive.

I think the idea of "being the man he desires" is exactly what scares her. She views physically strapping a dick onto her body as becoming in the form "male"-- whereas the use of a dildo and toys is just the use of toys and tools. So to suggest becoming or enjoying becoming the man he desires is potentially uncomfortable for her at this stage--- if you follow her logic out which is:

a dildo is a okay because its a toy/tool
a dick strapped on makes her feel like she is not herself/her own body/ not female-- thus pretending to be male
the idea of pretending to be male makes her feel scared and vulnerable because she worries her body is not enough for him and he wishes she had a real dick/was a dude.

This can all be NOT what her husband is thinking, but it's a relatively common and easy to follow train of logic particularly in female partners of bisexual men. So at this time, it is probably not particularly helpful for her to think she can be "the man he desires" because it plays into exactly the idea that she might be, in fact, playing at being a man. There is nothing wrong with that per se, but I think it pretty clearly is the specific part that makes her uncomfortable. There was a letter several months ago on a similar topic- a wife who's husband and her frequently pegged, but then husband started asking her to bind her breasts and stuff, and she was getting really uncomfortable and feeling like she was a prop for a man rather than a wife who was pegging her husband. This is a reasonable discomfort.

I also think the comment train re "of course he would"---re pegging has gotten a little abstract and unhelpful too. The LW SPECIFICALLY says "of course he would" not in relation to the act of being fucked per se, but she says - of course he would want to feel my body directly against his etc-- it's a comment about physical closeness, not that all bi men want to be fucked.--- she is also not speaking for all gay/bi men, nor is she trying to-- she's speaking for her husband-- who she knows this about. It's not like she's being broad and overstating of a whole sexuality.

As such, I think LW you're just gonna have to talk talk talk this one to death if you want to fulfill your husbands desires and be comfortable. Dan is right that you don't have to do anything, but that's not the problem, is it? The problem is you're nervous and scared but you also WANT to do this for your husband, so you're trying to reconcile those sides. I'm gauging by your letter that you want help understanding and feeling comforted by the fact that your husband is not trying to have you be a stand in for a man/change your body etc. The best person to do this is him. Ask him if he's into pegging porn, maybe watch some together? It'll help you realize it isn't a stand in for gay sex/a male body. Ask him what he finds hot about pegging in particular. Ask him if he enjoys watching your tits bounce while you fuck him, things that remind you both that you've got a beautiful woman's body who's also able to fuck her husband.

And then just talk talk talk, and eventually it will get better. It's totally okay to have these fears though-- and I think Dan's comments about lesbians should be a great comfort to you. Surely you know there is no way that lesbians using strap-ons are imagining that their partner's are dudes? The same is/can be true of your husband. Eventually (or maybe you already have?) you can get into helping him enjoy his enjoyment of men (maybe separately from you first)-- watch gay porn with him and dirty talk through a scene of watching him fuck/be fucked/ sucked whatever. But first you can do these things separately, so it doesn't feel like dangerous overlap of you feeling like a stand in. Good luck.


@33: qapla, that was by far the best, most sensitive and thoughtful, comprehensive response to the letter. There should be a "mic drop" icon we can insert, because this should be the final word; I hope Dan runs the entirety of your comment in the Reader Response Roundup.


Is it still ok to discuss the other letter?


@35: Yes, I grant that request. You may continue to discuss the other letter.
Carry on.




@37: You are most welcome!


@6. Bi. Excellent answer. What was all that 'strap it on your thigh' stuff? As someone who likes to be pegged and bottoms with men, I like the feel of a woman's body lying on me. It doesn't feel like a cis gay man. Being topped by a woman this way IS an experience, for me, of a woman's body.

The part of the other letter that is a blast from the past is the spending an hour in the bathroom. This is the timesink activity for bottoms--maybe the equivalent of online dating for straight men. There was a compulsive, and unhealthy, aspect in my douching so obsessively, beyond the point I was clean, that 'acted out' doubts about the propriety or 'rightness' of what I was doing. Anyone trying to shrink their dick enough to tuck, as I was, is also likely to spend too long in the shower.

Thank God Dan said (to the effect), 'you don't make a fist'.


@15. vab. The motivation for the strap-on top? That's a strange question. He or she is enjoying it. And your saying the natural top is 'compelled' to go on having sex to receive sensation is also odd. It isn't always pleasurable to have a hard-on during sex. It can become tiring, or a trial--in which case, one either stops or tries to go through with it to give one's partner an orgasm.


@22. Sublime. I think the two roommates have different tastes and are happy in their tastes. I didn't have the sense the lw still wanted to fuck the shower-er.


Nocute @ 34 - Maybe not the first paragraph. We don't want Dadddy to be too full of himself, do we?


Ms Qapla - Your interpretation is possible, but the letter is way too much of a muddle. And, whether she's inquiring for confirmation of an idea that all bi men want to be penetrated or that all men being pegged by a loving partner would prefer a strap-on to a dildo, it's clear that she is asking Mr Savage for universalities that don't exist instead of reporting reasons given her by her husband.

As I want to stay in my lane, I'll ask Ms Fan whether she sensed that LW just wanted the bi door to be closed as quickly as possible.


Ms Erica - One thing I see fairly often in other venues, usually floated by young(ish) women, is that everybody should be totally fine with having a bisexual partner, usually supported by a sentence like, "I'm bi, and now that I'm out to my husband/boyfriend, we go looking at pretty women together and it's a bond between us!" with an air of total oblivion to the fact that such an advantage only works for OS couples. Not that I grudge such an advantage; I'm more than content with the advantages that accrue on the SS side of the divide. It's just galling to be erased in the determination to have bisexuality proclaimed a Universal Plus.


PFD: A can confirm, you are in fact a woman.


@33. Qapla & @42. Ricardo. That was the bit I liked. Dadddy had a good point. The LW's reluctance to don the strap-on comes from her not wanting to be a second-best man. (The subsequent 'who was wrong first?' discussion between Bi and Dadddy maybe only spoke to their previous history).

The LW can reasonably fear that her husband wishes she were a man, that she (at least sometimes) had a male body. It's not likely that she'll take well to simulating a male body in these circumstances. He's been with her happily in sexual terms--one supposes--for 20 years, so they don't seem to suffer from an incompatibility of bodies in that sense. Even so, there has been that question of something unresolved or undisclosed that's troubled her, which has only now been clarified with the revelation of his bisexuality; again, her head is in a place where she easily believes that there's been something else he wanted instead of her, rather (perhaps) than something as well as her.

I don't think she should be in any rush to peg him. How does she feel about his actually sleeping with men?


@44. Venn. She's OK thinking something like 'his prostate likes this'. But not so much 'he wants to do it with a male body' or 'he'd prefer it if I were a man'.


@43 Venn - my sense for why some of the letter was muddled was that she is having trouble admitting, even to herself, that her husband's disclosure has made her worried about his satisfaction with their relationship. It seemed to me - perhaps out of a fear of being judgemental or out of insecurity - she is trying really hard to mentally push aside anything that isn't part of her being the cool, understanding and accepting wife.

I think that is part of where the "of course" comment came from. That's how she's been approaching her husband, "yeah, I totally get it, of course you'd want do x that you want to do!". She doesn't want to admit to him or to herself that she has feelings that don't include being the "fun wife who gets it" at a time when she's insecure about the relationship.


I think the people saying the lw is deflecting his desire for the showerer are all straight. It's the default understanding in gay male life that you're not a perfect sexual match for your friend(s). Yes, you're both gay; yes, you like each other personally and gave sex a go--but your tastes and kinks don't really align. It's no biggie. This is one of the sources of the solidarity of gay scenes--to a degree, you all like something a bit different. It also underlies the familiar post-Stonewall (and ongoing) valuation of friendship over fucking; and explains why gay couples can make it work when the partners are of very different cultural, educational, class etc. backgrounds--they're a rare match when it comes to sex.

The lw is put out by the troupe of guys traipsing through the flat and the water bill. He has some slight distaste-shaded concern for the incidence of his roomie's fisting.


M?? Harriet - Please don't. You really ought to change your first name to Emma.


The LW’s house mate is being inconsiderate, using all that water and having different strangers every day coming thru his home. It’s nought to do with orientation and all to do with living with compatible and thoughtful people.


@23: And the entire Trump regime is hopeless.


@8 delta35: You get a gold star (Thank you, BiDanFan, for initiating Gold Stars!) for cleverly fitting the word first into your first post. Bravo!


One of my favorite sexual memories involved a double-dong. It wasn't so much the penetration (although that too), it was the deep intimacy between us, and the delicious feeling of legs against mine. I've never considered this as bisexual behavior, FWIW. Just pleasure.


Qapla @33, other commenters (rockyboy @20, whirled @21, Kitten@25) observed that "perhaps she doesn't like the idea of role-playing a man," which indeed is a good point, without pretending to have "misunderstood" my suggestion. Dadddy just chose to troll, meaning that his attempt to make that point was squandered. Thanks also for the alternative interpretation of "of course he would."
How to enjoy pegging -without- the genderfuck aspect is not my area of expertise, because it's the genderfuck aspect that I enjoy. But I have spoken to people about this who were surprised that I saw a genderfuck aspect in pegging; to them, it is about BDSM (which surprised -me- the first time it was mentioned). An alternative mindset could be to see it as D/s, if (see, everyone, I wrote the word "if") that's something that appeals to her. Add a strap-on over a latex catsuit and she will not feel the least bit male. (And if your husband is in fact still closing his eyes and thinking about Ryan Russell, PFD will be none the wiser.)

Harriet @39, thanks. Many penis havers in this column have pointed out that a strap-on does not feel exactly like a penis. We don't know whether PFD, before he married, experienced a penis to know the difference, but the idea that there is one may be a comfort to PFD. (However, I do think the idea of a thigh harness was a good intermediate step.)

Harriet @40, can confirm. Wearing a strap-on is a huge, huge turn-on; the wearer is enjoying either the gender fuck or the dominant aspect (or both), or simply turned on by the enjoyment of their bottom. And remember what I said upthread about the straps going between one's legs? This causes friction against the labia. One can also "feel" their partner's resistance. I have had orgasms while pegging. As Harriet says, a sexual activity does not have to be directly orgasm-inducing to be enjoyable; Vab, do you enjoy going down on your partner? Do you enjoy receiving oral sex despite knowing your partner is not "compelled by a hard cock" to give it? Our minds compel us sexually, not just our genitals.

Venn @43, in order to avoid answering the wrong question, I'll have to ask you to clarify what you meant by "wanted the bi door to be closed as quickly as possible." The sense I got from the letter is that his coming out has overall been a good thing; it has improved communication and their sex life. I sensed she's glad he doesn't want to open the relationship, and she's enjoying the anal play generally, but needs a bit more than two months to get to a point where she is comfortable enough to play what is, in her mind, a male role. So I guess the answer is no, she does not want to put her husband back into the closet, if that's what you meant.

Venn @44, I agree that there is no corresponding ogling or group-sex advantages to SS couples having one bi partner, but I don't see how proclamations like "I'm bi, and now that I'm out to my husband/boyfriend, we go looking at pretty women together and it's a bond between us!" are MEANT to be universal -- the fictitious person you're quoting is talking about HER OWN relationship. I would note that gay SS couples ALREADY enjoy the advantage this fictitious person is describing -- ie, two gay men (or a gay and bi man) can go looking at hot men together and that's a bond between them. Right? It's just both-straight couples who are left out of this experience, and who therefore benefit if one or both comes out as bi.

Thanks for that, Marty @55.


@56, of course a catsuit will not help if he wants to feel her flesh against his, but she could wear a PVC bra and pants to get the same effect with the exposed flesh.


@57, "pants" as in panties, ie the British usage.


Fisting bottoms could gain society’s goodwill by helping out in Alaska during the Iditarod. Frostbite? No need to cut open any dogs.




@51. venn. There is one Emma already, and that's enough for any message board. 'Don't' do what? Are you saying you see me as Emma Woodhouse? Hmm.


@56. Bi. I'm not sure a strap-on feels much like a biocock at all.... My introduction to getting pegged was playing with a married couple. The man was bi and had been the moving force behind broadening the couple's sexual repertoire. (I had had sex with him before I met her). She wanted to peg someone else, and he wanted to show off her topping skills. My sense was that their understanding of what they were doing was some form of kink, or maybe switchy D/s. To me, it was just play, getting up to stuff, hanging out together.

The point of this is to say that consciously messing around with gender identity isn't necessarily the motivation for pegging, as you confirm. I am a lifelong voracious bottom--likely to say yes to anything hot and safe, and not caring too much whether it's 'genderfuck' or not.

And a masc-of-center lesbian topping me ... is that genderfuck or not? Both of us are acting out the gender we feel we are.


It is true that Dady's /initial/ post @13 was not a troll.

However, take a look at his very next post @19 erroneously mis-stating (one of the hallmarks of the common troll) that BDF had "misstated [her] point" (FYI @6 since he didn't do us the favor of specifying where)...

Whereas @14 she had explained that he had also taken her absurdly literally (another tool of trollery). She did end @14 with a sharp question, but I contend that she only did the least he had coming for the games he had just played with her.


Of course it could be worse, it could have been the unprovoked racist attack Sportlandia hit her with a couple months back, that has had me speechless until today. And feeling guilty, because while it was unprovoked by her, I had just wound him up. Sorry. I didn't mean to, but I did, probably not coincidentally because of a pattern of him calling me names. (Oh, and playing similar games to the ones I pointed out above by Dady.)


@65 p.s.
I know that was confusing, but that's part of the problem with trolls. They twist everything so much that everyone who isn't involved enough to be infuriated by it hasn't paid enough attention to know who to believe. So they don't know it's bullshit when they slither up and ask us to "judge me by what I actually write rather than based on her straw men". Don't believe the tripe.


Whether your husband is bi or straight, he says he doesn’t want to open the relationship, take his word for it LW. If you are not comfortable pegging him then don’t do it.
His bi ness has nothing to do with wanting to be pegged, it’s about pleasure. You are using a sex toy on him already, a non flesh object, how is pegging that much different, except in your head.
You are not a substitute for anyone, and with that vibe around perhaps it is best you decline pegging him at this time.


Sometimes I wonder if we applied the same norms to sex or drug use to other activities that (to me anyway) seem just as indicative of a problem.

"I think my room mate has a problem with self esteem since he comes home from work every day and binge watches television for three hours / wastes time online / eats fast food / plays video games"

As if we should all be spending our spare time learning fourth languages and appreciating poetry and donating our bone marrow and perfecting our arabesque.


It depends what people do in their down time, EL. Listening to music and smoking a joint is my recovery strategy, reading is my passion. Mostly Art books and biographies. My life has been so mundane, having several million children will tether one, I love reading about how others lived their lives. Especially Artists and Writers. Music, what a life saver. I fall in love with all these males via their voices.




Patti Smith is coming to Seattle. You lucky people. I’ve been reading a memoir about different Artists this wonderful woman knew, and one of them made a statue for Seattle. Hopefully it’s still there, this book is from the 90’s. Beautiful piece. Wish I could beam myself over there sometimes.


Dadddy @64, come on. You may be many things, but we both know you are not stupid. You can't possibly claim you genuinely thought I was asserting that wearing a strap-on would turn PFD into a man. Therefore I wasn't "contradicting myself" by initially saying it wouldn't. Either your masculinity is extremely fragile or you were, once again, "smarting off at the nuns," knowing full well that I couldn't have meant such a thing -- because we both know I'm not stupid either. You try to blame me for this friction between us when you're the one who provokes it, and I'm glad other commenters can see that. Smarting off at the nuns gets your fingers rapped -- again, I'm speaking metaphorically -- don't you get that by now?

Curious @65, thanks for your support. And congrats on the magic number, Lava @69.


@64 Np. It was plain as day what happened. BDF is the meanest, dirtiest arguer on this forum. And she's got her bully fangirls to support her. There's no winning. There is only rolling around in the mud and getting filthy. Best to just leave her be.


Oh philosopy school drop out @73; whose got their panties in a twist.


‘Bully Fangirls’? Grow up you dip stick, adult women inhabit these threads. If you’re not up to it, move on along.


I cop to being a FanGirl though. Love you Fan. Why do you even bite when he comes calling? I just ignore him now. Troll or not, he’s got a lot still to learn.


You’re 48 Fan, woman, I’ve known you for yrs. yes. I’m just about to hit double your number.
It’s a little confronting.


NoNo. Not double your number. Your number plus twenty. Math was never my strength. Along with the rest.


And if you DID think I was asserting that wearing a strap-on would turn PFD into a man, you owe me an apology for insulting my intelligence. Instead you attempted to gaslight me by claiming I was unclear. That is what you actually wrote, no straw men here. And then you continue to make things my fault by characterising my understandable annoyance at these insults as "rage." No one's falling for it, Dadddy. If you're so bored then please stop.


Thanks to you too, Lava @76. I do try to roll and scroll unless Dadddy addresses me directly, which he did this time.
I'd kind of like to get the honorific Philosophy @73 bestowed on a T-shirt. Bad, bad Leroy Brown, dirtiest arguer on the whole damn forum. It was plain as day to me what happened, too -- Dadddy picked a fight. As if I wouldn't defend myself. At least Philo knows me better than that. Anyway, shutting up now. Another week is around the corner and I'll play nice if others do.


This is like Bill Clinton's 'it depends on what the meaning of 'is' is'. It turns on the sense of 'be' in 'she can 'be' ... the man he desires'. Bi is right insofar as the 'be' was like e.g. 'at our daughter's sixth birthday party, she's going to be a fireman'; it only conceivably meant 'roleplay'. Dadddy is right insofar as he made the good point that the lw's whole problem was impersonating a man while fucking.

I prefer to think as both right rather than both wrong.

Meanwhile Lava has come up with workable advice.


@80 BiDanDan
"... addresses me directly..."

I find it much more difficult to resist when I'm addressed directly.


"...BDF is the meanest, dirtiest arguer on this forum..."

What? Far from it...While she doesn't shy away from an argument, she generally sticks to the rues of a fair fight. I usually don't see much "mean" in her tone (not that that means it NEVER happens, but if you poke a sleeping tiger you get what you deserve. Besides, the comments section is a PLACE to argue, where even the idiots get to spout their nonsense (and frequently do). Caveat Emptor, LWs... not all our advice is good which should come as no surprise. And if anyone, reader or commentor, is offended by the opinions of total strangers you need to take a pill and move on with real life. In case you hadn't noticed, the Internet is full of people fucking things that probably shouldn't be fucked.


Name calling and bullying? "Dadddy, you ignorant slut!" 44 years later still makes me laugh.


Grammar correction @74, not whose.. it’s who has. Sorry if I caused distress to the GP.
Mr D, you and Drop Out go join your incel brothers elsewhere or go tell your gf her hair is all wrong.


Yet another bully fangirl.


Ricardo, if you are there. Have you seen the August issue of Vanity Fair, the British edition?
I wait for the boat arrivals, though not that fussed with the new editor. But too PC and not enough goss(ip). Carter knew how to do it.
Idris Elba is on the cover and gracing many many pages inside. I watched him in Luther. Hang on, I say to myself, this man is hot.
No naked pics though. Hope he doesn’t get too up himself.


Anyways, I’m one of sixteen vestial virgins heading for the coast. Check youse all later.


Mr. tripple D
You finally got it right. All of us here are nothing but a bunch of sexually frustrated folks, so envy at you.


Fuck off you moron. How fucking dare you mention CMD and sex offenders lists.
Man, you’re too far gone. Go the fuck away.


You’re not going to turn this place into your version of how it should be, between men and women. Like your biggest insult is I can’t get a romantic life together. Once again taking it all back to the cock. It’s all you know. All you focus on and for some bizarre self deluded reason, you think independent, educated women are gonna fall in line with your 50’s vision.
Tons of women out there hungry for what you offer, more oppression, their business.
Go chat to them.


Hunter78, I don't agree that she's unhappy with her husband being bi. It sounds like it's revitalised their sex life and they've had some fun together. It's bound to give her some doubts but this is not a bad thing.
My husband of 25 years is also bisexual and monogamous. I do use a strap-on on him, and a) I have to be really horny to do it, and b) it takes me a few minutes to get my head in the zone of having a penis. When I'm into it, the experience is wonderful.
Her question "Does this require me, even if temporarily, to change my body?" is so weirdly worded.
I'm not entirely sure what she means but she's clearly having difficulty thinking about actually fucking him. It's good that she sees it as very different from just using a dildo on him, because it really is. I've discovered that using a strap-on dildo means using your entire body, and that fucking someone is hard work sometimes. That would be a good thing for anyone who hasn't done it to learn.


Donny @83, thanks to you too. I agree, we can do better than name calling and bullying, which is why I never call people names, even people like Sporty who have called me every name in the book, and stand up to bullies.

Dadddy @85: "We can do better than name calling and bullying."
Dadddy @89, @92, @96: bullies Lava and CMD and calls them names.
I agree -- let's judge Dadddy by what he actually writes.

Hunter @94: "Most women don't want gays or bis for partners." More for me! ;) Many bi women would not be put off a bi male partner, and as there are more bi women than bi men (data questionable due to more bi men being closested, but a reasonable working theory), bi men should have no problem finding OS partners.

Busy @99: "I don't agree that she's unhappy with her husband being bi. It sounds like it's revitalised their sex life and they've had some fun together." This too. Aside from the pegging doubts, his coming out has been a net positive for them as a couple. I agree with you that being the fucker instead of the fuckee has been educational. Some of those positions really require a lot of fitness and stamina! It also gives a feeling of power, which may be something PFD can connect with. I am woman, hear me run the fuck.


Most women don’t want gays because gays don’t want them. Lots of women find some gay men very attractive, they however are not available.


triple d
Wonder what made you lose your cool, you always came across as a very stable genius.

Busy @ 99
For me the beauty of pegging is being an act out of the ordinary, reverse roll “gender fuck” as another commenter put it. And as you also pointed out, not a daily routine but rather an act requiring mind and body preparation.

Some see it as nothing too extreme, just an added value pleasure. Unfortunately, not much if any prostate stimulation on my side, yet the whole mind thing and the chance to dress up totally worth it.


Indeed Lava @101, gays wouldn't be sad that women don't want them as partners. And this frequent conflating of bi with gay is one problem that keeps so many bi men in the closet.

CMD @102, indeed. She could just think of it as a "let's spice things up" activity. Your post made me wonder whether they ever have anal the other way round, and whether she likes it? They could make exploring their rear entrances something they do together. As I've said before, receiving anal is a great way to develop one's skills and sensitivities around performing anal. (But she should not feel that this is another activity she's obligated to participate in, if it doesn't interest her, or if she would now associate it with his liking men.)


I just want to say that CMDwannabe seems like a really cool person from my short time here and I think they would make an excellent and considerate partner, if that's what they want out of a relationship.

As for the rest, I just ignore him. It's worked out fine for me. Sometimes he has interesting things to say, but most of the time it's just white noise in the background -- the rest of the internet poking into an otherwise collegial corner.


For the record dumb nuts, I’ve got the romance I need in my life. I make sure it doesn’t include some arrogant self important loser, like yourself Dadddy, who assumes the right to comment on my shoes, my hair.. wherever it is on my body, etc. Uninvited.
Being into D/s doesn’t cover for you or any of the other men hiding behind it. Your object stays the same, controlling women. Where the beauty of adults being into D/s is the playful and mutual caring side. You hang onto deep patriarchal attitudes. Like many of your cis sex. Round here, those will be confronted.
I’m an old crow now, a wise older woman. Nothing, nothing you throw at me will stick. Except bad moments in parenting, I was a good daughter. Still there, I’ve said it all to myself before you.
That’s what it means to be an independent woman, free of the need for approval from controlling jerks like you.


And I was a good wife. I sure worked hard enough at it. He tried, at the core though he’s like you Dadddy, still, a decade on. Can’t give up that need to control a woman.


Many aspects of pegging she could potentially get into, if role playing a man is a turn off. The domination aspect. The feeling of power from running the fuck. The taboo. The idea of pegging as the ultimate act of micro-feminism: gender equality achieved! The new and interesting sensations of toys that stimulate both parties. They should try positions where she can see his face and the pleasure he's getting out of it -- in front of a mirror perhaps.

Calliope @104, seconded! Of the two, I know whom I'd rather date, by a country mile.