Interesting definition of rape there: one person [substituting] his judgment for that of another man or women simply to make it easier to get himself laid.

Word out to the excellent comments....

I would just add a couple of comments.

1) While I think it's entirely appropriate to think of a person's kinkiness as a type of orientation in some respects, and I agree that we should work to destigmatize it, I don't think it's 100% analogous to being gay or straight. Gay people in the closet aren't able to fully participate in society -- by introducing their partners to coworkers, openly pursuing romantic relationships, etc. Kinky people can. And I have no doubt that they experience terrible shaming, but they can say, "This is my wife, Sarah." Frankly, I wouldn't want that introduction to be followed up with, "we're into hardcore BDSM" -- or any other details of their sex life, vanilla or kinky.

2) I suspect Dan recommends low doses of psychiatric medication because American psychiatrists chronically overprescribe powerful psychotropic drugs. I would never judge someone for taking antidepressants -- I've taken them in the past -- and I'm glad they exist for those who need them. But I have also had horrible experiences with psychiatrists and have known countless others with similar experiences. The field is home to an incredible amount of arrogance, evident throughout its ethically-challenged history, and is deeply wedded to the pharmaceutical industry. These drugs are not well understood (often prescribed to children without being tested). They are a blunt instrument. A degree of caution is completely warranted.

@1 The writer *literally* said "I'm not saying this is rape" before they wrote that.

Fubar @1: That was an excellent turn of phrase too -- if, as @4 says, not "a definition of rape." I'd call it the definition of sleazy.

To Episode 567: I'm another one of those people. By coincidence, I also ended a 3.5-year, mainly sexual relationship two months ago. I tolerated, among other things, his being massively annoying and a bit of a misogynist out of bed because he solved my perennial sexual frustration problem. And while I know I'm well rid... damn, do I miss the sex!

The one commenting on the cousins at first came off a little harsh I felt....but then I thought "what if a pair of hot guys invited me for a night of fun...and later on I found out they were brothers"....I think I would be seriously weirded out by that.

The fact that I am only aroused masturbating to my fetish, and the idea of letting slmelme else jnto my fantasy is pretty undesirable, is definitely an orientation. My gender is already a screaming clusterfuck so not being able to connect with anyone of any gender sexually (despite really wishing I could, I do wish I could be all the wah connected to a partner, and I'd strongly prefer a female /not-cis-dude, but that's more for social reasons not attraction reasons) has a huge effect on my ability to socialize. It's an orientation, I'm in the closet , I find myself driven to flirt and form romantic connection but backing out when things want to get sexual.

@3: On orientations, yeah there are differences, but I find this a tricky subject. for a few reasons:

-Kink tends to refer to what used to be called paraphilias. Once being gay was "inversion." Transgender issues as well were labeled paraphilias. Ye we still use one word (eg kink) to refer to this vast cornucopia as if it's all the same. For all we know, there may be more yet to come out of this mysterious black box if we can ever get some proper research done.

-For many people kink is a side dish, and therefore not anything like an orientation. For some people, kink is exclusive, so before you even get to the boyfriend or girlfriend holding hands phase, you have to find out whether or not they think you are sick or are going to rat you out.

-Vanilla hetero types do plenty of sexual activities in public like kissing and most don't bat an eye. They can also freely talk about their likes, desires, interests and problems. If you're kinky, suddenly any manifestation of that is stigmatized or "too sexual."

-Try talking about boundaries and consent issues in a BDSM context with people who think you are sick. For example when I was a very young fetishist I was violated in a BDSM context, and I can't talk about that with vanilla people or terfs, because to even get there, we'd have to talk about a taboo sexuality.

-Some things that appear to be fetishes, at least, going by participants, aren't about sexual gratification. Some dressing up for example. And aside from fetishes, asexuality isn't about gratification or passing, yet it's included. Does orientation refer to stigma, attraction to genitals, or to a different way of processing the world?

On Kink Orientation:
The idea that kink is an orientation just like hetero or homo -sexuality has always bothered me. Surely, kink can be so compelling that sex without it is unfulfilling, and I realize that there are people for whom the sex of their playmate is insignificant as long as kink is in the equation. I submit that these people are simply bisexual (as most people are, in my opinion).
I hold myself up as a counter-example. I'm a perfect 6 on the Kinsey scale, and while not the kinkiest guy out there, I basically require kink. However, there is no way I could play with a woman (as top or bottom) even if we were doing «sterile» BDSM.

From the article: Keenan likes to say she was conscious of her kink orientation before she knew anything about her sexual orientation.
This tells me that Keenen considers kink orientation to be separate from sexual orientation—not a replacement of it.

For those who are kink-centric and bisexual, great for you. You have more options than those of us at either end of the Kinsey scale, but you are still on that scale (somewhere in the middle).

@10 you made me laugh out loud with that image. I have to also agree regarding clenching vaginal muscles leading to hands free orgasms. I regularly get woken up by orgasms from dreaming, and no, I'm not touching myself or grinding on anything in my sleep (my spouse has confirmed this). Whatever is in my head plus clenching is enough to put me over. So I'm positive the same thing can happen with BDSM - being in subspace is a bit like dreaming, is it not?

On the topic of non-contact orgasms, they're not just for subs. I've come while pegging. I got so deep into the fantasy, I was able to fantasise myself ejaculating, and though the cock was fake the orgasm was real.

@3

"These drugs are not well understood (often prescribed to children without being tested)"

You... don't actually know how the US system works, do you?

The first part is a given -- very few drugs are 'well understood' (it's not at all uncommon for drugs that have been in use for years to turn out to not work the way we thought they did), but _no_ drug is prescribed to _anyone_ 'without testing'.

....Well, today, at least. If certain groups in our government get that way they could change, but _today_ it doesn't happen at all. (Save in the testing phase, of course, I suppose.)