Savage Love Oct 8, 2019 at 4:00 pm

Three City Swing

Joe Newton

Comments

1

Disagree with a few:
1) If you’re asking if the vasectomy is reversible, it’s not for you
2) I would find it annoying if I wanted to relax with old friends and one kept including a rotating cast of strangers (regardless of the poly aspect). Meeting new people can be great, but it’s a different, and mildly stressful, dynamic.
3) not getting why the transmasculine person’s use of faggot would be different? (Although I think Dan dismissed that question as well.)

2

Is "transmasculine" code for "women who dress sorta like guys and have a butch haircut"?

3

Vasectomies May or MAY NOT be reversible...a lot depends on how much time has passed and other factors. I had a vasectomy & tried to reverse it a couple years later. No luck. So don’t count your chickens before they hatch, you might end up with no chickens at all.

4

@1 Disagree. Not being 100p positive you don’t want children ≠ you want children. Icing some swimmers and snipping to avoid accident pregnancy makes sense. Dan is right that pregnancy is reversible but that procedure is way more invasive, physically painful, and expensive than a vasectomy.

5

Vasectomies should NOT be considered reversible. Can they be reversed? Yes. Can the one YOU get be reversed? Maybe, but also maybe not, and either way reversal is far more expensive than getting one. Banking sperm isn't cheap or infallible either.

Vasectomies should absolutely be considered permanent when you are deciding whether to get one.

6

LW1: One could soak vegetables in apple cider vinegar to kill any bacteria - the vagina itself is acidic for the same purpose. The remaining apple cider vinegar can be used for salad dressing to eat any produce inserted into vagina, which seems to be the point of putting vegetables inside your or your partner's vagina.

A female commenter recently discussed her own vaginal penetration with a vegetable, perhaps she can shed light on her produce cleaning method, and any health effects.

LW2: There are plenty of times in your life when circumstances dictate that you be alone, but knowing that you or your partner are moving in a period of months is not one of them. You will also find that life always more rewarding when you can enjoy the present with friends and lovers and open yourself up to possibilities of a relationship.

LW3: I think @Dan missed something here, in that LW simply hates his partners' mothers. It doesn't even suggest any reciprocal animosity. LW needs to get help.

LW4: "Done right, anal feels amazing." Amen.

LW5: Sit your boyfriend down, and ask him what being polyamorous means to him, and how he would like your relationship to unfold. Remember you always have the power end your relationship if he pressures you to change your relationship model.

LW6: Be discrete when in public and/or look for selected locations where you can let your guard down. It couldn't hurt if you have a well-rehearsed lie about your secondary partner if you are seen together (i.e., "Please meet my cousin Jack."). If your husband is also seeing other people, perhaps you can trade occasional weekends away from your community, and go somewhere you won't be recognized.

LW7: @Dan may very well hit upon why this arrangement has developed, but it doesn't answer the question. If LW doesn't want to spend time with her friend's rotating cast of lovers, don't invite that friend to hangout or make sure it is understood that the invitation isn't with a plus one.

LW8: If you knowingly have sex with someone who is partnered in a monogamous relationship, you don't have the right to run to their partner and spill the details. After being so morally compromised, you are not "doing the right thing," or setting moral scales right, by letting your sex partner's partner know about the sex in which you have engaged.

LW9: Is part of his enjoyment of swinging knowing or seeing you have sex with someone else, or might a compromise be allowing him the freedom to go solo from time-to-time?

LW11: Make your next bed a king size, four poster bed with a canopy. It will provide the room to get physical without falling off the bed, and offers lots of attachment points for bondage. Use the space under the bed for toys, like liberator pillows. Purchase a multi-bulb floor lamp, and Philips LED bulbs for a range of colored lighting options.

LW12: Orgasm denial is popular among kinky women too. The ability to orgasm is a fundamental aspect of personal autonomy. Even in partnered sex, one can orgasm whenever one has received sufficient stimulation. Dominance and submission is about power exchange, so giving your partner the power to decide if, when, how you orgasm particularly potent. For this reason, submissives are typically required to ask permission to orgasm, and to thank their dominant partners for allowing them to do so.

7

Water-Melon is my choice for fruit to use. Squashed up. I’d rather not have a banana up
my secret place (there’s another one).

8

Thanks SA, looks like you’ve covered it. Even remembering the LW’s no. Impressive. The lawyer mind I’d guess. Surely not mine.

9

Straight guys, well, can speak for themselves, but a lot of them seem to view (giving) anal as an achievement, scoring points against a woman by convincing her to do something she doesn't really want to do. It's not an egalitarian way of having sex and that's the point. That said, some straight guys don't like to give anal, and no one is obligated to have anything stuck up their butt that they don't want there. My guess is that this woman is young and the guys she's meeting are trying to tick something off their lists. It's understandable that they're curious to try something different, see how it compares to PIV, but any guy who's pressuring you is probably not going to have the patience to do it in a way that feels nice for the recipient. Don't listen to porn: anal is neither standard nor required. Only do it if YOU want to.

Wow to the person with the poly friend who, gasp, is bringing her dates to "social events." Would you be as contemptuous of a single person bringing dates to social events? Introducing our "flavours of the week" to our friends is an important step in figuring out whether the relationship will go anywhere. Are these people really ruining your nights out? Why don't you issue invitations to her and the wife specifically if you'd like to see Wife? If these social events are more or less open invite, your open friend can invite whoever she wants. Try being gracious instead of judgmental and who knows, you might find something to enjoy about their company. (Maybe your friend is bringing a date because her wife is on a date of her own, ever consider that?)

Sexier bedroom? Lower lights, better music, mirrors. Sorry, Dan, but the bed is the most convenient place for good sex.

Is male chastity enjoying "sudden widespread popularity"? I doubt that. I think LW just read an article about it, having been unaware of it before. Most men do not want to suppress their sexuality. Though many of them should.

I don't understand "My boyfriend is really fucking sexy, hence the .025 percent doubt." Where is the connection between his sexiness and the possibility of becoming parents? Read some letters; babies kill your sex life. If your boyfriend is really fucking sexy, you should be going for that vasectomy so you can enjoy baby-free sex for the next several decades. (Also, agree that vasectomies aren't easily reversible, so saving sperm is a better Plan B. And be aware that sometimes, soon after a vasectomy, pregnancy is still a risk and take precautions.)

10

Sublime @7, seconding the head/foodboard that can have restraints attached to them. Perhaps take any family photos off the walls, too.

11

Lol, footboard, not foodboard! I got confused with Letter 1. :)

12

SublimeAfterglow @6: No, women shouldn't be putting vinegar up their vag. Also no, don't tell people your lover is your relative. It's gonna get weird if/when people notice the sexual chemistry. Just don't make out in public and make sure your partner knows about the activities. That way if any busybody mentions "oh, I saw your wife getting a milkshake yesterday..." the partner can grin and go "yeah, they brought back a cookie. S/he and [secondary] were doing some shopping/whatever." Just make clear that whatever's going on is going on with the consent and knowledge of all parties, and you'll be fine.

BDF @9: people get annoyed at single friends who keep bringing their flavors of the week to gatherings as well.

Re: outing your cheater. It's a "right thing for the wrong reasons" situation. Yeah, you're doing it out of spite, but at least now the person being duped knows the truth instead of being unknowingly put at risk for STDs and privately wondering if s/he really is paranoid, and their S/O is right about whatever lies the S/O is telling them to cover up the cheating. So do it, it's the least you could do to make up for the shit you've already done. However, as with most confessions of wrongdoing, don't expect a parade for telling the truth.

13

Traffic @12, unfortunately, LW won't "be fine" if she's outed publicly as ethically non-monogamous. Did you miss the bit where she is a teacher? Unfortunately, what teachers do off campus can and does affect their ability to keep their jobs. It shouldn't, but it does. I agree, though, that "friend" would be a better cover story than "cousin."

I'm not sure about the outing-the-cheater scenario. It's obvious that this woman wanted to break up her ex's relationship, which is why she slept with him and wants to tell her. Does the cheatee have the right to know that both her boyfriend and his ex are cheating pieces of shit? Perhaps she does. Should this info come from the LW? Well, it's unlikely the boyfriend will fess up. It's more likely she'll tell the girlfriend, and boyfriend will deny it, saying LW made it up because she's jealous and wants to break them up -- a believable lie because the second half is true. But at least the girlfriend may be less naive and more on the alert for signs of future cheating. Ugh, this letter makes me wish male, and female, chastity devices WERE more popular...

I don't think Sublime @6 was serious about the vinegar. If one must insert vegetables into one's vagina, one could use condoms.

14

Savage is a man after my own heart. Apart from his not watching rugby, three-day eventing and tennis on television, he's right about everything--especially fucking in the confined cubicles of upscale restaurants. There have been guys I wouldn't otherwise have seen, or kept in touch with, with whom I've done that. Best when the food is excellent (a 12 or 15 course tasting menu) and the restaurant ambience frosty, fuck-off or otherwise antipathetic.

Lesbians, take note!

15

Food question: foods to avoid: anything with sugar so skip the whipped cream. Nothing too spicy, no mustard or hot sauce unless she is a masochist. (Learned this the hard way.) nothing that is not smooth. Most important: put a condom on anything being inserted.

Bedroom question: depends so much on what you are planning to do in there. Fond of flogging? No ceiling fan or other overhead obstacle. Bondage? Good tie down points, some suspension points in the ceiling. Exhibitionism/voyeurism? Nice seating (easy chairs or a couch across from the bed) for your or others’ viewing pleasure. Like porn? A big tv. Variable lighting, good sound system, a plush but cleanable rug if you are likely to end up on the floor, bare floor if cleanup is more of a priority. A covered trash can for condoms or other used supplies, a covered laundry basket for same. Waterproof mattress cover, conveniently located towels and/or peepads if your activities might be damp. Some fuckworthy furniture besides the bed for variety, e.g. an easy chair, a spanking bench. A big enough bed for all participants (had an amusing attempt at a mfm threesome in a single once... do not recommend.) Last but not least, if you live with other people, a good lock on the door.

Vasectomy? I read somewhere that the sperm is still produced after the procedure, just does not come out in ejaculate anymore. So no need to freeze sperm as it can be extracted from the testicles, fresh as ever, in the future. But yeah, you will want to get actual medical advice from a medical professional. Personally, i’d be happy if all sperm-producing individuals had a vasectomy at puberty since there is no need for anyone to be spewing live biologicals wherever they go, but that’s an unrealistic dream.

16

Vinegar? Isn’t the object to eat it?
vegetables: if it’s carrot it needs to be cooked, chocking hazard otherwise. Peas would just fall out . You can eat those raw, so no cooking needed if it all happens in a moment of passion. Not frozen peas, heavens no. Room temp ones. Take them out of freezer a few hours before they might be spontaneously needed. Eggplant. Now there’s an idea.

17

People ask some very simple questions. Was there a question here that didn't have a knockdown answer?

In the first question, it was the guy getting a vasectomy for himself (he did his own scheduling, presumably). His partner must respect his bodily autonomy. I see no reason that she shouldn't suggest his getting some sperm put on ice. @9 Bi--I think with 'drop dead sexy' she meant the child would likely be very good-looking. Maybe?

18

Smear something over the clit maybe, outside the vagina; but with anything inside, you're risking an infection.

19

Many different shaped eggplants, it would need softening up, just a little.. in the oven. Then wait till it cools down of course before using in. Can’t eat a half cooked eggplant, sorry. The receiver would probably like it.

20

I don’t see that Harriet. Not with my list anyway. I know how to keep a twat clean.

21

@20. Lava. I'm ceding before your expertise!

22

Ms Glow - It's tempting to make a joke about how ordinary OS sex should do nearly as well, but I won't.

Ms Fan - We are in nearly total agreement, most strongly of all on the question of why LW's boyfriend's being sexy would give her a scintilla of doubt about not wanting to have children. I assumed LW meant that their progeny would likely be gorgeous, but I don't know that that would be such a recommendation. I recall Ms Cute's claiming that her daughters were "objectively" stunning; while that may be all very nice for the Miss Cutes if true, if anything the point seems to have added to their good mamma's list of anxieties. Maybe Ms Erica could inform us of the optimal degree of attractiveness in offspring for parental satisfaction.

I think cross-examination is required on the social events. If LW is really inviting Marcia and Jan specifically, only for Marcia to turn up with first Cindy and then in turn Greg, Peter, Bobby, Keith, Laurie, Chris and Tracy (I omit Danny, as anyone who brought Danny Bonaduce to a social event instead of the invited partner would instantly either be hailed as a demigod or struck off all future invitation lists), then LW is entitled to a good round of "Marcia, Marcia, Marcia!" These events don't seem pure GCCS, which would run to such delights as Progressive Dinners and Couples' Bridge. But it would be useful to establish whether the general tone of the events is to socialize as and with couples or whether the events are mixed with some established couples, some singles, and some daters in random numbers. LW might have a point if the attendees are or become established friends, and the general custom is to improve ongoing acquaintances. Maybe bring Peter or Laurie on occasion if Jan's busy. But, if it's the sort of event where Peter or Laurie might show up in future with someone other than Poly Friend, that's different. Are dates welcome, or are partners expected? If everyone else is bringing an established partner or the same new partner on the road to becoming established, I can see that a series of transitory partners might not fit easily. But definitely agree that, if LW wants to see Jan as well as Marcia, Jan should be invited explicitly.

23

BDF @13: I didn't say come out as poly. I just said make sure people know that nothing's going on behind the spouse's back. "Bob thinks his wife is at the hairdresser but she's actually having lunch with Joe" is way different than "Joe's friends with Bob and his wife Sue, and Joe and Sue often hang out separately as well." People will be less suspicious and less interested if they don't think there's a secret involved, and the best way to insure that is to make the whole thing as dull and matter-of-fact as possible. Yeah, Joe and Sue sometimes hang out together [shrug] how about that sports team.

As for the "the cheatee has the right to know, but should this info come from the LW" question, who it comes from isn't the main point. The point is that the Cheatee is not being deceived and taken advantage of. If you know that bitch from high school is embezzling from her company's retirement fund, you report it, even if you're only doing it because you're gonna jerk off over the article that outlines her prison sentence. As for whether she's believed, obviously she'll want to have some evidence, but that's a separate issue.

24

Organic fruit and vegetables, washed well. Don’t leave them up there too long and make sure every bit comes out. Don’t want the carrot sprouting.

25

I'd say yeast infection from sugars is more likely than bacterial infection from bacteria - and way more foods have sugars than you'd think.

My experience is that food and sex are a combination that are considerably sexier to think about than to do - in reality it just felt stupid and vaguely nauseating. But then I've never been one for props.

26

LW1 food play: probably Just Say No.

I think someone at some point, possibly Dan, said "Don't use vegetables without a condom, because the rough surfaces might cause micro abrasions". So "shaped for insertion": still be careful.

Sweet sexy treats like dribbling honey or chocolate sauce on your bits? Sugar is apparently something you really do not want around your vagina. I'm not sure whether it's dangerous around external vulval tissue as well, but definitely bad inside.

And squishy food like Dan's suggestion of lasagne? No.

Flavoured condoms, possibly, then you know it's supposed to go into both vagina and mouth.

27

Venn @22, don't all parents think their offspring are beautiful? So it shouldn't matter about objectively attractive genes. Also, I would offer as a cautionary tale Alexa Rae Joel, who got her father Billy's musical talent but also his looks, rather than her supermodel mother Christie Brinkley's. Genetics are a crapshoot! (I agree, I've banged some sexy men but never have I been tempted to let them put a sexy child in me.)

I agree with you, too, that the nature of these "social events" makes a difference. Is it an all-are-welcome pub meet or an otherwise fixed group that meets for a specific purpose, like your bridge group? This LW's complaint feels mean-spirited, and I'm with Dan, it's no wonder the wife doesn't want to be around them.

Traffic @23, I guess I misread you as saying the wife shouldn't bother being discreet when on dates (your mention of sexual chemistry which is noticeable), and if a busybody reports back to Spouse, Spouse should out them by saying they know about the secondary partner. I guess I read it this way because you used the word secondary, rather than specifying that Spouse could say "yes, that's Sue's friend Joe, don't worry, they're just friends." I would advise that LW not just not make out, but make a conscious effort to act as platonic as possible in public, so as not to arouse suspicion in anyone but the Mike Pence types who don't believe in extramarital friendships.

28

Woofb @26, the lasagne suggestion was clearly a joke.

29

Short-term chastity play is great (and I think the appeal is the female agency involved - by virtue if controlling his sexuality, she’s acknowledging it and in some sense stimulating it continually, which is understandably arousing to the guy), but - and i can’t stress this enough - an ejaculation a day keeps the BPH and prostate cancer away. You don’t want to be peeing five times a night in your golden twilight, don’t do long-term orgasm denial.

30

@23/Traffic Spiral: Your analogy is all wrong. LW is an active and enthusiastic partner in morally wronging her sex partner's partner, not a mere bystander who comes into possession of this information. There is no moral balancing of the scales that takes place by immediately confessing to your sex partner's partner as soon as the sex stops. Indeed, these case confirm that acting morally isn't a motivating factor at all, but rather a further desire to cause injury.

31

Sublime @30, exactly. It's more analogous to conspiring with a colleague to embezzle from the company, then turning in the colleague, letting her take the fall for the crime.

33

30 and 31: pretty sure the company would still like a heads-up on that embezzlement info. Same with cheaters. The end result is that the wronged person gets a heads-up and the chance to make informed decisions about their life and health - the cheatee deserves that, regardless of where the info comes from.

34

The Flavor of the Week - after enough flavors - becomes inappropriate at any type of social events. It's a type of attention-seeking performance and bragging. 5 or 6 new dudes over a year? Fine. Meeting 20 new dudes in a year? Fucking exhausting. I wouldn't want to meet 20 associates of a friend over the course of a year, let alone someone's newest romantic belt-notch.

35

@32 If that were truly the case, the entire human race would consist of only children except in the case of twins, etc.

I'm sure you were joking, hopefully not trolling, but anyway:

Just because our culture's dominant concept of sexually attractive females are girls instead of women doesn't mean women - mothers - aren't sexy as hell and viewed so by most.

The idiots that prefer the virginal look seem to forget that this preference is self-defeating. You find young and untouched hot, but once you've "touched" it, you've destroyed the seemingly sole trait you find desirable. Yeah, no.

If that's how a guy feels, he doesn't deserve to even practice the act of attempting to procreate. Instead, he should go to the incel forums to complain about how they're being cheated of their rightful due and let the rest of the human race carry on without them.

Will admit, there are a couple years, however, where a woman has little time/energy to being sexy. Babies are a lot of work. That doesn't mean the moms AREN'T sexy. Just a little slowdown on shenanigans.

36

Re the swinger couple --

I would initiate a serious discussion about what you both get out of swinging and what compromises might be workable.

In the swinging world, he probably needs to arrive with a woman in order to be welcome. Are you fine if he starts dating someone else and brings her to swinger events instead of you?

You may have to choose between feeling jealous that he's out with other people versus "taking one for the team" (having unwanted sex when you'd rather be home).

37

Jinxie @35, definitely trolling. Do not feed.

38

@9 I absolutely would have an issue with a single friend who brought a new date to nearly every social function. If it was limited to just larger gatherings it would be one thing, but that doesn't sound like it's the case here. If I want to hang out with just my friends and a new person is there it completely changes the dynamic.

42

ice cubes

A good bed with a sturdy headboard increases the ease of position possibilities IME, drawer nearby for the accoutrements, indirect lighting, no photographs, options for closed or open windows (curtains) and thick blanket and pillows available for non-bed stuff in the bedroom. Simple. I knew a guy with mirrors above his bed, not my thing, but we do have one directly across from the bed (above the dresser) that we did not put there for that reason but which is fun anyway. If someone has particular kinks that require equipment or space, then your options for bedroom (or basement or whatever) design will naturally follow, but if not, just general good taste and practical arrangements should suffice- less is more in a bedroom in my opinion, fewer colors, fewer things on the wall, I never understand why people prefer dozens of pillows and elaborately made beds, but to each their own.

I agree it would be a little annoying not to have the couple you know, but Dan's solution is the right one- invite the wife out and then you either get to see them together or her alone, and tolerate the friend bringing the new partners- this is part of who she is- and also invite her out solo from time to time as well. If you start nit picking about this, it's making a mountain out of a molehill.

43

@4 people’s experiences of invasiveness and pain vary, but an abortion is MUCH less expensive than a vasectomy... and MUCH MUCH less expensive than IVF which as @15 Squidgie points out is the main fertility option post-vasectomy, since reversal is not realistic due to scarring in the vas.
Also cheaper than banking sperm for years.

44

@9 Sublime I read LW3, the mother-hater, as female, but you read them as male. It’s unclear. Interesting...

45

I have no idea what the transmasculine who identifies as female means. I'm guessing a butch woman who may or may not be into men. So my instinct would be to say, the use of "faggot" is a problem.

About anal: Sometimes this type of sex is hot because it's a deviation from PIV and/or getting head. Sometimes this type of sex is better because the partner doesn't really give good blowjobs (or isn't interested in giving blowjobs) and maybe PIV isn't tight enough. I assume for other men it's a conquest thing or feels taboo.

46

@9 BiDanFan re anal: Bravo for the WIN! You just described my abusive ex to a T.

47

@9 I think you're overstating this. Yeah, I'm sure some guys see anal as something to trick women into (sorry @46, that sucks!) but I don't think that's most guys. Most guys see it the same way women see it - a transgressive forbidden thing that spices up a relationship or makes a casual hook up hotter. I also think that straight guys are into anal because more straight women are into anal. As people more openly sleep with more people before pair-bonding, they're looking for new stuff to do.

49

Surfrat @45: My take on "transmasculine folks who don't necessarily identify as men" is someone who is female, presents as male, and identifies as non-binary.

Larry @47: I don't think most women view anal as "a transgressive forbidden thing that spices up a relationship or makes a casual hook up hotter." Sure, some women enjoy anal, but I think more of them view it as something men want which some women are willing to tolerate. (And ixnay to anal on the casual hookups. Ixnay with a capital ick.)
If your view is correct, why are far fewer straight men into being pegged? Hmm.

50

It’s expected, isn’t it Fan, anal. Along with blow jobs. The list get longer.. over the decades.
Still a man’s world far as I can see. Anal is and has always been off the table for me. What? My secret place not good enough.. then move right along.

51

Many women may be fine with anal, love it even. The problem is any assumption that all will be.

52

Ms Fan/Ms Lava - I fully grant my lack of standing here, but I put this down largely to the Team Spirit, Miss Brodie's old anathema. Getting one's OS partner to do what (s)he doesn't really enjoy but is willing to tolerate is a victory for the whole sex in the eyes of many. One might theorize that in sex the coercion is generally M>F, in socializing generally F>M (at least in the GCCS) and in, say, movie selection, closer to balanced, just to pick examples from each category.

53

As the last question merely invites the inference that the questioner (or the subjects of the question) wants to present using the F word, I'll take it the other way and say that the world would be a more pleasant place if that word dropped entirely out of hearing, but this concerns ranks about on a par with getting In God We Trust off US currency.

57

At what point does "Open" become "Polyamory" become "Break Up"? It seems like you're either in a monogamous relationship or you're in the process of moving on. Call me old fashioned or paranoid...

58

@58. really? did you realize it was a douche at that age?

Straight men and anal. I don't get it. I'm a bi top. Vaginas are so so much better equipped to take a penis than an ass, I don't know why you'd choose the back door when the front door is open. With clean up and everything, I don't know why a woman would allow it. Just saying.

59

Tim @57, okay, you're old fashioned and paranoid. I'm poly and I've been with one of my partners for eight years, another for going on six, along with a "flavour of the week" I've been seeing for about six months. Clearly if I was hoping to engineer a breakup, I'm failing badly. Long-term poly relationships are a real thing. They're not for everyone, but it's cynical to presume they can't work for any of us.

Tim @58, Larry nails it: for variety, and because it feels naughty. Other reasons include: some women are submissive and like that sort of thing; the "front door" may be occupied -- period sex also requires "clean up and everything"; some guys are not very well endowed, so that PIV does not give one that filled-up feeling, but PIA does. Some women don't just "allow" anal, but request it. Perhaps men should wait for these requests instead of bugging women like this week's LW who clearly aren't interested.

60

Commercially available douches cause yeast infections. Clothes hangers and prayers are old time birth control methods. In short, a small boy's interpretations of things he smelled and saw in his mother's bathroom are irrelevant to whether or not vinegar is a healthy thing to shove up your twat.

61

The naughtiness (transgression) part is a real thing, but straight men receiving anal is still too taboo for most of them- there's a happy area where a thing is just naughty enough but not too naughty to be disturbing. Also people lack imagination and fucking women in the ass is common in porn whereas fucking a straight man in the ass is not. Also, most women do not own a strap on, but most men do own a dick. So I don't think the fact that straight men are generally squeamish about receiving anal themselves cancels out the transgressive thrill of it.

However I also think it's true that it's acceptable to cause women's bodies pain and it is not to do the same for men- this is just in our culture and everyone accepts it that way. When I read Dan's description of how to try anal for the first time (which he links to a lot) I often think of the care and preparation and communication involved- I don't know if most gay men do this the first time in reality, but the advice is that they should and people ask about it- there is at least a conversation around the potential pain and care required. Contrast that with the lack of advice for women's first time at PIV, which frequently involves tearing skin and bleeding and some painful- you are just expected to bleed a bit and power through it, it will feel good eventually. (And btw I'm not saying Dan lacks advice here, he probably would advice otherwise and maybe has- just that it's not the norm for people to write in asking how they can make first time PIV more pleasant even though it's something that billions more people do than anal.) Likewise, birth control methods when literally all it takes is cumming somewhere other than a vagina, the fact that most women experience pain in sex at some point, etc etc, and I can't believe than anyone would question why men press for anal even if most women don't like it- it's because yes it's transgressive, but also we are accustomed to accepting that women put up with discomfort and pain in sex.

Women have a vagina and they have no prostate. I get why women would want to experience it once in a while just to switch things up and enjoy the novelty, but honestly unless your woman is into anal (and some are!) then don't press for it. There is nothing in it for most women.

It's normal that a straight guy would like to try it. I suggest hiring a sex worker who specifically provides this or searching online specifically for a woman who wants it.

62

It can't just be because it feels good?

I mean, if someone asks for a blowjob, do you think that means they don't think your vagina is good enough?

Not everybody has to be into anal, of course, I completely get that there are many reasons not to want to do it. But neither is it necessary to look so far for reasons for other people to be into it. And yes, some men like having to talk a girl into it. Some men like that about regular sex, too. Some men are assholes. Let's not pretend anal has anything to do with it.

63

I don't know clods. I felt that way too until I read about how most women find it painful and don't like it but do it anyway from time to time because the man in their relationship keep asking for it. It's also correlated in the rise of straight women in HIV infection- not because guys into anal are more likely to have HIV but because it's easier to transmit that way and the receiving partner (who will be the woman in straight relationships almost all the time) carries the greater risk. Of course you can make studies about anything and then extrapolate from them, but I think it's unnecessarily reductive to pretend that an acceptance of women's increased consequences and decreased pleasure has nothing to do with it. Though I agree that it's equally reductive to suggest this is actually a deliberate motivating factor for the guy.

65

Women don't have prostates, so there's that.
Like I said, I'm a bi top... I've bottomed some, and it never really does a lot for me either. I generally give it up to guys who REALLY want it, and who have me really turned on. There aren't many... lol.

66

I don't think anyone is assuming that no women enjoy it- plenty do, some of whom have commented on this forum pretty regularly. Some women even prefer it. But it's going to decrease the likelihood of them preferring it or enjoying it. Obviously if men have greater opportunity to receive pleasure (and different kinds of pleasure) from the act, they are going to like it more. You are trying to make an exclusionary statement which makes no sense.

As far as things have been studied on this subject, most women do not enjoy anal and in fact find it painful. Now we can say that studies are flawed but these are the conclusions. I think it would be interesting to discuss why- I think BDF is on to something when she's said (in other threads) that her opinion is that straight men try to fuck a butt the way they fuck a vagina. This would obviously increase the pain that women experience and decrease the pleasure, and that's mostly how it's presented in porn too. So if that's true, then the approach could account for a lot of the discomfort and more women might be more into it and enjoy it than currently do.

Nonetheless, if you combine all these factors, then it's just dishonest to have a conversation about why straight men ask straight women for anal even though most don't like it without accounting for a general acceptance - among straight men and straight women- that women will receive more pain and less pleasure in sex. Again, I'm not saying this is a conscious motivating factor, but it is a norm, and it's one that is going to reinforce the fact that anal is less pleasurable for women and more painful for them, because if this is a norm sexually, then there is no reason for couples to learn to make it less painful and more pleasurable, hence the norm of pestering for something that women don't want to do and the feeling of having done something novel and perhaps even transgressive.

67

Also I think the analogy with blow jobs is incorrect and maybe disingenuous for a couple reasons. One is that most people expect oral to go both ways- it is a norm now that straight men and straight women give and receive although we've had some dispute on this forum on how many people really do oral regularly. But it's exceptionally rare that straight men want to be pegged or that straight women want to use a strapon. So the analogy doesn't stand.

Second, while most women may not receive pleasure from blowing a guy and might even find it difficult or uncomfortable (plenty of people don't like giving oral apparently), it is not painful for them. Most women do not experience pain while giving a blow job. Most women do find anal painful.

So a better analogy would be face fucking a woman- being face fucked is painful for most people and it's not something that most women receive pleasure from, the pleasure is mostly for the man. And like anal, a small percentage of women are really into it even though most are not.

If being face fucked were becoming an expectation of straight women, we would be having a similar conversation about that with similar motivations attributed. In fact, I'm pretty sure we have.

68

Tim @57 - non-monogamous relationships last until they don't, just as monogamous relationships last until they don't.

It sounds like for you personally, either you're in a monogamous relationship or you're in the process of moving on. But that's not true for me (or BiDanFan @59, or many others).

As for anal, I think EmmaLiz's analogy to facefucking (@67) is spot on. Both activities are vaguely unpleasant for me, but can be hot if the right D/s buttons are getting pressed in the process. (Conversely, a finger in and around the anus can actually feel good during other sexual play. There are a lot of fun nerve endings there.)

69

Ciods@ 62, you talkin’ to me.. You know what I meant. My point being don’t pressure women, it’s not a given that every woman wants anal. Or wants to try and see if she might like anal. Or needs to be told her arse is tighter than her vagina, or that other women love it, so what’s wrong with her.

70

Lava @69, I thought Ciods @62 was talking to Tim Browne @58, who couldn't understand why some women would want to receive anal. But congratulations on the magic number! And thanks to EmmaLiz @66-@67. I agree there's an ingrained expectation that a certain level of pain is par for women's course during sex. Someone on this board has opined that sex is boring if it doesn't involve hair pulling and spanking. Someone else has insisted that a woman's desire to be "well and truly fucked" means she wants to be dominated. Men have been told that anal hurts -- most straight men cringe at the idea of their own butts being penetrated -- yet a disturbingly large number think this is an acceptable price for women to pay to satisfy their curiosity or desire to feel like a porn star.

And congrats on the magic number!

71

Doh, I already congratulated you, it must be past my bedtime.

72

@49 BDF Re:Anal "something men want which some women are willing to tolerate."

Doesn't that make it essentially transgressive by definition?

73

@67: Emma, I wasn't attempting to make a full-on analogy, just to point out that sometimes people want variety of sensation without it meaning anything about how much they like vaginal sex.

I agree that we normalize discomfort and pain for women in sex.

I also agree that the enjoyment one gets out of anal depends a lot on how the top treats it--it's not a vagina, don't act like it is.

What I was reacting to was my general (possibly incorrect) feeling that everyone was looking for the worst reasons a guy might want anal--sometimes this board feels a bit cynical to me, I guess. I'm sure there are all sorts of people who want to do (insert sex act) for (insert negative reason). But I don't think that should be the default assumption. I dunno, I've been having sex with men for twenty-some years, and never once had someone treat me the way people here act like straight men treat straight women regularly. I am not saying it doesn't happen--or even that it's not common, it may be. And I doubt my screening mechanism for people is all that superior to average, so maybe I'm just lucky. But every once in a while I just like to chime in with a slightly less negative theory.

I like anal, I think it feels great, lack-of-personal-prostate notwithstanding. The men I've done it with have all been thoughtful about it, though (see prior comment re: it's not a vagina). No one has ever pressured me about it; on occasions (or with men) I didn't want to, I said so, and that was that. I definitely don't think people should be pressured to try it or do more than they want (a statement which holds for all sex acts). But I don't think that a guy asking (without pressure) for it necessarily means he wants to get something from the girl as a point-scoring mechanism, or that he doesn't care about her comfort, or whether she's in pain.

My point was, people like that exist, but I don't think asking for anal is a tell-tale marker.

74

I'll add another reason some straight guys may pester their female partners for anal sex, even if the woman initially declines. If she has EVER agreed before, even one time, it seems there can often be a weird drive to leave no stone unturned that any other previous partner experienced. It's an almost pathological sense of entitlement. They may as well be racing to plant another flag on the moon.

@61 @EmmaLiz That's an interesting comment about more focus on how to prep for a more mutually positive experience when both parties are male. I haven't read that yet, but that's interesting since (by far) a majority of people receiving anal sex are women, even when you factor in gay men. I have read many accounts of gay men shaking their heads at the "no prep" stories of anal they hear from their female friends. Often it's approached just like PIV sex in those cases, yes.

75

Cidos, agreed, the only thing I'd add is that the norm of women experiencing more pain and less pleasure is not something I'm claiming men do to women. It's a cultural norm, reinforced by all sorts of people and experiences (including porn and our narrative of sex as starting with penetration and ending with ejaculation), and women themselves often internalize this, participate in it, think it's normal (since that's the point of something being a norm) and IMO probably accounts for a lot of kinks. So I don't think pointing this out should feel like we are saying men want to treat women like shit. In my experience, most men have been fine- hit and miss in the skills/compatibility department but generally wanting both of us to have a good time and not being pushy. However when I was young, I definitely had experiences with men (also young) who were selfish, pushy and treated sex as an achievement they could wear a girl down to doing for them, and our interpretations of conversations are colored by our experiences.

@future cat lady, yes exactly, but I meant the fact that most of us have PIV for the first time without any lingering preparation or building up to it- it's just accepted that there's a likelihood that you are going to tear and bleed and it's going to hurt and that you will power through it until it feels good which isn't usually the first time. This never occurred to me as odd until after I read Dan's advice for first time anal, and I started to think how much nicer it would be if we treated all penetrative sex that way. Like, maybe only PIV after you've done a lot of mutual orgasms from hands and oral. After you've played with fingers and toys and used a lot of lube and warmed up to it rather than the default which is just, I'm going to insert my dick into you,, probably causing you bleeding and pain, and then do that again and again for several minutes. Yes it will hurt, it will be better next time. My own first time was mildly painful, messy not particularly pleasant and I was sore for the next couple of days. Wonder why I thought this was normal? And yet in many cultures, it's not just expected and accepted, but required as a proof of virginity- that you will bleed, that it will hurt. Fascinating.

76

@69 WA-HOOOO!!!! Congratulations to LavaGirl on scoring this week's Lucky @69 Award! Savor the the highly envied decadence. :)

77

Thanks Grizelda. I’m fine with a bit of cock sucking. It’s the in built expectation in the words blow job, that I resist.

78

@77 LavaGirl: I must concur with you. The term blow job is a turn off for me, too. The only time I ever found that term amusing at all was from the late Robin WiIliams' (as DJ Adrian Cronauer) line from Good Morning, Vietnam (1987), to vicious Sargeant Major Phillip Dickerson (played by J.T Walsh):
"You know, you are more in dire need of a blow job than any white man in history."

Holy shit, folks--Griz's love of movies is showing.

79

Rest in peace, Robin WIlliams. "Nanu nanu" to Mork. So beloved a comedian worldwide--warm, loving and giving a man.

80

Do women give up anal w o prepping? Omfg

81

@80: Don't generalize, tim. Prepping---for what?!? I've never done anal simply because I'm just not into it, and for good reason. That's like me harping all over you for something you're not into that I wrongly assumed all guys were into, like, say, auto-fellatio. Omfg.

82

Tim @80, some women give up anal before it’s a thought, let alone before prepping.

83

No SLLOTDs this week?

Sporty @72, no, "tolerating" something does not make it transgressive. I would not want to engage in any act my partner was merely tolerating. Mutually enjoyed breaking of a taboo is transgressive. Asking someone to do something they don't enjoy is selfish.

Ciods @73, I admit that I read badgering into the question "Why do straight guys like anal so much?" I presumed that someone who wasn't feeling pressured by multiple men wouldn't ask that question, and read it as "Why do straight guys like anal so much that they keep asking even after I've said no?" Indeed, this has not been my experience with straight guys; perhaps I've fallen for the hype that says young men now watch so much porn that they all want anal and facials and face fucking, and perhaps I believe that my demeanour conveniently scares off these sorts of men, who are busy pestering younger and less confident women. This may in fact not be true at all, and I'm just basing my impression on the horror stories.

EmmaLiz @75, another reason more men may be pushing for anal is that previously, men could consider it an achievement or conquest if they pushed a young woman for PIV and got her to "give it up." Now, we're living in a world where, for the most part, we don't see sex that way; we see it as something enjoyable two people do with each other. Perhaps that's removed the element of achievement so that the sort of men (not all, of course) who do get off on the idea of breaking through a woman's resistance are asking them to "give up" their butts instead.

Tim @80, good grief, blame the victims, eh. How about, "Do men press women for anal without prepping?" I know I'm arguing both sides here, but you're still seeing anal as something that is never willingly received. Yes, I have had men try to have anal sex with me without prepping; EmmaLiz referenced my earlier comments about men trying to fuck an ass the way they fuck a vagina, so yes, this is a thing. However, "prepping" when you are female is somewhat different than "prepping" when you are male. You could consider PIV as foreplay to anal. If you've been having PIV, the whole area is wet and relaxed, meaning it can be easier to gently slide a dick into that ass than into the ass of someone who hasn't got a vagina. CAN BE; I wouldn't recommend it as a technique, particularly if you're endowed and/or she's not well practised. Any "ow" means "stop immediately."

84

First let me say that I have no problem with anyone being gay or bi. However with that said, a cis male that portends to be straight, who is willing to fuck a woman in her ass should realize that doing that is only a hop, skip and a jump away from fucking a man in his ass. This could mean that he's possibly not as "straight" as he believes himself to be.

85

@80 @tim browne - Not sure if you mean "prepping" as in the woman prepping herself hygienically specifically for anal sex (such as with an enema bulb) or if you mean "prepping" like the guy doing appropriate foreplay specific to anal, but the answer to both is yes. At least in my experience, most straight guys will at most realize a bit of lube is a good idea, and often it happens spontaneously or unplanned such that an anal-specific hygiene routine hasn't occurred. To be honest with you, I didn't even know what I was missing until I encountered a guy who was great at foreplay for anal sex. I was not surprised to learn he had experience with men.

@84 @JuanMas Did you know this advice column is written by a gay man? I hope your "straight" eyes didn't catch the gay by reading it!

86

Juan @84, I hope you're trolling. Everyone has an ass. Do you think a man who kisses a woman on her mouth is only a hop, skip and a jump away from kissing a man on his mouth, and vice versa, and therefore everyone in the world is bisexual? Because that's the logical follow-on from your position, and makes zero sense. (Don't worry, it's okay to be straight and have no interest in anal, if that's where this is coming from.)

FutureCat @85: Yes, good question, one I should have asked myself. Tim, what do you mean by "prepping" for anal? Do you mean enemas or do you mean working up to one's cock by using fingers and/or toys? I agree with FutureCat @85. The problem is that straight guys think they know how to fuck because they know how to fuck a vagina, they assume butts work the same way, and women, who are not the ones initiating the anal, don't have the experience to tell men how to do it right, whereas men who sleep with men learn this pretty quickly because they have to. So, a woman agrees to let her guy try anal; he does it with no foreplay; it hurts like hell; and she never wants to do it again. This is how straight buttsex typically goes, and one reason I recommend men try pegging so they won't be so clueless.

87

@86 @BiDanFan I agree it's a problem that a lot of women don't know what to ask for either. I remember reading a thing about anal foreplay some time after having been with the one guy who did really thorough anal foreplay and I was like "Oh! That's what he was doing!" Because even after experiencing it, since it wasn't in my field of vision, it was hard for me to even figure out what he had done. Like rimming was an obvious sensation, as was fingering, but I had never experienced a guy massaging and stretching me in preparation for anal, so until I read about this things, I couldn't even match my experience of the sensation to what he had done.

88

@Juan do you feel that way when a woman sucks your dick? Hop skip jump and next thing you know, you're asking yourself, 'why do all these homosexuals keep sucking my cock?'

@Tim - In my experience, there was no prep except lube, and yes as BDF says, it was OK because it was always after some PIV.

Another element of this conversation that we've maybe touched upon before is that there are religious fundamentalist straights who use anal to preserve virginity. The girl remains a virgin since no one has touched her precious vagina. But what about the boy? Is he considered a virgin if he's never touched a vagina?

89

My own experiences with anal- to me the switch to anal was a buzz kill. Like we are doing this fun thing, but now all the fun stops and I just get to lay there and get fucked in the ass. I'm sure if I'd had more experience with it, I'd get better at it, and then it could become more fun, but I felt locked into a couple positions. I couldn't take an active role and I'm generally slightly more dominant (though I guess with practice I could learn) which means I was limited to bottoming. Facing-away positions are great if you are into what is happening (I enjoy it during PIV) but anal itself does nothing for me so face-away positions are just boring. I just get to stare at / touch something other than my lover and try to put up a convincing show of not being bored. Facing each other positions are more pleasant during PIA but again I'm not getting any pleasure from the penetration- he might as well be fucking my hand- but it's fun to see the guy enjoy it and I can masturbate more easily so it's fine. To me it feels like mutual masturbation only he's using my ass. More importantly, there's the fact that after PIA, there's no returning to PIV and there's no blow job either. So it's the end of things I like.

Again, if I'd done it more, I guess I could've learned to make it fun or at least have just done it from time to time for the guy to mix it up. But I didn't- I made anal off limits because after a little over a year of anal from time to time, I got hemorrhoids. I've since had people tell me that it's coincidence, that anal sex doesn't cause hemorrhoids but I never had them before. In the decades since, when I use a butt plug (which I really like- butt plug + PIV is fantastic) I have to use the narrowest waist that I can find. If I increase the width at all or if I use it consecutively (I have to skip days in between use) then the hemorrhoids come back. The only time I've ever had them is after anal sex and after using a butt plug too frequently or too big. Otherwise, I don't have them. So sure, it's possible that I just have them in a really minor way that I never notice until they are irritated by anal penetration- Regardless, anal is off limits b/c it damages my ass and does nothing for me to make that worthwhile.

Also I have a cousin who had to have surgery to correct an anal fissure- not caused by anal sex (as far as I know!) and it was a massive ongoing hassle for him, took a year to really heal. And anal can cause fissures so after witnessing that, I didn't just shut the door to anal, I bolted it and built a moat around it. I've never had a man argue with me when I tell him I've tried it and don't like it. I don't know if it's such a big deal among younger people as porn leads us to believe, but I do think we need better education about how to go about it, and Dan's advice regarding anal should be standard sex ed stuff.

For people who are into and/or who use it as primary penetration, that you can learn to minimize the risks of all these things, make it more fun, get better at different positions, and that all sex carries risk, etc. And more power to them. But I resist normalizing anal as a standard thing for everyone like oral sex or mutual masturbation- it is more complicated and more personal and does carry more risks- it's just not the same thing and should not become an expectation.

I'm probably being an old prude about it, but fine. Girls should give it a try if they want, but if they don't like it, they shouldn't feel that they aren't being GGG.

90

Can we stop with the idea that because men have a prostate that anal is like or more likely to feel good for men? The prostate isn't some joy buzzer that if hit automatically sends men into ecstasy. Anal sex may feel good for some men because it stimulates their prostate, just as anal sex feels good for some women because the position of their clitoral crura can be stimulated through anal sex. So far as I know a total of zero studies have been conducted to show the percentage of the male and female populations who find sexual pleasure receiving anal sex or find it painful. Give that, perhaps we can stop talking about anal sex as if such data exists.

91

Missing new columns I decided to jump back on this one and I'm glad I did.

@86 BiDanFan
"Everyone has an ass. Do you think a man who kisses a woman on her mouth..."

Superbly made point!

"I hope you're trolling."

Do trolls know they're trolling? I think usually not.
IIRC JuanMas isn't new to writing stuff like this; JuanMas is usually demasiado[1] Juan.

[1] too much

92

"Transmasculine is a term used to describe transgender people who were assigned female at birth, but identify with masculinity to a greater extent than with femininity."
https://gender.wikia.org/wiki/Transmasculine

93

Sublime, there's loads of men talking about prostate orgasms. No one is claiming this is the end all of anal pleasure, but it is a significant one for many men and it is one that does not even potentially exist for women. I think it's as relevant as any thing else- just like we talk about how some people not having orgasms from PIV affects their interest in PIV but does not eliminate it.

I just don't understand this reasoning that because not everyone experiences X then therefore X is irrelevant. Bullshit. The potential pleasure from prostate stimulation is on the plus side for men having anal and the lack of such potential is on the minus side for women. No one said it's the only factor. Likewise, stimulation of the clit is on the plus side of women experiencing anal and not for men. However, there are other ways to stimulate the clit whereas (correct me if I'm wrong) there is no other way but butt play to stimulate the prostate. Likewise, men are more likely to orgasm from fucking an ass than are women from being fucked in the ass. Therefore it follows that most men will have more motivation to engage in anal play - as giver or receiver- than most women. And I don't understand what is so troublesome about acknowledging this.

94

"Do you have any postpartum sex advice?"

Focus on "sexy", and if you make it as far as "sex" without falling asleep or being interrupted, that's a bonus. But keep the sexy going.

95

Also there is research on women in het relationships experiencing pain and less pleasure from anal with men. I don't know how much there is, what I know of came out of studies on HIV increases in het women, a recent ongoing trend. I don't remember much about sample sizes, etc- I suppose someone who was interested could start googling. But it's also stupid to say that just because some people have done some studies, that we should stop talking about it. Studies of subjective things never end in final conclusions which is why these conversations are interesting.

97

EL @88, also used before female birth control to avoid pregnancy.
The question asked by this LW, “ why do straight guys like anal so much?” Is not one which would have been asked in my youth, by casual lovers. People in LTR get up to what they get up to. I’ve had newly met men, post my marriage breakup, once I rejoined the fray, ask straight up if I was into anal. Like what mate..
The ground has shifted, and as long as a man accepts a firm no, there’s no problem.

98

@Daddy

I think everything gets better with practice and the right state of mind. Well most things anyway.

What I meant specifically was attempting to be on top during anal. It was a comedic attempt, could not keep the rhythm, painful, not pleasant for the guy either. I suppose with practice I could improve. I tend to prefer topping at least some of the time so I found it sort of limiting. This was a long time ago. Being in a passive position during PIV still gives me a lot of opportunity to control the pressure and rhythm when it's desirable for us, but being in a passive position during anal made me feel like I just needed to keep still. This probably would've changed with practice.

That books sounds interesting, thanks. Regarding butt play v penetration, yes exactly. I don't know if people are hardwired either way- it could be more about experience and also how much effort you wish to put into something when you have other alternatives readily available.

99

@EmmaLiz @89 @98 - I've found I can be the most active in the prone bone position (strangely enough) with spooning next best, but I really only do this with partners who have proven themselves capable of being reasonably gentle and responsive to cues. Doggy would likely be even better for being able to be an active participant but I haven't tried it because it doesn't feel as safe to me from a control perspective.

@Dadddy @96 As far as whether it can get better with practice, I assume so, but for me the much greater variable was the partner, how they handled/treated me, and their overall technique.

100

Griz?

101

Sorry, folks, I couldn't help myself. WA-HOOOO on the Big Hunsky!
After a kickass weekend in the San Juans and my beloved VW now in winter hibernation,
Griz is ready to strike @100. :)

102

LW1- Fruit in vag: Definitely deep soap wash. Do the vinegar first if you must, then wash it off. I´ve seen people with cooties fondling the zucchinis. Are they for external clit play (those corncob nuggets! r
ugged carrots!) or insertion? Condoms are always a safer option. Be very, very careful with things that may go in and may not easily come out. In our experiences, no one has ever had negative consequences. Enjoy the shapes and textures!
LW4- Some lesbians with vags also enjoy anal! Penises are not necessary! Be sexy and considerate, a good communicator, definitely not stupid drunk or high, that goes for both parties. Always use lube!!! Sometimes personal care gloves are easier to use if hand insertion, and they always protect from nails. Always have a safe word/stop word. My opinion for cis women being pressured: he should already be rimming you (annilingus), and willing to be penetrated. Or if you are playing power plays, he should be respecting your boundaries and making it sexy for you, it takes time to get there. And yes, +++ condoms and lube +++ and trust, and some level of sobriety, you can get hurt badly if your partner is selfish!
LW5- Poly after a year of dating?! IMO, 90% someone who already has a side thing. Possibly 10% someone who is exploring or discovering other sides of themselves. Probably someone who cannot bring themselves to break it off, regardless of the reason, if they know LW does not want a poly relationship.
LW 13- Sexy ≠ good parent! Also, it is each person´s complete decision to be or not to ever be a parent. If sexy sperm owner does not want to parent or spawn, that is their entire choice to make.
Fun thread, fun comments!

103

Congratulations Grizelda..you deserved it .. use your good luck well.

104

EmmaLiz @89, you are absolutely not being a prude. You gave it a try - multiple tries - and you don't like it. Not only that, but it causes you health problems. You are absolutely entitled to take it off the table.
That said, a couple of tips that I've found help with some of the problems you've experienced:
- Spooning position, I find easiest for simultaneous masturbation, either for PIV or PIA. This enables me to come because in rear entry positions there is no collateral clit friction.
- Nothing to look at - with rear entry positions I like to face my mirrored wardrobe. Even though I can mostly see me while spooning, it's much hotter than looking at a blank wall.
- "there's the fact that after PIA, there's no returning to PIV and there's no blow job either" - problem easily solved by always using a condom during PIA, even with a fluid bonded partner.
Not suggesting that you, personally, give these a try - the hemorrhoids issue would take anal permanently off the table for me, too.
I'm also a fan of PIV plus a small toy. My current partner is one of those straight guys who has a hard limit against sticking his dick where the poop comes from, and that's a solution that works for us both. (My other partner is just too large!) But I find that unless I'm the one who suggests it, it doesn't really work. I need mental "prepping" to get into the headspace of welcoming something into my ass, otherwise my sphincter just says "nope."

Sublime @90, we absolutely can't because it's absolutely true that people who have prostates are more likely to enjoy having their prostates stimulated than people who don't have prostates. We can and should get rid of any idea that ALL men enjoy having their prostates stimulated, but that's not what you said.

Curious @92, thanks for that helpful link.

Dadddy @96, I agree with FutureCat that it's probably 95% down to the top as to whether anal is enjoyable. I do agree that doing it more often helps trick one's sphincter into overcoming its instinct to close up and not let anything in, but it really is being in the mood that makes the biggest difference for me there, which is unhelpful from the point of view of the hopeful top.

Stranger @102: For whatever it's worth, I don't like rimming AT ALL. Amend that to "optional" on your anal foreplay checklist.
And "poly after a year of dating!?" Why, in your mind, could this not be someone who fell for someone who is monogamous, thought he could forsake all others, and then a year in, when the NRE is wearing off, realised that he can't? Perhaps he likes LW enough to give her the option to work with him here, perhaps discover that she too enjoys a non-exclusive relationship -- after all, this is how quite a few people become poly -- rather than just end an otherwise promising relationship. I agree, if LW can't see herself being poly (or compromise on allowing him hall passes), they should move on.

105

@103 LavaGirl: Thanks--I have indeed, been quite fortunate lately. :)

106

Just noticed Mr. Venn saying @22 that I might have an opinion about the optimal degree of attractiveness in offspring for parental satisfaction. To which I would reply that anyone hoping to find satisfaction in the physical appearance of their offspring is bound to be left unsatisfied in the long run. Even if the child is objectively gorgeous, they'll dress or groom themselves in a way sure to annoy their parents.

107

Ms Erica - It was a tribute to you as the most objective parent among the assembled company. You have not disappointed.

Mizz Liz - I thought of the virginity angle as well, but it wouldn't go anywhere other than giving me the idea that maybe all LW's dates attended the same RC high school. (Some horses just don't break well out of the starting gate.)

108

Glad you are in the luck, Grizelda. Hope your music is going well.
EmmaLiz, perfect example of creeping Patriarchy, you even going to a thought like you’re a prude for not wanting anal. The ol blue balls routine, with the ante uped.
Obviously some cis women love the experience. Not all.
Per SA’s attempt to equate arseholes of cis men and women.. there’s much quicker routes to the clit. It’s woven all thru the vagina as well as the shining little button which is positioned outside for easy access.
I’m surprised you have fallen for this, EL, shows how insidious Patriarchy can be. Strong feminist like you thinking yourself a prude because you don’t want anal sex.

109

What you mean Mr Venn, most objective parent? You an expert on parenting now.

110

Correction re @108; “SA’s attempts to equate arses of cis men and women.”


    Please wait...

    Comments are closed.

    Commenting on this item is available only to members of the site. You can sign in here or create an account here.


    Add a comment
    Preview

    By posting this comment, you are agreeing to our Terms of Use.