If she committed a crime that hurt anyone in Washington, then she should serve her sentence and be turned over to ICE. Short of that, the state shouldnât be involved.
Giving immigrants any reason to fear contact with public safety agencies, hospitals, state licensing departments, or simply calling 911, puts all of us at unnecessary risk. Our policy of not helping Federal immigration spooks do their extremely pointless job is based on the duty of city and state government agencies to serve the public good. Whether or not one person gets persecuted because their papers aren't in order is never worth upsetting the far more important jobs that police and fire and other agencies do for us.
Fucking conservatives are always quaking in fear for their safety and are never smart enough to figure out what is and what isn't a threat. Go punish Melania Trump for all her technical violations of her immigrant visa, if it sticks in your craw so bad that somebody didn't jump through every bureaucratic hoop. Go turn your neighbor in to the gestapo for building a deck without a permit. Didn't you guys used to believe in individual liberty? And small government? Remember small government? Hello? Anybody?
Hey number 5 I break the law I go to jail or pay a fine or both. These people get "free " lisc.,assistance, schooling,etc.etc. Oh and medical. You no ,medical this lady says she and her kid don't have which is bullshit because I payed for about 1600 dollars last year so she could. I can't afford insurance for my whole family so I think it's more than fair that Obama take that 1600 and give medial to his supporters. Like you #5,this "ILLEGAL ACTIVIST"lady and her kid,and the rest of thoughs "ILLEGAL PEOPLE".I,ll just figure out something else for my family maybe a witch doctor or something . One half of my blood line is from the revolution, the others from Ellis .How about yours #5?
@5. Illegal immigrants wonât call 911 because theyâre afraid of deportation. Thatâs one of the best reasons to deport them. Theyâre not good citizens. Theyâre worried more about their own ass then the lady who just flipped her car, or the suspicious person prowling around their neighbors backyard.
And the other bit. Individual freedom and small government, who says those are mutually exclusive from a country with secure borders and intact sovereignty? They seem like they pair nicely actually.
They shouldn't even be giving illegals a driver's license. It's absurd! Not only are non-citizens not entitled to such things, they can commit voter fraud as well.
Totally ridiculous. They should absolutely work with ICE as well. This is freak'n clown world.
Undocumented people work very hard and pay taxes just like everyone else. They pay into benefits they will never be eligible for. They are also ineligible for welfare benefits. They do not get a free ride, and live under horrible stress.
They came here to seek the dream of opportunity and democracy that we promote endlessly. They come from countries that don't have those opportunities because Western greed and power have intentionally peripheralized their cultures and economies.
Are the US ideals espoused in our founding documents not big enough for everyone? Would you have the courage to travel to a strange country, where you are marginalized, in order to provide your kids with a chance? That shit is real courage.
Where's the compassion? Where's the humanity? Are their any hearts still beating out there?
Immigrants aren't hurting your community, taking jobs, etc. They're contributing to our communities. Stagnant wages, the end of unions, and corporate control are what you should worry about. Not your fellow man trying to get by.
Laws are not sacrosanct. It used to be illegal to teach African Americans to read and write, or to help them make a better life for themselves. Many broke those laws because they were morally and ethically wrong. There are higher laws like integrity and compassion.
Undocumented people commit a civil offense, not even a criminal offense, in order to have a shot at life. If your kids were starving, with little to no opportunity for any future, what laws would you be willing to break to save them?
I side with MLK, Jesus, Ghandi, Frederick Douglass, etc etc and choose humanity. How many laws do we all break or bend on a daily basis?
I work with undocumented folks on a daily basis. They start businesses, they raise money for community causes ... I see them at PTA meetings. They are our neighbors and the parents of our kids' friends. How does judging them from our privilege high-horse help? Let's give our fellow human beings a hand.
Agree to disagree, I guess. I know many of these people, and they neither corrode nor corrupt anything. In most cases, they are fleeing countries that are non-functional due to generations of US trade, foreign policy, military intervention, or imperialism.
I have great hope for all immigrants, regardless of status, because so many of Seattle's best and brightest are working tirelessly, in collaboration with colleges, non -profits, and public institutions to lift these folks up rather than put them down. I'm in those meetings and doing that work alongside immigrant communities every day.
If you meet these folks, talk with them, hear their stories human to human, you can't help but be moved.
Ignorance, intolerance, and greed are the only plagues I see in America.
"So when will we see these Russians doing the perp walk in cuffs?
Or might Mueller just as well have indicted a sack of ham sandwiches....."
Bub Boswell
Apparently the rule of law only matters to you when it fits your narrative.
I can't wait to see what your new screen name is going to be after they ban you again.
Honestly, I don't care what your opinions are.
I'm just pointing out the fact that you're a hypocrite.
The Russians were indicted because they broke the law, nothing more nothing less.
If you think there's no point to it, that shows that you don't believe in the rule of law.
Stop pretending that you do.
"...theyâre afraid of deportation. Thatâs one of the best reasons to deport them. Theyâre not good citizens"
This is exactly the same circular reasoning that said gays couldn't be trusted in the military, because being in the closet made them liars, and the risk of discovery made them vulnerable to blackmail. *facepalm* To this day most Republicans haven't figured out how far that argument's head is up its own ass. They apply the same paradoxical head-in-ass thinking to trans people now. It pretty much drives their assumption that all Muslims hate us.
Fucking babies. It all rests on assuming life is fair. The hardships or benefits you get from being born on one side of a border or the other are in no way undeserved dumb luck. Life is incapable of being unfair! You deserve whatever you get. Trying to change anything is *wrong* because it was all fair *to begin with*. Just walking though how their minds work and laying it bare leaves you gobsmacked with how absurdly wrong it is. It's why they can't admit they think life is fair: it makes you sound like a god damn idiot to talk like that.
They make up kooky rationalizations to hide the real reason behind everything they do, because the real reason is they think like six year olds. Life is not fair, babies.
I see your thinking on this and understand your points, however I have a different point of view in this... and that's cool. That's what society's all about.
Far be it from me to judge people's decisions in life. I feel it absolutely is the moral high ground to help folks in my community. I do fight to change the current immigration system, which as I'm sure you're aware, is completely messed up.
But in the meantime, how does it help my community to harass and lock up contributing members in disgusting, inhumane private detention centers where they are forced into slave labor, leaving their (often US citizen ) children in the roster system. Why break up functioning healthy families who aren't hurting anyone? ICE use dishonest, unethical, despicable tactics to attack these families.
I'm not interested in American exceptionalism. Many of the same arguments were put against abolitionists, civil rights activists, suffragettes, indigenous rights activists, LBGQT activists, etc.
I've gotta take the risk and ride with hope, compassion, and humanity. You've got to choose your path. I think we all want what's best .. so I hope we share some common ground.
We are a nation of laws. If you don't like a law. Then do something to change it. If not...STFU.
This is a part of the Washington State Governor's Oath of Office. I mean, the dude swore an oath. if he's not going to keep his word. He needs to step down.
"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support the Constitution of the United States and the Constitution and laws of the state of Washington, " And "Constitution" means Federal Law.
Undocumented is term meant to rhetorically emphasize the humanity of a group of people. After much research, training, and thought on the issue, I choose to use that term. You use whatever terms you like. Is it weasely to speak from my heart and with respect for others?
I have myself broken laws. I know many who have been, or are currently incarcerated ... I speak with respect about them as well. It's not my place in the world to excuse or judge people for wrongdoing.
I'm not the praying kind, and I believe actions speak louder than words, so I will do you a favor.
"...in the end the immigrants are pawns and victims; it would be nice if the political parties could at least get together on this one thing and find a humane workable solution."
As an independent, I'm very disturbed that lawmakers from both parties seem uninterested in crafting immigration policy that actually works.
The solution is simple.
If you want to see an end to unlawful immigration, treat the employers who hire unlawful immigrants the same way we treat drug dealers.
If you hire an illegal immigrant, you go to jail and you forfeit your assets.
If employers knew they would face real penalties for hiring undocumented workers, they would stop hiring them.
Undocumented immigrants, or illegal aliens if you prefer that term, come here because they know they will be able to find work. If they knew they'd be unable to find work, they wouldn't come.
The real problem is that both Democrats and Republicans feel that having a large amount of undocumented immigrants in the United States works to their advantage.
Democrats believe the undocumented immigrants will eventually be given citizenship, and the largest proportion of them will vote Democrat.
Republicans want illegal immigrants here for two reasons. The first is cheap labor. The second is an easy scapegoat.
Republicans would rather spend 25 billion dollars on a wall that can be defeated with a $250 ladder then do anything to stop unlawful immigration, because they don't want to stop unlawful immigration.
Punishing people who hire undocumented immigrants wouldn't just save money, it would make money.
Just imagine how much money ICE would receive through asset forfeiture.
Imagine if all the employers that cheat American workers by exploiting undocumented workers we're locked up and their businesses and personal properties were sold at auction.
Honestly, I don't see this happening. As I said before, both Republicans and Democrats have their own reasons to continue the status quo, and both parties want to continue the debate over immigration, because both parties believe that the debate is politically profitable for them.
As far as the idea that Dems want immigrants to bolster their base..
The irony is that the vast majority of immigrants I meet (undocumented or otherwise) express largely conservative social and economic viewpoints. If Repubs would just stop it with the fear mongering and hateful rhetoric, they would probably find themselves with some new allies in a lot of areas.
"If Repubs would just stop it with the fear mongering and hateful rhetoric, they would probably find themselves with some new allies in a lot of areas."
I definitely agree.
I live in Detroit, and let me tell you, there are a lot of socially conservative African Americans in the "Black Church" who would love to be involved in a political party that had a socially conservative agenda, but when they look at the GOP all they see is racism.
That's only got worse since Trump.
We also have a large amount of Muslims here in the Detroit area. I'm sure it's no surprise to anyone that a large percentage of Muslims are very socially conservative. A large number of South Asian Muslims in this area are in fact Republicans, but most Muslims of Middle Eastern heritage steer clear of the GOP.
In fact, I just saw a news story last night about a Minnesota Republican attempting to ban Muslims from joining the Minnesota Republican Party after a group of Muslims had shown interest in joining the Republican Party.
The Republicans seem to be moving farther and farther down the path of white identity politics, and they are definitely a shooting themselves in the foot in the process.
It's absolutely disgusting that a Governor would use an executive to outright defy the federal government. Washington state is not it's own country. Trump ought to have the DOJ prosecute Inslee, there is more than enough grounds for this.
We already know the DOJ has sent warnings to officials who have been defying federal law and obstructing the feds from delivering justice. Inslee and Durkin, etc,. better be prepared to face some serious consequencess for their arrogance and hubris.
Yeah, there absolutely needs to be mandatory e-verify. I wouldn't go so far as to seize the property of an employer who hires illegals, but I think it should be a criminal offense, but those are just details.
The idea is that we need a comprehensive solution to the problem of mass immigration (legal and illegal). I believe strongly that we need a moratorium on all immigration for at least 4 or 5 decades, like we did between the 20's and the 60's, so we can integrate the truly astonishing number of foreigners.
But honestly, I doubt they can ever be truly "assimilated" in the way European immigrants were-- those who made up the bulk of pre-hart-celler act immigrants. It was hard enough integrating eastern and southern Europeans into an Anglo-Saxon culture and system! That's why we took the long break.
The future of America is really a balkanization. I don't expect, or even want, to destroy and assimilate the cultures of Indians, Chinese, Latin Americans, and Africans into a culture they aren't even remotely related to. It would be immoral to expect and demand they do so(oddly enough, it would be a form of white supremacy).
So, by bringing them all in we are setting ourselves up for balkanization and most likely, the end to the union. Governor's like Inslee are only accelerating this process by defying the federal government that is holding it all together.
Too bad the native americans let the puritans live. Then maybe we wouldnât have to put up with right wing bigots now.
The global corporations have tied up and destroyed many economies throughout the world.
And all you xenophobic control freaks can do is blame migrant workers. Pathetic not to mention chickenshit. You are corporate slaves and keep towing the lines they feed you.
Either that or you are part of the global corporate elites that benefit from this hate mongering.
You know -divide and conquer- so people donât figure out its you.
Fucking conservatives are always quaking in fear for their safety and are never smart enough to figure out what is and what isn't a threat. Go punish Melania Trump for all her technical violations of her immigrant visa, if it sticks in your craw so bad that somebody didn't jump through every bureaucratic hoop. Go turn your neighbor in to the gestapo for building a deck without a permit. Didn't you guys used to believe in individual liberty? And small government? Remember small government? Hello? Anybody?
And the other bit. Individual freedom and small government, who says those are mutually exclusive from a country with secure borders and intact sovereignty? They seem like they pair nicely actually.
Totally ridiculous. They should absolutely work with ICE as well. This is freak'n clown world.
@7 and @8 write like the prime targets for one of those love potion or Nigerian prince spammers.
They came here to seek the dream of opportunity and democracy that we promote endlessly. They come from countries that don't have those opportunities because Western greed and power have intentionally peripheralized their cultures and economies.
Are the US ideals espoused in our founding documents not big enough for everyone? Would you have the courage to travel to a strange country, where you are marginalized, in order to provide your kids with a chance? That shit is real courage.
Where's the compassion? Where's the humanity? Are their any hearts still beating out there?
Immigrants aren't hurting your community, taking jobs, etc. They're contributing to our communities. Stagnant wages, the end of unions, and corporate control are what you should worry about. Not your fellow man trying to get by.
Undocumented people commit a civil offense, not even a criminal offense, in order to have a shot at life. If your kids were starving, with little to no opportunity for any future, what laws would you be willing to break to save them?
I side with MLK, Jesus, Ghandi, Frederick Douglass, etc etc and choose humanity. How many laws do we all break or bend on a daily basis?
I work with undocumented folks on a daily basis. They start businesses, they raise money for community causes ... I see them at PTA meetings. They are our neighbors and the parents of our kids' friends. How does judging them from our privilege high-horse help? Let's give our fellow human beings a hand.
Agree to disagree, I guess. I know many of these people, and they neither corrode nor corrupt anything. In most cases, they are fleeing countries that are non-functional due to generations of US trade, foreign policy, military intervention, or imperialism.
I have great hope for all immigrants, regardless of status, because so many of Seattle's best and brightest are working tirelessly, in collaboration with colleges, non -profits, and public institutions to lift these folks up rather than put them down. I'm in those meetings and doing that work alongside immigrant communities every day.
If you meet these folks, talk with them, hear their stories human to human, you can't help but be moved.
Ignorance, intolerance, and greed are the only plagues I see in America.
"So when will we see these Russians doing the perp walk in cuffs?
Or might Mueller just as well have indicted a sack of ham sandwiches....."
Bub Boswell
Apparently the rule of law only matters to you when it fits your narrative.
I can't wait to see what your new screen name is going to be after they ban you again.
Honestly, I don't care what your opinions are.
I'm just pointing out the fact that you're a hypocrite.
The Russians were indicted because they broke the law, nothing more nothing less.
If you think there's no point to it, that shows that you don't believe in the rule of law.
Stop pretending that you do.
Well said, every one of your points.
Soros and his hyenas must be gnashing their teeth!
This is exactly the same circular reasoning that said gays couldn't be trusted in the military, because being in the closet made them liars, and the risk of discovery made them vulnerable to blackmail. *facepalm* To this day most Republicans haven't figured out how far that argument's head is up its own ass. They apply the same paradoxical head-in-ass thinking to trans people now. It pretty much drives their assumption that all Muslims hate us.
Fucking babies. It all rests on assuming life is fair. The hardships or benefits you get from being born on one side of a border or the other are in no way undeserved dumb luck. Life is incapable of being unfair! You deserve whatever you get. Trying to change anything is *wrong* because it was all fair *to begin with*. Just walking though how their minds work and laying it bare leaves you gobsmacked with how absurdly wrong it is. It's why they can't admit they think life is fair: it makes you sound like a god damn idiot to talk like that.
They make up kooky rationalizations to hide the real reason behind everything they do, because the real reason is they think like six year olds. Life is not fair, babies.
Only Congress has the authority to declare war.
And...
The indictments give the authorities the ability to arrest those indicted if they return to the United States.
That means they can't come back and try to do it again.
Are you really that stupid?
I see your thinking on this and understand your points, however I have a different point of view in this... and that's cool. That's what society's all about.
Far be it from me to judge people's decisions in life. I feel it absolutely is the moral high ground to help folks in my community. I do fight to change the current immigration system, which as I'm sure you're aware, is completely messed up.
But in the meantime, how does it help my community to harass and lock up contributing members in disgusting, inhumane private detention centers where they are forced into slave labor, leaving their (often US citizen ) children in the roster system. Why break up functioning healthy families who aren't hurting anyone? ICE use dishonest, unethical, despicable tactics to attack these families.
I'm not interested in American exceptionalism. Many of the same arguments were put against abolitionists, civil rights activists, suffragettes, indigenous rights activists, LBGQT activists, etc.
I've gotta take the risk and ride with hope, compassion, and humanity. You've got to choose your path. I think we all want what's best .. so I hope we share some common ground.
This is a part of the Washington State Governor's Oath of Office. I mean, the dude swore an oath. if he's not going to keep his word. He needs to step down.
"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support the Constitution of the United States and the Constitution and laws of the state of Washington, " And "Constitution" means Federal Law.
http://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?c…
I have myself broken laws. I know many who have been, or are currently incarcerated ... I speak with respect about them as well. It's not my place in the world to excuse or judge people for wrongdoing.
I'm not the praying kind, and I believe actions speak louder than words, so I will do you a favor.
"...in the end the immigrants are pawns and victims; it would be nice if the political parties could at least get together on this one thing and find a humane workable solution."
As an independent, I'm very disturbed that lawmakers from both parties seem uninterested in crafting immigration policy that actually works.
The solution is simple.
If you want to see an end to unlawful immigration, treat the employers who hire unlawful immigrants the same way we treat drug dealers.
If you hire an illegal immigrant, you go to jail and you forfeit your assets.
If employers knew they would face real penalties for hiring undocumented workers, they would stop hiring them.
Undocumented immigrants, or illegal aliens if you prefer that term, come here because they know they will be able to find work. If they knew they'd be unable to find work, they wouldn't come.
The real problem is that both Democrats and Republicans feel that having a large amount of undocumented immigrants in the United States works to their advantage.
Democrats believe the undocumented immigrants will eventually be given citizenship, and the largest proportion of them will vote Democrat.
Republicans want illegal immigrants here for two reasons. The first is cheap labor. The second is an easy scapegoat.
Republicans would rather spend 25 billion dollars on a wall that can be defeated with a $250 ladder then do anything to stop unlawful immigration, because they don't want to stop unlawful immigration.
Punishing people who hire undocumented immigrants wouldn't just save money, it would make money.
Just imagine how much money ICE would receive through asset forfeiture.
Imagine if all the employers that cheat American workers by exploiting undocumented workers we're locked up and their businesses and personal properties were sold at auction.
Honestly, I don't see this happening. As I said before, both Republicans and Democrats have their own reasons to continue the status quo, and both parties want to continue the debate over immigration, because both parties believe that the debate is politically profitable for them.
You see, we can agree.
As far as the idea that Dems want immigrants to bolster their base..
The irony is that the vast majority of immigrants I meet (undocumented or otherwise) express largely conservative social and economic viewpoints. If Repubs would just stop it with the fear mongering and hateful rhetoric, they would probably find themselves with some new allies in a lot of areas.
"If Repubs would just stop it with the fear mongering and hateful rhetoric, they would probably find themselves with some new allies in a lot of areas."
I definitely agree.
I live in Detroit, and let me tell you, there are a lot of socially conservative African Americans in the "Black Church" who would love to be involved in a political party that had a socially conservative agenda, but when they look at the GOP all they see is racism.
That's only got worse since Trump.
We also have a large amount of Muslims here in the Detroit area. I'm sure it's no surprise to anyone that a large percentage of Muslims are very socially conservative. A large number of South Asian Muslims in this area are in fact Republicans, but most Muslims of Middle Eastern heritage steer clear of the GOP.
In fact, I just saw a news story last night about a Minnesota Republican attempting to ban Muslims from joining the Minnesota Republican Party after a group of Muslims had shown interest in joining the Republican Party.
The Republicans seem to be moving farther and farther down the path of white identity politics, and they are definitely a shooting themselves in the foot in the process.
We already know the DOJ has sent warnings to officials who have been defying federal law and obstructing the feds from delivering justice. Inslee and Durkin, etc,. better be prepared to face some serious consequencess for their arrogance and hubris.
Yeah, there absolutely needs to be mandatory e-verify. I wouldn't go so far as to seize the property of an employer who hires illegals, but I think it should be a criminal offense, but those are just details.
The idea is that we need a comprehensive solution to the problem of mass immigration (legal and illegal). I believe strongly that we need a moratorium on all immigration for at least 4 or 5 decades, like we did between the 20's and the 60's, so we can integrate the truly astonishing number of foreigners.
But honestly, I doubt they can ever be truly "assimilated" in the way European immigrants were-- those who made up the bulk of pre-hart-celler act immigrants. It was hard enough integrating eastern and southern Europeans into an Anglo-Saxon culture and system! That's why we took the long break.
The future of America is really a balkanization. I don't expect, or even want, to destroy and assimilate the cultures of Indians, Chinese, Latin Americans, and Africans into a culture they aren't even remotely related to. It would be immoral to expect and demand they do so(oddly enough, it would be a form of white supremacy).
So, by bringing them all in we are setting ourselves up for balkanization and most likely, the end to the union. Governor's like Inslee are only accelerating this process by defying the federal government that is holding it all together.
Either that, or they are so obsessed with this post that they are just desperate to keep commenting.
Not that we didn't already know that they are pathetic, but their loneliness and emptiness are going to make me cry soon.
The global corporations have tied up and destroyed many economies throughout the world.
And all you xenophobic control freaks can do is blame migrant workers. Pathetic not to mention chickenshit. You are corporate slaves and keep towing the lines they feed you.
You know -divide and conquer- so people donât figure out its you.